first time i took venom was by itself one cap in the am, and one cap either with lunch or before an afternoon workout. I was on a 40/40/20 split at maintenance level, and cut about 10 pounds. Nothing to amazing and I didnt really notice any big recomp. I was looking for an energy supp mostly, and finding one that really helps me focus can be tough. Venom worked wonders for appetite control, but only decent for me in the focus area. Using it now on a cut, almost out actually, and I am down 25lbs.