Trest/Ment + Ralox cycle questions

hairygrandpa

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I did a oral Trest+TD Trest cycle in the past, got bad gyno symptoms even on 1mg adex ed. Did a follow up cycle of Ralox and got rid of the gyno.

Now the questions:

Is it sound to run Ralox and IM-Ment together to avoid gyno?
If so, should I take an AI on cycle -or does Ralox suffice?
My guess is, I would need a hefty dose of Exemestane (-or better letro?) after the cycle to deal with the rebound, right?
 
Smont

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I'm not sure as I've never used ralox or letro. I will say tho that im trest isn't quite ass bad with estrogen as the transdermal is. I'm pretty sure brofessorx just had a long ment cycle so maybe he can help
 
hairygrandpa

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Spurfy , Nac , justhere4comm , jakz , NoAddedHmones
 
justhere4comm

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Oh heyyyy. You rang? :D
 
hairygrandpa

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Bump

 
Smont

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Is it bad that I want next on that court
 

Nac

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Sorry bro, cant offer much insight on this one, my knowledge on ralox is essentially zilch.

fueledpassion
 
hairygrandpa

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Sorry bro, cant offer much insight on this one, my knowledge on ralox is essentially zilch.

fueledpassion
Ralox binds most firmly to breast tissue receptors, inhibiting estrogen from docking while on ment.
But do you think my reasoning is sound?
 

Nac

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Ralox binds most firmly to breast tissue receptors, inhibiting estrogen from docking while on ment.
But do you think my reasoning is sound?
We know MENT has high affinity for the progesterone receptor (PGR), and PGR has significant expression in breast tissue. If Ralox can inhibit any PGR activity of MENT at breast tissue, then sure I guess your theory is sound.

But like I said, Im unfamiliar with the specifics of Ralox MoA, and especially in relation to the PGR.
 
hairygrandpa

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We know MENT has high affinity for the progesterone receptor (PGR), and PGR has significant expression in breast tissue. If Ralox can inhibit any PGR activity of MENT at breast tissue, then sure I guess your theory is sound.

But like I said, Im unfamiliar with the specifics of Ralox MoA, and especially in relation to the PGR.
Hmmm....
Even though Ralox reversed my Trest induced gyno after the cycle, I would rather need something that works on the progesterone receptors, like Bromocriptine during cycle.

Anyone?
 

Nac

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Hmmm....
Even though Ralox reversed my Trest induced gyno after the cycle, I would rather need something that works on the progesterone receptors, like Bromocriptine during cycle.

Anyone?
Thats where Im really unsure; is gyno typically characterised by ER activity, or PGR activity, or both?

I honestly dont know.
 
hairygrandpa

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Thats where Im really unsure; is gyno typically characterised by ER activity, or PGR activity, or both?

I honestly dont know.
 
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fueledpassion

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Ralox was never enough for myself when I had gyno issues from Ment. What did work was Ralox + AI.

Start MENT with 12.5mg/day. Take Raloxifene @ 30mg/day. If no gyno issues, bump MENT to 25mg/day and bump Ralox to 60mg/day. Be ready to add Arimidex or Letro as needed. The combination of Ralox and an AI is powerful and in my case, both are needed when taking IM MENT.

Avoid excessive sugars and alcohol (hops) while taking MENT. Both of those seem to make matters worse for gyno. Just something I've noticed while cycling this particular compound.
 
brofessorx

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I run ralox as my serm of choice. What does anyone want to know?

And the last im trest cycle I ran was 5 months long. I didn't use any ancillaries.
 
hairygrandpa

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I run ralox as my serm of choice. What does anyone want to know?

And the last im trest cycle I ran was 5 months long. I didn't use any ancillaries.
I did a oral Trest+TD Trest cycle in the past, got bad gyno symptoms even on 1mg adex ed. Did a follow up cycle of Ralox and got rid of the gyno (first crushed e with 25mg exem for 2 days).

Now the questions:

Is it sound to run Ralox and IM-Ment together to avoid gyno?
If so, should I take an AI on cycle -or does Ralox suffice?
My guess is, I would need a hefty dose of Exemestane (-or better letro?) after the cycle to deal with the rebound, right?
fueledpassion , Did I got it right? You already used ralox with ment and possibly an AI if sides were noticed?

That is what I'm planing to do, just looking for confirmation/experience with it.
 
fueledpassion

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Dude, load up on ancillaries. My understanding is that MENT converts directly over to a methylated estrogen. And from my experience it behaves like it too.

But what you experienced last time may not be what you experience this time. Every time seems to be different from the last for myself. I mean, you may not need all that much but if it were me, I'd be doing this:

Trest @ 25mg/day
Ralox @ 60mg/day
Aromasin @ 25mg/day
Aldactone @ 1/2 tab every 12hrs

And I'd have Letro on deck...
 
hairygrandpa

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Dude, load up on ancillaries. My understanding is that MENT converts directly over to a methylated estrogen. And from my experience it behaves like it too.

But what you experienced last time may not be what you experience this time. Every time seems to be different from the last for myself. I mean, you may not need all that much but if it were me, I'd be doing this:

Trest @ 25mg/day
Ralox @ 60mg/day
Aromasin @ 25mg/day
Aldactone @ 1/2 tab every 12hrs

And I'd have Letro on deck...
Sounds good! Thank you browalski!
 
brofessorx

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If you're getting estrogenic sides from ment then you need to lower the dosage.

Ralox would do great at 60-120 mg ed in preventing sides.

Going off ment experiences from when it was only available from ug labs, 30mg daily was considered a very high dosage.
With 15mg being the norm.

So when I decided to run a long cycle, I took 30mg im every other day, 90mg/week.
If I had been intending to grow, getting larger would of been extremely easy at this dose.
Instead I was obstacle course race training, running 25 miles per week, fasted, lifting 4 days per week, eating only around 2,500 calories per day, and my weight didn't drop below 185lbs.

I should note, I also took 25mg of superdrol 2-3 times per week as sides permitted.
I took 500mg Tudca for that as I got sides.

I've also ran trest at 300mg per week. And got very bad sides from it. Which is why I chose to go so low the second time.
 
fueledpassion

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It is strong, like I said earlier, start at 15mg/day w/ Ralox @ 30-60mg/day. Adjust from there as desired.

Higher doses I would also prefer the mild diuretic, as water retention does become sort of an issue for some.

When I said "if it were me" - that should have triggered you to realize in your head --> "whatever he is about to say is probably more aggressive than what I should do, since he has taken IM MENT before and I haven't."

In regards to strength and pumps, 15mg/day MENT feels alot like 500mg/wk of Test-C.

In regards to actual anabolic activity/ weight gain that dose would compare also to 500-750mg/wk Test-C.

In terms of appetite, 15mg MENT is comparable to a low dose of Tren-E, say 200mg/wk.

In term of bloat, it's alot like a modest dose of A-Bombs or D-Bol (25-50mg/day).

25mg/day and all that just amplifies. Most people compare 50mg/day to a gram of Test weekly, but I think that is still underestimating what the experience is like. The only other compound I've experienced that was stronger was when I took Dienolone Acetate @ 700-1400mg/wk.

Was a stupid idea.

Anyways, I digress.
 
hairygrandpa

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It is strong, like I said earlier, start at 15mg/day w/ Ralox @ 30-60mg/day. Adjust from there as desired.

Higher doses I would also prefer the mild diuretic, as water retention does become sort of an issue for some.

When I said "if it were me" - that should have triggered you to realize in your head --> "whatever he is about to say is probably more aggressive than what I should do, since he has taken IM MENT before and I haven't."

In regards to strength and pumps, 15mg/day MENT feels alot like 500mg/wk of Test-C.

In regards to actual anabolic activity/ weight gain that dose would compare also to 500-750mg/wk Test-C.

In terms of appetite, 15mg MENT is comparable to a low dose of Tren-E, say 200mg/wk.

In term of bloat, it's alot like a modest dose of A-Bombs or D-Bol (25-50mg/day).

25mg/day and all that just amplifies. Most people compare 50mg/day to a gram of Test weekly, but I think that is still underestimating what the experience is like. The only other compound I've experienced that was stronger was when I took Dienolone Acetate @ 700-1400mg/wk.

Was a stupid idea.

Anyways, I digress.
Awesome info here! Thanks a lot !
 
brofessorx

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I got some diene ace, even at 100mg/week makes my nips sore.
 
fueledpassion

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I got some diene ace, even at 100mg/week makes my nips sore.
Yes, and I know a while back you guys insisted on arguing with me about whether it converts to estrogen or not, but regardless the mechanism, estrogen levels increase greatly on this stuff. But so does strength and mass, lol. It's like the less androgenic version of MENT, to be honest.

My thoughts are that it also has boat loads of progesterone activity, making any sort of available estrogen considerably more effective.
 
brofessorx

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It wasn't an argument just a discussion based off of science. :spankme:

It treats me pretty much exactly as tren ace,
 
fueledpassion

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It wasn't an argument just a discussion based off of science. :spankme:

It treats me pretty much exactly as tren ace,
Yeah I know, but also I'm glad you now know that I'm not full of $&@! for having the position I had on Dienolone. Stuff makes me bloat pretty bad and like you, the nipples get enflamed and gyno sneaks up if I dont treat it immediately.

One day I'm getting those stupid tit glands cut out so I can stop all the circusry with estrogen management.
 
brofessorx

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One day I'm getting those stupid tit glands cut out so I can stop all the circusry with estrogen management.
Same here. I was going to get it done back in 09, but chickened out. Def going to have it done soon though.
 

Spurfy

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Just run raloxifene
-- AIs are completely outdated now. There's nothing better for gyno prevention or treatment than raloxifene.
 
Godstrength

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@hairygrandpa just curious what your final thoughts are on this? Getting ready to do a low dose trest cruise/cycle and have ralox on hand.... Should I add some proviron or mast in low-moderate dose? Use ralox in conjunction? Just curious how you concluded the matter... I have a feeling youre going to say dht helps which is my thinking here.
 
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Brain5ick

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Just run raloxifene
-- AIs are completely outdated now. There's nothing better for gyno prevention or treatment than raloxifene.
I’ll be doing a little run of it for a bit because I hear out of that and nolva, ralox is actually much better at curing older gyno. Should be interesting.
 

CroLifter

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It is strong, like I said earlier, start at 15mg/day w/ Ralox @ 30-60mg/day. Adjust from there as desired.

Higher doses I would also prefer the mild diuretic, as water retention does become sort of an issue for some.

When I said "if it were me" - that should have triggered you to realize in your head --> "whatever he is about to say is probably more aggressive than what I should do, since he has taken IM MENT before and I haven't."

In regards to strength and pumps, 15mg/day MENT feels alot like 500mg/wk of Test-C.

In regards to actual anabolic activity/ weight gain that dose would compare also to 500-750mg/wk Test-C.

In terms of appetite, 15mg MENT is comparable to a low dose of Tren-E, say 200mg/wk.

In term of bloat, it's alot like a modest dose of A-Bombs or D-Bol (25-50mg/day).

25mg/day and all that just amplifies. Most people compare 50mg/day to a gram of Test weekly, but I think that is still underestimating what the experience is like. The only other compound I've experienced that was stronger was when I took Dienolone Acetate @ 700-1400mg/wk.

Was a stupid idea.

Anyways, I digress.
Is the bloat on 15mg trest per day worse than 500mg test?

What would the advantage be of, say, running 250- 300mg of trest over a gram of test, if these are comparable at those doses in anabolic potency?
 
Codybenz

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First off, what the hell are doing considering a cycle already? Please tell me this is for 6 months down the road.

With that out of the way. I’m taking 50mg of IM Trest Ace every day. 150mg of test a week(trt) 2-3 mg of arimidex a week. 100mg of proviron a day, and .5mg of caber a week. I’ve had zero problems with estrogen getting out of whack or gyno. I would consider myself a moderate estrogen converter.
 

CroLifter

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i can run 650mg test per week with no ai and experience 0 gyno issues.

However what interests me is whether ment is easier on the prostate?

You know what is funny, neither masteron nor proviron caused me shedding or prostate discomfort.
However, transdermal 11 ketotestosterone applied to the testicles oh man, dozens of hair strands in the bath every time i showered (i usually get few if any) and for some reason i felt this pressure in the lowest part of the abdomen and peed very frequently small amounts.
 
Rocket3015

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Good info in here!
 
ItalOne

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You can reduce gyno but the only way to get rid of it is surgery
Most people cannot wrap there head around the fact there is different kinds of gyno.

PUBERTAL - CANNOT be treated by AI’s or SERMS.. Staying lean helps, but only surgery will eliminate this.

Prolactin- This is caused by elevated estrogen. You can literally lactate without having any pain or physically noticeable side effects. Cannot be controlled with a SERM only with a AI and dopamine antagonist. This is not permanent!

Lumps - Are permanent but CAN be controlled and reduced by using a combination AI and Serm. If the lumps are controlled before the breast tissue begins to mutate and change shape. You can put the lumps into REMISSION by NOT cycling for a long time or EVER again. If you do cycle highly aromatizing compounds again or let your estrogen get out of control without using a AI or Serm, then these same lumps will come back in the same spot over and over again.

Mutating Cones - This is what happens if the LUMPS sre not controlled and you KEEP cycling. The breast itself starts to mutate in a cone pyramid shaped LIKE A WOMANS breast pointing down and out. This is the most OBVIOUS form of gyno. NO AMOUNT OF RALOX OR LETRO will bring the breast shape back to normal. ONLY SURGERY!

This is information most people do not understand. This should be a sticky!
 
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cstallion

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So is Trest Ace supposed to be really thick? I just tried to draw some into an insulin syringe and it wasn’t working too well, plunger didn’t want to move?

How do you guys inject? With slin gauges or larger?
 
Codybenz

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So is Trest Ace supposed to be really thick? I just tried to draw some into an insulin syringe and it wasn’t working too well, plunger didn’t want to move?

How do you guys inject? With slin gauges or larger?
Depends on the concentration. Mine is 75 mg per ml so not thick. What is yours?

I have been injecting delts with a 25 gauge
 

cstallion

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Depends on the concentration. Mine is 75 mg per ml so not thick. What is yours?

I have been injecting delts with a 25 gauge
Ok, that might make sense. Mine is OR’s 100mg/ml, I was using a 29 gauge I think? Might have to roll up to Kroger’s and get a 25 gauge then.

You dosing ED or EOD @Codybenz?
Thanks man!
 
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Rocket3015

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Mine was 50 mg per ML used a slin pin but it would draw very slow.
 
ItalOne

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So is Trest Ace supposed to be really thick? I just tried to draw some into an insulin syringe and it wasn’t working too well, plunger didn’t want to move?

How do you guys inject? With slin gauges or larger?
The concentration doesn’t mean a damn thing! The viscosity is dependent apron the carrier oil. MCT and MIG Flow the best. GSo, cotton seed and avocado oil all have lower viscosity and flow more slowly.
 
Godstrength

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Dammit I recessitated this more than 2 year old thread bc I had a legit question for @hairygrandpa and now its turned into a full on cycle log

That is all... Carry on haha
 
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cstallion

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Why fuk around drawing with a slin pin? It takes literally 5secs to draw with an 18, swap to shooting needle, you cheap lazy bastardz.
Because I don't have access to anything other a slin pin. I ordered some 21, 23 and 25 gauge needles, but the package has been delayed. Where I live, you have to have a script to buy syringes, with the exception of slin pins. So, yeah... but I'm still a cheap, lazy bastard!
 

cstallion

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The concentration doesn’t mean a damn thing! The viscosity is dependent apron the carrier oil. MCT and MIG Flow the best. GSo, cotton seed and avocado oil all have lower viscosity and flow more slowly.
Word. Thanks for explaining that.
 
ItalOne

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Why fuk around drawing with a slin pin? It takes literally 5secs to draw with an 18, swap to shooting needle, you cheap lazy bastardz.
Yup this!! I actually draw with a 20 gauge, it does a little less damage to the stopper. Then switch to a 25 gauge 1 inch for everything and everywhere. Some people back load there insulin syringes, though this technique is usually far from sterile.
 
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