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Tren Xtreme - XTREME SHUTDOWN- PLEASE HELP!!!

ok well I got the Paravol and HGHup and Clomidex in the mail today.

I started taking the Clomid 2 days ago - it seemed like most people who recommended only the Clomid said they felt their libido come back in a week. And the Restart Protocols call for 2 weeks of Clomid.

so I am thinking try 2 weeks of Clomid and Extenze before adding anything else- just in the interest of weening myself off any more supplements rather than adding more . And if the Clomid doesn't do the trick then add the HGHup and the Clomidex. This is back to my previous concern that Clomidex will do the trick but only for the time I am on it. I read teh HGHup tech writeup and it seems like it is exactly what I need though!... I just don't want to be dependent on supplements anymore!!! (It is sitting on top of my fridge taunting me!)

Today is my third day of 50 mg of Clomid and this morning I woke up with wood for the first time in God only knows! I also feel better today and much more like myself! I also had scary ass nightmares the last 2 nights which I think is related to the Clomid. I am almost out of the bottle though and more is in the mail (taking longer than I estimated) but I think I will have to cut it to 25mg for the next 3 days until my package gets here with the rest. I can drop down to 25mg as long as I don't go off it right? Perhaps I see a light at the end of the tunnels even the doctors cant help!!
 
I got my new test results back today (I wasnt using anything at the time):

SEX HORMONE BINDING GLOBULIN 34 (7 - 49 nmol/L)
T-4, FREE 1.1 (0.8 - 1.8 ng/dL)
TSH 3.35 (0.40 - 4.50 mIU/L)
LH 5.3 (1.5 - 9.3 mIU/mL)
FSH 3.5 (1.6 - 8.0 mIU/mL)
IGF-I 142 (126 - 382 ng/mL)
 
Keep us posted. Im keen to follow this.

The first cycle I ran was OmnEvol (only lasted 10 days thank goodness) but I was totally shut down. Didnt even know what a serm was. So if it makes you feel better running OmnEvol without a serm is even stupider than what you did! Lots of people mess up the first cycle when a noob.
Anyway, I was screwed. Nothing worked and no libido. Went to several doctors and finally an Endo. He prescribed pharma clomid (which is sweet because now I have a 10 refil prescription). Libido and function were back in a few weeks. But to reiterate others comments, you need to run the clomid for a month. Then youll be OK. I also think a TRS course is a good idea. But run it after 3 weeks of clomid stand alone. IMO anyway.

As I said keep us posted dude. Good luck. I know this sucks so bad, but you'll be ok soon enough. Just stick with the clomid
 
pbrocky said:
Keep us posted. Im keen to follow this.

The first cycle I ran was OmnEvol (only lasted 10 days thank goodness) but I was totally shut down. Didnt even know what a serm was. So if it makes you feel better running OmnEvol without a serm is even stupider than what you did! Lots of people mess up the first cycle when a noob.
Anyway, I was screwed. Nothing worked and no libido. Went to several doctors and finally an Endo. He prescribed pharma clomid (which is sweet because now I have a 10 refil prescription). Libido and function were back in a few weeks. But to reiterate others comments, you need to run the clomid for a month. Then youll be OK. I also think a TRS course is a good idea. But run it after 3 weeks of clomid stand alone. IMO anyway.

As I said keep us posted dude. Good luck. I know this sucks so bad, but you'll be ok soon enough. Just stick with the clomid
Click to expand...

thanks man your story makes me feel better like theres a light at the end of this aweful tunnel!
 
stilllearnin1 said:
Do you mean you waited 8 months to take the PCT then your libido came back?
Click to expand...

Sorry bout that, I waited 8 months till I ran the cycle. Even a couple weeks after PCT I still didn't have it back. The clomid will help and you'll be back in business :drive:
 
spezzy said:
Sorry bout that, I waited 8 months till I ran the cycle. Even a couple weeks after PCT I still didn't have it back. The clomid will help and you'll be back in business :drive:
Click to expand...

So you ran the Clomid and your libido STILL didn't come back after a couple of weeks? How long did it take?
 
stillleamin1, and everyone else in this forum...

I have been dealing with the EXACT same problem as you, but for 2.5 years. I have never tried clomid. Maybe now i should.

I used methadrol..didn't properly PCT, and have been to 2 different urologists, an endocrinologists, psychologists, sex therapist, boston medical group... etc and no one knows whats wrong with me.

And EXACTLY like you said, its not "all in my head" because i;ve done the therapy, and try to FORCE myself for 2.5 years now to want to have sex, but its like i don't have the 'mental strength' to even get myself horny. EXACTLY how you've described. H
Have had my blood work done 3 times, all hormones of any type, are in perfect/normal range.

I had thrown around the idea though, of taking another prohormone ( or not taking a another prohormone) and doing the PROPER pct, with a clomid, not just a novedexXT, and trying to "REBOOT", as you said, my system.

What is your pct regime your doing right now? have you gotten any positive response to it?

Anyone else out there...what would be a great, reliable, PCT. (even at this point, maybe i don't need a pct, because all my bloodwork is normal) but atleast a proper PCT--products used, duration, amount of each....ANY HELP WOULD BE GREAT

thanks
TIGER
 
OP, I made the idiot mistake of running a solo cycle of tren (the real AAS) about 10 years ago, and it shut down my libido hardcore. For months. Took clomid... no help. Took all the then-available OTC test-boosters (tribulus, etc.) and... nada. All hormonal tests came back "normal."

My advice: Take the clomid (and the other OTC products if you want)... but stay the hell away from Clomidex, if we're talking about the AMS product with the matrix aromatase inhibitors in it. An AI will probably only worsen matters for you at this point. No ATD, 6-bromo, etc. High estrogen isn't the issue for you --- hormonal imbalance is.

Most of all, KNOW THIS: Your libido will return. It may take time, but the less you worry about it, the sooner that day will come. Basically -- quit trippin'. Your body will normalize and sex will once again become a huge priority in your life... for better or for worse.

In the meantime, use this as an opportunity to get things accomplished. I'm serious. My to-do list is always much longer than it needs to be because of my unceasing-typical-male desire to insert my penis into one of the warm, moist orifices of a beautiful woman's body on a consistent basis.

Anyway, best of luck... especially on the last part.
 
the tiger said:
I have been dealing with the EXACT same problem as you, but for 2.5 years. I have never tried clomid. Maybe now i should.
Click to expand...

I would suggest toremifene over clomid, but that's just me. Since you've not taken a SERM, and the docs can't seem to find the issue, then I see no real harm in giving this a shot. I've used toremifene when I was pretty shutdown, and it worked wonders with a quickness. I would suggest the following dosing scheme:

Day 1: 120 mg
Day 2: 90 mg
Day 3: 90 mg
Days 4-7: 60 mg
Weeks 2-3: 60 mg
Week 4: 30mg

One warning: Your balls may expand to the size of medium-sized grapefruits... but hey, that's not an intolerable side effect in your situation, right? :lol:
 
Greatly appreciate your input- Rubberring-

So, you think TOREMIFENE is the way to go, to restore libido after a prohormone cycle? thats the best SERM these days?

And just cycle it- or should i throw in any sustain alpha or anything?

thanks
tiger
 
the tiger said:
Greatly appreciate your input- Rubberring-

So, you think TOREMIFENE is the way to go, to restore libido after a prohormone cycle? thats the best SERM these days?

And just cycle it- or should i throw in any sustain alpha or anything?

thanks
tiger
Click to expand...

Sustain Alpha is a great product, but I'd go solo with the SERM. There is a mild AI in the SA, and you just never know what kind of synergy that may induce in a case like yours. If anything, you can always go to a 5-on, 2-off dosing of it after the toremifene run.

(Replied to your PM with an RC discount code.)
 
Vernymac, quick question, sorry to highjack this thread. Did you run real sust250 or one of the brands like legalsteriods? Reason I ask is I ran legit sust250 and it gave me wicked rage I had to quit half way thru my cycle felt like jumping out off my own skin. also no PCT felt fine a few days out. Did you experience anything like this?
 
rubberring said:
OP, I made the idiot mistake of running a solo cycle of tren (the real AAS) about 10 years ago, and it shut down my libido hardcore. For months. Took clomid... no help. Took all the then-available OTC test-boosters (tribulus, etc.) and... nada. All hormonal tests came back "normal."

My advice: Take the clomid (and the other OTC products if you want)... but stay the hell away from Clomidex, if we're talking about the AMS product with the matrix aromatase inhibitors in it. An AI will probably only worsen matters for you at this point. No ATD, 6-bromo, etc. High estrogen isn't the issue for you --- hormonal imbalance is.

Most of all, KNOW THIS: Your libido will return. It may take time, but the less you worry about it, the sooner that day will come. Basically -- quit trippin'. Your body will normalize and sex will once again become a huge priority in your life... for better or for worse.

In the meantime, use this as an opportunity to get things accomplished. I'm serious. My to-do list is always much longer than it needs to be because of my unceasing-typical-male desire to insert my penis into one of the warm, moist orifices of a beautiful woman's body on a consistent basis.

Anyway, best of luck... especially on the last part.
Click to expand...

thanks for all the advice man

yeah - i have been taking advantage of it that regard. however i have a girlfriend who is suffering along with me..and i love her so much and its terribly painful that she has to suffer too because of my dumb ass. and i dont want to lose her! how long did it take you to get back on track? and yeah I was talking about the same 6bromo Clomidex - it came recommended so strongly and i am sure that it would fix it temporarily. but you think its gonna set me back on my recovery? while i was on 6-oxo i had a better libido and when i had a testosterone depot shot i had no issues whatsoever for a couple weeks but obviously that isnt a sustainable plan. there has to be some chemical or something that is affecting the libido that is missing that the 19Nor depletes!
 
stilllearnin1 said:
thanks for all the advice man

yeah - i have been taking advantage of it that regard. however i have a girlfriend who is suffering along with me..and i love her so much and its terribly painful that she has to suffer too because of my dumb ass. and i dont want to lose her! how long did it take you to get back on track? and yeah I was talking about the same 6bromo Clomidex - it came recommended so strongly and i am sure that it would fix it temporarily. but you think its gonna set me back on my recovery? while i was on 6-oxo i had a better libido and when i had a testosterone depot shot i had no issues whatsoever for a couple weeks but obviously that isnt a sustainable plan. there has to be some chemical or something that is affecting the libido that is missing that the 19Nor depletes!
Click to expand...

Yes, my advice would be to steer completely clear of any AI. Have you tried a product like Activate Xtreme or Testofen? Those products definitely increase free testosterone. Also, herbs like longjack and maca have a good reputation in the libido department. NOW Foods makes both of those products on the cheap.

In the meantime, for your girlfriend's sake... get some Cialis. It won't increase your libido, but it will have you up and at 'em with very little work on her part. I like it much better than Viagra because one dose usually has effects over a 2-3 day period. You'd be surprised what that might do for you psychologically at this point. I know your lack of libido is not "all in your head," but after a while it takes its toll on a guy from a confidence standpoint. Being able to have a rock-hard boner from a PDE-5 inhibitor might just be the boost you need.
 
rubberring said:
Yes, my advice would be to steer completely clear of any AI. Have you tried a product like Activate Xtreme or Testofen? Those products definitely increase free testosterone. Also, herbs like longjack and maca have a good reputation in the libido department. NOW Foods makes both of those products on the cheap.

In the meantime, for your girlfriend's sake... get some Cialis. It won't increase your libido, but it will have you up and at 'em with very little work on her part. I like it much better than Viagra because one dose usually has effects over a 2-3 day period. You'd be surprised what that might do for you psychologically at this point. I know your lack of libido is not "all in your head," but after a while it takes its toll on a guy from a confidence standpoint. Being able to have a rock-hard boner from a PDE-5 inhibitor might just be the boost you need.
Click to expand...

yeah but the PDE5's dont work at ALL they only worked when i was on the 6oxo and didnt work that great - they worked perfect when i had the testosterone but i didnt really need them then...

how does Activate compare to the Testopro? Looks like the main ingredient "Divanillyltetrahydrofuran " is in both.. I just ordered that and I was going to add on to the Clomid after my 3rd week with the HGHup. I also currently have a bottle of Paravol in my closet and Max Anabol

And yes it has taken a toll on my confidence I am like not the same person anymore
 
stilllearnin1 said:
yeah but the PDE5's dont work at ALL they only worked when i was on the 6oxo and didnt work that great - they worked perfect when i had the testosterone but i didnt really need them then...

how does Activate compare to the Testopro? Looks like the main ingredient "Divanillyltetrahydrofuran " is in both.. I just ordered that and I was going to add on to the Clomid after my 3rd week with the HGHup. I also currently have a bottle of Paravol in my closet and Max Anabol

And yes it has taken a toll on my confidence I am like not the same person anymore
Click to expand...

Keep in mind that, if you used a liquid version of the PDE-5 inhibitor, it was probably severely under-dosed. If you want a legit RC source, send me a PM.

What's in the Max Anabol? Just knowing it's a Max Muscle product doesn't thrill me. Everything else you have looks good-to-go. Probably won't need the Paravol. It's pretty mild stuff. I'd save it for a later date.
 
rubberring said:
Keep in mind that, if you used a liquid version of the PDE-5 inhibitor, it was probably severely under-dosed. If you want a legit RC source, send me a PM.

What's in the Max Anabol? Just knowing it's a Max Muscle product doesn't thrill me. Everything else you have looks good-to-go. Probably won't need the Paravol. It's pretty mild stuff. I'd save it for a later date.
Click to expand...

yeah i have some pharma Viagra :( which doesnt work now and i have liquid tadalifil which wont now which did work in small doses when on test
 
holy s h i t. i was about to start a x-tren 4 week cycle and this is making me really nervous now!

is a PCT such as this ( sustain alpha, toco-8 and milk thislte ) ok or will i have the same issues?
 
lemonade said:
holy s h i t. i was about to start a x-tren 4 week cycle and this is making me really nervous now!

is a PCT such as this ( sustain alpha, toco-8 and milk thislte ) ok or will i have the same issues?
Click to expand...

bro... do some research if you honestly think any of those would be used as a pct.
 
lemonade said:
holy s h i t. i was about to start a x-tren 4 week cycle and this is making me really nervous now!

is a PCT such as this ( sustain alpha, toco-8 and milk thislte ) ok or will i have the same issues?
Click to expand...
i think his situation is different..he took no proper PCT but also the more we see his test results and talk to him his situation may not even be related to his tren use..
at 4 weeks you should be ok with the PP PCT..but others will tell you to have a Serm...i would at leat order some clomid and keep it on hand just in case..i would also recomend you get some dermacrine if running the x-tren..this should keep you from having hard shut down..you want your PCT as easy on you as you can..I actually ran Paravol and dermacrine the entire 6 week cycle of tren and p-plex..still wake up with chubbies almost every morning..only side affect i noticed was sensitive nipples but after 1 dose of clomid and 2 days off tren almost no sensitivity....

stilllearnin1... like rubbering said i would hold off on the Paravol til after your finished with clomid.. i just dropped mine as well and plan on adding it back after the clomid....i dont think you will need it while on..as the clomid will give you what your looking for...i would start it the day you finish the clomid..
 
purelife1 said:
i would also recomend you get some dermacrine if running the x-tren..this should keep you from having hard shut down.
Click to expand...

isnt the sustain alpha suppose to help with my test levels? and yea ive heard some say a SERM is needed so ill take you advice and definitely keep it on hand atleast!or would you suggest using Hdrol since its less harsh?(this is my first cycle)
Thanks purelife!
 
tren may be a bit much if your first cycle..hdrol is weak but if your first cycle you should do well....sustain alpha is supposed to help bring levels back...but remember you are running a cycle with no test which is going to cause low sex drive and lethargy..dermacrine will help off set this..but if you switch to hdrol i wouldnt worry to much about loss of libido
 
oh ok. so for tren you suggest i add dermacrine to my sustain alpha, toco-8 and then have clomid on hand?
does clomid only come into play after im done with those or do i use it as soon as, if i get, swollen/ sore nipples?
 
dermacrine you run with the tren..its a mild PH...the clomid you take for PCT..dont take while on cycle
 
Step 1: Stop taking random ****. This means HCG too. HCG is not PCT. HCG will shut you down more. It is good for on cycle because it maintains testicular function.

Step 2: Get blood tests done immediately. Don't bother talking to your doctor. Come on here, post them, and I will tell you what you need to do. Unless your doctor is very in the know about how to diagnose this ****, he will probably no less than most of the guys on this forum.

Step 2 Alternative: If you can't get blood tests done, start taking a SERM (clomid or nolvAdex), not the OTC (over the counter) crap. 4 weeks, 120mg on the first day, 40mg the next 6, 30 the next week, 20 the last 2 weeks. SERMS don't lower estrogen levels, they just keep the estrogen from effecting certain things in the body. Your body wants HOMEOSTASIS, so keeping E2 levels high will help with PCT.

I have to ask, though. Viagra should have worked even with low testosterone levels. You may psychologically not be able to get an erection. When you start taking more and more stuff you gain that 'roid confidence that many do, and you might break out of your shell so to speak.

Edit: Just read through the topic. I see the blood tests and the fact you stopped taking random things to try and help out. I think it might be in your head (as other users pointed out).

However, natural test levels don't effect FSH and LH levels negatively. You had pretty low FSH levels in the first and recent blood tests, which means you probably were signifigantly shut down. SERM use should help bring these up.
 
BigBlackGuy said:
I have to ask, though. Viagra should have worked even with low testosterone levels. You may psychologically not be able to get an erection. When you start taking more and more stuff you gain that 'roid confidence that many do, and you might break out of your shell so to speak.
Click to expand...

he has posted and talked about that as well...im thinking its psychological for him at this point.... i explained to him i have similar problems when i depend on the other products to give me the edge..when i dont have them i feel i cant perform to that level so im afraid to even attempt these pleasures:drive:
 
Almost the same problem here. However , I can still get a boner, however is not as rock-hard as usual, and whereas a girl with a nice perfume would stand next to me I would get an instant/natural erection, now I just feel like having sex or not does not make any difference.


Took some advices here, third day on Clomid now, and also taking some " natural" Ginseng/Yohimbine products....
 
BigBlackGuy said:
Step 1: Stop taking random ****. This means HCG too. HCG is not PCT. HCG will shut you down more. It is good for on cycle because it maintains testicular function.

Step 2: Get blood tests done immediately. Don't bother talking to your doctor. Come on here, post them, and I will tell you what you need to do. Unless your doctor is very in the know about how to diagnose this ****, he will probably no less than most of the guys on this forum.

Step 2 Alternative: If you can't get blood tests done, start taking a SERM (clomid or nolvAdex), not the OTC (over the counter) crap. 4 weeks, 120mg on the first day, 40mg the next 6, 30 the next week, 20 the last 2 weeks. SERMS don't lower estrogen levels, they just keep the estrogen from effecting certain things in the body. Your body wants HOMEOSTASIS, so keeping E2 levels high will help with PCT.

I have to ask, though. Viagra should have worked even with low testosterone levels. You may psychologically not be able to get an erection. When you start taking more and more stuff you gain that 'roid confidence that many do, and you might break out of your shell so to speak.

Edit: Just read through the topic. I see the blood tests and the fact you stopped taking random things to try and help out. I think it might be in your head (as other users pointed out).

However, natural test levels don't effect FSH and LH levels negatively. You had pretty low FSH levels in the first and recent blood tests, which means you probably were signifigantly shut down. SERM use should help bring these up.
Click to expand...


I am on my 15th day of Clomid 50mg/day and today i took 25mg for the first day. Its not in my head. I know it. Its not. I cant get it up over an 30% erection watching porn by myself with 100mg of pharma viagra. i can force myself to cum - and its watery and lame. The 2nd day I took the clomid I felt horny for about 20 mins about 30 mins after i took and that was it. sometimes in the middle of the night i wake up with a 30% wood. this thing is dead man. its not in my head. I can admit that there is some anxiety related to it sure. its partially a problem. but i just DONT want to F*CK. Not even kinda.

The dosage you recommend seems really high compared to what I have read about restart protocols - I saw some people saying to take that much so I tried that initially at 100mg a day but i got such bad moodswings and weird vision blurs. i was crying and stuff for no reason lol. so i quit taking it after 5 days or so figuring that it wasnt helping...
 
I would make some blood tests to know progesterone and prolactin levels.

Tren is a progestin, and neither Nolva nor Clomid help reduce prolactin levels.
Besides inhibiting the secretion of gonadoliberin by hypotalamus (and thus lowering secretion of LH), prolactin also prevents testosterone from converting to DHT.
And libido issues on progestins are mainly associated with low DHT levels.

Nolva and Clomid help with the first part, increasing production of LH, but can do nothing with the effect of prolactin on DHT.
I think its worth trying a dopamine receptor agonist like Dostinex (cabergoline). Half tablet (.25 mg) twice a week for two weeks should be enough.
 
Arkh said:
I would make some blood tests to know progesterone and prolactin levels.

Tren is a progestin, and neither Nolva nor Clomid help reduce prolactin levels.
Besides inhibiting the secretion of gonadoliberin by hypotalamus (and thus lowering secretion of LH), prolactin also prevents testosterone from converting to DHT.
And libido issues on progestins are mainly associated with low DHT levels.

Nolva and Clomid help with the first part, increasing production of LH, but can do nothing with the effect of prolactin on DHT.
I think its worth trying a dopamine receptor agonist like Dostinex (cabergoline). Half tablet (.25 mg) twice a week for two weeks should be enough.
Click to expand...

I tried Parlodel for 2 weeks but it didn't do anything at all except make me feel like sh*t and keep me from ever really falling completely asleep... i am with you on the low DHT - i cant get my doc or my endo to order the dht or progesterone test though. and my prolactin test came back in the mid range. if i have normal testosterone blood tests then there must be some sort of problem converting it to DHT? Do you know how to fix it?
 
If your prolactin test is normal, I would check prostate too. Might be the cause.

BTW, Parlodel (Bromochriptine) is 1st generation dopamine receptor agonist, a very harsh substance. Better use cabergoline as it is a 3rd gen. selective drug, you would not feel that bad as with parlodel.
 
i say at this point keep rocking the clomid and run entire run and c what happens
 
As odd as it may sound, but start forcing yourself to jurk off every day, minimal once, better is more. Within a month or two you'll rebound.
 
J-ing off doesn't do anything.

I am dealing with the EXACT same issue, and my 'sex therapist' made me do that sh*t for months, saying it would make me feel normal again-and all this is 'in my head'.

No, its not 'in my head'. Something is wrong..Only someone in this position can truly describe whats going on with there body, and people need to trust, when we say,

We know there is something wrong...Its not a mental thing...
 
the tiger said:
J-ing off doesn't do anything.

I am dealing with the EXACT same issue, and my 'sex therapist' made me do that sh*t for months, saying it would make me feel normal again-and all this is 'in my head'.

No, its not 'in my head'. Something is wrong..Only someone in this position can truly describe whats going on with there body, and people need to trust, when we say,

We know there is something wrong...Its not a mental thing...
Click to expand...

xx2
 
i believe you dude and am in the same position without use of steroids (8 years trouble with the ****)

it definitely looks like a progesterone, prolactin issue cuz of tren, or perhaps e2 is indeed too high

can you get bloodtests done?

if nothing works you're looking at lifelong TRT with perhaps some proviron/hgh...
 
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