Thrown on the TRT wagon

[blynch1]

Well gents, been a while since I’ve been on the forum. Took a break from lifting (2 kids, new house, etc) but finally took the leap to see a new doctor in my area about my low T; was sent to see a Urologist today.

A little back story:
Currently 25 yo, 185lbs (was 200lbs in my ‘peak’ of lifting 5-6 days/wk in 2020, 6ft tall).

Sept 2019 - Took my first PH cycle (8 wks) of 1/4 Andro along with Sustain Alpha, PCT with Clomid, MTest and Sustain Alpha.

Jan 2020 - Ran DMZ, StanoPlex and Sustain Alpha (6 wks), PCT again with Clomid, MTest and Sustain Alpha.

Packed on some good size from both runs, obviously much more from DMZ, but after the first I knew my T was wrecked (zero libido, ED issues, etc). Felt super fatigued most days, still to this day needing to pop Cialis (haven’t touched anything PH wise in 3 years) and my T came back 2 weeks ago at 289, with 280 being the lowest on the ‘normal’ range at my doctor. Doc asked, following me mentioning my PH use, “why didn’t you just take Test?” I like this guy.

As mentioned, was referred to the Urologist, in which they gave me the option to choose any TRT option I wanted (surprised at this) and even offered up Clomid or HCG injections twice a week, but knowing the patches and gel are **** and Clomid making me depressed and soft as **** mentally in the past, I knew T injections were the way to go; although I’m not opposed on going the HCG route - maybe in addition though.

She prescribed me 100mg of Test Cyp to be injected once a week to start and suggested I cycle in order to try and sustain some sort of fertility if I wanted more kids in the future. I’ve read on other threads that 150-200mg is the ‘sweet’ spot for most getting TRT, so we’ll see how 100mg goes once I get word that my pharm has it and I start injecting and I get bloods in a few months.

Any advice going forward and being on this BS? I knew the risks of taking the PH’s and most of you bro’s have been lucky on recovery/PCT, but not this guy! Lol this is what I get.

I did start lifting again and would be interested to get some extra Cyp down the road potentially to run actual cycles of Test; hopefully safer/more effective but obviously don’t want to **** myself since I got the ability to be on TRT. Last thing I want is to skyrocket my levels when I need blood work, lowering my prescribed dosage I planned on starting back up lifting with some solid natty supps and my TRT before venturing into obtaining more Cyp. Open to suggestions here!

 

[blynch1]

Damn, 8 weeks of 1/4 andro shut you down for good? That's rough, I wonder how often that happens. Sorry I don't have any trt advice but I'm sure other guys will give you all you need.

crazy, right?! Compounds hit people differently for sure. I also felt way worse on 1/4 Andro all around vs DMZ!

 

[Stacks1]

Did you ever get blood work done prior to your first cycle to see what your test was?

 

[blynch1]

Did you ever get blood work done prior to your first cycle to see what your test was?

Nope. Wish I would have. Just wanted to get swole quick and not care about my blood work prior to, which was stupid! Would’ve been nice to see my baseline.

 

[Mikereyn513]

Why don't you just freeze your Seeman just in case you want more kids that why you don't have to worry about hcg. Unless you paranoid about testicular atrophy, you may not even get that, I don't and I know some other dudes on here that doesn't happen to

 

[Smont]

Why don't you just freeze your Seeman just in case you want more kids that why you don't have to worry about hcg. Unless you paranoid about testicular atrophy, you may not even get that, I don't and I know some other dudes on here that doesn't happen to

I don't get it either. I also for some reason maintain good sperm quality, quantity and motility.

Hell, Ronnie Coleman had 4 kids while he was competing.

I think we often talk about genetics for growth and drug response and side effects. But I'm sure fertility is going to be genetic as well

 

[Smont]

I can't remember what BB coach it is but there fertility protocol is 3000mg test per week and some hcg and his clients wires get knocked up fast, but almost always have girls for some reason

 

[Mikereyn513]

I don't get it either. I also for some reason maintain good sperm quality, quantity and motility.

Hell, Ronnie Coleman had 4 kids while he was competing.

I think we often talk about genetics for growth and drug response and side effects. But I'm sure fertility is going to be genetic as well

You were one if the ones I was thinking of just didn't want to mention you directly. At this point in my life I'm not even trying to have kids do I hope my fertility is f.cked that way when i do eventually get laid there will be no condoms for Mikey

 

[Stacks1]

Nope. Wish I would have. Just wanted to get swole quick and not care about my blood work prior to, which was stupid! Would’ve been nice to see my baseline.

I was just curious because your test is still technically within normal range. Sure it's not where you want it to be but it's still not as bad as it could be. If I was 25 and my test on the lower end of the normal range... I don't know. I would probably give the clomid a shot. Not trying to push you into it.. totally your choice but for me I think it would be worth a shot.

 

[Smont]

I was just curious because your test is still technically within normal range. Sure it's not where you want it to be but it's still not as bad as it could be. If I was 25 and my test on the lower end of the normal range... I don't know. I would probably give the clomid a shot. Not trying to push you into it.. totally your choice but for me I think it would be worth a shot.

"Normal range if your 75" and even tho the range might be 250-1000, 1500 is still a natural testosterone number. If you go back 50 years ago, normal testosterone was 1000+

The current "normal range" is a joke, they want men to be docile little ladies with low testosterone.

Now let me just clarify, unless someone specifically wants trt, I think trying to raise it by other means first should be the approach.


Also, unrelated, did I read correctly, his Dr. Perscribed 100mg a week and suggests cycling it....... worst fucking advice for someone with already low test. It's going to do more damage

 

[Stacks1]

I don't get it either. I also for some reason maintain good sperm quality, quantity and motility.

Hell, Ronnie Coleman had 4 kids while he was competing.

I think we often talk about genetics for growth and drug response and side effects. But I'm sure fertility is going to be genetic as well

Ronnie Coleman was a freak. He said he felt zero side effects from AAS. Said he felt exactly the same on and off cycle and never had an issues with it. But Ronnie also didn't start cycling until he was 30 so that probably helped too. Arnold had a kid at 50... basically it varies from person to person.

 

[Smont]

Ya Ronnie is a definite freak. He has lots of injuries but steroids didn't seem to effect his health. I think it's kind of like how some people can smoke cigarettes till they're ninety and others get lung cancer at 45, genetics

 

[Stacks1]

"Normal range if your 75" and even tho the range might be 250-1000, 1500 is still a natural testosterone number. If you go back 50 years ago, normal testosterone was 1000+

The current "normal range" is a joke, they want men to be docile little ladies with low testosterone.

Now let me just clarify, unless someone specifically wants trt, I think trying to raise it by other means first should be the approach.


Also, unrelated, did I read correctly, his Dr. Perscribed 100mg a week and suggests cycling it....... worst fucking advice for someone with already low test. It's going to do more damage

Yeah that's true... it is below the normal range for a 25 year old. So the doctor either mislead him or he's in another country where the numbers are different?

 

[blynch1]

I was just curious because your test is still technically within normal range. Sure it's not where you want it to be but it's still not as bad as it could be. If I was 25 and my test on the lower end of the normal range... I don't know. I would probably give the clomid a shot. Not trying to push you into it.. totally your choice but for me I think it would be worth a shot.

Valid points for sure and appreciate the feedback.
I mentioned it before, I ran Clomid for both of my PCT’s and although maybe I’d have different results running it now being that I haven’t taken any AAS in years, it made me feel like a ***** and after my final run in 2020, my T was in the 250s so it’s not like it shot up my T unless I was literally at 0. That was my concern going that route. As for freezing the swimmers, definitely could be an option, it just wasn’t one given to me at my initial appt.

As for the low-normal T, I just don’t want to accept that 289 is ‘good’. I’m 25, HAVE to take Cialis and am tired af 24/7 so I believed going the TRT route was my last viable option outside of the HCG avenue.

 

[Stacks1]

Ya Ronnie is a definite freak. He has lots of injuries but steroids didn't seem to effect his health. I think it's kind of like how some people can smoke cigarettes till they're ninety and others get lung cancer at 45, genetics

Genetics are a huge part of it. Interestingly enough, Ronnie also said he didn't notice any increase in strength from AAS but as far as conditioning he said it was night and day on AAS. That guy was just an all around genetic freak. Look at Jay Cutler today.. the guy is still huge. Sure he doesn't look like he did when he competed but he's still huge. Genetics play a huge role in bodybuilding... from how big you can get to how you even respond to the AAS.

 

[blynch1]

Yeah that's true... it is below the normal range for a 25 year old. So the doctor either mislead him or he's in another country where the numbers are different?

I’m in OH. Doctor surely didn’t mislead me by any means - that’s literally the scale used to determine ‘normal’ T levels (280-1,000 ng/dL).
Invalid Link Removed

 

[Stacks1]

Valid points for sure and appreciate the feedback.
I mentioned it before, I ran Clomid for both of my PCT’s and although maybe I’d have different results running it now being that I haven’t taken any AAS in years, it made me feel like a ***** and after my final run, my T was in the 250s so it’s not like it shot up my T unless I was literally at 0. That was my concern going that route. As for freezing the swimmers, definitely could be an option, it just wasn’t one given to me at my initial appt.

As for the low-normal T, I just don’t want to accept that 289 is ‘good’. I’m 25, HAVE to take Cialis and am tired af 24/7 so I believed going the TRT route was my last viable option outside of the HCG avenue.

Yeah man understood. My feeling on the whole clomid thing is that there is little to lose by just giving it another shot. If it doesn't work you can just jump back on to TRT. But I get what you're saying, especially if you had side effects from the clomid. I've always had success with it without any side effects so maybe I'm just one of the lucky ones.

 

[blynch1]

Also, unrelated, did I read correctly, his Dr. Perscribed 100mg a week and suggests cycling it....... worst fucking advice for someone with already low test. It's going to do more damage

You read that right. She did mentioned I may experience ups and downs from the cycling but wanted to start off with that approach for the fertility aspect. She mentioned that I can always transition to the fully ‘on’ TRT whenever I want, which was nice to hear that I have quite a bit of options.

 

[blynch1]

Yeah man understood. My feeling on the whole clomid thing is that there is little to lose by just giving it another shot. If it doesn't work you can just jump back on to TRT. But I get what you're saying, especially if you had side effects from the clomid. I've always had success with it without any side effects so maybe I'm just one of the lucky ones.

For sure boss. Hell maybe I can just throw some Clomid in lol I still have quite a bit left. I know some guys experience the BS I did on it which is why they switched to using Nolva instead but either way, again appreciate your stance.

On the flip side, at least now I can travel with Cyp legally

 

[Stacks1]

I’m in OH. Doctor surely didn’t mislead me by any means - that’s literally the scale used to determine ‘normal’ T levels (280-1,000 ng/dL).
Invalid Link Removed

Yeah that's a general range for all individuals. But typically the younger you are the higher it should be. I think Smont is right, at 25 I would consider 289 to be below the normal range. In general for all individuals it's probably the "right" range... but that's not necessarily the best way to look at it.

 

[Stacks1]

For sure boss. Hell maybe I can just throw some Clomid in lol I still have quite a bit left. I know some guys experience the BS I did on it which is why they switched to using Nolva instead but either way, again appreciate your stance.

On the flip side, at least now I can travel with Cyp legally

Yeah... I mean, I always feel like it's worth a shot. Wouldn't be unheard of or surprising if the clomid took your test up to 600 - 800 range. Totally up to you though.

 

[sammpedd88]

You read that right. She did mentioned I may experience ups and downs from the cycling but wanted to start off with that approach for the fertility aspect. She mentioned that I can always transition to the fully ‘on’ TRT whenever I want, which was nice to hear that I have quite a bit of options.

I promise you, you will hate that cycling that she is referring to. My urologist did the same thing with me when I first got on TRT almost 10 years ago. That why I’ve been with a different dr for about 8 years now. If you’re wanting to have kids, try everything you can to boost your natural production to preserve your sperm. If nothing works, freeze your sperm and get on TRT. As has already mentioned, some guys still have good sperm quality and quantity while on TRT but freezing it would be insurance.

 

[blynch1]

I promise you, you will hate that cycling that she is referring to. My urologist did the same thing with me when I first got on TRT almost 10 years ago. That why I’ve been with a different dr for about 8 years now. If you’re wanting to have kids, try everything you can to boost your natural production to preserve your sperm. If nothing works, freeze your sperm and get on TRT. As has already mentioned, some guys still have good sperm quality and quantity while on TRT but freezing it would be insurance.

Glad to see you’ve had experience with the TRT cycling. The game plan is to run with it for the first few months, get bloods to see if the dosage is where I need it but I always have the option to opt for the full-on TRT and not cycle.
Sounds like freezing would be, like you mentioned, insurance so I will look into that option as well.
Thanks sir!

 

[sammpedd88]

Glad to see you’ve had experience with the TRT cycling. The game plan is to run with it for the first few months, get bloods to see if the dosage is where I need it but I always have the option to opt for the full-on TRT and not cycle.
Sounds like freezing would be, like you mentioned, insurance so I will look into that option as well.
Thanks sir!

The cycling not only will make you feel worse than you do now, but it can cause serious health issues relating to your cardiovascular system for one.

 

[Dustin07]

I can't remember what BB coach it is but there fertility protocol is 3000mg test per week and some hcg and his clients wires get knocked up fast, but almost always have girls for some reason

that's interesting. years ago I thought I had heard that high T usually correlated with more daughters and anecdotally we saw a lot of that among my police force and military friends but I just did some quick searches and most of the immediate studies I pulled indicated that high T yields more sons.

 

[blynch1]

that's interesting. years ago I thought I had heard that high T usually correlated with more daughters and anecdotally we saw a lot of that among my police force and military friends but I just did some quick searches and most of the immediate studies I pulled indicated that high T yields more sons.

Low T club here and I can say I have a 17mo daughter and 2 week old son lol not sure T levels matter much but who knows

 

[Dustin07]

Low T club here and I can say I have a 17mo daughter and 2 week old son lol not sure T levels matter much but who knows

my dad, brother, and I all threw boys but my brother has one daughter in his litter of 3 kids. He's military, but all the military brethren I know ended up with probably 60/40 girls to boys lol so IDK either

 

[Mikereyn513]

Low T club here and I can say I have a 17mo daughter and 2 week old son lol not sure T levels matter much but who knows

Congrats on the newborn bro

 

[Smont]

Genetics are a huge part of it. Interestingly enough, Ronnie also said he didn't notice any increase in strength from AAS but as far as conditioning he said it was night and day on AAS. That guy was just an all around genetic freak. Look at Jay Cutler today.. the guy is still huge. Sure he doesn't look like he did when he competed but he's still huge. Genetics play a huge role in bodybuilding... from how big you can get to how you even respond to the AAS.

I think the strength thing is because his training changed more from strength to bodybuilding. Plus he's kinda lieing because in his heyday he was doing 800lb deadlifts and he definitely wasn't doing that when he was in his early 20's

that's interesting. years ago I thought I had heard that high T usually correlated with more daughters and anecdotally we saw a lot of that among my police force and military friends but I just did some quick searches and most of the immediate studies I pulled indicated that high T yields more sons.

Maybe there's a difference between a natural high testosterone and injectable testosterone. Trt might produce 1000 for total test, but 3000 mg will probably put your testosterone over 10,000

 

[blynch1]

Congrats on the newborn bro

Appreciate it bro!

 

[Stacks1]

I think the strength thing is because his training changed more from strength to bodybuilding. Plus he's kinda lieing because in his heyday he was doing 800lb deadlifts and he definitely wasn't doing that when he was in his early 20's

That's true... he started as a powerlifter. As far as the strength, I'm sure he was probably at his strongest over the years he was competing in his 30s but I think he was referring to being on cycle and off cycle. While he was on cycle he said the conditioning was night and day but his strength pretty much stayed the same. Either way, even though his organs are good I wouldn't want his physical ailments.