The Salt-an of Swole: Muscle Research KetoSalt

[The_Old_Guy]

I wouldn't raise your protein. Again, Keto is muscle sparring. And protein won't fix the feeling you're having.
The_Old_Guy had to take his protein down to 88g a day to have his blood measure above moderate(1.6-3) mmol *i believe*

I was at around 68g P in order to get above 0.5mmol. I'd have to go back and look at the meter (Edit: just did) - highest I achieved was 1.1mmol/l

But there are so many definitions of what various people say "Keto" is - as long as you don't read "Lo" on the meter - maybe it'll "work"?

I'll say this, after actually doing "True" Keto - I'll NEVER do it again for athletic/body comp purposes. None of what all the gurus say, manifested with me: More fat loss - nope. Curbs your hunger - nope. Diet adherence improved - absolutely f'n NOPE!... was worse because a piece of Cream Cheese the size of a 'Dice' has 200kcal and 15g of fat, LOL! Food Volume is way too low for me. When you take into account that energy equated deficits produce the same fat loss no matter the macro ratios in a lot of studies - I'll take the food volume.

But you won't lose muscle at low protein - I never had to strip even 1.25lb plates - just lost some reps off the 11-15 range probably due to no Glycogen.

I still believe "True Keto" is healthy from a longevity standpoint though (or for seizures/brain cancer - some other cancers), so I'll probably still do a couple/few/4 weeks of it each year.

Get a meter! You'll never know unless you do - Stix are useless.

 

[Wimsicle]

My best stint of keto came with no dairy and no nuts. All my fats came from oils and cuts of meat. That led to more volume..

However, I eat 0.8-1g of protein per lbm, not body weight.

I agree there are different methodologies when it comes to ketosis. There is medical, treated for epilepsy, cancer, and 300+ lb individuals. Then there is nutritional/bodybuilding ketogenic..

Most of my research has come from the ketogains community as well as bayesian bodybuilding. I trained for several months with the head of ketogains, and learned a lot in the process.

There is no 100% right way to do it, just like with most dieting. Everyone is different.. But protein > fat when it comes to satiety, and I wouldn't be so afraid of getting kicked out. If you do due to gluconeogenesis, it won't take the full 26 hrs to get back in typically (blood ketone readings).

I even did a TKD where I'd take 15g of glucose pre workout. It'd knock me out temporarily but I had readings within an hour after my workout. That was after 10 weeks of fat adaptation.

 

[Driven2lift]

I had protein higher than this but was not using keto strips so can't comment if I ever bounced out

Nothing but meat, oils and measured greens.

Sure worked for fat loss.
But ice cream... lol

 

[Wimsicle]

I had protein higher than this but was not using keto strips so can't comment if I ever bounced out

Nothing but meat, oils and measured greens.

Sure worked for fat loss.
But ice cream... lol

Strips arent really a good indicator, because the longer you are in ketosis the less of a reading you will get. If you are seeing dark colors on the strip, that means you are peeing out an excess of ketones (acetone in the case), rather than using them. Burn fat -> use ketones.. not pee ketones. Excess dietary fat / exogenous ketones -> pee them out Good for performance, not great for fat loss.

Blood monitor the way to go!

 

[booneman77]

Awesome info guys.

Still feeling pretty low. Took my last dose that I have with me on Sunday for legs power and between the family stuff and the overall lethargy I just couldn't get into it. Squats/rdls and a couple sets of leg press and I just left. Couldn't hack it.

Next few days will be without anything since I have funerals and work taking up all my time. Hopefully Friday I'll get home to reload. Been a really rough couple weeks both from the keto but personally as well.

 

[Driven2lift]

Sorry to hear you have funerals lined up brother. Hoping all goes as well as it can for you and those affected

 

[Wimsicle]

Awesome info guys.

Still feeling pretty low. Took my last dose that I have with me on Sunday for legs power and between the family stuff and the overall lethargy I just couldn't get into it. Squats/rdls and a couple sets of leg press and I just left. Couldn't hack it.

Next few days will be without anything since I have funerals and work taking up all my time. Hopefully Friday I'll get home to reload. Been a really rough couple weeks both from the keto but personally as well.

Take care of you first always! Things will turn around soon. Sorry to hear about the funerals and such. Hopefully Friday you are able to kick a workouts a$$!

 

[tyga tyga]

Sorry about the funerals Boone but I'll be Praying for you buddy.

The gym isn't going anywhere so you can lift when everything settles down!

 

[booneman77]

Thanks guys. Nothing we can control and mostly for the best. Just a strain since I'm not local anymore here so it's been a lot of changing plans

 

[cubsfan815]

Boone, I'm on a project charter at my work for making our company ISO 9001 certified, plus all this lean stuff. I'm the rep chosen from the sales group. 1.5 year project.

Sales people don't belong on that stuff. I nearly fall asleep every meeting. Not sure how you do it.

That is kinda what you do right? Or did I mix you up with another member lol.

 

[booneman77]

Boone, I'm on a project charter at my work for making our company ISO 9001 certified, plus all this lean stuff. I'm the rep chosen from the sales group. 1.5 year project.

Sales people don't belong on that stuff. I nearly fall asleep every meeting. Not sure how you do it.

That is kinda what you do right? Or did I mix you up with another member lol.

The lean stuff, yes. ISO certs no friggin way ha. I just help them define the "what we do" usually through physically workingbit out and trying stuff and let them write up the ISO bs to document it. I'm much more functional/process focused. Paperwork is awful haha

 

[Wimsicle]

The lean stuff, yes. ISO certs no friggin way ha. I just help them define the "what we do" usually through physically workingbit out and trying stuff and let them write up the ISO bs to document it. I'm much more functional/process focused. Paperwork is awful haha

What is it you do?

 

[booneman77]

What is it you do?

Manufacturing process improvement mostly. About 60% of my time is focused on actual shop floor stuff and the other 40% support functions (engineering/sales/procurement/etc)

 

[booneman77]

finally heading home tonight... I'll check in with weight and and stix (just for reference) then take a dose tonight before bed, then tomorrow my plan is to dose the salts a couple times through the day and see how m afternoon workout goes. Hoping for a good day finally since things have just been a mess personally and in the gym during this diet

 

[Wimsicle]

finally heading home tonight... I'll check in with weight and and stix (just for reference) then take a dose tonight before bed, then tomorrow my plan is to dose the salts a couple times through the day and see how m afternoon workout goes. Hoping for a good day finally since things have just been a mess personally and in the gym during this diet

Try adding 1-2g sodium into your pre and see if that helps as well! Or maybe do what u had planned tomorrow, and try that +2g the next workout. It really does make a difference energy wise. a tbls of MCT oil works well too on keto for energy pwo

 

[booneman77]

Try adding 1-2g sodium into your pre and see if that helps as well! Or maybe do what u had planned tomorrow, and try that +2g the next workout. It really does make a difference energy wise. a tbls of MCT oil works well too on keto for energy pwo

Yeah I won't be buying any mct oils cuz I'm hella done with this keto bs after another week or so ha. Just doesn't fit me clearly (unless the double dose or something changes things the next few days).

Just gonna transition back to my normal lower carb but high protein/veggie style after.

 

[Wimsicle]

Yeah I won't be buying any mct oils cuz I'm hella done with this keto bs after another week or so ha. Just doesn't fit me clearly (unless the double dose or something changes things the next few days).

Just gonna transition back to my normal lower carb but high protein/veggie style after.

Keto can be high protein and plentyyyy of veggies. Actually apart from oils that's all I ate on keto lol.

Beef, turkey, ham, chicken, Tuna, salmon, sausage, bacon

Spinach, lettuce, green beans, asparagus, broccoli, cauliflower, any pepper..

I want to help you figure it out and troubleshoot haha. You care if I send you some PM's of stuff to try / read before giving up on it? Just to give it a fair shot from all angles haha.

If not.. I know you know what works for you, but it's always worth a shot

Don't fall for the bulletproof coffee butter slugging ketoers... Follow the bodybuilding athletic ketoers haha

 

[booneman77]

Keto can be high protein and plentyyyy of veggies. Actually apart from oils that's all I ate on keto lol.

Beef, turkey, ham, chicken, Tuna, salmon, sausage, bacon

Spinach, lettuce, green beans, asparagus, broccoli, cauliflower, any pepper..

I want to help you figure it out and troubleshoot haha. You care if I send you some PM's of stuff to try / read before giving up on it? Just to give it a fair shot from all angles haha.

If not.. I know you know what works for you, but it's always worth a shot

Don't fall for the bulletproof coffee butter slugging ketoers... Follow the bodybuilding athletic ketoers haha

Send it all my way! Even if I don't use it I love reading that kind of stuff anyways ha

So the gf's breath analyzer was here when I got home tonight and I blew a .6g/l (which is actually on the highest end)... so clearly I'm wel into ketosis, just still unsure why I'm feeling awful still.

 

[Wimsicle]

Send it all my way! Even if I don't use it I love reading that kind of stuff anyways ha

So the gf's breath analyzer was here when I got home tonight and I blew a .6g/l (which is actually on the highest end)... so clearly I'm wel into ketosis, just still unsure why I'm feeling awful still.

Typical reason for feeling awful that I have seen is electrolytes. I used to think I got 'plenty of sodium' but until I actually tracked 5-7g On Top of what is in my food.. It made a world of difference.

I'll send you some stuff shortly once I get a break in work!

 

[booneman77]

Took a dose before bed last night (with my normal evening meal) - still loving the orange juice-like flavor! just so refreshing each time and no salty aftertaste either.

Woke up this morning feeling really good (and down 6lb from the time I left home ~2.5wks ago). Going to take a dose of the salts at noon today (in place of my normal bcaas) as well as pre-workout (prob around 4-5pm). will report back on the rest of the day and the workout tomorrow.

 

[Wimsicle]

Hope you get a stellar workout in man! Sounds like you deserve one haha

 

[booneman77]

Hope you get a stellar workout in man! Sounds like you deserve one haha

Hope so. I need it. for the first time in my life, even my motivation to go to the gym has been dwindling... normally its my favorite place to be. The last two weeks, I just want to be in bed ha. Even stopped tracking my workouts since I was so all over the place with timing, days, motivation, and energy levels. I miss the grind.

 

[Wimsicle]

Hope so. I need it. for the first time in my life, even my motivation to go to the gym has been dwindling... normally its my favorite place to be. The last two weeks, I just want to be in bed ha. Even stopped tracking my workouts since I was so all over the place with timing, days, motivation, and energy levels. I miss the grind.

That's literally the worst feeling lol. Set a new goal for new motivation. I always get this around holiday season.. determined not to this year!

 

[booneman77]

That's literally the worst feeling lol. Set a new goal for new motivation. I always get this around holiday season.. determined not to this year!

I honestly can't even remember the last time I didn't CRAVE gym time. Most of my days I spend wishing I was in the gym or wondering if there's any way I can justify going back for seconds and actually having it be productive ha

 

[Driven2lift]

I honestly can't even remember the last time I didn't CRAVE gym time. Most of my days I spend wishing I was in the gym or wondering if there's any way I can justify going back for seconds and actually having it be productive ha

This is what we all need, passion for lifting

In the gym I see more passion for "photography", conversation, and self-obsession from the flex in the mirror bros.

If my gym was full of guys like you I might enjoy going more. Sadly I get more hyped up for a home gym lift than I do for my other options here.

Good on you sir

 

[Wimsicle]

For me personally I crave the knowledge and the tweaking aspect of it. Maybe its the engineer in me... but I love to tinker and alter and figure out what personally works best for me and run with it. The nice thing is that its never good enough, so that keeps me going.

 

[booneman77]

This is what we all need, passion for lifting

In the gym I see more passion for "photography", conversation, and self-obsession from the flex in the mirror bros.

If my gym was full of guys like you I might enjoy going more. Sadly I get more hyped up for a home gym lift than I do for my other options here.

Good on you sir

ugh i cant stand the picture in the gym people... they make my lifts better tho because i get annoyed and angry and just channel the rage into my lifts and then focus on not looking around ha. Home lifting I like, but i find that i dont have enough to distract me between sets and often end up sacrificing reps due to getting impatient ha. Plus I find that having other people around and watching (or at least assuming theyre watching/judging) tends to push me more. at home, its just me and I can slack off with only myself to see it. Im just hyper competative and in public want everyone to know it ha

 

[booneman77]

For me personally I crave the knowledge and the tweaking aspect of it. Maybe its the engineer in me... but I love to tinker and alter and figure out what personally works best for me and run with it. The nice thing is that its never good enough, so that keeps me going.

This too... I'm such an engineering in that aspect as well. Its why i love tracking everything. Also why I can adhere to any diet/training plan even when i hate everything about it. Will power is at 100% cuz i have to eliminate all variables in order to get a concrete answer ha

 

[booneman77]

So, yesterday i dosed KS around lunchtime (in place of bcaas) and then again pre workout with an additonal 2g of sodium (via pink himalayan salt) and 1sc of mesomorph. I was a bit tired heading in, but perked up once i was there. Motivation was much better being home and having a good pre as well. Strength has absolutely gone to shiit though. I'm literally down about 20lb pretty much across the board on my heavy day lifts. SO frustrating.

Workout was pretty good, got everything done and was there about 45-50min. I definitely was beat afterwards though but not dead like the last few weeks. A couple doses seemed to help a bit.

Same story today as far as dosing, got up this morning and had meso+KS+salt and headed in for pull power. I was feeling well rested for once and did pretty good as far as the workout went. Again, weights were down and I have absolutely zero stamina, but still felt better motivation and was actually happy to be there. That said, when I was done, I was done. Really just missing that drive to just keep going beyond my prescribed sets.

I decided that I'm going to finally refeed today and just have a complete cheat/blowout day. Feel like I really need it both mentally and physically as I look flat, feel awful, and just want to enjoy some food that my stomach can actually digest for a change ha. I'll be getting back on the keto train tomorrow and we will see how this week goes. Going to bump protein a bit higher this week as well and see if that helps the terrible feels.

 

[Wimsicle]

So, yesterday i dosed KS around lunchtime (in place of bcaas) and then again pre workout with an additonal 2g of sodium (via pink himalayan salt) and 1sc of mesomorph. I was a bit tired heading in, but perked up once i was there. Motivation was much better being home and having a good pre as well. Strength has absolutely gone to shiit though. I'm literally down about 20lb pretty much across the board on my heavy day lifts. SO frustrating.

Workout was pretty good, got everything done and was there about 45-50min. I definitely was beat afterwards though but not dead like the last few weeks. A couple doses seemed to help a bit.

Same story today as far as dosing, got up this morning and had meso+KS+salt and headed in for pull power. I was feeling well rested for once and did pretty good as far as the workout went. Again, weights were down and I have absolutely zero stamina, but still felt better motivation and was actually happy to be there. That said, when I was done, I was done. Really just missing that drive to just keep going beyond my prescribed sets.

I decided that I'm going to finally refeed today and just have a complete cheat/blowout day. Feel like I really need it both mentally and physically as I look flat, feel awful, and just want to enjoy some food that my stomach can actually digest for a change ha. I'll be getting back on the keto train tomorrow and we will see how this week goes. Going to bump protein a bit higher this week as well and see if that helps the terrible feels.

Nice work!! Enjoy that yummy cheat day! This is what I just downed... Hahaha

Invalid Link Removed

 

[booneman77]

Dear god did it feel good to have that cheat day.

Didn't blow calories too ridiculous either since doing keto has certainly helped to shrink my stomach capacity. I actually experience feeling full on a reasonable amount of food haha.

Workout on Sunday morning I dosed the salts again and started back on the keto train.

Everything felt better during Sunday's lift. Legs were stronger and overall drive was back to normal. Still a tad bit low on stamina but a marked difference vs the keto days.

I've been doing two scoops a day yesterday and today, one at lunch and one pre (or evening today since it's my off day). I'll continue this for the next few days (early am workouts and lunch doses) and anticipate running out late this week. Hopefully I keep feeling good through the week.

 

[booneman77]

Tuesday, Weds, today were/are all pretty similar in both schedule, meals, and workouts (this morning was my final dose as well). Workouts have been at 6am each morning with a dose about 15min pre. One thing that i have noticed lately is that the keto salts dont sit in m stomach all that well... after drinking, its like i can feel them sitting in my belly for at least an hour or more. Almost a "sour stomach" type feel (only two days - one being today - did i actually get sick, but it never seems to really set well).

Workouts have been ok, but as the week progresses, even with two doses per day, i can feel my stamina fading through the day and in the gym my performance has been decreasing slowly. Ive added salt to everything, tweaked foods and macros, and just cannot find a good balance with this keto diet. Results are OK, but nothing I couldnt do on a "normal" macro split. My plan is to finish out the week with this and then go back to normal as this clearly just is not for me.

Final review for the keto salts to come later.

 

[Wimsicle]

At least you gave it some other tries! It's definitely not for everyone, and there is no point in feeling like crap when you can get similar results feeling good!

 

[booneman77]

Keto Salts Final Review

So sorry for the delay guys! Work has been hectic and I wanted to really take some time to get everything together here.

Overall thoughts (for those who dont want to read it all): It does what is expected. Increased energy during fasted periods and while in deep ketosis (as measured by breath - not the best but what i had avail.), focus and sharpness was marginally improved, endurance was slightly better but short lived, taste was phenomenal (think orange juice). Downsides for me were that it didn't seem to set well in my stomach much of the time (tho I seemed to have some general issues with the keto diet altogether as well) and that the benefits were fairly short lived in the gym (an hour was the absolute max for me).
Would I buy it? Most likely not, more due to the fact that I didn't do well with the keto experience altogether and this stuff isn't cheap. The cost:benefit just wasn't there for me.
Would I recommend it? Yes, for someone who does well with keto and is looking for a boost, this certainly can help as it had some benefits for me even when I was having a rough go of the whole keto experience.

Taste: the highlight of this product by a wide margin. Many of these keto salt products have awkward flavoring due to the salty nature of the salts themselves but this was completely void in this product. Mixed in anywhere from 10-16oz of cold water it tastes exactly like a nice glass of orange juice.

Effects:
Good - increased energy during fasted periods. When I used this multiple times throughout the day while fasting it definitely made a difference in my energy levels (and body temp) throughout that time. While it was not necessarily dramatic, it was evident the difference with and without. Pre workout it also had some level of influence on me being able to get through what during this diet was a very lethargic and tired time. It also did seem to allow me to focus somewhat more during lifts, especially with multiple daily doses vs just pre.
Bad - about half the time it really just didnt settle in my stomach. It would feel like I had a ball of lead just sitting there and even a couple times I threw up after or during a workout and literally every bit of it would come up. Take this with a grain of salt as I seemed to have general digestion issues on keto as a whole, but even at 20hrs fasted, this would not sit too well. One thing also to note was that it really didn't have the level of impact that I had hoped for. I guess I had hoped for something more like a pre in terms of a boost, but this was not the case.

Thanks to the guys at Muscle Research for allowing me to try this out. Unfortunately my biggest takeaway is that keto just doesn't work for me, but the product itself is not to fault for that.