The real risks of epistane and SERMs?

[Athenry]

Considering doing a cycle of epistane and 4-andro (+TUDCA) with clomid as PCT.

Of course I know the theoretical severe side effects of oral steroids. I've tried to read all of the good anecdotal accounts, as well as the horror stories.

But still I don't have a handle on what the real risk is.

If I run one or two cycles, exactly how much am I risking?

What are the chances of doing serious and irreversible organ damage? What are the chances of dramatically shortening my life?

I want to really understand just how much I'll be risking. But all I can find is "it's liver toxic" and "it's less liver toxic than other compounds" but nothing concrete about the real, tangible risks.

Can anyone help me out here?

 

[emiliozapata]

you may want to consider your risk for prostate cancer, such as any family hx, depending on your age check a PSA first

 

[celc5]

No one in the history of man ran 1 or 2 cycles ever

 

[Smont]

The risks are very low with the liver, it's a long term accumulated effect on the heart, elevated bp on cycles over years of use and that having a downstream effect on the kidney's that is a concern. That can be managed with proper precautions.

Running 1 or 2 cycles, it's a total waste of your time. When you pct and come off you loose the majority of the gains you made after a few months, long term once your last cycle is over it's only a matter of time before your back to normal.

Maybe I could see someone running 1 cycle a year to look good for summer but not with orals. There is very little to no actual muscle tissue that gets built in 4-6 weeks. You get a bunch of glycogen and mineral retention that makes you look like your building muscle and that dissapear post cycle.

If you ran 8-12 week oral cycles, ya you can put on just as much muscle as a regular injectable cycle but now your risk to reward ratio is not very favorable.

Serms have more negative side effects then the oral steroids most of the time too.

Get on some testosterone and enjoying slow steady gains with little to no health risks and save yourself the wasted time of running a couple short oral cycles for little to no benifits

 

[thebigt]

No one in the history of man ran 1 or 2 cycles ever

being 'ON' is addicting...not only for the gainz but also for for the feelz.

 

[celc5]

being 'ON' is addicting...not only for the gainz but also for for the feelz.

100 man, we r so dumb

 

[thebigt]

100 man, we r so dumb

nah....at least we aren't robbing liquor stores to get our gainz

 

[Rad83]

How long have you been training, age, lifts etc? This will play a bigger factor in whether a cycle is right for you.

Sounds like you’ve done a fair amount of research regarding cycle layout, supplements…

I think the typical ‘unhealthy diet of a non health conscious person’ +/- cigarettes and alcohol are worse than what you’re proposing.

If you really know what you’re doing training and nutrition wise, I think you can keep some, not all, of your cycles progress…but enough to make it worth it! (This is all “just like, my opinion, mannn)

 

[Whisky]

Imo the risk to your liver and other organs off a couple of cycles is minimal, I certainly wouldn’t call it ‘life shortening’.

it’s like having a couple of packs of cigarettes and then stopping, there’s basically no irreversible damage (the organ stress builds up over years of use.

however, can one or two cycles have a significant impact on your own natural hormone production, yes it can. Doesn’t mean it will, lots of the time it doesn’t but for every guy who’s blasted gear for years and then has natural production back at where it once was there is another guy who runs one cycle and ends up on trt.

so whilst unlikely that’s the risk I think you should probably be more focused on

 

[Smont]

How long have you been training, age, lifts etc? This will play a bigger factor in whether a cycle is right for you.

Sounds like you’ve done a fair amount of research regarding cycle layout, supplements…

I think the typical ‘unhealthy diet of a non health conscious person’ +/- cigarettes and alcohol are worse than what you’re proposing.

If you really know what you’re doing training and nutrition wise, I think you can keep some, not all, of your cycles progress…but enough to make it worth it! (This is all “just like, my opinion, mannn)

The average American diet combined with going out on the weekends to party will probably kill you long before steroids will

 

[Smont]

And over the counter things like Tylenol used daily will crap out your liver faster then anadrol will

 

[Mathb33]

The real answer is : the risks range from nothing to dying. How would you possibly know more than that?. Make your bet.

 

[Smont]

The real answer is : the risks range from nothing to dying. How would you possibly know more than that?. Make your bet.

Technically no1 can make a argument against that, every day when you wake up the risk for the day is nothing to dying

 

[GQdaLEGEND]

No one in the history of man ran 1 or 2 cycles ever

Haha that was me .. only 1 cycle in college

7 cycles later .. yea I’m good wish I knew and researched more lol

 

[Ironpirate]

I wish someone would remake those epimints.

 

[Smont]

I wish someone would remake those epimints.

Epimints??? Never heard of them, was it a sublingual epistane tic tac type thing lol

 

[Ironpirate]

Epimints??? Never heard of them, was it a sublingual epistane tic tac type thing lol

Yes, looked just like icebreakers mints. They also made cherry halodrol. Those are from like ten years ago at least. Steel crushers brand.

 

[Smont]

Yes, looked just like icebreakers mints. They also made cherry halodrol. Those are from like ten years ago at least. Steel crushers brand.

That's awesome, I might be tempted to eat like 10 a day tho

 

[Ironpirate]

That's awesome, I might be tempted to eat like 10 a day tho

It was easy to do with those. Probably a lot of accidental ingestion is why you don't see them. Each pack was 5mg x 100 so children could definitely be in trouble.

 

[GQdaLEGEND]

I wish someone would remake those epimints.

haha those were awesome , although never took them .. had some and sold for profits
now thinking back .. yeah wish i stored them away

epi , halo and best was phera @5mh chewables candy

 

[Smont]

haha those were awesome , although never took them .. had some and sold for profits
now thinking back .. yeah wish i stored them away

epi , halo and best was phera @5mh chewables candy

I used phera a really long time ago and loved it, then I came across a source like 2 years back who one Monday had like 100 bottles of it in stock. I was super excited, 2 days later I shot him a email to put a order in and all 100 bottles were gone.. and I've never come across phera again