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The New Arizona Immigration Law (SB1070) in Arizona

No because when their beliefs are opposed to their constituents that elected them and they face defeat in the next election, they flip flop and change their beliefs in the hopes of getting RE-ELECTED. Not serving the voters and their wishes. Remember you spoke about that earlier. Plenty of politicians were elected by people and then go off the tracks and go against the wishes of the people that elected them.

I read a book that said something about being hot or cold, just not luke warm. Take a stand, be a freakin man and stand for something. Wishy washy politicians are scum of the earth in my book because their values change each election. Don't ride the fence. You believe something or you don't. Don't go back and forth.

Obama was voted in by progressives. He is pushing progressive legislation. I would say in accordance with your own words, that he's taken a firm position.

Bush was pseudo-elected twice and couldn't articulate a clear position or direction for the country, and we're still digging ourselves out of that mess.

Charlie Crist went independent, because he supported some of Obama's ideas, that certainly isn't a crime, unless you're an ideologue, ever hear of the term "blue dog democrat". FYI-Florida turned blue in the last election and by a wide margin.
 
That article simply states that a relationship exists, and it's one that is strategic in nature. You do know what an "Imam" is correct? Additionally, the author of that column Matthew Lee, is a key contributor/writer for conservativeblogwatch.com. It's safe to say a lot of people emote over these issues, for which they have a limited understanding.

The STRATEGY of the US sending a known radical with known ties to radicalism, his father even, is a BAD strategy.
 
The STRATEGY of the US sending a known radical with known ties to radicalism, his father even, is a BAD strategy.

I agree if in fact what you said is true, again...PROVIDE INDEPENDENT SOURCES(NOT CONSERVATIVE BLOGS)?

By the way, I asked you a question regarding the murder of a doctor, who performed abortions and a christian worship center being built across the street from the practice, what are your thoughts on that?
 
Since Jesus didn't preach kill sinners in my name, that murderer is just that. A murderer. He is in no way exonerated for what he did. Having 1 murder in an area is not the same as the radical Islam preaching if you don't convert them you must kill them in the name of Allah. The mosque in Jerusalem was built after Muslims invaded. The one in Turkey and the one in Egypt were all built as symbols of conquest. That is the problem here.

People use the crusades to bash Christians but they happened after the Muslims overthrew Christian nations. They were taking their land back that had been conquered.
 
Since Jesus didn't preach kill sinners in my name, that murderer is just that. A murderer. He is in no way exonerated for what he did. Having 1 murder in an area is not the same as the radical Islam preaching if you don't convert them you must kill them in the name of Allah. The mosque in Jerusalem was built after Muslims invaded. The one in Turkey and the one in Egypt were all built as symbols of conquest. That is the problem here.

People use the crusades to bash Christians but they happened after the Muslims overthrew Christian nations. They were taking their land back that had been conquered.

Didn't the old testament preach "an eye for an eye", and he who is not with me shall perish?

I'm not taking a position, either for or against any type of organized religion. On a personal level, I find organized religion to be divisive, rather than inclusive. In fact many christian organizations supported Jim Crow and adamantly opposed desegregation, reference Strom Thurman.

My point is that there exists radical elements in all religions, Christianity is not precluded from that list. In fact go to a tea-party rally and you'll see what I'm talking about, it's something out of the movie "Deliverance". If all elements of Islam are bent on our destruction or that of Israel, then I'm all for going on the offensive. My brother was in the United States Air force, having served in Desert Storm. I know many people, many of whom abide by that religion and are just as perplexed and angry that a fringe element has drowned out their voices. I for one refuse to paint an entire religion with such a broad brush.

How about having these same christian centers built in and around the area, where the Oklahoma City bombing took place, where many more lives were lost? You see where I'm going with this....
 
I'm painting this Imam and his associates, not every single Muslim to ever walk the earth. You still haven't addressed the issues of this guys close and personal ties to the radicals. The Cordoba Initiative is a radical group. How do you justify catering to the Radical Muslims? In the other post its been pointed out who this guy is associated with yet the liberals in New York and other places just gloss over that little tidbit of info. Did the family of the christian murderer build that center across from the abortion clinic as an F you to the abortion doc?
 
I'm painting this Imam and his associates, not every single Muslim to ever walk the earth. You still haven't addressed the issues of this guys close and personal ties to the radicals. The Cordoba Initiative is a radical group. How do you justify catering to the Radical Muslims? In the other post its been pointed out who this guy is associated with yet the liberals in New York and other places just gloss over that little tidbit of info. Did the family of the christian murderer build that center across from the abortion clinic as an F you to the abortion doc?

The only information that has been provided thus far, has been sourced from conservative blogs and an online petition, all of these sources share one common trait, they are all authored by conservatives. You might as well just offer a source from twitter or youtube, they would probably be just as credible. I'm asking you to support your claims with factual, non-biased sources, and no Glenn Beck does not count.

Again, provide me an independent news source, which has reported these ties that you allude to? Reuters...anything?
 
Neither is the Mosque. I asked you that question for a very specific reason.

The reason you ask such "tricky" questions is because the only answer you have is to argue semantics, not actual content. That's all you have done so far. The washington post link, the only comment you had was that doesn't count because that guy has written for conservative blogs. you still didn't refute the content, at all.
 
The reason you ask such "tricky" questions is because the only answer you have is to argue semantics, not actual content. That's all you have done so far. The washington post link, the only comment you had was that doesn't count because that guy has written for conservative blogs. you still didn't refute the content, at all.

Because it was an "opinion" piece, you do understand the differences between an actual news report, a column and an opinion piece right?

And I ignore the content because I consider the source, these individuals bring their personable biases to bare, with each tap of the keyboard. The only articles I've seen offered as "proof" of anything, come from your side of aisle, refute that.
 
What kind of word is "teabaggerish"? The kind that obviously solicited a response.

The immigration issue appears to be nothing more than a rallying cry for conservatives. Many small to mid-size businesses have been using illegal labor since the 80's, which helped them to grow and create new jobs.

Additionally, since the illegals are undocumented, it's fair to say, that there exists no conclusive data with respect to the percentage of crimes committed by illegals, even Arizona has admitted that they can't come up with any firm statistics, again with respect to illegal immigration and levels of criminality.


It seems okay to criminalize those that accept work (who wouldn't), rather than those that offered the work in the first place, anti-business as liberals are so often labeled. Arizona is also the same state that refused to honor Martin Luther King, a symbol of the civil rights movement, that tells me everything I need to know. I immigrated to this country as a child, my perspective on this issue is quite different. Neither of our perspectives will change. Having visited many places in both South and Central America while in college, taught me many of the attributes that I carry with me today, one of which is being empathetic to the basic need of feeding one's family.

semantics
 
Well why isn't it in the OPINION section then?
It's an opinion column, which cross links back to his blog, which I referenced for you (I'm sure you had no clue). Next time you offer something as "proof", make sure you do your due diligence and investigate the source.
 
States cannot write nor blindly enact their own version of federal law, hence the constitution. Since you support the constitution so broadly, then let me ask you this; Do you support the group wanting to build a Mosque near Ground Zero, since they are within their constitutional rights to do so? I'm asking this for a very important reason, once you respond, I will explain why.


Semantics
 
Thanks for the education. Apparently I am just some redneck teabagger who isn't as sophisticated as you liberal college educated never have a real job types of people. I feel a lot smarter now.

peace out.
 
Thanks for the education. Apparently I am just some redneck teabagger who isn't as sophisticated as you liberal college educated never have a real job types of people. I feel a lot smarter now.

peace out.

Predictable and what constitutes having a real job? I would call 8 years of higher education a massive challenge, surely you wouldn't frown upon an education? Or maybe a lack thereof is the problem and plays into those who prefer to emote over social issues, rather than thinking them through, or as you argue...semantics.

Anyway no harm, no foul. Good discussion.
 
Thanks for the education. Apparently I am just some redneck teabagger who isn't as sophisticated as you liberal college educated never have a real job types of people. I feel a lot smarter now.

peace out.
It's "teabaggerish".

Predictable and what constitutes having a real job? I would call 8 years of higher education a massive challenge, surely you wouldn't frown upon an education? Or maybe a lack thereof is the problem and plays into those who prefer to emote over social issues, rather than thinking them through, or as you argue...semantics.

Anyway no harm, no foul. Good discussion.
That same education may leave some void of any social consciousness.
 
It's "teabaggerish".

That same education may leave some void of any social consciousness.

Okay fine, maybe "teabaggerish" was a bit over the top. What I should have said is that these people remind me of the movie "Deliverance".

Or a lack of education, which hinders them from fully grasping nuanced topics, leaving them with nothing else to do but emote.
 
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