Testosterone and Thyroid axis

[muchstronger2]

When someone injects testosterone long term for the purpose of TRT, the HPTA axis goes to sleep.

That's why you need to not only supplement with T, but also DHEA and progesterone which are part of the cascade down from cholesterol.

hcg will often be used to maintain testicular function.

In that case:

- am I forgetting something that is also necessary to supplement because part of the hormonal cascade that has been shut (pregnenolone? else?...)

- will the Thyroid hormones be suffering as well, or are they part of another axis / feedback mechanism?

I'm again talking long term replacement here, not one cycle.

 

[heavylifter33]

Have you had bloods and your thyroid looked at? Was there a low reading somewhere (TSH/T3/T4)?

TRT should not shut down the thyroid. There will be minimal impact but as far as damaging permanently, no. You'd see levels return to baseline upon cessation of TRT.

As far as hcg, i think there are studies on women that show positive results on the thyroid.

 

[rtmilburn]

When someone injects testosterone long term for the purpose of TRT, the HPTA axis goes to sleep.

That's why you need to not only supplement with T, but also DHEA and progesterone which are part of the cascade down from cholesterol.

hcg will often be used to maintain testicular function.

In that case:

- am I forgetting something that is also necessary to supplement because part of the hormonal cascade that has been shut (pregnenolone? else?...)

- will the Thyroid hormones be suffering as well, or are they part of another axis / feedback mechanism?

I'm again talking long term replacement here, not one cycle.

Think you mean pregnenolone not progesterone?

 

[rtmilburn]

Have you had bloods and your thyroid looked at? Was there a low reading somewhere (TSH/T3/T4)?

TRT should not shut down the thyroid. There will be minimal impact but as far as damaging permanently, no. You'd see levels return to baseline upon cessation of TRT.

As far as hcg, i think there are studies on women that show positive results on the thyroid.

This^

it shouldn't have an impact

 

[2kvette]

When someone injects testosterone long term for the purpose of TRT, the HPTA axis goes to sleep.

That's why you need to not only supplement with T, but also DHEA and progesterone which are part of the cascade down from cholesterol.

hcg will often be used to maintain testicular function.

In that case:

- am I forgetting something that is also necessary to supplement because part of the hormonal cascade that has been shut (pregnenolone? else?...)

- will the Thyroid hormones be suffering as well, or are they part of another axis / feedback mechanism?

I'm again talking long term replacement here, not one cycle.

DHEA should not be affected, its produced by adrenals, neither should thyroid either. Same principle, different feedback loops.

 

[rtmilburn]

DHEA should not be affected, its produced by adrenals, neither should thyroid either. Same principle, different feedback loops.

Could be wrong but I thought it was recently accepted in endocrinology that complete trt includes​ a dhea supplement as it tends to decrease while on test. It's been a while since reading in this topic so I could be totally wrong.

 

[2kvette]

Could be wrong but I thought it was recently accepted in endocrinology that complete trt includes​ a dhea supplement as it tends to decrease while on test. It's been a while since reading in this topic so I could be totally wrong.

It may very slightly; but 90% of dhea is produced by the adrenals, so I don't see how it would make a big difference. I think you may be thinking of pregnenolone.

 

[rtmilburn]

It may very slightly; but 90% of dhea is produced by the adrenals, so I don't see how it would make a big difference. I think you may be thinking of pregnenolone.

Could be like I said it's been awhile. Also I thought pregnenolone was also produced by the adrenals​?

 

[2kvette]

Could be like I said it's been awhile. Also I thought pregnenolone was also produced by the adrenals​?

It is, but it's the product of 17,20-desmolyase that converts cholesterol to pregnenolone. Pregnenolone is made in any steroid producing tissue. Testes and adrenals both make it, but testes convert it to androstenedione, testosterone, and estradiol. The adrenals concert it to DHEA, cortisol, and aldosterone.

See, the pathway is the same regardless of the tissue. It always goes cholesterol--> pregnenolone. The difference in the steroid product made is dependent on the complement of enzymes that differ in specialized tissue. So the only difference in the pathway is the last enzyme or two in the process.

 

[rtmilburn]

It is, but it's the product of 17,20-desmolyase that converts cholesterol to pregnenolone. Pregnenolone is made in any steroid producing tissue. Testes and adrenals both make it, but testes convert it to androstenedione, testosterone, and estradiol. The adrenals concert it to DHEA, cortisol, and aldosterone.

See, the pathway is the same regardless of the tissue. It always goes cholesterol--> pregnenolone. The difference in the steroid product made is dependent on the complement of enzymes that differ in specialized tissue. So the only difference in the pathway is the last enzyme or two in the process.

Thanks

 

[muchstronger2]

So a complete TRT regimen could be comprehensive with:
- Test
- Pregnenolone
- DHEA
- HCG
- AI if needed

?

 

[2kvette]

So a complete TRT regimen could be comprehensive with:
- Test
- Pregnenolone
- DHEA
- HCG
- AI if needed

?

Drop DHEA, it's not needed.

 

[muchstronger2]

Drop DHEA, it's not needed.

Ok.

Any item you would add to complete the replacement picture?

 

[2kvette]

Ok.

Any item you would add to complete the replacement picture?

Anything your labs show you to be low or deficient in. Your provider should check all this out for you in your labs. But pregnenolone is always good, and may not even be needed if HCG is being taken.