Terror in our time. Video.
- Thread starter CEDeoudes59
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Funny Monkey
Board Supporter
What branch? When do you leave?Grant said:
jarhead
Well-known member
So on one hand you don't think these "ungrateful muslim trash" are worth the death of one soldier , yet you're gonna enlist? you claim to be a patriot after evrerything else you have posted? you need a clue about what this country is supposed to stand for. because the country I SERVED damn sure didn't stand for racial intolerance or prejudice against people, or turning a blind eye when there are people in the world that we can help. You also asked why should we fight for someone elses freedom? what if the the french had said that when OUR country was fighting for it's freedom?Grant said:
BigVrunga
Well-known member
I saw part of the video and shut it off. The Nick Berg one was enough for me.
**** that whole geographical location. Blow it to kingdom come.
That's what's going to have to happen, but it wont until some terrorist prick detonates a nuke or dirty radiation bomb on US soil, and a few thousand more Americans lose their lives.
BV
**** that whole geographical location. Blow it to kingdom come.
That's what's going to have to happen, but it wont until some terrorist prick detonates a nuke or dirty radiation bomb on US soil, and a few thousand more Americans lose their lives.
BV
Grant
Registered User
No I dont think that they are worth the death of American soliders. I am definintly a patriot, as I said, I am joining because I cannot stand by and watch my countrymen be murdered. Dont you realize that it is only recently (within the last 60 or so years) that we have taken a non isolationist stance? The country you served sure does have people in it that are racsit, just as it has people who are not racist. You cant group everyone in America into the same group. Hell I know plenty of racsit Marines, just as I know non rasict ones. Turning a blind eye?? What about the citizens of Iraq, they turned a blind eye for years, and would still have been under saddam if we hadnt have helped, I have no problem with that. The difference between the French helping us during the American Revolution and us helping Iraq is the simple fact that WE started the American revolution, the Iraqis did not start thier revolution, that should tell you something about the situation and the people over there. Ask almost ANY Middle easterner, most will say that democracy will not work over there, nor is it wanted. You have to realize that while democracy may work for us Americans, it is not the best for of government for countries like Somolia, Haiti, or Iraq. These countries are so out of order they need Dictatorships, not free elections or anything like that. They cant handle it, and like I said, it is generally not wanted.jarhead said:
jarhead
Well-known member
Grant said:
dude you are doing nothing but contradicting yourself. you do it in every one of your posts. on one hand you say " we shouldn't be there" and then you say "i'm gonna enlist?" i don't understand what your point is at all. and exactly how many "middle easterners" as you call them have you talked to? have you been there? where the hell do you get your idea that these people don't want free elections? i agree and have said in the past that i don't believe a democratic government fits every type of situation, but to say these people need or prefer a brutal dictatorship is absurd. i honestly think you are just grossly misinformed about the situation over there and history in general. and no offense but how the hell does a 20 year old kid know what ENTIRE countries like haiti, somalia, and iraq need or can handle? why don't you leave that up to the people of those respective countries to decide. Oh wait but as you stated before they're just "muslim trash" so why should we get involved. by the way, as a marine we took PRIDE in being a country that is strong enough and moral enough to help other countries in need countries you say we should just leave alone and suffer their own fates. whether or not we end up doing the right things for the right reasons, and given the state of our government that's hard to tell sometimes, that IDEA is a large part of who we are. and iraq is just a small part of the world that needs help. there are many other places in the world where people are suffering horribly and are in need of someones help. so you better think about exactly why you're joining before you sign that contract and make a commitment to a country who's causes and morals, judgeing by what you have said, you don't seem to believe in. That's not meant as an insult, but it takes alot of character and conviction to serve in any branch of the military and to get thru it you have to believe in this country and what we're doing because there may come a point where that's the only thing that gets you thru tough times.
Grant
Registered User
I havent contradicted my self at all. I told you I am joining not to free Iraqis, but because I dont like seeing my countrymen murdered. You know just as well as I do what these people need. I have talked to a few people, as a matter of fact, my half sister married a man from Iran, who is not muslim, and I have talked to him, his family, his friends and people he works with who have all told me the same thing, that the middle east cannot handle democracy. You seem to be getting rather pissed off that I dont share the same beliefs as you. Where the hell do you get your idea that the majority of iraqis want free elections?? You have just as much right as I do to give opinions about this situation. I never said a brutal dictatorship, I just said dictatorship. Bro, if you really think we are there just to help them because they are being oppressed you are the one who is illusionized. There are SO many places in the world that need and have needed our help for much longer then Iraq, but those places would not be as benifical. I am a nationalist, I dont think that you or I should go die for these people, I love my country just as much as you do, I just think that we should not risk our lives for people like these. If they had started the revolution themselves, then MAYBE it would be a different story, but they didnt.
jarhead
Well-known member
I don't think "illusionized"is even a word. i never said those people WANTED free elections, i just asked you how you know that they don't. and certainly a "guy from iran who's not muslim" doesn't exactly qualify as a majority. and of course we're not there just to liberate them. saddam never lived up to his end of the cease fire from the first war! so even if you don't buy the wmd thing there are plenty of reasons to get the guy out. and if we didn't get involved, do you honestly think saddam would have just sat there and NEVER make a move to harm americans in one way or another? i'm not pissed that you don't have the same beliefs as me. that's what this country is about having different beliefs. you have just repeated some of the things i have said.(about other places in the world needing help) what bothers me is your whole stance on the u.s. staying out of everything in the world and lumping muslims together and calling them trash. if we had done that throughout history, what do you think the world would be like today? what offends me is that as a veteran my IDEA of what this country stands for is far different from your "screw everyone else in the world" attitude. ANY MARINE'S idea is different than that. I'm done with this. just do yourself a favor and tell your "ideas" of what america stands for to any vet from any generation before you enlist.Grant said:
Grant
Registered User
He may not be muslim, but her grew up there, as did his freinds and family, many of which are muslim. Im pretty sure that qualifies him ALOT more then you or me to give on opinion on the subject. Illusionisized may or may not be a word, but you know exactly what I meant. Haha, you are livin in a world of your own bro, not EVERY Marine agree's with you. I know plenty who dont FOR A FACT. And many of them have been over there. An example, I do yard work for a WW2 vet, and I have talked to him about this war in Iraq before before, he thinks it is a sad situation, because those people over there are ungratefull, yet we are dieing for them. Also, In case you didnt know, many WW2 vets did not dissagree with the Nazi's, they just had a higher allegiance to their country, which is simular to me, I dissagree with being over there, but I have a higher allegiance to my country. Of course other places need help, but they do not offer the same benifit ratio as Iraq did. My idea is far from screw everyone else in the world, my idea is "screw everyone else in the world who beheads our defenseless civilains and soliders, and screw everyone in the world who runs planes into our trade towers". Like I said, I might have different ideas if the Iraqis had started this revolution them selfs, but they didnt... I dont know if saddam would have never made a move, but if that was our reason for going over there, we should have stated that, instead of saying it was for WMD's.
jarhead
Well-known member
Don't tell me what a marine does or does not know. you are not one, I AM. you know NOTHING of our values or who we are or what it means to be a marine. there is a difference between knowing one and being one. I do live in a world of my own, it's called REALITY. If you expect me to believe that ww2 vets did not disagree with the nazi's you are effin crazy. ANY decent human being is against genocide. where do you live? Klansville USA?! I am not arguing the politics of the war, I'm disagreeing with your statement of basically screw the world, oh wait, i'm gonna enlist. I can't even argue with you about this **** anymore, you're doing a fine job of contradicting yourself IN EVERY SINGLE POST. YOU just said AGAIN "those people over there are ungrateful." HAVE YOU INTERVIEWED EVRY PERSON OVER THERE? or did some guys grass you cut tell you that too? OUR VALUES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE WHAT MAKES US DIFFERENT FROM THE SCUM WE ARE FIGHTING. That's a concept you cannot seem to grasp.Grant said:
Grant
Registered User
Wow, flip out. My point about the Nazi thing is that everyone in the service is not alike, and I wasnt talking about the genocide aspect either.. and I never Ever said all ww2 vets. I know 3 and 2 of them think that Germany was right in making a contry for whites but wrong in genocide. You are in your own little world, and its not reality. To think that just because I am not a Marine, that I cannot repeat what other marines have told me. I have talked to over 10 people from the middle east, that is a pretty good base, as most people with opinions on the war have talked to ZERO. WHERE DID I CONTRADICT MY SELF!!! I NEVER SAID THAT I WAS ENLISTING TO FREE THE IRAQIS, I SAID I WAS JOINING BECAUSE I CANNOT STAND BY AND WATCH MY CONTRY MEN DIE, HOW MANY TIMES DO I NEED TO SAY... I AM NOT JOINING TO FIGHT FOR THEIR FREEDOM.... QUIT PUTTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH. I never said I know what it is to be a marine, NEVER said I did... BUT I DID SAY THAT I HAVE TALKED TO MARINES WHO HAVE GIVEN ME THEIR OPINIONS. DO I NEED TO BE A MARINE TO REPEAT WHAT THESE MARINES HAVE TOLD ME.... MASTER??? (Sarcasm)
Brodus
Banned
Hey guys--let's chill. I respect both of you for taking a strong stance and defending our country. I think you're agreeing more than you might see it. Yelling at each other won't change opinions (believe me, I know!) Let's try to cool this thread off a bit. You both have made good points.
jarhead
Well-known member
oh gee you got me, 2 ww2 vets think it was right for germany to create a "contry for whites" as you say. did they take their white hoods off before they told you this, or were they just skinheads? and wow i didn't realize that nazis just wanted a "contry for whites" considering they killed plenty of white jews. i always thought there was a little more to that movement but now i know. thank you sooo much for your enlightenment, you are wise beyond your years.Grant said:
MarcusG
Board Supporter
Grant said:
Its exactly this attitude which I find very dissapointing. 'Countries so far out of order' - an euphemism for 'failed states' requiring 'intervention'. The countries you mentioned Somalia, Haiti, Iraq have a long long history of meddling by US and Western powers. You say democracy won't work but the US have always supported military coups and right wing dictatorships in those countries. Never mind Aristide won by a landslide victory of 90%, apparently the democratic process have no validity if the CIA and the US do not approve.
The real issue is one of oil considerations instead of humanitarian food convoys in Somalia.
Grant
Registered User
jarhead said:
You need to go back to school bro. I told you more then once that this is just to show you that all vets do not agree, this statements has nothing to do with my political beliefs, it is only to show you that (I will repeat again) NOT ALL VETS AGREE. You seem to think that every single vet shares the same ideals, and they dont. Quit trying to bring other things into this discussion. You always thought there was a little more to what movement, what do you know now? If you had comprehension skills you would realize I only brought up WW2 vets to show you that NOT ALL VETS AGREE (repeating again). I have said this over and over again, but because you have little ground to stand on, you try and slander me. Nice try though. Did you know that some US soliders are traitors and have betrayed our country in every single war.... I it may come as a suprise, but its true, I know, I know, I was shocked also when I realized that every single solider doenst agree, its crazy isnt it... ( sarcasm) Haha and no, they kept their White hoods on when they told me this......
Grant
Registered User
BTW, the making a country for whites comment was what they agreed with. You do know that many people (including some Jews) do not consider Jews to be white, but to be of their own race, although just as some argue this, others argue against it. ( have to walk on egg shells with you, I know your going to pick that apart as much as you can)jarhead said:
Funny Monkey
Board Supporter
jarhead
Well-known member
I need to go back to school? look "bro" i have tried to not to say anything about your spelling up until this point, but since you feel the need to keep throwing out insults, it's kinda at a second grade level. I don't know what your point is anymore. And no i did not slander you, anything i quoted was something you wrote. For example you have said the only reason we have to send military into another country is to "expand our national borders." you give examples of vets supporting nazis saying that they were right to create a white country, consistantly refer to muslims as trash and expect this not to be offensive? you know what, i could go on and on but this is getting nowhere. i honestly think i'm actually dumber for having had this argument, and i'm embarassed it went on so long. peace out.Grant said:You need to go back to school bro. I told you more then once that this is just to show you that all vets do not agree, this statements has nothing to do with my political beliefs, it is only to show you that (I will repeat again) NOT ALL VETS AGREE. You seem to think that every single vet shares the same ideals, and they dont. Quit trying to bring other things into this discussion. You always thought there was a little more to what movement, what do you know now? If you had comprehension skills you would realize I only brought up WW2 vets to show you that NOT ALL VETS AGREE (repeating again). I have said this over and over again, but because you have little ground to stand on, you try and slander me. Nice try though. Did you know that some US soliders are traitors and have betrayed our country in every single war.... I it may come as a suprise, but its true, I know, I know, I was shocked also when I realized that every single solider doenst agree, its crazy isnt it... ( sarcasm) Haha and no, they kept their White hoods on when they told me this......
Grant
Registered User
If my spelling is bad, then so is your puntuation and capitalization. I type on this board for fun, not for a grade.
You didnt slander me?
"thank you sooo much for your enlightenment, you are wise beyond your years."
"where do you live? Klansville USA?! "
Hmmm?
All of my examples are only trying to show you that all vets do not think alike, I spoke from personal experience, quoting people that I have talked to who are in the service, and who have been in the service. Some of them think we should be in Iraq, some of them dont, that is what I have been trying to tell you this whole time. Regardless of weather my examples were offensive to you, they still show that not all vets agree.
I did not say just to expand national borders, I said to defend the country also. Before the USA should go out and solve other countries problems, we should focus on the problems of our own, such as drug addiction, homelessness, crime, teen pregnancy., etc...
I dont know what you are going on about, you are trying to convince me that all service members think alike??? I dont know what to say to that.
You try to convice me that all muslims are not trash, well, of course not all, but those who follow the koran to a T are not ones that I would ever call my friend. Did you even watch the video? Did it not disgust you? Make you angry?
You rarely responded to anything I said with a counter arguement, instead, you focused on how offensive the things I said were, and how I dont understand what its like to be a Marine (which I never claimed to understand). ]
Oh, and here are some passages from the Koran that I said I would get you.
Invalid Link Removed
It is nothing like Christianity, where we follow the New Testament instead of the Old.
You didnt slander me?
"thank you sooo much for your enlightenment, you are wise beyond your years."
"where do you live? Klansville USA?! "
Hmmm?
All of my examples are only trying to show you that all vets do not think alike, I spoke from personal experience, quoting people that I have talked to who are in the service, and who have been in the service. Some of them think we should be in Iraq, some of them dont, that is what I have been trying to tell you this whole time. Regardless of weather my examples were offensive to you, they still show that not all vets agree.
I did not say just to expand national borders, I said to defend the country also. Before the USA should go out and solve other countries problems, we should focus on the problems of our own, such as drug addiction, homelessness, crime, teen pregnancy., etc...
I dont know what you are going on about, you are trying to convince me that all service members think alike??? I dont know what to say to that.
You try to convice me that all muslims are not trash, well, of course not all, but those who follow the koran to a T are not ones that I would ever call my friend. Did you even watch the video? Did it not disgust you? Make you angry?
You rarely responded to anything I said with a counter arguement, instead, you focused on how offensive the things I said were, and how I dont understand what its like to be a Marine (which I never claimed to understand). ]
Oh, and here are some passages from the Koran that I said I would get you.
Invalid Link Removed
It is nothing like Christianity, where we follow the New Testament instead of the Old.