Sweetlou's training log

Honestly, the ipsilateral glide bat hangs are the best thing for me to loosen mine up.

Wide stance works better for me, due to my next point. What seems to ef mine up is when i butt wink my squats, which i dont do with wider stance, but i do with a narrower stance (more than likely due to hip mobility issues...or just my morphology). Keeping my pelvis neutral with my spine is the key factor for me keeping mine happy it seems.

This is my simplistic theory on it (could be off basis...ie take it with a grain of salt)..we are basically forcing ourselves to hit a certain depth...and when the femeroacetabular joint runs out of ROM due whatever reason, including the two i stated regarding myself above...what's the next thing that has the ability to move (albeit very slightly...i think less then 5 degrees)? The SI joint. The SI isn't inherently meant to be a mobile joint. Then once your individual SI ROM is maxed out the iliolumbar ligament starts getting yanked on because once you run out of ROM for the SI then boom whats next...the lumbosacral joint (start butt winking here). This is also my theory on 9/10 patients that come into the chiro with SIJD have fairly severe trigger points on the iliolumbar ligament.

I'm sure you can find a better theory on it than what I just laid out from someone smarter than me, but that's what ive seemed to gather.
 
jswain34 said:
Honestly, the ipsilateral glide bat hangs are the best thing for me to loosen mine up.

Wide stance works better for me, due to my next point. What seems to ef mine up is when i butt wink my squats, which i dont do with wider stance, but i do with a narrower stance (more than likely due to hip mobility issues...or just my morphology). Keeping my pelvis neutral with my spine is the key factor for me keeping mine happy it seems.

This is my simplistic theory on it (could be off basis...ie take it with a grain of salt)..we are basically forcing ourselves to hit a certain depth...and when the femeroacetabular joint runs out of ROM due whatever reason, including the two i stated regarding myself above...what's the next thing that has the ability to move (albeit very slightly...i think less then 5 degrees)? The SI joint. The SI isn't inherently meant to be a mobile joint. Then once your individual SI ROM is maxed out the iliolumbar ligament starts getting yanked on because once you run out of ROM for the SI then boom whats next...the lumbosacral joint (start butt winking here). This is also my theory on 9/10 patients that come into the chiro with SIJD have fairly severe trigger points on the iliolumbar ligament.

I'm sure you can find a better theory on it than what I just laid out from someone smarter than me, but that's what ive seemed to gather.
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I hurt mine arching on the bench actually. Not squatting or pulling. The capsule is just tight is all.

What is that specific bat hang you listed?

Wide stance always feels better than close. Esp low bar. High bar gives me more wiggle room. So do ssb/fronts.

I feel conv a touch more in the si then sumo. I didn't expect I would. I assume its bc any dysfunction from side to side is more evident when close as the widen allows me to even it out.

So sumo it is? Idk.
 
liftandswim said:
Reading your log scares me lol. Praying I'm not this in a few years
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Dude I was good until after this last meet. Well kinda.

I separated both ac joints when I first started. Left one plays into my firing issues on that side now.

Then I hurt my left hips. Which never hurts now. Odd.

Then popped my si out on the right side.

Popped my t spine.

And dropped that bar squatting.

Then restrained my left pec for the 3rd time.

Benching is 95-98% ATM.

Deadlifting is 100% ATM.

Squatting is the one that's suffering. However idk if sumo pulling is contributing to my squat problems or not?

Gonna start seeing a chiro soon.
 
How do my thick thigh brothers pull conv? Am the only one that has trouble using his glutes bc his thighs are in the way? If I go wider on my feet I feel I'm decreasing my leverage. Hence one reason I pulled sumo.
 
SweetLou321 said:
I hurt mine arching on the bench actually. Not squatting or pulling. The capsule is just tight is all.

What is that specific bat hang you listed?

Wide stance always feels better than close. Esp low bar. High bar gives me more wiggle room. So do ssb/fronts.

I feel conv a touch more in the si then sumo. I didn't expect I would. I assume its bc any dysfunction from side to side is more evident when close as the widen allows me to even it out.

So sumo it is? Idk.
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Fwiw...i have 0 issues with it pulling sumo and i can without a doubt feel it conventional. And yeah, side to side dysfunction seems to be correlated with incidence of SIJD in my experience. One example: me - my left QL has trigger points all up through it and is weaker than my right side. Same side as the si that hurts. When i get the QL to release and activate properly it seems to help with my SI pain (this is done via the ipsilateral glide bat hang i mentioned).

And you answered your own question man...if wide stance squat feels better then wide stance must be what fits your current mobility and or individual femeroacetabular morphology. For deads...im assuming the further from 90 you get your torso the more the force shifts from loading your discs axially to shear. Im not sure the correlation between that and the SI...but id assume it kind of falls into how the lumbosacral joint effects the SI.

Again, im doing a lot of theorizing and assuming here...so if someone else can offer better input please go ahead lol.

Ill find that bat hang for you. Its the one where your feat are up in the air on the band and you tilt your pelvis right and left. Like you would do if you were going into anterior/posterior pelvic tilt...but to the left and right.
 
Also...if you haven't seen a chiro do so as soon as possible. Mine was real screwed up and one adjustment took my subjective pain level at the office from a 7 to a 2. The side posture lumbosacral adjustment fixed me up. They can also do the drop technique...but ive never had that one done so i cant comment on the difference.
 
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At 3:17 he talks about that one
 
jswain34 said:
Also...if you haven't seen a chiro do so as soon as possible. Mine was real screwed up and one adjustment took my subjective pain level at the office from a 7 to a 2. The side posture lumbosacral adjustment fixed me up. They can also do the drop technique...but ive never had that one done so i cant comment on the difference.
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Plan on it. Putting some money aside for it now. Its just tough bc of the distance gf and trying to save to move.
 
jswain34 said:
Fwiw...i have 0 issues with it pulling sumo and i can without a doubt feel it conventional. And yeah, side to side dysfunction seems to be correlated with incidence of SIJD in my experience. One example: me - my left QL has trigger points all up through it and is weaker than my right side. Same side as the si that hurts. When i get the QL to release and activate properly it seems to help with my SI pain (this is done via the ipsilateral glide bat hang i mentioned).

And you answered your own question man...if wide stance squat feels better then wide stance must be what fits your current mobility and or individual femeroacetabular morphology. For deads...im assuming the further from 90 you get your torso the more the force shifts from loading your discs axially to shear. Im not sure the correlation between that and the SI...but id assume it kind of falls into how the lumbosacral joint effects the SI.

Again, im doing a lot of theorizing and assuming here...so if someone else can offer better input please go ahead lol.

Ill find that bat hang for you. Its the one where your feat are up in the air on the band and you tilt your pelvis right and left. Like you would do if you were going into anterior/posterior pelvic tilt...but to the left and right.
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You have been a great help man. I appriciate it!

What's a ql?

Also I find bent over bb rows/rdls/conv pop pulls don't hurt my si if I have some extension in the lumbar. But if I keep it locked like you should to properly pressurize your core they light up both si. Which is why you never seen them in my program after one try. unless I should have some extension in the lumbar? Idk anymore.

I also can't use my abs as well close or conv as I can wide. That could just be a learned thing tho.
 
SweetLou321 said:
Plan on it. Putting some money aside for it now. Its just tough bc of the distance gf and trying to save to move.
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I understand the grind man. Gf and i are about to pay our rent. I know what trying to save money is all about lol.

SweetLou321 said:
You have been a great help man. I appriciate it!

What's a ql?

Also I find bent over bb rows/rdls/conv pop pulls don't hurt my si if I have some extension in the lumbar. But if I keep it locked like you should to properly pressurize your core they light up both si. Which is why you never seen them in my program after one try. unless I should have some extension in the lumbar? Idk anymore.

I also can't use my abs as well close or conv as I can wide. That could just be a learned thing tho.
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QL - Quadratus Lumborum muscle. Its the muscle in your low back that runs from L1-L4 to the "Iliolumbar ligament, adjoining part of the iliac crest, tips of transverse processes of lower lumbar vertebrae". It is responsible for lateral flexion to the same side and resisting lateral flexion to the opposite side.

Thats interesting. SLSLs/RDLs don't hurt mine. I dont do enough bb bo rows to know about that one (should probably address that). Im not sure what to think about that in terms of how you should go about it. Id think extension in the lumbar wouldnt be bad in BB rows. I think that a recent article on AM said that the lats, upper back musculature work more efficiently while at least the thoracic spine is in some degree of extension. Don't remember if they mentioned the lumbar though.

And im the same way in terms of wide/close. I feel like i can breathe deeper into my core wide.
 
SweetLou321 said:
How do my thick thigh brothers pull conv? Am the only one that has trouble using his glutes bc his thighs are in the way? If I go wider on my feet I feel I'm decreasing my leverage. Hence one reason I pulled sumo.
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Shins at the very edge of the slick part, toes ducked out a little bit. Some people dislike the wider stance conventional, but I've always done it that way. You'll see really big guys get their shins out into the knurling.

It also helps me to sit into my hips better. Best way to do it is start too narrow and squeeze your glutes, find the spot where the contraction is best and go there.

I should also nite that I start with the bar over the balls of my feet. More forward knee travel brings my hips more on top of the bar for an easier finish.
 
Heres the full function of the QL. I didn't remember the contribution to breathing. I found it kinda interesting:

Actions of quadratus lumborum muscle:
Quadratus lumborum fixes the last rib by its contraction. It therefore acts as a muscle of inspiration by helping to stabilize the lower attachments of the diaphragm. The same action is also suggested to be responsible for providing a fixed base for controlled relaxation of the diaphragm needed for speech and singing.

When the pelvis is fixed, the quadratus lumborum acts upon the vertebral column and flexes it to the same side. When the quadratus muscles of both sides contract, they help to extend the lumbar part of vertebral column."
 
herderdude said:
Shins at the very edge of the slick part, toes ducked out a little bit. Some people dislike the wider stance conventional, but I've always done it that way. You'll see really big guys get their shins out into the knurling.

It also helps me to sit into my hips better. Best way to do it is start too narrow and squeeze your glutes, find the spot where the contraction is best and go there.

I should also nite that I start with the bar over the balls of my feet. More forward knee travel brings my hips more on top of the bar for an easier finish.
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That's exactly how I do it. Ive even contemplated putting shins on knurling but I'm scared lol. I've played w a lot of widths and I'm absolutely strongest with feet shoulder width ducked out some on conv. And moving the bar out further over my feet like that about 9 months ago helped positioning for sure. You need to make room to clear your thighs after all, and I got bigger.

As for pushing knees out, that's what I focused on other weekend and combined w keeping a more neutral spine it really lets the hips drive thru at the top.
 
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Looks like i what I thought about the mobility may be behind the times?

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This is the McGill study the author references

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Another good one.
 
10/31/15-deadlift/squat
Warmup
Banded squats
One arm swings
Conv deadlift on stiff bar
465x2x4
465x7, PR
Front squat
275x3x4
Reverse hypers
180x2x12
Landmines/chins
25x10/5
35x10/5
45x10/5
Notes: great day.
 
Hell of a session there man. Good work. Congrats on the conv pr. I take it the flared foot position went over well eh?
 
Strong PR man.
 
jswain34 said:
Hell of a session there man. Good work. Congrats on the conv pr. I take it the flared foot position went over well eh?
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Yeah it worked great. Also watched the leeman st video on set up again. Mimicked a lot of it and it went great. Had 405 and less leaving the ground before I even pulled. I have a lot of trouble breathing on reps so I may switch to touch and go ala duffin/leeman. Also hit a big stride squat wise. Will see how it holds up over time.
 
You guys think a pendulum reverse hyper would help the si out? I did them yesterday for the first time in years at my gfs gym. My low back as been torched ever since lol.
 
Sean1332 said:
It's worth a shot if it feels good. You could try strict single legged too. They feel like doing a weighted bird dog.
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Feels good is a no. It aches to sit for prolonged periods of time. I won't be doing them again. Plus both so joints are sore now.
 
liftandswim said:
Hey Lou, thoughts on the M2 method? Lol
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I think I have the book if you want it?
It's OK. The percents don't play out for everyone as they do in his book. Its written for him, keep that in mind.
Its 3 board, 2 board, 1 board, and only touch and go reps off the chest. Main work is off boards. I became a great board presser, crappy bench presser. Plus my board percents did not correlate at all. The high boards were to easy.

If you are not stronger off block then the floor in the pull you are in trouble. Since his percents reflect that you are. There is chain/reverse band options too.

Lots of box squats. Same as pulls. Reverse band and chain options tho.

If you don't have the goodies you are in trouble. Requires a lot of extras.
 
I was hoping you'd having something clever to say lol. On his YouTube videos it says minimalist method and I remember you saying they were lazy so I found it funny/ironic.
 
liftandswim said:
I was hoping you'd having something clever to say lol. On his YouTube videos it says minimalist method and I remember you saying they were lazy so I found it funny/ironic.
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Oh I had no idea. I tried to be neutral. Lol.

In scientific principles of strength training they bash his book.

He was told by Dave Tate to change the name to m2 method because minimalist is a bad view point.

Not only is the book based minimizing training...he doesn't even do the bare min. He skips his own assistance work. Lol.

He talks of minimizing training time yet takes 3ish hours to do one lift.

His laziness created that book. I wonder if the 2.0 will be just the main lifts.
 
11/2/15-deload heavy bench
Warmup
5min bike
McGill 3
One arm swings
Pushups
Bench
80%-265x3x2
Incline
225x6
205x6, I'm so bad at this.
One arm chest supported db rows
80x5x10
Dips/light band pushdowns/hammer curls
12/20/30x12
12/15/30x12
Mini band pullaparts/mini band wide grip upright rows/shoulder horn
20/15/10x15, 2 sets
One arm hangs 2 sets
Cardio: 10min on bike
Notes: god damn I have weak pecs/bottom end strength. I am attacking this head on. I'm tired of getting hurt and I'm tired of being weak here. I was my strongest on bench per bw when I did compound pressing like incline/ohp/dips on the regular. I was also the most balanced in my shoulder girdle.
 
SweetLou321 said:
Oh I had no idea. I tried to be neutral. Lol.

In scientific principles of strength training they bash his book.

He was told by Dave Tate to change the name to m2 method because minimalist is a bad view point.

Not only is the book based minimizing training...he doesn't even do the bare min. He skips his own assistance work. Lol.

He talks of minimizing training time yet takes 3ish hours to do one lift.

His laziness created that book. I wonder if the 2.0 will be just the main lifts.
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He must follow M2
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Gonna reach out to you guys who have imbalances and how you overcame them or are doing so now.

My right and left side and not even (as most of us). But my left delt is noticeably smaller than my right and my right pec is noticeably smaller than my left. By this I mean other people at the gym can see it and boards sit slanted on my chest when I do board presses.

Just curious how you would attack this. Its clearly part of the reason I hurt my left pec so often. The delt is not strong enough to help protect it and its stronger meaning it takes extra load.

I use to do a mix of 5/3/1 bench, press, with db incline and dips. This was when I was most balanced. I fell out of this for a westside approach and my imbalances got bad. To correct it I was doing the Dave tate db complex. I still have yet to match these PRS to this day.

It is: start light and slowly add weight.

Oh db press max 8-15 reps
Flat db press, match oh
Incline db press, match oh/flat
Decline db press, match oh/flat/incline.

It goes hard, easier, hard, easiest. Rest 1-2min between sets. I quickly prd with 55x22, 60x18, 65x14 ect. They are actually in this log I believe. I paused all angles but oh to increase difficulty but not weight or reps.

If you guys think this would be a good start I'd agree. It helped remove ego, set rep PRS, and balanced me out pretty quick. Plus its quick and time efficient.

Obb is a tiny gym. Doing some things is very time consuming to set up, work around others, and waiting for a rack. I regularly lose an hr of training time due to these reasons. So while I want to be effective as possibly I'd also like to minimize this wasted time as much as I can.

Thanks to anyone who contributes. Ivd had these glaring issues for years now. No more. I want to bench 400 raw in a few years. Gotta be balanced and healthy to do so. And it starts here.
 
Wish I could help, but you said it yourself. You were most balanced when you were doing that. If it ain't broke don't fix it
 
liftandswim said:
Wish I could help, but you said it yourself. You were most balanced when you were doing that. If it ain't broke don't fix it
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The only issue is getting back to that. I'm to imbalanced to do all that I use to. So I have to get myself back there first. I'll start with the db complex and dips and slowly adjust over the next 6 or so months. Thinking long term here.
 
I've always heard that imbalances in size should be dealt with dumbbell vs barbell. (I think I'll even give that dumbbell complex a go tonight if benching is a bust)

I might look into why there's an imbalance in the first place. Which, I'd have no where to look.

Nothing what I said was helpful lol I'm curious for other answers
 
Sean1332 said:
One-arm dumbbell pressing. I think Eric Cressey mentioned it for throwers with an imbalance
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Maybe I could use a multi faceted approach?

I was leaning towards db complex/dips. Dips are however close chain and if I'm not centered I cant fix it. Plus my stronger side can take over.

Maybe do

1 day db complex

2nd day do flat one arm pressing starting with the weaker side?
 
Sean1332 said:
I've always heard that imbalances in size should be dealt with dumbbell vs barbell. (I think I'll even give that dumbbell complex a go tonight if benching is a bust)

I might look into why there's an imbalance in the first place. Which, I'd have no where to look.

Nothing what I said was helpful lol I'm curious for other answers
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Imbalance is the result of ego really, over time. Using to much weight for certain moves years back.

My left scap doesn't move right and my left lat is weaker.

I've been addressing that for a little while now with

Ext rot work
One arm swings
Hangs
One arm back work

Thanks for the input.

I wanna try the McGill chins as they felt great when I stuck with them some time ago. Wondering if they would be a good warm up with one arm pulldowns as a finisher or just use them as an assistance move in general and skip the one are pudowns. Thinking out loud. As these small things will add up.
 
Yep, you said it again. Take the ego out and do all the little stuff that takes 5-10 minutes. Time will tell. I realize I'm speaking in generalities and not really helping lol
 
liftandswim said:
Yep, you said it again. Take the ego out and do all the little stuff that takes 5-10 minutes. Time will tell. I realize I'm speaking in generalities and not really helping lol
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No you are right. I will just have to try and see what happens in the end.
As long as it helps balance me out I feel its good in the long run.
 
Yeah, taking a step back is hard but we all have to sometimes. I did this training cycle. I've handled more than 80% on squat like 2 times.
 
liftandswim said:
Yeah, taking a step back is hard but we all have to sometimes. I did this training cycle. I've handled more than 80% on squat like 2 times.
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I've had to take quite a few steps back this off season. I feel I'll be a better lifter in the long run tho.

I wrote out my current goals. Then wrote things I can do to fix them. I then designed my next block based said primary and secondary goals.

Main goals:
Balance pecs/shoulders/scaps/lats/hips
Technique refinement before starting possible meet prep.
Reduce back pain

Fix:
Db work and unilateral work for said areas. Drop ego and track weights closely.
Strength work done in comp form, speed work done in comp form
McGill big 3

Secondary goals
Strengthen my strengths (Tris/glutes/core/upper back)

Fix
Pick movements to do so

Rough outline

Day 1-heavy bench
Upper warm up (mcgill 3, one arm swings, oh db press, mc gill chins or pulldowns/pushdowns)
Comp bench
Strength work 70-85% 4-6 reps
Unilateral flat bench paused 3-4x8-10
One arm chest supported db rows 5x8-10
Rolling tricep ext/hammer curls 2-3x8-10
Pullaparts/WG upright rows/shoulder horn 2-3x20-25
One arm hangs

Day 2-heavy squat/speed deadlift
Lower warmup (mcgill 3, one arm swings, banded goblets, step ups, banded abduction)
Comp squat
Strength work 70-85% 4-6 reps
Speed deadlift against bands
Step ups/banded abduction 2-3x8-10/12-15
Abs wheel/one arm pulldowns or mcgill chins 4-5x8-10/1-2
Psoas stretch

Day 3-speed bench
Upper warmup (same as above)
Speed bench against bands
Db complex
T-bar rows 5x8-10
Tate press/bb curls 2-3x8-10
Side raises/face pulls/shoulder horn 2-3x10-20
One arm hangs

Day 4-heavy deadlift/speed squat
Lower warmup (same as above)
Comp deadlift
Strength work 70-85% 4-6 reps
Speed squat against bands
Ghrs/banded abduction 2-3x8-10/12-15
Landmines/one arm pulldowns or mcgill chins 4-5x8-10/1-2
Psoas stretch

Would love your input. This is a rough outline. It meets all my goals I have above I feel too.
 
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