Reliable supplement companies besides SNS CEL etc

JayNY8899

New member
I like variety. There seems to be no variety here, besides the same people pushing the same company over and over and over. I’m not saying SNS or CEL ain’t good. But they ain’t the only supplement company on the planet that makes supplements. I’m wondering if this supplement forum is really about supplements or the same people just pushing sns and cel and all their other connected brother sister companies. It doesn’t make coming here appealing for new people in my opinion or myself, usually same people replying with the same recommendations, it’s like everytime I’m here it’s 100 different sns threads It would be nice to see what other companies people have used with good results.

I currently am using Magnapower by SNS and I have been getting very nice results , similar to results I have had with ConCrete Creatine HCL. So I picked up 3 more tubs. I also just started using api Plex and Epi Plex , about 4 days in and I guess in time I’ll see.

I have also used PA by SNS and it seemed just a waste of money I have two brand new bottles left and I really don’t even want to bother taking them cause they seem useless. And to be clear my diet is on point. I meal prep and make about 20-25 meals for the week every weekend. I train 5 days a week and have a home gym with over 15k$ in equipment. I did everything necessary and PA by SNS did absolutely nothing.

So what other nutrition supplement companies are out there that offer good products.
 
Plenty, hit the company section and peruse company sites. I like Perfect Sports for protein, Life Extension for fish oil and general health stuff, whoever for ZMA/creatine, and muscleandstrength for online buying. I hate to break it to you, though: for test boosting or performance stuff......SNS/CEL are unbeatable. That's why you see them everywhere here. It's legit.
 
SNS has been around a long time, contributed to this board for longer than most people here have been lifting, and actually seems to care about quality and keeping up with new interesting ingredients. So there is going to be a bias towards recommending them, but honestly why not? There’s lots of other board sponsors but you don’t hear about some because they don’t actually provide any useful help to the board or any useful products (but being sponsors I appreciate they help keep the board alive 🙂).

Not every ingredient will end up being as useful for everyone, but even if an SNS product ends up being not useful for me I know that it’s just the ingredient may not be for me and not because it’s underdosed or not what it says on the label.

I like NOW, Life Extension, Jarrow, and Doctors Best for various other things, Nordic Naturals for Fish Oil, Innovapharm for various things, Nutrabio, etc.

Doesn’t mean SNS is all there is, but they are pretty close to covering most needs for me.
 
I'd say most of the love for SNS/CEL is a combination of: 1 - Steve is still super active on here. Not just for answering questions/suggesting stuff, but a whole lot of his releases over the past few years are things coming from people on here asking for specific ingredients, like Prime for example.

2 - Between SNS/CEL/MA/XPG, theres basically a product for everyone for just about any category you can think of. Proper doses of things/good prices, easy to suggest stuff haha.

3 - Most of the remaining active members on here have been using stuff from these companies for ~10+ years at this point. Again, easy to suggest companies you've been using for so long.

Apex Alchemy and Iron Legion make some good transdermals. I use stim-free pre's from Black Magic Supply, InnovaPharm and Huge Supplements. EvoMuse Gut Health is a long time staple. NOW/Life Extension for some stuff, MuscleSport/Axe & Sledge/PES/Black Magic Supply/GHOST/RYSE are all currently on my protein shelf.
 
I concur with others above. I've been on this forum since 2005 and seen a lot of good companies and good owners and reps come and go. Steve is still around and very active and his supplement line is very extensive. Evomuse still makes products and has been around a long time as well.

I guess to answer your question, reputation and long standing in the shady world of supplement is a big deal so it is why credit goes to sns and sister companies.
 
I was just looking at innovapharm genesis-1. Been a while since I used humanofort. Might stack it with some tribulus, for extra juice.
 
Definitely word up to Steve and his lines sns cel xpgelz and ma. Other than that I basically use NOW for single vitamins and Animal pak still because I can’t find anything better.
 
I’ll echo the list Resolve mentioned when looking at single type ingredients (NOW, Jarrow, Thorne..etc). And as many have also mentioned Steve is a super helpful guy, and I’m willing to support him and his brands. He has gone into very lengthy conversations when I’ve asked for help, or had questions. He regularly offers his email and cell#. I’m sure there are a lot of good brands out there but I’m finding outside of protein SNS covers my basic supplement needs (which is very little these days).
 
Not sure why we need another brand … especially once the protein is out.

phosphatidic xt is primarily a branded ingredient - maybe you’re a non-responder but most people hold it in high regards.
 
H
poison said:
Plenty, hit the company section and peruse company sites. I like Perfect Sports for protein, Life Extension for fish oil and general health stuff, whoever for ZMA/creatine, and muscleandstrength for online buying. I hate to break it to you, though: for test boosting or performance stuff......SNS/CEL are unbeatable. That's why you see them everywhere here. It's legit.
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How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
 
JayNY8899 said:
H

How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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good question. I think sns / steve does double the testing most companies do … one of the reasons new products take a bit longer. He would have to confirm … I doubt he would put a branded ingredient on the label just to substitute something else or not include it.
 
JayNY8899 said:
H

How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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You got a point. I guess if place had 3rd party tested or all trademark branded ingredients you could make a case for a company's legitimacy. I look for proven ingredients or trademarked branded ingredients. Not really into a latest greatest mystery herb brought out from x company.
 
chainsaw said:
You got a point. I guess if place had 3rd party tested or all trademark branded ingredients you could make a case for a company's legitimacy. I look for proven ingredients or trademarked branded ingredients. Not really into a latest greatest mystery herb brought out from x company.
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Totally agree man.
 
JayNY8899 said:
H

How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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For one, I would start by looking at a company's testing and manufacturing processes (things like Current Good Manufacturing Practices (CGMPs), although I am sure there are many others), and the extent to which they voluntarily comply with standards that may not be imposed upon them by regulation. Unless I am incorrect (a definitive possibility), inherit in your question is an implication that people are not trust worthy unless they are proven so. I hope we never come to that. Lastly, I believe we need to look at someone's track record and integrity.
 
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I get the bandwagon comment. I've been on this board 6yrs, tried many many other brands and it wasn't until last year I finally gave Steve's products a shot, and probably had similar thoughts as you.

However the truth is, he makes the most legit, tested products I have used. If you are looking for muscle builders it's the only brand I consider at this point. Other companies make fine products and I won't name any names.

But SNS/CEL is a step above the rest and I've come to that conclusion month after month since jumping on the bandwagon lol.

It's not his fault he is the most active company poster on here.

The world has changed many times and forums are less important to ppl as social tools. So it's easy to see all the SNS posts and assume something else is going on. I don't think that is what is happening at all here.

We got lucky with a trust worthy person in the industry willing to spend time with us.
 
JayNY8899 said:
H

How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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As stated, he uses a ton of patented forms of stuff, like 3-4 in one product. Those companies would rip him a new one if he was playing games.

As far as 3rd party testing, I was a rep. SAN had COA's for everything, but the reality is unless you're standing there as its tested, walk with the legit product to watch it hit the production line, and pick your bottle up off the belt, you're still basing things on trust. I could show you COA's all day long, but are they from this batch? The last? Which one is your bottle from? Who's the testing company, and are they legit?

;)
 
JayNY8899 said:
How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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There's a very simple answer to your question.

Do NOW Foods, Natures Way, Life Extension, Thorne, Muscletech, Ghost, Ryse, PES, or many others show their test results?

No, hardly anyone does and there is a big reason why.

Back around 2017, there became a real big problem with fly by night brands taking lab reports that other brands posted and photoshopping them to look like they were their own. Sometimes the brands doing this weren't even changing the lot numbers - and that was a big potential legal liability issue for the brands and the testing facilities. This caused a huge issue in the industry to the point where the FDA got involved and went after a lot of companies doing that, but it was impossible to catch them all bc some weren't even legitimate companies.

At that time, most of the Iso certified FDA/DEA registered testing facilities asked companies to stop posting their results publicly because it was creating legal liability issues for them and harming the testing facilities reputations and also taking up an immense amount of their time because they were being bombarded with questions as to which ones were legit and which ones weren't.

At that time, every industry compliance attorney that I know of told brands to stop posting those results publicly.

We were one of the original companies to publicly post test results and we started doing that all the way back in 2004, and didn't stop until the above industry issues happened. We stopped at the same time that PrimaForce and a lot of other brands did.

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You seem to have the misguided impression that SNS is just me. You may view it that way because I post here and take the time to help people on here, but its very much not just me at all and we have a wide scope of operations.

SNS is an FDA registered company that follows all cGMP guidelines and only uses FDA registered cGMP compliant contract manufacturers, and meet or exceed all of the FDA testing requirements including quantitative, qualitative, heavy metals, and microbial testing. As part of this, there are FDA inspections in which the FDA reviews all documentation including the test results.

We also, and many don't know this bc its not relevant to normal supplement discussion, have a 20k sq. ft. warehousing and distribution facility that handles warehousing and shipping for dozens of other brands. This also is GMP and comes along with its own inspections and processes.

Any company that has these processes and scope of operation are subject to FDA oversight and inspections.

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As a couple of people pointed out above, we use a lot of branded ingredients.

How does that have anything to do with quality?

Companies that have patents and trademarks are normally going to be careful who they work with.

There are many branded ingredients that are clinically researched and shown in studies to provide certain results. By using these ingredients, we are using science based ingredients with real world clinical studies.

There are some branded ingredients that the studies would pertain to the ingredient themselves and the branded ingredient version isn't necessarily any better than a non-branded form, but the branded ingredient form may exist because there may be quality variances with the generic material. In this case, and I'll use HICA-Pure and Cornerstone HICA as an example, neither is better than the other - they are both 99% HICA. Neither is better than legitimate 99% HICA if you can find it in a generic form, but its hard to find that % purity in a generic form, so the reason for using one of the branded versions is to ensure top quality and consistency from batch to batch.

When using branded ingredients, a brand has to license the ingredients from the branded ingredient company.

In the last 3 weeks, we've had over a dozen labels submitted for approval by various branded ingredient companies.

Each branded ingredient company may have different requirements, but most of the time they are going to include a lot of details as to quality control programs, making sure the contract manufacturer used is GMP, etc. Most are going to make the brands and the contract manufacturer account for every kg. of raw material purchased and used.

Then, most are going to require proof of finished product testing and most are also going to purchase bottles of the products from retailers, without the brands knowledge, and perform independent testing on them.

Are there brands here and there that claim to use branded ingredients that don't? Sure, there are scammers in every industry and every walk of life. But branded ingredient companies are normally going to find out and take legal action against them.

SNS uses a lot of branded ingredients, more than any other company our size.

A couple of questions:
  • Do you think that a branded ingredient company is going to list a company on their website if the company doesn't actually use their ingredient?
  • Do you think a branded ingredient company is going to work with a brand to launch a new branded ingredient by them if the brand doesn't meet label claims?
  • Do you think branded ingredient company owners are going to mention brands on podcasts when interviewed about their ingredients if the brand doesn't meet label claims?
  • Do you think brands would let us, or want us to literally name a product for their ingredients if they didn't meet label claims? (Example - MitoBurn XT, GlucoVantage XT, Furosap XT, Cocoabuterol XT, Sabroxy XT, Theracurmin XT, and many more)
The reason I ask those questions is that it goes back to quality and answering your question.

Here are just a few examples:
  • Shawn Wells, of NNB, mentions SNS quite a bit in interviews when discussing MitoBurn. He mentions MitoBurn XT some and Thermo Scorch a lot.
  • NNB Nutrition has done worldwide press releases for several SNS and CEL products containing their ingredients.
  • SNS was the first company to launch NNB Nutrition's new EZ-GABA ingredient - Invalid Link Removed
  • Price Plow has done several articles on PeptiStrong and talks about Pepti-Plex
  • Price Plow interviewed one of the people with Nuritas, the branded ingredient company that owns PeptiStrong, and he mentions Pepti-Plex.
  • Nuritas has mentioned Pepti-Plex on their own social media including supporting the branded ingredient launch.
  • SNS listed on the Paradoxine website (screen shot at bottom of post) - Invalid Link Removed
  • SNS listed on Mediator PA website (screen shot at bottom of post)
  • CEL Joint Edge listed on the Tamaflex website (screen shot at bottom)
  • SA3X article the branded ingredient company and listing multiple SNS products - Invalid Link Removed
  • Multiple products that literally have the branded ingredient in the name, so obviously they are known by, vetted by, and tested by the branded ingredient companies - MitoBurn XT, GlucoVantage XT, Furosap XT, Cocoabuterol XT, Sabroxy XT, Theracurmin XT, and many more.
I could keep going, but that's just a list I can think of right off hand.

Mediator .PNG


Paradoxine.PNG


Tamaflex.PNG
 
JayNY8899 said:
How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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I wasn't going to reply in this thread at all, but since I replied to the quality part, may as well reply to this part too.

In reply to your comment - It seems it’s just word of mouth.

Absolutely. You say word of mouth like that's a bad thing.

As opposed to what, spending a lot of money to have influencers and spokespeople tell you something works because you're paying them to say it and then having to markup products more on customers bc you're paying them to say it?

SNS has always had a - Real People, Real Results - concept to it.

I love the science and I love helping people, but I hate the marketing side of things.

We don't have the big marketing money that some of the corporate backed brands do, but I'm not sure why that would be a bad thing? Because it we start putting profits over helping people, then we have to scale back formulas to bring the cost of them down, factor in a big advertising budget into the profits needed, and mark products up a lot more. All of that would go against what we are about because it would involve either making a lot less thorough formulas &/or increasing prices and the products can't help people if people can't afford to take them.

If you are more impressed with fancy marketing than science based formulas at good prices, there are definitely a lot of brands out there that can accommodate that and will be glad to take your money. And I don't mean that in a bad way because I formulate for some of them and warehouse for some of them; there's nothing wrong with them, its just a difference in business models.
 
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Oh, and here are some other good brands including a great protein bar brand that I never see ads from but are excellent.

NOW Foods, Nature's Way, Life Extension, Jarrow, and Doctors Best are all great brands.

Some sports nutrition brands that come to mind that I like and recommend a lot are Iconic Formulations, Innovapharm, & Body Nutrition (Trutein).

A great company for protein bars, that I never see anyone mention besides me is Daryl’s bars.
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I believe a lot of why most of us on here all plug SNS and the sister companies is because, the products are of quality efficacious ingredients, properly manufactured/tested, all at a great price point and it's owned by a very good guy who has integrity and takes time out of their very busy day to explain, help or listen.

A lot of us have spent thousands of dollars for years on crap products and weeding through the bs to finally find products that work, companies and someone we can trust. So, it's not so much fanboying, as it is having already done the work, noted the positives and negatives and are giving a conclusion from years of experience.
 
Reality is @sns8778 is one of the only companies that is on here almost every day and provides valuable insights. Sometimes a little too insightful for us small minded folks but we don’t mind. Not all supplements work for everyone and that is ok. I think all board sponsors here have good supplements overall. Just depends what you want.

I don’t venture away from anything other than these board sponsors besides NOW foods because I don’t need to. Plus they are cheaper and my cheap ass always wants the cheapest most cost effective supps.
 
Haven’t seen universal on here but I trust them. As well as Patrick Arnold’s stuff (prototype nutrition.) could be wrong about this one but HiTech was believed to have to be super buttoned up because they were audited by the fda constantly for fighting them in court. Don’t know what testing they do but I tend enjoy their supplements
 
CATdiesel76 said:
Haven’t seen universal on here but I trust them. As well as Patrick Arnold’s stuff (prototype nutrition.) could be wrong about this one but HiTech was believed to have to be super buttoned up because they were audited by the fda constantly for fighting them in court. Don’t know what testing they do but I tend enjoy their supplements
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Universal has great quality. I don't use anything by them but would definitely trust them if there was something I liked by them and wanting to use.

Some people don't like the way Hi-Tech markets or names products or that they use proprietary blends in some things, but that's opinions based on the way they choose to market. Quality wise, they're going to be spot on
 
One time, years ago, I lost my job for the second time in a short period. I mentioned it on bb.com in passing, where I was repping SAN. Out of nowhere, Universal sent me a huge box of supps and a note wishing me success.

I haven't used their stuff in a while, but they're good people and aren't lying about ingredients.
 
kid amnesiac said:
good question. I think sns / steve does double the testing most companies do … one of the reasons new products take a bit longer. He would have to confirm … I doubt he would put a branded ingredient on the label just to substitute something else or not include it.
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Thanks man. Appreciate your feedback. Makes complete sense.
 
Danksta710 said:
I get the bandwagon comment. I've been on this board 6yrs, tried many many other brands and it wasn't until last year I finally gave Steve's products a shot, and probably had similar thoughts as you.

However the truth is, he makes the most legit, tested products I have used. If you are looking for muscle builders it's the only brand I consider at this point. Other companies make fine products and I won't name any names.

But SNS/CEL is a step above the rest and I've come to that conclusion month after month since jumping on the bandwagon lol.

It's not his fault he is the most active company poster on here.

The world has changed many times and forums are less important to ppl as social tools. So it's easy to see all the SNS posts and assume something else is going on. I don't think that is what is happening at all here.

We got lucky with a trust worthy person in the industry willing to spend time with us.
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Why wouldn’t you name other brands? Lol makes no sense when the thread I specifically ask for other brands. But hey I just won’t buy a product because some body posts a lot. Is it cool the guys active, yeah I guess so, but it’s also all PR and money tactics bro. The more he spends time the more he talks the more people will naturally trust his supplements “ cause he is a nice guy and always interacts” well these are business tactics to make as much money as he can. Thats a fact not saying he ain’t a nice guy but he certainly is out for his well being to make money.
 
JayNY8899 said:
H

How do you or anybody know it’s legit? They show up proof of 3rd party testing or anything for that to prove they are top quality. It seems it’s just word of mouth. One says they like every body jumps on the bandwagon. I have seen people on here say they love a product by and state the effects it’s having on them just to be told them effects are not what these supplements do , so it seems a lot of bandwagon people. I ain’t trying to argue I’m just trying to figure out all the hype based off nothing. But i absolutely appreciate your feedback man. Thanks for the info
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Idk what you are really looking for, your questions seem disjointed.

Just go look it up or search on here, Steve has posted information about how all this works for years now.

If you are upset there are "bandwagon" people that is just life man get over it.
JayNY8899 said:
Why wouldn’t you name other brands? Lol makes no sense when the thread I specifically ask for other brands. But hey I just won’t buy a product because some body posts a lot. Is it cool the guys active, yeah I guess so, but it’s also all PR and money tactics bro. The more he spends time the more he talks the more people will naturally trust his supplements “ cause he is a nice guy and always interacts” well these are business tactics to make as much money as he can. Thats a fact not saying he ain’t a nice guy but he certainly is out for his well being to make money.
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Get lost dude.

You obviously are just ignoring people’s feedback that contradicts how you feel.

edit: it just seems overly rude and completely obtuse and missing what people are saying. He’s not just “active”, if you actually looked at what gets posted you’d be able to (maybe not) tell it’s not just the same kind of crappy “posting” most people do.
 
poison said:
One time, years ago, I lost my job for the second time in a short period. I mentioned it on bb.com in passing, where I was repping SAN. Out of nowhere, Universal sent me a huge box of supps and a note wishing me success.

I haven't used their stuff in a while, but they're good people and aren't lying about ingredients.
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Agreeing have used universal a lot but haven’t much in years
 
Resolve10 said:
Idk what you are really looking for, your questions seem disjointed.

Just go look it up or search on here, Steve has posted information about how all this works for years now.

If you are upset there are "bandwagon" people that is just life man get over it.


Get lost dude.

You obviously are just ignoring people’s feedback that contradicts how you feel.
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Idc how my questions seem to you. If they don’t make sense then keep it moving. My questions are quite clear , everybody else seeem to understand them but you. Maybe you are brain dead,idk. Seems like you a problem lol. And Wtf u all pissy for over a few questions. Get the guys 🍆 out of your mouth dude lol
 
JayNY8899 said:
Idc how my questions seem to you. If they don’t make sense then keep it moving. My questions are quite clear , everybody else seeem to understand them but you. Seems like you a problem lol. Wtf u all pissy for over done questions. Get the guys 🍆 out of your mouth dude lol
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Again your questions have been answered in the past so many times if you took the chance to actually read any of it.
 
JayNY8899 said:
Why wouldn’t you name other brands? Lol makes no sense when the thread I specifically ask for other brands. But hey I just won’t buy a product because some body posts a lot. Is it cool the guys active, yeah I guess so, but it’s also all PR and money tactics bro. The more he spends time the more he talks the more people will naturally trust his supplements “ cause he is a nice guy and always interacts” well these are business tactics to make as much money as he can. Thats a fact not saying he ain’t a nice guy but he certainly is out for his well being to make money.
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Thanks for confirming the reason you posted. You aren't interested in having an actual discussion.

All your questions were answered and then some. I won't mention other companies as it would come across as bashing. Many of wasted lots of money before we found Steve. The information is above, but again you don't really care and are not actually trying to have a conversation. Just disruption.
 
sns8778 said:
I wasn't going to reply in this thread at all, but since I replied to the quality part, may as well reply to this part too.

In reply to your comment - It seems it’s just word of mouth.

Absolutely. You say word of mouth like that's a bad thing.

As opposed to what, spending a lot of money to have influencers and spokespeople tell you something works because you're paying them to say it and then having to markup products more on customers bc you're paying them to say it?

SNS has always had a - Real People, Real Results - concept to it.

I love the science and I love helping people, but I hate the marketing side of things.

We don't have the big marketing money that some of the corporate backed brands do, but I'm not sure why that would be a bad thing? Because it we start putting profits over helping people, then we have to scale back formulas to bring the cost of them down, factor in a big advertising budget into the profits needed, and mark products up a lot more. All of that would go against what we are about because it would involve either making a lot less thorough formulas &/or increasing prices and the products can't help people if people can't afford to take them.

If you are more impressed with fancy marketing than science based formulas at good prices, there are definitely a lot of brands out there that can accommodate that and will be glad to take your money. And I don't mean that in a bad way because I formulate for some of them and warehouse for some of them; there's nothing wrong with them, its just a difference in business models.
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So I’m not sure what you are babbling about “liking fancy marketed brands” instead of acting all but hurt I’m not kissing your ass like everybody else does , your prior comment was fine the next comment came off like Resolves as you were all offended lol. I never mentioned I like any brand so wtf are you talking bout me liking fancy brands . I never said I even take supplements. All I take is basic is some basic supplements by now foods ( omegas , dim and calcium d Glucarate) and life extension probiotics and Lox5 inhibitor) and Megazymes. I take creatine and I stated I am using your creatine and did state I like it. I have looked up a lot of ingredients you have and I find many different articles that say it’s done this and that but then other articles saying it don’t. So lol the natty supplement business is in many ways a big scam. Only supplement that is 100% proven is creatine. I’m taking api and epi plex now cause I figured why not. I’m a week in , nothing different is happening. Nothing at all. I have a 60 day supply. My diet is on point my training in point. Sns PA did nothing for me. But so coincidental that every body says how amazing it is. Truth is bro people like to fit in society they wanna be part of somehting so they say anything to fit in.

that’s great you have some good feedback and I’m sure every other brand for the most part can post comments if people that back them.

I guess only way I’ll know if your **** works atleast test boosters is by getting blood work. Which all the people swear by and but I never seen one person post their blood work to support it and even so how reliable are these people cause I think ppl would be scared to come in and say it did nothing for me but boost my libido a bit.
 
JayNY8899 said:
So I’m not sure what you are babbling about “liking fancy marketed brands” instead of acting all but hurt I’m not kissing your ass like everybody else does , your prior comment was fine the next comment came off like Resolves as you were all offended lol. I never mentioned I like any brand so wtf are you talking bout me liking fancy brands . I never said I even take supplements. All I take is basic is some basic supplements by now foods ( omegas , dim and calcium d Glucarate) and life extension probiotics and Lox5 inhibitor) and Megazymes. I take creatine and I stated I am using your creatine and did state I like it. I have looked up a lot of ingredients you have and I find many different articles that say it’s done this and that but then other articles saying it don’t. So lol the natty supplement business is in many ways a big scam. Only supplement that is 100% proven is creatine. I’m taking api and epi plex now cause I figured why not. I’m a week in , nothing different is happening. Nothing at all. I have a 60 day supply. My diet is on point my training in point. Sns PA did nothing for me. But so coincidental that every body says how amazing it is. Truth is bro people like to fit in society they wanna be part of somehting so they say anything to fit in.

that’s great you have some good feedback and I’m sure every other brand for the most part can post comments if people that back them.

I guess only way I’ll know if your **** works atleast test boosters is by getting blood work. Which all the people swear by and but I never seen one person post their blood work to support it and even so how reliable are these people cause I think ppl would be scared to come in and say it did nothing for me but boost my libido a bit.
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Coming on a supplement forum to complain about and bash supplements would be like someone that doesn't play golf going on a golf forum to bash golf.

You made a statement that the brands seemed to be mostly known by word of mouth.

I replied directly to your statement that yes, the brands are known mostly by word of mouth and that we don't pay for influencers and big marketing campaigns like some brands.

You're the one that criticized word of mouth and real world feedback.

I just said that if you prefer brands with fancy marketing (as in not word of mouth), there are plenty of them out there.


Different things work differently for different people. But the way you're trying to frame it is that if most people like something and you don't, then they're all lying and its some big conspiracy - when maybe it either just doesn't work for you or you have unrealistic expectations, or you didn't use something long enough.

Like for example, under your previous username that your posts are deleted from, but preserved in quote replies with quite a few people telling you that you had unrealistic expectations. You were bashing Anacyclus XT because you'd been on it for 5 days and hadn't noticed anything yet but in the same thread acknowledged that when you used testosterone a few years ago that it took 3 weeks to even start working.

For those reading, here are some of the quotes:

JayNY2Fla said:
5 days on Anacyclus. Feel absolutely nothing. Not even a slight libido boost. Diet and training is for sure 100% on point. I’m waiting one more week I feel nothing I’m tossing the bottle and the 2nd bottle. Seems like a waste of money which is exactly why I’m sketchy bout buying all these supplements. Most are crap

JayNY2Fla said:
That’s fair enough man. Well I have two bottles so I’ll see what happens. Yes I also get your point regarding injecting test I did a few times years ago and the same about 2-3 weeks to really start to see results

The posts were deleted but for anyone that wants to see them, you can find them in other people's quotes where they replied to them:

Invalid Link Removed
 
There can be a significant variation between people in how they react to supplements. For example, in my case, I react very strongly to Yohimbine and GABA, much more so that many others. In addition, supplements may take some time to build up, meaning an individual may not feel results immediately and with other supplements, such as fish oil, the individual may not feel anything at all. Just points of reference.
 
JayNY8899 said:
Idc how my questions seem to you. If they don’t make sense then keep it moving. My questions are quite clear , everybody else seeem to understand them but you. Maybe you are brain dead,idk. Seems like you a problem lol. And Wtf u all pissy for over a few questions. Get the guys 🍆 out of your mouth dude lol
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You asked questions, people answered you.

You ignored the answers you received and then posted:
But hey I just won’t buy a product because some body posts a lot.

No one, not one single person said that they buy our products because I post a lot.

Some people said that they like that I post and interact and help people here, but not one single person said that was why they bought the products. People gave you plenty of reasons, but you ignored them.

He said that your questions seemed disjointed because you ignored probably a dozen people’s answers to your questions to just continue posting antagonistic and negative things.

To which, he made a very clear statement:
You obviously are just ignoring people’s feedback that contradicts how you feel.

You proved his point by immediately going to name calling and insults.

You don’t like me, cool. You made that clear under your last usernames.

Some people come here to discuss supplements.
Some people come here to read and learn about supplements.

You say that you want to know about supplements, but if that were true, you wouldn’t come on here and insult respected members that have contributed to AM for many years and helped and encouraged others, when all you’ve done is try to cause drama, brag about how much you spent on workout equipment like that makes you better than anyone else, and in one thread say that someone should overdose and kill themselves.

If you want to discuss supplements, cool. That's what the forum is here for. But coming on here and insulting people and especially making light of or jokes about suicide are just going to get you banned quickly.
 
Beau said:
There can be a significant variation between people in how they react to supplements. For example, in my case, I react very strongly to Yohimbine and GABA, much more so that many others. In addition, supplements may take some time to build up, meaning an individual may not feel results immediately and with other supplements, such as fish oil, the individual may not feel anything at all. Just points of reference.
Click to expand...

Agreed. And in the case of Phosphatidic Acid XT, it contains both Mediator Phosphatidic Acid and Senactiv, both of which have real world clinical studies and have been proven to be effective and have a lot of great feedback on them. And its been pretty commonly discussed that some people experience results from phosphatidic acid quickly and for other people they really don't see a lot until it builds up in their system a bit, which is why some people front load and double the dose for the first 2 to 4 weeks.

And good observation too - that with a lot of health supplements like vitamins, fish oil, etc. you may never actually feel anything but that doesn't mean the overall health benefits aren't happening.
 
JayNY8899 said:
So I’m not sure what you are babbling about “liking fancy marketed brands” instead of acting all but hurt I’m not kissing your ass like everybody else does , your prior comment was fine the next comment came off like Resolves as you were all offended lol. I never mentioned I like any brand so wtf are you talking bout me liking fancy brands . I never said I even take supplements. All I take is basic is some basic supplements by now foods ( omegas , dim and calcium d Glucarate) and life extension probiotics and Lox5 inhibitor) and Megazymes. I take creatine and I stated I am using your creatine and did state I like it. I have looked up a lot of ingredients you have and I find many different articles that say it’s done this and that but then other articles saying it don’t. So lol the natty supplement business is in many ways a big scam. Only supplement that is 100% proven is creatine. I’m taking api and epi plex now cause I figured why not. I’m a week in , nothing different is happening. Nothing at all. I have a 60 day supply. My diet is on point my training in point. Sns PA did nothing for me. But so coincidental that every body says how amazing it is. Truth is bro people like to fit in society they wanna be part of somehting so they say anything to fit in.

that’s great you have some good feedback and I’m sure every other brand for the most part can post comments if people that back them.

I guess only way I’ll know if your **** works atleast test boosters is by getting blood work. Which all the people swear by and but I never seen one person post their blood work to support it and even so how reliable are these people cause I think ppl would be scared to come in and say it did nothing for me but boost my libido a bit.
Click to expand...

People always resort to dumbass comments like only creatine is 100% when they are too dumb to understand how any of this works.

Not our fault if you fail to understand.

Just move along then.

It’s always the same kinds of dudes who you always have to tip toe around with answers for because they have such fragile egos that immediately resort back to showing how woefully inadequate they are at understanding what they are discussing the second anything (which is quite a lot and happens nearly immediately) goes over their limited understanding.
 
Still seemingly ignoring the most useful post in this thread that actually answered your question, but again I don’t think that any of this was your actual question, someone just wanted to complain.
 
$15K of equipment but can you actually use it? Is that pic even yours or just from another forum poster on another board? You aren't clever at all. People are being too nice entertaining anything you say. Here I am feeding the troll...

CAN'T WAIT FOR THE NEXT DROP OF NEW SNS! :)
 
Based on the posts of the OP, I am under the impression that he is not really saying that he doesn't trust what is on the label is not in a product per say. But more so whether the claims a particular company makes about a product are actually going to be delivered. I may be in the minority in this thread, but I think this is a huge issue in the supplement industry. So much so that recent changes have been made in regards to supplement advertising that require much more validated research to be cited to make health benefit statements. Honestly, I personally think most supplements do not do a whole lot, even if 1-2 human studies are done showing benefits. Usually the studies are small and need much more replication. Many more tenured supplements are less impressive then they were originally stated to be based on the early studies due to many issues in the world or publishing research. That the first study published usually shows the biggest effect and could just be an outlier as more studies are published, or that other studies were done prior but not published bc the findings were not impressive enough to make it into a journal (impact value study matters for publication a lot of times). A good example is the research history of citrulline/citrulline malate (first study was the most impressive and later studies showed much less or nothing and then a meta was run and the overall results were pretty small in the end). OP, if you are not a troll, my best advice is to only buy supplements with well done metas or systemic reviews on the ingredients showing a meaningful enough effect that warrants your money. This basically means you need to be a late adopter to supplements, a very late adopter as research is generally slow. More often then not, being an early adopter as a consumer of supplements usually means wasted money, sadly.
 
SweetLou321 said:
Based on the posts of the OP, I am under the impression that he is not really saying that he doesn't trust what is on the label is not in a product per say. But more so whether the claims a particular company makes about a product are actually going to be delivered. I may be in the minority in this thread, but I think this is a huge issue in the supplement industry. So much so that recent changes have been made in regards to supplement advertising that require much more validated research to be cited to make health benefit statements. Honestly, I personally think most supplements do not do a whole lot, even if 1-2 human studies are done showing benefits. Usually the studies are small and need much more replication. Many more tenured supplements are less impressive then they were originally stated to be based on the early studies due to many issues in the world or publishing research. That the first study published usually shows the biggest effect and could just be an outlier as more studies are published, or that other studies were done prior but not published bc the findings were not impressive enough to make it into a journal (impact value study matters for publication a lot of times). A good example is the research history of citrulline/citrulline malate (first study was the most impressive and later studies showed much less or nothing and then a meta was run and the overall results were pretty small in the end). OP, if you are not a troll, my best advice is to only buy supplements with well done metas or systemic reviews on the ingredients showing a meaningful enough effect that warrants your money. This basically means you need to be a late adopter to supplements, a very late adopter as research is generally slow. More often then not, being an early adopter as a consumer of supplements usually means wasted money, sadly.
Click to expand...

I see what you're saying, I post all the time about what study numbers really mean and how they equate to real world scenarios. I went through the RipFactor study and did a comparison of what some brands advertise those percent gains to mean versus what they mean in the real world. And I talk a lot about how important it is to look at studies in context and to see if the results have been duplicated in other studies.

But you missed the backstory on this one that some people are familiar with and caught onto.

This isn't his first account or his first time coming here. He came on here in the past under a different account bragging about how much he spent on equipment, insulting people and putting them down, and promoting Amazon brands.

In one thread where he was talking about Amazon brands, he got mad at me and another member that's a retail store owner for posting links to the NOW Foods test results showing that some of them failed label claims. Neither of us said anything negative about the brands, just for people to be careful about Amazon brands and how NOW has done a lot of testing on them and shown that many don't meet label claims, and we posted links to those results.

Then he started complaining about natural anabolics not working within 5 days, but in the same thread acknowledged that it takes 3 weeks for him to feel when his test cycles kicked in in the past.

I think that you would agree that anyone that has an expectation that a single ingredient herb will outperform a test cycle in the same amount of time likely is either trolling or has a very unrealistic expectation.

And this time around, one of his first posts on here under the current account was making light of suicide and telling someone to kill themselves. So, if he's not trolling then hell, that's even worse.

But yes, his quality comments earlier in the thread were trolling bc they circle back to him getting mad about having posted those results by NOW when he was here before on the other account. I wasn't going to even bother to post in the thread until he started in on the quality thing, and wasn't going to post anymore in it until he started insulting other forum members.
 
SweetLou321 said:
Based on the posts of the OP, I am under the impression that he is not really saying that he doesn't trust what is on the label is not in a product per say. But more so whether the claims a particular company makes about a product are actually going to be delivered. I may be in the minority in this thread, but I think this is a huge issue in the supplement industry. So much so that recent changes have been made in regards to supplement advertising that require much more validated research to be cited to make health benefit statements. Honestly, I personally think most supplements do not do a whole lot, even if 1-2 human studies are done showing benefits. Usually the studies are small and need much more replication. Many more tenured supplements are less impressive then they were originally stated to be based on the early studies due to many issues in the world or publishing research. That the first study published usually shows the biggest effect and could just be an outlier as more studies are published, or that other studies were done prior but not published bc the findings were not impressive enough to make it into a journal (impact value study matters for publication a lot of times). A good example is the research history of citrulline/citrulline malate (first study was the most impressive and later studies showed much less or nothing and then a meta was run and the overall results were pretty small in the end). OP, if you are not a troll, my best advice is to only buy supplements with well done metas or systemic reviews on the ingredients showing a meaningful enough effect that warrants your money. This basically means you need to be a late adopter to supplements, a very late adopter as research is generally slow. More often then not, being an early adopter as a consumer of supplements usually means wasted money, sadly.
Click to expand...

This completely misses the point of this thread.

If OP wants to question all supplements, fine, but that isn't what he did.

If someone prefers to have to wait for mountains of evidence before making their decisions on what is worth their time, that is fine, as it is in nearly any field, they'll just have to also accept generally being far behind the curve.

If they make that choice to only want things with immense backing and are nearly undeniable, that again is their choice, but even if they choose that they'd be better off choosing a brand like SNS or NOW that you know you are getting what is on the label from a company who follows the proper standards and not just buying the cheapest of that product on Amazon. :)
 
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