Rebound XT sides anyone?

AlexParty

Yari Ka Daw!
I would of never thought I'd be getting this much of a breakout. I finished the PP cycle 4 weeks ago then started to post cycle therapy with RXT. After a week I had zits like crazy, hives as big as my toe. I never get zits, my face is clear and smooth. I started to get hives on the back of my head! It's so extreme(anabolic ;) ) now I'm just shooting the bottle out. I would of accepted it on PP but RBXT? I can see how it raises test naturally but my BP went through the roof. At the gym if I even lift something light I turn red, kinda embaressing makes me look like I'm on something beyond. Anyone else experience this side? I read in some threads that XT has caused delayed gyno, although I have not had any problems.

Oh by the way anyone who wants to try Retain but doesn't know for sure should try it, the recovery is great....
 
Unfortunately for me, one of the negative side effects of using an AI is the death of my immune system, and as expected since the estrodial levels are low. I got pretty sick 2 weeks into RXT. It sucked.
 
What dosage were u using, some have to start off at say 25mg a day for the first few days and then move up, as always if u r having negative effects from any supp. lower dosage or stop altogether......
 
I took RXT awhile back solo, just to break through a plateau and all I experienced was a massive and crushing loss of libido that made me realize I will not be taking it for PCT..lol
 
I still don't understand why people would use ATD, which has a very short track record and is highly untested over Nolva which has been used for PCT by bodybuilders for years. ATD has hormonal sides even when taken solo and it has been linked as the cause of gyno for people on SD cycles. Why would this be used for PCT?
 
MattHines said:
I still don't understand why people would use ATD, which has a very short track record and is highly untested over Nolva which has been used for post cycle therapy by bodybuilders for years. ATD has hormonal sides even when taken solo and it has been linked as the cause of gyno for people on superdrol cycles. Why would this be used for PCT?
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It is often used in conjunction with, and not in place of Novla Matt.
 
Mulletsoldier said:
It is often used in conjunction with, and not in place of Novla Matt.
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I know I know. What I am trying to say is that it is retarded to use ATD for PCT. Nolva is superior in all regards, even cost.
 
AlexParty said:
I would of never thought I'd be getting this much of a breakout. I finished the PP cycle 4 weeks ago then started to post cycle therapy with RXT. After a week I had zits like crazy, hives as big as my toe. I never get zits, my face is clear and smooth. I started to get hives on the back of my head! It's so extreme(anabolic ;) ) now I'm just shooting the bottle out. I would of accepted it on PP but RBXT? I can see how it raises test naturally but my BP went through the roof. At the gym if I even lift something light I turn red, kinda embaressing makes me look like I'm on something beyond. Anyone else experience this side? I read in some threads that XT has caused delayed gyno, although I have not had any problems.

Oh by the way anyone who wants to try Retain but doesn't know for sure should try it, the recovery is great....
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I actually had some of the sides that you are getting from RXT. I don't have perfect skin, I always had a few zits here and there, but when I was using RXT for PCT I did have more outbreaks, and most of them actually occurred on the back of my head like you claim. I also had some of BP issues, often when I was lifting it felt like my "heart was heavy." I started to take Hawthorne and Celery Seed and it helped a lot. Needless to say, it was the last time I'll ever be using RXT. I wouldn't worry about it too much, your not the only one that this happened too, but next time im just going with Nolva
 
MattHines said:
I know I know. What I am trying to say is that it is retarded to use ATD for post cycle therapy. Nolva is superior in all regards, even cost.
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Well, they perform different functions. I concede your original point that ATD is a relatively unknown compound and thus has more inherant risk than nolva....but nolva has liver toxicity risks that ATD doesn't appear to have and nolva doesn't actually clear excess estrogen (like ATD) it just stops that excess estrogen from acting on breast tissue. This is why you find many people combining an AI and a SERM (to get the benefits of both).

As to superdrol and delayed gyno, I don't think there is any proven link between it and the use of ATD. I find it difficult to believe that if this were an issue that we wouldn't see delayed gyno with ATD use combined with other compounds. People are experiencing a problem and are grasping for an explanation. IMO, since superdrol seems to be the common denominator, then that is probably the source of the problem. People are underestimating just how powerful a compound it is. I shudder when I read on other boards how casually people are taking it and what their post cycle therapy plans look like. Big surprise when they experience some gyno symptoms months later because their hormones are still out of whack.
 
Thanks for the info...great post

yeahright said:
Well, they perform different functions. I concede your original point that ATD is a relatively unknown compound and thus has more inherant risk than nolva....but nolva has liver toxicity risks that ATD doesn't appear to have and nolva doesn't actually clear excess estrogen (like ATD) it just stops that excess estrogen from acting on breast tissue. This is why you find many people combining an AI and a SERM (to get the benefits of both).

As to superdrol and delayed gyno, I don't think there is any proven link between it and the use of ATD. I find it difficult to believe that if this were an issue that we wouldn't see delayed gyno with ATD use combined with other compounds. People are experiencing a problem and are grasping for an explanation. IMO, since superdrol seems to be the common denominator, then that is probably the source of the problem. People are underestimating just how powerful a compound it is. I shudder when I read on other boards how casually people are taking it and what their post cycle therapy plans look like.
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good replys guys. Yes I can understand most of you guys saying that I should of used Nolva, but on PP? PP is mild IMO and can be post cycled without Nolva. I'd of course have it on hand and wait for symptoms to arise but I would only use it then to prevent gyno. It's funny though how everyones body reacts differently. Only one person here had the same sides. I don't have any loss of libido so I am happy with that. I'm just gonna wait it out now, take some extra anti-ox's and whatever else. I did notive my strength decreasing a little bit. I can still lift the same weights as I did "ON" but with less reps.
 
AlexParty said:
good replys guys. Yes I can understand most of you guys saying that I should of used Nolva, but on PP? PP is mild IMO and can be post cycled without Nolva. I'd of course have it on hand and wait for symptoms to arise but I would only use it then to prevent gyno. It's funny though how everyones body reacts differently. Only one person here had the same sides. I don't have any loss of libido so I am happy with that. I'm just gonna wait it out now, take some extra anti-ox's and whatever else. I did notive my strength decreasing a little bit. I can still lift the same weights as I did "ON" but with less reps.
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PP is not really that mild. It is a methylated compound but it is one of the strongest of the designers. ATD may be OK but it is not adviseable or prefferable. Nolva is a must-have for a PP cycle.
 
Would Nolva, 6-oxo, trib and fenugreek cover all the bases for a Methyl Masterdrol (i.e. Superdrol) cycle?
 
SD is a lot harsher, drier than PP. Didn't get as aggressive on PP as I did on SD. PP is mild(still effective and potent) when compared to SD. People can argue about this but it's true with just the compounds alone. Although I loved PP over SD, less sides and size/strength was great.
 
Ninjo, for sure. Your playing beyond safe. Are they all necessary? That's all up to you to decide. I think if your going to do something with a harsher compound to play it safe with those products. I actually had a debate in another post about this. Everyone pretty much agreed that it's better to be safe than sorry so they bought whatever needed for cycle and post cycle therapy even if it wasn't needed. There's no greater investment than your health.
 
Thanks Alex. I kinda had a feelin' I may be goin' overboard to run both Nolva and 6-oxo but like you said, health comes first (i.e. over expense). Also, since there seems to be an overwhelming amount of consensus that SD/MM has some pretty extreme sides, I thought this would be the way to go!
 
Ninjo said:
Thanks Alex. I kinda had a feelin' I may be goin' overboard to run both Nolva and 6-oxo but like you said, health comes first (i.e. over expense). Also, since there seems to be an overwhelming amount of consensus that superdrol/MM has some pretty extreme sides, I thought this would be the way to go!
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I wouldn't go as far as saying you are going overboard by running both, it's not redundant as they don't do the same thing. One prevents estrogen from binding to your receptors and the other prevents aromatization by blocking the aromatose enzyme. AI's
IMO are more useful because of their mechanism on cycle as opposed to post cycle.
 
Ninjo said:
Would Nolva, 6-oxo, trib and fenugreek cover all the bases for a Methyl Masterdrol (i.e. Superdrol) cycle?
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If you run a search for superdrol PCT I think you'll find that you're not playing it safe. You might be playing it adequate, but this is by no means excessive IMO. Many people will combine a SERM with an AI and 6-oxo is a pretty weak AI compared to ATD......and I'm assuming you're just talking PCT because you don't mention any liver/lipid/blood pressure support sups.
 
What the hell, me and BP both had another post on here?..Strange..Anyway, this RXT talk brought me to something that I think could be the cause of delayed gyno on Superdrol, and it isn't either products themselves, yet the way they are used. During a hormone cycle you introduce exogenous hormones into your body which suppress your natural testosterone. Hence, shutdown. Once the cycle is over one of your goals in reaching homeostasis, IMO, the main goal is to restore your HPTA. If we all remember from Biology, such proccesses work through negative feedback. Your body recognizes it's natural testosterone level is very low, and in turn starts producing it's own. With that production also comes, through negative feedback, production of estrogen. This estrogen production is why we use SERM's to try to negate the estrogen being produced from binding to the receptors. Why using RXT or another AI during post cycle therapy may not be a good idea, is that you are suppressing estrogen production and consequently through negative feedback, suppressing your natural test production. So, all of the sudden when you come off PCT your body begins to mass produce Test and with it Estrogen, except at this point you have nothing to block the binding of that estrogen to the receptors, and voila you have 'delayed gyno'. Now, take this with a grain of salt, because I'm sure with all of the knowledgeable people here, I'm sure one of them would have thought of this before me, and so it's most likely not the answer. But, I would venture to guess most of the individuals who experienced the delayed gyno also felt very shutdown during their PCT.
 
Why would you use an AI after a Superdrol cycle? Or PP for that matter?

They do not aromatize and they shut down test production leaving very little estogen at the end of the cycle. Add an AI to post cycle therapy and you have a recipe for destroyed estrogen levels. That is not good. A SERM will help restore HPTA function.

Edit: yeah Mullet, I just didn't feel like retyping the whole dam rant. :D
 
bpmartyr said:
Why would you use an AI after a Superdrol cycle? Or PP for that matter?

They do not aromatize and shut down test production leaving very little estogen at the end of the cycle. Add an to post cycle therapy and you have a recipe for destroyed estrogen levels. That is not good. A SERM will help restore HPTA function.

Edit: yeah Mullet, I just didn't feel like retyping the whole dam rant. :D
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Did what I said above make sense to you though BP, on why cats are getting 'delayed gyno'? Because they are destroying their Est levels, and it comes rushing back with no binding protection
 
Mulletsoldier said:
Did what I said above make sense to you though BP, on why cats are getting 'delayed gyno'? Because they are destroying their Est levels, and it comes rushing back with no binding protection
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I hadn't really put too much thought in the gyno thing seeing that I have never had a problem like that but yeah, I suppose it makes sense.

What some people fail to realize is post cycle therapy is about assisting/speeding/enhancing your body's natural return to homeostasis. While an AI has the ability to raise test off cycle through negative feedback, I don't see the efficacy while E levels are already low.
 
bpmartyr said:
I hadn't really put too much thought in the gyno thing seeing that I have never had a problem like that but yeah, I suppose it makes sense.

What some people fail to realize is post cycle therapy is about assisting/speeding/enhancing your body's natural return to homeostasis. While an AI has the ability to raise test off cycle through negative feedback, I don't see the efficacy while E levels are already low.
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Yeah, exactly. In an already low Est environment, using an AI just crushes it, which IMO isn't good for Test b/c of negative feedback
 
So would running nolva, trib and fenugreek be a good post cycle therapy for Methyl Masterdrol? I haven't done a cycle with this powerful an oral before and want to ensure I do it right. My MM dosages will be as follows:

week 1: 10mg/day
week 2: 20mg/day
week 3: 20mg/day

post cycle therapy will include Nolva (in addition to trib and fenugreek) as follows:

week 4:40mg
week 5:30mg
week 6:20mg
week 7:10mg

For those of you more experienced with these methylated orals, is there any use (such as reducing likelihood of gyno) in running an AI (i.e. 6-oxo) while on cycle?

And btw, I will be running all the supporting supps incl. hawthorne berry, celery seed, milk thistle, saw palmetto, CoQ10, RYR, etc...I just didn't list them previously 'cause I've seen the list so many times on this board and didn't feel the need to repeat...thought these supps s/b a "given" while on Superdrol/MM.
 
I haven't run my cycle yet but I know I will run an inverse taper with serm and RXT like so:

week 1
Toremifene 120 mg
RXT 1 cap
Act 4 caps

week 2
Toremifene 60 mg
RXT 1 cap
Act 4 caps

week 3
Toremifene 30 mg
RXT 2 caps
Act 4 caps

week 4
Toremifene 30 mg
RXT 2 caps
Act 4 caps


I made this decision based upon more positive feedback from people who have experimented to include one.
 
Ninjo said:
So would running nolva, trib and fenugreek be a good post cycle therapy for Methyl Masterdrol? I haven't done a cycle with this powerful an oral before and want to ensure I do it right. My MM dosages will be as follows:

week 1: 10mg/day
week 2: 20mg/day
week 3: 20mg/day

post cycle therapy will include Nolva (in addition to trib and fenugreek) as follows:

week 4:40mg
week 5:30mg
week 6:20mg
week 7:10mg

For those of you more experienced with these methylated orals, is there any use (such as reducing likelihood of gyno) in running an AI (i.e. 6-oxo) while on cycle?

And btw, I will be running all the supporting supps incl. hawthorne berry, celery seed, milk thistle, saw palmetto, CoQ10, RYR, etc...I just didn't list them previously 'cause I've seen the list so many times on this board and didn't feel the need to repeat...thought these supps s/b a "given" while on Superdrol/MM.
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If Methyl Masterdol is Superdrol running an AI on cycle won't do anything because if I am not mistaken it cannot directly convert, so that won't help you much. Your PCT looks fine, though I would probably add in something like LX or Retain for cortisol, and probably a more effective Saponin then just straight Trib. Look at picking up some Powerfull or something of that sort.
 
I used rebound a few times and started the dose hig 4/day then 3,2,1 gradually and I did get decreased libido and acne on the shoulders too but the product works very well . Kept most gains and hardened up a little and have no gyno.
 
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