Progesterone and Prolactin raised

skyline999

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Hi new to the forum so hello to everyone,

I was looking for some advice which I think with the body building community please.

Background - work out 4 times a week, was using finasteride 1mg a day, creatine, protein and aminos.

Libido suddenly dropped and ED, gyno and puffy nipples, more to left than right but confirmed gyno on both sides.

Took a hormonal blood test, results below show elevated prolactin and progesterone:

Albumin 45.4 g/L (Range: 35 - 50)

X SHBG 60.9 nmol/L (Range: 18.3 - 54.1)

FSH 3.95 IU/L (Range: 1.5 - 12.4)

LH 4.55 IU/L (Range: 1.7 - 8.6)

Oestradiol 113 pmol/L (Range: 41 - 159)

X Testosterone 31 nmol/L (Range: 8.64 - 29)

Free Testosterone - Calc. 0.469 nmol/L (Range: 0.2 - 0.62)

Free Androgen Index 50.9 Ratio (Range: 24 - 104)

Prolactin X 405 mU/L (Range: 86 - 324)

Adrenal Hormones DHEA Sulphate 8.920 umol/L (Range: 4.34 - 12.2)




Stopped finasteride 2 months ago, bloods now show the following:

Albumin 39.20 g/L (Range: 35 - 50)

SHBG 50.60 nmol/L (Range: 18.3 - 54.1)

FSH 3.99 IU/L (Range: 1.5 - 12.4)

LH 4.11 IU/L (Range: 1.7 - 8.6)

Oestradiol 110.00 pmol/L (Range: 41 - 159)

Testosterone 25.30 nmol/L (Range: 8.64 - 29)

Free Testosterone - Calc. 0.449 nmol/L (Range: 0.2 - 0.62)

Free Androgen Index 50 Ratio (Range: 24 - 104)

X Prolactin 576.00 mU/L (Range: 86 - 324)

Adrenal Hormones DHEA Sulphate 8.430 umol/L (Range: 4.34 - 12.2)

X Progesterone 1.17nmol/l (Range: < 0.474)



This is my theory but please advise/correct me if I'm wrong, Finasteride lowered DHT but increased my T and as T had nowhere to go it aromatised into E however my E is still showing within range, as finasteride is a progestin it would be similar to what people get when on progestin steroids? MY SHGB binded to the T and/or E to bring the E down and as DHT is knocked out it's next preference was T. In essence am I feeling what a body builder would feel coming off a steroid cycle without running PCT? Should I take something like Inhibit-P to bring my progesterone and estrogen in balance along with lowering my prolactin?

The endo's aren't too fussed about the Progesterone however they aren't the ones with puffy nipples and gyno so of course they aren't fussed.

Sorry for the long post but just would like some insight please?

Thank you for all replies if any!
 
ValiantThor08

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That is high prolactin. At minimum I would run 300mg P5P every day. Maybe even some caber at .5mg every 4 to 7 days.
 

skyline999

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That is high prolactin. At minimum I would run 300mg P5P every day. Maybe even some caber at .5mg every 4 to 7 days.

Thanks for your reply. Will I only need to use this until it gets back to level and then stop?
 
ValiantThor08

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Tha



Thanks for your reply. Will I only need to use this until it gets back to level and then stop?
Caber should be a temporary solution. You could ride out P5P for a while afterwards just to be sure.
 
ValiantThor08

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Would I have to use P5P long term?
Once everything is at equilibrium, probably not, especially if you get sufficient B6 in your diet. Just hard to tell when you reach equilibrium. Your going to have to play with it. Maybe run caber to get the sharp prolactin drop off. Switch to 300mg of P5P, run that a week, drop to 200, run it a week, drop to 100, and hold there for a while, and then try to come off.
 

skyline999

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Thank you. Would this be a similar situation of not running a PCT after a steroid cycle as the body gets stressed?
 
Whisky

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Something doesn’t quite add up to me bro.

progesterone typically lowers prolactin (and when progesterone is low prolactin is high - that’s how lactation occurs).

the higher t and e on fin absolutely is what the studies show but I don’t think that should have affected prolactin


Caber at 0.5mg 1-2 times a week would reduce it but personally I’d want to understand what it causing it to be high when you don’t appear to have any other hormone imbalance.

2 months after ceasing fin with everything else in range I don’t think that simply bring prolactin back in range with caber would solve the issue as it won’t address the reason it’s high. It would be a possible temp fix. My main reason for concern would be that you are further out of range now than you were.....
 
ValiantThor08

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skyline999

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Thanks bros for the replies!

The endo said a tumour would be present if the prolactin reading was in the 1000s where as mine is in the 500s, also the LH and FSH would be out of whack with a p-tumour wouldn't they? But they are within range. I may push for an MRI just to be sure but would a p-tumour raise progesterone as from what I have read it raises prolactin?

I've spent hours and hours reading on this and I think its because Progesterone inhibits 5AR which is what Finasteride is to do and finasteride in essence is a lab progestin and DHT and Progesterone are antagonists, if DHT rises then Progesterone will lower I should think (and vice versa), however I was reading something about Prohormones and it got me thinking about PCT as they say to run it after a cycle so in theory as high test is what I had on Finasteride which would be the 'Prohormone' and then quitting cold turkey kinda smacked everything out of whack.

Sorry it won't let me copy and paste but on this link:

https://www.predatornutrition.com/articlesdetail?cid=post-cycle-therapy-pct-after-a-prohormone-cycle

Under 'Progesterone Inhibition' it kind of matches what I am facing. Hence why I'm considering trying Inhibit-P for a month and getting my bloods tested again.

Would this be a valid thought:

T and E rose
SHBG rose with it
Prolactin rose due to the rise in E
Progesterone then rose to counteract the E and Prolactin
As DHT still inhibited so Progesterone and Prolactin still raised hence the argument in the link I sent..??
 
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Whisky

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Thanks bros for the replies!

The endo said a tumour would be present if the prolactin reading was in the 1000s where as mine is in the 500s, also the LH and FSH would be out of whack with a p-tumour wouldn't they? But they are within range. I may push for an MRI just to be sure but would a p-tumour raise progesterone as from what I have read it raises prolactin?

I've spent hours and hours reading on this and I think its because Progesterone inhibits 5AR which is what Finasteride is to do and finasteride in essence is a lab progestin and DHT and Progesterone are antagonists, if DHT rises then Progesterone will lower I should think (and vice versa), however I was reading something about Prohormones and it got me thinking about PCT as they say to run it after a cycle so in theory as high test is what I had on Finasteride which would be the 'Prohormone' and then quitting cold turkey kinda smacked everything out of whack.

Sorry it won't let me copy and paste but on this link:

https://www.predatornutrition.com/articlesdetail?cid=post-cycle-therapy-pct-after-a-prohormone-cycle

Under 'Progesterone Inhibition' it kind of matches what I am facing. Hence why I'm considering trying Inhibit-P for a month and getting my bloods tested again.

Would this be a valid thought:

T and E rose
SHBG rose with it
Prolactin rose due to the rise in E
Progesterone then rose to counteract the E and Prolactin
As DHT still inhibited so Progesterone and Prolactin still raised hence the argument in the link I sent..??
honestly bro, a site that sells prohormones and otc pct supplements is the last place I would be getting my information on this stuff.....we know predator and basically they (like any business are out to sell stuff), a pct can not be conducted properly with otc supplements (it needs prescription medication, this is extremely standard and well known in the steroid world), however, predator can’t sell clomid or nolva or hcg etc so they are going to portray information in a way that suits their commercial position....

inhibit p won’t do much at all in your situation imo. It’s simply not that effective. Any of us who use 19nors (known for raising prolactin) have caber or similar on hand.

i don’t think that at this stage BOTH progesterone and prolactin should be raised
 

skyline999

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honestly bro, a site that sells prohormones and otc pct supplements is the last place I would be getting my information on this stuff.....we know predator and basically they (like any business are out to sell stuff), a pct can not be conducted properly with otc supplements (it needs prescription medication, this is extremely standard and well known in the steroid world), however, predator can’t sell clomid or nolva or hcg etc so they are going to portray information in a way that suits their commercial position....

inhibit p won’t do much at all in your situation imo. It’s simply not that effective. Any of us who use 19nors (known for raising prolactin) have caber or similar on hand.

i don’t think that at this stage BOTH progesterone and prolactin should be raised
What do you suspect it is then..? I'm stumped
 
Whisky

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What do you suspect it is then..? I'm stumped
that’s just it, I don’t know and imo (I’m just an internet bro by the way, definitely no expert on any of this) there isn’t an obvious cause.... I’m not convinced it is linked to the fin even (do you have bloods prior to using that so we at least know it hasn’t been high for ages?)

I’d be finding a medical professional to take a look tbh
 

skyline999

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No unfortunately I don't have a hormonal panel before using Fin.

Is it worth maybe trying the Inhibit-P or Prolacterone?

Medical professional's answer - wait it out, I wouldn't be worried about Progesterone and your Prolactin is mildly raised.... that's it..that's what they say...
 
ValiantThor08

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No unfortunately I don't have a hormonal panel before using Fin.

Is it worth maybe trying the Inhibit-P or Prolacterone?

Medical professional's answer - wait it out, I wouldn't be worried about Progesterone and your Prolactin is mildly raised.... that's it..that's what they say...
If you really want to try and lower it, and see if it stays low, caber, not inhibit P, and even though I rep for BLR, and suspect Prolactrone would help, if I was in your shoes, I would hit caber first then Prolactrone or P5P; after caber. Then I would get my labs done again.
 

skyline999

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I can't get Caber without a prescription unfortunately and as the doc wants me to 'wait it out' I don't know what other option I have, I can't seem to persuade him to give me anything yet I'm being charged to sit in his office!
 
ValiantThor08

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I can't get Caber without a prescription unfortunately and as the doc wants me to 'wait it out' I don't know what other option I have, I can't seem to persuade him to give me anything yet I'm being charged to sit in his office!
I think some of our board sponsors have caber.
 
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blackirish36

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Thanks bros for the replies!

The endo said a tumour would be present if the prolactin reading was in the 1000s where as mine is in the 500s, also the LH and FSH would be out of whack with a p-tumour wouldn't they? But they are within range. I may push for an MRI just to be sure but would a p-tumour raise progesterone as from what I have read it raises prolactin?

I've spent hours and hours reading on this and I think its because Progesterone inhibits 5AR which is what Finasteride is to do and finasteride in essence is a lab progestin and DHT and Progesterone are antagonists, if DHT rises then Progesterone will lower I should think (and vice versa), however I was reading something about Prohormones and it got me thinking about PCT as they say to run it after a cycle so in theory as high test is what I had on Finasteride which would be the 'Prohormone' and then quitting cold turkey kinda smacked everything out of whack.

Sorry it won't let me copy and paste but on this link:

https://www.predatornutrition.com/articlesdetail?cid=post-cycle-therapy-pct-after-a-prohormone-cycle

Under 'Progesterone Inhibition' it kind of matches what I am facing. Hence why I'm considering trying Inhibit-P for a month and getting my bloods tested again.

Would this be a valid thought:

T and E rose
SHBG rose with it
Prolactin rose due to the rise in E
Progesterone then rose to counteract the E and Prolactin
As DHT still inhibited so Progesterone and Prolactin still raised hence the argument in the link I sent..??
If you have a microprolactinoma, you won't necessarily have prolactin levels as high as your endo has indicated. The good news is that Caber is effective in shrinking various pituitary adenomas, and especially so with prolactinomas. A course of Caber could even completely resolve a microadenoma. I have a microadenoma myself, and my endo was talking to me about running Caber until we determined that the tumor was inactive.
 

blackirish36

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I think ValiantThor08 has given you a very good protocol to start out with.
 
Whisky

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No unfortunately I don't have a hormonal panel before using Fin.

Is it worth maybe trying the Inhibit-P or Prolacterone?

Medical professional's answer - wait it out, I wouldn't be worried about Progesterone and your Prolactin is mildly raised.... that's it..that's what they say...
I can't get Caber without a prescription unfortunately and as the doc wants me to 'wait it out' I don't know what other option I have, I can't seem to persuade him to give me anything yet I'm being charged to sit in his office!
none of us using caber have a prescription for it bro .......just saying
 

skyline999

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If you have a microprolactinoma, you won't necessarily have prolactin levels as high as your endo has indicated. The good news is that Caber is effective in shrinking various pituitary adenomas, and especially so with prolactinomas. A course of Caber could even completely resolve a microadenoma. I have a microadenoma myself, and my endo was talking to me about running Caber until we determined that the tumor was inactive.
What were your prolactin levels at?
 

skyline999

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Also to all the bros who use AAS have you had a case where after a cycle your prolactin remains elevated until you’ve done something to lower them? Once you’ve lowered them have they stayed there or do you have to continuously take something like caber?
 
RIPDanDuchaine

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Would I have to use P5P long term?
You can run regular B6, it doesn't necessarily have to be P5P. P5P is just a more active form of it. You could take a cheap B complex like NOW B-100. Also, check your multi and see how much B6 it has.

Thank you. Would this be a similar situation of not running a PCT after a steroid cycle as the body gets stressed?
Not exactly. After an AAS cycle, your prolactin and progesterone normally aren't elevated to those levels. It's normally estrogen and cortisol.

I would follow the advice of the other members of the forum and take Caber. If you're starting to get gyno, I would also recommend taking a SERM like Nolvadex at around 20-40mg a day. Proviron would be an ideal solution if you can get your hands on it too.

Does Vitex work to balance progesterone and estrogen?
It does to a certain degree. It's mainly used as a PMS or Menopause.

Reading the info on examine.com, it doesn't sound promising though.

At least one study has noted increased serum estrogen (and progesterone) in female rats as a result of supplementation with Vitex Agnus

[...]

Vitex Agnus has the classification of containing phytoestrogens, but due to potent binding to the beta subunit of the Estrogen Receptors (ERb) and not the alpha subunit typically associated with 'estrogen-like effects', the overall actions of Vitex Agnus may be practically anti-estrogenic
So, some conflicting information, but it sounds like something I would probably stay away from.

 

skyline999

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Thanks for the link, it doesn't work though, it says I have to redirect to another site, is the redirection legit?
 

skyline999

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You can run regular B6, it doesn't necessarily have to be P5P. P5P is just a more active form of it. You could take a cheap B complex like NOW B-100. Also, check your multi and see how much B6 it has.



Not exactly. After an AAS cycle, your prolactin and progesterone normally aren't elevated to those levels. It's normally estrogen and cortisol.

I would follow the advice of the other members of the forum and take Caber. If you're starting to get gyno, I would also recommend taking a SERM like Nolvadex at around 20-40mg a day. Proviron would be an ideal solution if you can get your hands on it too.



It does to a certain degree. It's mainly used as a PMS or Menopause.

Reading the info on examine.com, it doesn't sound promising though.
Strange that as they put it in Inhibit-P???!
 
sns8778

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You can run regular B6, it doesn't necessarily have to be P5P. P5P is just a more active form of it. You could take a cheap B complex like NOW B-100. Also, check your multi and see how much B6 it has.

Not exactly. After an AAS cycle, your prolactin and progesterone normally aren't elevated to those levels. It's normally estrogen and cortisol.


It does to a certain degree. It's mainly used as a PMS or Menopause.

Reading the info on examine.com, it doesn't sound promising though.
Strange that as they put it in Inhibit-P???!
It's been kind of known for that in bodybuilding circles for a long time, but it doesn't appear to work that way. Maybe @sns8778 can help clarify.
Examine.com is a great website for some information but if you go just by what they say on everything, half the ingredients that people love don't appear to work. Remember that they are more geared to being a general health site than a bodybuilding one. Also remember that there are some ingredients that look great on paper that don't work and there are some ingredients that work great that don't have tons of research.

Vitex was traditionally used for PMS and Menopause years before it was known to help with Prolactin; and 99% of the customer base market for Vitex as an herb is looking for it for that reason so of course that's what Examine.com is going to focus on. That doesn't mean that it's not good for other things, including Prolactin control.

Vitex was already known to work for Prolactin before Inhibit-P ever came out. When we released it, some of the smartest people to ever post here (Cooper, Synapsin, etc.) all praised it as a very complete formula and a great price and backed the inclusion of Vitex in the formula.

As for P5P vs. regular B6 - most of what I've seen for Prolactin is on P5P.

Inhibit-P has been offered for a long time and has tons of positive feedback, including numerous instances of people posting bloodwork over the years. We've had feedback on everything from on cycle use, PCT use, situations similar to this, people trying to reduce prolactin for fertility purposes, and people that use it in the HRT, especially if nandrolone is part of it. We've also had plenty of feedback over the years from people that thought they had gyno issues that really seemed to be related to prolactin because when they took Inhibit-P, it helped.

Here's a link to the write up if you want to read more on it:
 
ValiantThor08

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Thanks for the link, it doesn't work though, it says I have to redirect to another site, is the redirection legit?
Yes, it is legit. Pure Rawz. They are one of the board sponsors.
 

skyline999

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Examine.com is a great website for some information but if you go just by what they say on everything, half the ingredients that people love don't appear to work. Remember that they are more geared to being a general health site than a bodybuilding one. Also remember that there are some ingredients that look great on paper that don't work and there are some ingredients that work great that don't have tons of research.

Vitex was traditionally used for PMS and Menopause years before it was known to help with Prolactin; and 99% of the customer base market for Vitex as an herb is looking for it for that reason so of course that's what Examine.com is going to focus on. That doesn't mean that it's not good for other things, including Prolactin control.

Vitex was already known to work for Prolactin before Inhibit-P ever came out. When we released it, some of the smartest people to ever post here (Cooper, Synapsin, etc.) all praised it as a very complete formula and a great price and backed the inclusion of Vitex in the formula.

As for P5P vs. regular B6 - most of what I've seen for Prolactin is on P5P.

Inhibit-P has been offered for a long time and has tons of positive feedback, including numerous instances of people posting bloodwork over the years. We've had feedback on everything from on cycle use, PCT use, situations similar to this, people trying to reduce prolactin for fertility purposes, and people that use it in the HRT, especially if nandrolone is part of it. We've also had plenty of feedback over the years from people that thought they had gyno issues that really seemed to be related to prolactin because when they took Inhibit-P, it helped.

Here's a link to the write up if you want to read more on it:
Thank you. Does Vitex help with raised Progesterone in men? All I can seem to find on the internet is it RAISES Progesterone?
 
sns8778

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Thank you. Does Vitex help with raised Progesterone in men? All I can seem to find on the internet is it RAISES Progesterone?
In women, Vitex helps balance Progesterone and Estrogen levels. That's why its been used at least since the 90's as a supportive supplement for women going thru menopause.

In men, Vitex is commonly used to help lower prolactin levels and some research indicates it may increase luteinizing hormone (LH) levels which could explain the libido increase that some men experience with Inhibit-P.

I have seen plenty of bloodwork over the years of in men showing where it decreased their Prolactin levels and don't recall ever seeing any instance where it increased Progesterone (including my own bloodwork).

So basically, I wouldn't say that Inhibit-P would specifically lower progesterone in men but I would say that it does a great job lowering prolactin in men and that many men seem to see their progesterone levels normalize as their prolactin does.
 
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blackirish36

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What were your prolactin levels at?
364 mIU/L.
My PCP thought it was sufficient to merit an MRI to look for an adenoma. The MRI found a 4mmx3mm microadenoma, and also confirmed that I have empty sella syndrome.
My prolactin returned to normal when my doc prescribed NP Thyroid to deal with subclinical hypothyroidism. You might have your doc look into your thyroid.
 

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Thanks. Thyroid came back normal. Every time they were ran alongside the bloods.

Is mIU/L the same as mu/L?
 

skyline999

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In women, Vitex helps balance Progesterone and Estrogen levels. That's why its been used at least since the 90's as a supportive supplement for women going thru menopause.

In men, Vitex is commonly used to help lower prolactin levels and some research indicates it may increase luteinizing hormone (LH) levels which could explain the libido increase that some men experience with Inhibit-P.

I have seen plenty of bloodwork over the years of in men showing where it decreased their Prolactin levels and don't recall ever seeing any instance where it increased Progesterone (including my own bloodwork).

So basically, I wouldn't say that Inhibit-P would specifically lower progesterone in men but I would say that it does a great job lowering prolactin in men and that many men seem to see their progesterone levels normalize as their prolactin does.
Thank you for this info, very much appreciated!
 
sns8778

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Thanks. Thyroid came back normal. Every time they were ran alongside the bloods.

Is mIU/L the same as mu/L?
This is completely off subject and has nothing to do with the thread topic but is related to thyroid.

If they haven't (and a lot of doctors don't) tested reverse T3, ask them to add that in to the next bloodwork for thyroid. A lot of doctors judge your thyroid being 'okay' based off the regular tests but when they look at Reverse T3, they may find out there is an issue. Just sharing from personal experience and trying to help out.
 

blackirish36

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Thanks. Thyroid came back normal. Every time they were ran alongside the bloods.

Is mIU/L the same as mu/L?
The thing about panels is that the reference ranges have been changing to reflect a less healthy population. Your thyroid tests could come back "normal," but you might still have a problem. My initial panel came back "normal," but far enough from optimal that my supposedly healthy thyroid was causing problems.
I think the two units are the same. One is just abbreviated.
 
sns8778

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What’s reverse T3?
It's a thyroid hormone. I'm not sure about in the UK, but in the US when most doctors do thyroid testing, they don't test for reverse T3 levels. Research in recent years has shown the importance of testing for reverse T3 in addition to regular thyroid testing. Because in many people, regular testing may show your thyroid levels are normal but then when reverse T3 is tested, it may reveal an issue. My endocrinology specialist is a big advocate of reverse T3 testing. If it were me, next time I was going to have labs done, I'd just mention it to the doctor ordering the testing.
 
sns8778

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The thing about panels is that the reference ranges have been changing to reflect a less healthy population. Your thyroid tests could come back "normal," but you might still have a problem. My initial panel came back "normal," but far enough from optimal that my supposedly healthy thyroid was causing problems.
I think the two units are the same. One is just abbreviated.
Good post. The same thing happened to me. My initial tests came back 'normal' but far enough off to indicate an issue. When I saw an endocrinology specialist, they ordered a re-test and tested reverse T3 along with it and showed that the ratio it is supposed to be was off by a pretty good margin.
 

skyline999

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MRI came back clear for Prolactinoma.

Progesterone and prolactin still raised so I’ve been given a 4 week course of caber, would this help? If prolactin lowers does that give progesterone a chance to fall back within its limits?

I’m having a strange nut ache when I try shooting a load, which by the way the volume has dropped significantly
 
tfola

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Your best bet would be to try Nettle Root along with Pine Pollen, both work on bringing down prolactin and is good for prostate health to

I used to experience waking up in the middle of the night several times to pee and i discovered its a likely symptom of early prostate issues, i never had it checked, but i noticed since i started cycling herbs like Saw Palmetto and Nettle Root i have stopped experiencing aking up in the middle of the night to pee

Recently i got pine pollen powder, although some say its not as powerful as the tincture, but it works fine for me, pairing it with nettle root and tongkat ali makes it work better for me

Hope this helps
 

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