Polycythemia: Once per week VS twice per week injections?

CroLifter

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So i just encountered this study: https://www.auajournals.org/doi/full/10.1016/j.juro.2016.02.1856

Basically it says that biweekly injections caused higher hematocrit values than equivalwnt once per week dose?

I usually read that people say more frequent lower doses (say 50mg test e 2x per week, what i am doing right now) is more optimal than say 100mg every 7 days.

Have we been wrong all along and is once per week dosing better as far as side effects go?

also they say that hypogonadal symptoms return before the next dose on twice per week dose. I dont feel it that way.
 
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GreenMachineX

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Interesting study! No one else has any thoughts???
 

CroLifter

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My thoughts are that biweekly injections cause a higher percentage of testosterone to be in a free state, hence the larger rise in hematocrit.
 
GreenMachineX

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My thoughts are that biweekly injections cause a higher percentage of testosterone to be in a free state, hence the larger rise in hematocrit.
Makes sense. On another forum, someone said a higher trough (as opposed to peak) results in higher hct.
 
thebigt

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I usually do once a week but I've been experimenting with twice weekly...going to go back to once a week, I miss the boost I get from once weekly...twice weekly I don't get the 'boost'.
 
GreenMachineX

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I usually do once a week but I've been experimenting with twice weekly...going to go back to once a week, I miss the boost I get from once weekly...twice weekly I don't get the 'boost'.
With once a week, is the low lower than what you feel with twice per week? I’d like a boost, but not if it going to take me even lower than potential stable higher troughs.
 
The Matrix

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I have doctors doing daily injections subq T reducing need to donate blood
 

kisaj

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When I moved to 2x weekly injections I saw a substantial increase in HCT. I moved back to once a week and it dropped back down.
 
GreenMachineX

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When I moved to 2x weekly injections I saw a substantial increase in HCT. I moved back to once a week and it dropped back down.
Was your trough higher or lower with each protocol?
 

kisaj

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Question on this study is why they weren't consistent with the dose. This is a huge variable that basically makes it worthless.

"separated into 27 men on 200mg of T once weekly (QW) and 28 men on 80-160mg of T twice weekly"
 
thebigt

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When I moved to 2x weekly injections I saw a substantial increase in HCT. I moved back to once a week and it dropped back down.
same here, I also went back to once weekly.
 

CroLifter

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So the last day or two before the next injection the feels start to creep up. Anxiety, lack of motivation and slight sadness/depression. Lack of motivation maaaan it sucks literally getting up feels hard.

Anxiety and panic attacks have been linked to amygdala's not getting enough dopamine. When i take cabergoline, which is a dopamine agonist, i feel an uplift in mood, so there is some truth in that.
Since free test stimulates dopamine, we can conclude that lack of free test causes dopamine deficiency and therefore anxiety, and panic attacks in susceptible individuals.

Since i am a cheap phuk and dont want to waste test and i currently only have amps i inject more than 125 mg at once, more like 150-175 and then wait 9 or 10 days instead of 7 to average roughly 125mg pw.

When i inject, few hours later, as if invisible curtains start to lift. It is a weird feeling you just sit there and feel as if life force is being injected into you hahahah no pun intended. I swear it is the dopamine, and therefore lack of it in the last days preceeding the next injection.


I have to say that since i have been injecting subq i have been able to delay the crash by about a day or two, so absorption is definitely slower.
 
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sammpedd88

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When I moved to 2x weekly injections I saw a substantial increase in HCT. I moved back to once a week and it dropped back down.
Are you still not on an AI? Does once a week contribute to no AI?
 

CroLifter

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Are you still not on an AI? Does once a week contribute to no AI?
I actually thought it was the other way around. Once per week dosing=bigger spike in test=more e2.

i am a low aromatizer. Single 12.5mg dose of exemestane (along with proviron) was enough to cause me bad joint pain and extreme uneasiness and feeling of anxiety (for some reason i get this when i crash e2, along with subtle pains all over my body and rven heart palpitations sometimes, yuck, they can be caused by drop in estrogen).
 

sammpedd88

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I actually thought it was the other way around. Once per week dosing=bigger spike in test=more e2.
It can if your dose of test isn’t right. Kisaj hasn’t taken an AI for many years and switched to once a week injections a year or so ago if I remember correctly.
 

CroLifter

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It can if your dose of test isn’t right. Kisaj hasn’t taken an AI for many years and switched to once a week injections a year or so ago if I remember correctly.
2 times per week is superior when it comes to stability, mood and need for an ai (less ai is usually needed, however this is not from my experience as i do not need an ai with 125mg once per week either) however since more frequent dosing results in higher free test and higher trough value, hct tends to increase more, which is the detrimental aspect of otherwise superior protocol discussed in this thread.

Once per week subq might be the answer.
 
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kisaj

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Are you still not on an AI? Does once a week contribute to no AI?
Still no AI. Labs have not changed that much for e2 sensitive 1x vs 2x weekly. There is a higher peak and slightly lower trough, but also higher free test with 1x. Lower peak, but overall high trough with 2x. So, for feel and consistency, there is some obvious benefit to more frequent injections, but based on my labs no advantage for anything else. HCT is lower, free test is higher, SHBG is lower, lipids remained about equal, and e2 about equal.

I honestly never felt much of a difference in more frequent dosing so 1x weekly is just better for me.
 

CroLifter

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Still no AI. Labs have not changed that much for e2 sensitive 1x vs 2x weekly. There is a higher peak and slightly lower trough, but also higher free test with 1x. Lower peak, but overall high trough with 2x. So, for feel and consistency, there is some obvious benefit to more frequent injections, but based on my labs no advantage for anything else. HCT is lower, free test is higher, SHBG is lower, lipids remained about equal, and e2 about equal.

I honestly never felt much of a difference in more frequent dosing so 1x weekly is just better for me.
At what point after inj3ction do you test?
 

sammpedd88

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Still no AI. Labs have not changed that much for e2 sensitive 1x vs 2x weekly. There is a higher peak and slightly lower trough, but also higher free test with 1x. Lower peak, but overall high trough with 2x. So, for feel and consistency, there is some obvious benefit to more frequent injections, but based on my labs no advantage for anything else. HCT is lower, free test is higher, SHBG is lower, lipids remained about equal, and e2 about equal.

I honestly never felt much of a difference in more frequent dosing so 1x weekly is just better for me.
Good deal man. Glad to hear things are still good with the x1 protocol.
 
ItalOne

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I’m on 180mg Test E @ 90mg 2X week. No AI until. I get above 300mg test e. FYI Test E peaks at 36 hours.
 

CroLifter

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UPDATE: 1 Grapefruit a day experiment for 18 days

So 18 days ago my hct was 0.478, hb 163 and rbc count 5.67

Today...drumroll...

Hct 0.453 Hb 156 rbc count 5.47

125mg test e per week throughout

Yay
When i started the cycle, 2 weeks in, hct was 0.477 and hb was 166. So this is awesome! I was surprised to see how easy the blood was flowing when i was there at the doc's. It hasnt been like that ever since i began a cycle. Grapefruit definitely helps!

@ItalOne graphs usually shows a peak about 12 hours post injection
 
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GreenMachineX

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So far we’ve only looked at splitting the dose equally vs taking the full dose at 1 shot...but what if we split 100mg, for example into 60/40mg or 70/30mg? Could that provide a little more e2 but still stable enough total T levels without an increase in Hematocrit?
Anyone have any thoughts?
 

kisaj

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I don’t see why that wouldn’t be an option. I mean some guys do every day, other every other, and so on. I think people just do whatever works.
 
GreenMachineX

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I don’t see why that wouldn’t be an option. I mean some guys do every day, other every other, and so on. I think people just do whatever works.
@kisaj
I recall reading your now on once a week and prefer it; how quickly did you notice a change in how you felt when switching protocols?
 

kisaj

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I never noticed a change moving to 2x weekly was the reason I moved back to 1x weekly. It's more convenient and then seeing my bloodwork improved related to HCT, RBC, and Hb, it was a no brainer. Literally dropped my HCT by 2pts by following a more convenient protocol.

BTW- I believe I mentioned this, but e2, SHBG, and free test all stayed very close to the same.
 
GreenMachineX

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I never noticed a change moving to 2x weekly was the reason I moved back to 1x weekly. It's more convenient and then seeing my bloodwork improved related to HCT, RBC, and Hb, it was a no brainer. Literally dropped my HCT by 2pts by following a more convenient protocol.

BTW- I believe I mentioned this, but e2, SHBG, and free test all stayed very close to the same.
Gotcha. I appreciate it.
 

PHOTOSnFIBERS

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Makes sense. On another forum, someone said a higher trough (as opposed to peak) results in higher hct.
Shows how some think they know what they are talking about and dont. A thread i made on dosing they were telling me even though my trough was on target, my peak would be too high.
 

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