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On Squat Depth

jaces said:
Powerlifters bench mre with triceps and delts by using tuckd elbows and a narower grip , bodybuildrs use mre flared elbow and wider grip,,, powerlifters use a low bar squat and bb use a high bar squat
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Guys that compete, squat with all sorts of different bar and stance positions. With benching, some guys tuck more, some don't tuck as much. Dependant on body type and style. Like Herderdude said, there's still right vs wrong. You can't sum things up like that. Having competed so many times yourself, I'm sure you know that.
 
Sean1332 said:
Guys that compete, squat with all sorts of different bar and stance positions. With benching, some guys tuck more, some don't tuck as much. Dependant on body type. Like Herderdude said, there's still right vs wrong. You can't come things up like that. Having competed so many times yourself, I'm sure you know that.
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Ok you wil agre with me when I say lifting the most weight is also a result of manipulating leverage , by tucking your elbow your creating mre leverage , im I nt corect?
 
jaces said:
Ok you wil agre with me when I say lifting the most weight is also a result of manipulating leverage , by tucking your elbow your creating mre leverage , im I nt corect?
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It's called not destroying your shoulders. Benching parallel is terrible for them, for anybody, even Joe Schmo on Mondays International Chest day.
 
Sean1332 said:
It's called not destroying your shoulders. Benching parallel is terrible for them, for anybody, even Joe Schmo on Mondays International Chest day.
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Watch most bodybuildrs dnt tuck , bcuz you want to use mostly chest ,, and bb dnt go for sheer weight but rather form and contraction to stimulate max growth
 
jaces said:
Watch most bodybuildrs dnt tuck , bcuz you want to use mostly chest ,, and bb dnt go for sheer weight but rather form and contraction to stimulate max growth
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You don't have to belly bench and exaggerate a tuck. It can still be a slight tuck, still have your chest engaged, and not kill your shoulders all in one shot. Id rather think long term health.
 
Sean1332 said:
You don't have to belly bench and exaggerate a tuck. It can still be a slight tuck, still have your chest engaged, and not kill your shoulders all in one shot. Id rather think long term health.
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No its true without health your nthng ,, but u get what im trying to say here?
 
jaces said:
No its true without health your nthng ,, but u get what im trying to say here?
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Yes. By incorrectly bench pressing, you feel that you're working your pecs better. I'm saying, by correctly bench pressing, you're still working everything out, you don't destroy your shoulders, and you don't look like it's your first day bench pressing lol
 
The problem is that you are looking at the BP as just a chest exercise, where it is in fact a full body technical lift.
Go hit the peck deck if you want to isolate
 
jaces said:
Powerlifters bench mre with triceps and delts by using tuckd elbows and a narower grip , bodybuildrs use mre flared elbow and wider grip,,, powerlifters use a low bar squat and bb use a high bar squat
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Delts are the last thing that you want to use while benching. Lats, triceps, and chest are the primary movers. Grip width is going to be 100% dependent on the size of the lifter with some doing pinky on the outer ring and some doing max legal width. Same with squat stance and bar positioning. You're painting in absolutes with placement and width when it is far from true.

jaces said:
Ok you wil agre with me when I say lifting the most weight is also a result of manipulating leverage , by tucking your elbow your creating mre leverage , im I nt corect?
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Tucking is a slight misnomer as it's not nearly as prevalent in raw benching as it is in geared benching. Either way it's about health moreso than leverage.

This thread has become a prime example of how the most dangerous knowledge is a little knowledge aka the Wikipedia effect.
 
Powerlifting and bodybuilding obviously have different goals. Many bodybuilders use a good amount of exercise variations that wouldn't be considered proper. A lot of these variations that aren't as safe are also performed with considerably less weight than they would be if done "correctly".
 
jaces said:
Have any of u competed??
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600 squat in a belt and wraps, 479 bench in a single ply shirt, 385 raw bench, 562 deadlift. But since I know what kind of contest this is, I'll come forward and admit my penis is very average. :)
 
breezy11 said:
Powerlifting and bodybuilding obviously have different goals. Many bodybuilders use a good amount of exercise variations that wouldn't be considered proper. A lot of these variations that aren't as safe are also performed with considerably less weight than they would be if done "correctly".
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I agree with that. Would you say that the weight is lesser for the pump and feel of the targeted muscles and proper TUT as opposed to safety concerns? Perhaps that's too broad of a brush.
 
herderdude said:
I agree with that. Would you say that the weight is lesser for the pump and feel of the targeted muscles and proper TUT as opposed to safety concerns? Perhaps that's too broad of a brush.
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It probably depends on the lifter. I will often do light dumbbell rows to feel it better and isolate the back better after doing something like barbell rows or kroc rows. Safety isn't really the concern but targeting the muscles I want to work is.
 
Sean1332 said:
Yes. By incorrectly bench pressing, you feel that you're working your pecs better. I'm saying, by correctly bench pressing, you're still working everything out, you don't destroy your shoulders, and you don't look like it's your first day bench pressing lol
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But you wil have the chest of a 3 year old girl
 
herderdude said:
600 squat in a belt and wraps, 479 bench in a single ply shirt, 385 raw bench, 562 deadlift. But since I know what kind of contest this is, I'll come forward and admit my penis is very average. :)
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Haha lol , our weights are almost the same , squating 500 , deadlift 572 and bench 320 raw but I dnt go for weight anymre just focusing on the muscle
 
PILL said:
It probably depends on the lifter. I will often do light dumbbell rows to feel it better and isolate the back better after doing something like barbell rows or kroc rows. Safety isn't really the concern but targeting the muscles I want to work is.
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Exactly my point , for bb its about the muscle nt the movement/weight ,, stil loving the kroc rows though
 
Rodja said:
Because BP is the only option to increase chest mass....

Dated article is irrelevant and, again, makes erroneous assumptions on training styles.
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Its bad when the 19 year old shows u up ,,haha my man just stop posting and have a shake to get over yourself
 
I have tracked my progress every 6 months since 2011 and I can tell you since I have gone ATG in the last 8 months, I have seen more growth in the 6 month time period. I've seen too many studies and talked to too many bodybuilders not to continue doing ATG. I also have had a knee reconstruction in the last couple years, so I don't believe having a bad knee is an excuse. Do what you will. ATG works. It seems like you guys are just making excuses not to make a proper rep. Then again, what is proper?
 
This thread is a mess , if all your concerned with is muscle growth then you don't have to bench or squat. Emg analysis shows similar m activation in leg press and squat and highest activation for chest during decline movements. U can get the same results with dare I say hammer strength machines

Once you go past parallel force on the meniscus and joint increase significantly. Unless looking for athletic performance enhancement I don't see the point
 
braskibra said:
This thread is a mess , if all your concerned with is muscle growth then you don't have to bench or squat. Emg analysis shows similar m activation in leg press and squat and highest activation for chest during decline movements. U can get the same results with dare I say hammer strength machines

Once you go past parallel force on the meniscus and joint increase significantly. Unless looking for athletic performance enhancement I don't see the point
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Ive stated this already but my point exactly
 
dbrock504 said:
I have tracked my progress every 6 months since 2011 and I can tell you since I have gone ATG in the last 8 months, I have seen more growth in the 6 month time period. I've seen too many studies and talked to too many bodybuilders not to continue doing ATG. I also have had a knee reconstruction in the last couple years, so I don't believe having a bad knee is an excuse. Do what you will. ATG works. It seems like you guys are just making excuses not to make a proper rep. Then again, what is proper?
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I agree with u here , I think form is dependent on goaland a litle dependent on you as individual
 
jaces said:
But you wil have the chest of a 3 year old girl
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If benching doesn't work your chest you probably have some pectoralis major activation issues. If you can get those pecs to fire correctly you will feel it in your chest.
 
PILL said:
If benching doesn't work your chest you probably have some pectoralis major activation issues. If you can get those pecs to fire correctly you will feel it in your chest.
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No ive no problem feling my chest working during a bench, but while we are on the topic , shouldrs I cant feel working that much , I do fel side laterals but db pres and milatery press I dont feel working , any tips on this?
 
jaces said:
Its bad when the 19 year old shows u up ,,haha my man just stop posting and have a shake to get over yourself
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You haven't done a thing besides parrot bro lore over and over. Your problem is that you think that there is zero carryover between the two when there is a ton each way. Feeling a muscle contract is fine and dandy, but that in and of itself doesn't mean a thing.

I can already tell that you're equating proper technique to manipulating leverages when that is only a small part of the equation. Above all, the most important element when it comes to technique is complete tightness throughout the body. If you're going to argue that this isn't important for everyone, then you've clearly never had weight on your back despite your claims in your numbers.
 
jaces said:
No ive no problem feling my chest working during a bench, but while we are on the topic , shouldrs I cant feel working that much , I do fel side laterals but db pres and milatery press I dont feel working , any tips on this?
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Wants to dispute proper squat and bench technique and its merits with a guy with a master's in exercise science and one of the top drug free squatters in the world.

Wants to ask the internet how to shoulder press.

I know that this is impossible for you to realize because you are a child, but doesn't that seem a little off to you?
 
herderdude said:
Wants to dispute proper squat and bench technique and its merits with a guy with a master's in exercise science and one of the top drug free squatters in the world. Wants to ask the internet how to shoulder press. I know that this is impossible for you to realize because you are a child, but doesn't that seem a little off to you?
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You didn't know that shoulder press is the most difficult lift to master and learn?
 
One of the most.... uh...... entertaining threads I have read in a while.

To type it out so the great jaces can understand:

gr8 thred. Wood reed agn.
 
herderdude said:
Wants to dispute proper squat and bench technique and its merits with a guy with a master's in exercise science and one of the top drug free squatters in the world.

Wants to ask the internet how to shoulder press.

I know that this is impossible for you to realize because you are a child, but doesn't that seem a little off to you?
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No y?? Just bcuz you change your view on things when someone else tels you your wrong doesnt mean I have to
 
herderdude said:
Wants to dispute proper squat and bench technique and its merits with a guy with a master's in exercise science and one of the top drug free squatters in the world.

Wants to ask the internet how to shoulder press.

I know that this is impossible for you to realize because you are a child, but doesn't that seem a little off to you?
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And I am not taking anything away from rodja , I like these disputes we have as this is a beter way of learning then just agreeing with everything everyone says
 
Rodja said:
Ask and ye shall receive.
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Yes and this is true , ive learned a lot talking to you but it doesnt mean ive changed my views,, now I know that a tucked elbow is beter for safety but im stil going to flare mine as this works best for pecs imo
 
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