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Ok...what do I add next?

OnceNatty

OnceNatty

New member
Background:
57 yrs old...long training history....dialed diet...natty up until last year...have done 3 cycles:
300mg test for 9 weeks
400mg test for 12
500mg test for 12

All test E...used exemestane as needed...pct was Nolva 40/40/20/20 with great bloods after.

I'd like to add something for my next bulking cycle but am still cautious of doing too much bodily/organ damage at my age. So I'm not sure if anadrol, dbol, superd etc...are my choices.
What would you suggest that's a "bang for the buck" sort of thing? GH? Are the above mentioned that hard on the liver/body?
My base will be 500mg test E again for 12 weeks

Thoughts?
 
Do not use orals at your age. Like the rest of your body the organs age and can’t handle the stress, trust me I am 50 and can’t tolerate them anymore
 
Dblock said:
Do not use orals at your age. Like the rest of your body the organs age and can’t handle the stress, trust me I am 50 and can’t tolerate them anymore
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Agreed.
And, we all decide our own priorities, and make our own decisions....
But have you considered your body's "normal" time, for your body?
During cycles, our bodies are under unique stresses that affect BP, future recovery, blood lipids, heart and other organ strain, etc ...
And those aren't just during cycles, it is also during pct. So even if you finally accomplish "normal" for you at the end of PCT, that is merely day one of normal, vs all of those other days of abnormal.
For those who start new cycles almost immediately after recovery, that means that their bodies are almost always under serious strain.
Ive been here a while, and I've seen a lot of guys (in our age bracket) who go balls to the wall almost continuously (and I Do understand the drive).
But the truth is, most of them either post about developing SERIOUS health issues, finally ....
Or just disappear entirely, after announcing another big cycle.

I'm only trying to be helpful with this reminder, and I have to remind myself of these things often.
:)
 
Renew1 said:
Agreed.
And, we all decide our own priorities, and make our own decisions....
But have you considered your body's "normal" time, for your body?
During cycles, our bodies are under unique stresses that affect BP, future recovery, blood lipids, heart and other organ strain, etc ...
And those aren't just during cycles, it is also during pct. So even if you finally accomplish "normal" for you at the end of PCT, that is merely day one of normal, vs all of those other days of abnormal.
For those who start new cycles almost immediately after recovery, that means that their bodies are almost always under serious strain.
Ive been here a while, and I've seen a lot of guys (in our age bracket) who go balls to the wall almost continuously (and I Do understand the drive).
But the truth is, most of them either post about developing SERIOUS health issues, finally ....
Or just disappear entirely, after announcing another big cycle.

I'm only trying to be helpful with this reminder, and I have to remind myself of these things often.
:)
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I stay natty now and have to remind myself of these things constantly. Such a temptation the goodies are but at 64 I gotta be smart.
 
Find the DHT that suits you best, primo or actual DHT would be the best bets, mast is typically a safer more user friendly compound as well. And other than finding your secondary anabolic I would look into HGH. If your over 40 and running gear, HGH is a high priority
 
Strictly talking in terms of safety (with safety being relative since none of it is truly safe)

Human data on :

Oils - Test, nandrolone, primo, mast

Orals- Adrol, dbol, winny, var, halo, provirion

EQ- quite a bit of anecdotal data to suggest it’s relatively tolerated at reasonable doses but no real human data.

Would definitely stay away from the orals, no real benefit to the orals when bulking from a bodybuilding standpoint and way way more risk with them as age increases. Only real reason where someone would consider orals would be at the very end of contest prep to give that freakishly grainy look. At your age the safest (relatively) would be var with maybe a little winny (knowing that both , especially winny will ruin your cholesterol). It would only be 4 weeks of your life with tanked lipids so I wouldn’t worry so much about generating a bunch of coronary plaque (takes years) , although it could destabilize existing plaque.

Things to consider discussing with a physician if playing this game would be regular echos and at least 1 cononary artery CT angiogram or calcium score (CT angiogram shows soft new plaque and CT calcium only shows old hard plaque). If you have much plaque you are definitely playing with fire, especially with orals. If you don’t you are lucky and should do your best to keep it that way.

Bulking being calorie dependent you might be better off with lowering the test down and adding a tiny bit of a secondary compound while upping calories.
 
I think gh is what I'm leaning towards.
So some questions:
--- I've heard 2iu per day is pretty standard
--- How long do I stay on this? As long as I can afford it? lol
--- Will I see muscle gains on 2iu per day?
 
OnceNatty said:
I think gh is what I'm leaning towards.
So some questions:
--- I've heard 2iu per day is pretty standard
--- How long do I stay on this? As long as I can afford it? lol
--- Will I see muscle gains on 2iu per day?
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I know I'm going to get people who disagree with me but I don't see any performance benefits at all on two units, and outside of the forums I don't know a single person who says they get progress on anything less than five. With that being said I found five units a day or five units every other day produced similar results and I eventually went with five units every other day. I'll honestly probably do 10 units every other day next time. If you can afford to run it for your entire cycle that would be the best way to go about it.

I'm going to backtrack a little bit cuz I'm not telling you to come out the gate with 5 to 10. You absolutely should start at 2. But I wouldn't expect any performance enhancing benefits out of it until you hit 5.

With all that being said, someone in their 50s who has low GH and igf-1 could potentially see a big improvement with two units. It should also make your gear work better because you're addressing a new growth pathway to compliment your anabolics
 
^^^Thank you Smont! And as I read my OP, i realized I wasn't too clear.
I'm on my 3rd cycle now, have 2 shows in 6 weeks, that's when this cycle will end.

When do I start the GH and how long do I run it? My source has 360iu for $500 which he says is very good and supposedly 3rd party tested for purity. So at 2iu/day, 360iu would last 6 months.
 
OnceNatty said:
^^^Thank you Smont! And as I read my OP, i realized I wasn't too clear.
I'm on my 3rd cycle now, have 2 shows in 6 weeks, that's when this cycle will end.

When do I start the GH and how long do I run it? My source has 360iu for $500 which he says is very good and supposedly 3rd party tested for purity. So at 2iu/day, 360iu would last 6 months.
Click to expand...
Man it's been aong times since I ran GH. For a couple years my insurance covered it but that part ended. Bought tons of pharma grade and Chinese back in the day too. Is it really that cheap now?
 
OnceNatty said:
Background:
57 yrs old...long training history....dialed diet...natty up until last year...have done 3 cycles:
300mg test for 9 weeks
400mg test for 12
500mg test for 12

All test E...used exemestane as needed...pct was Nolva 40/40/20/20 with great bloods after.

I'd like to add something for my next bulking cycle but am still cautious of doing too much bodily/organ damage at my age. So I'm not sure if anadrol, dbol, superd etc...are my choices.
What would you suggest that's a "bang for the buck" sort of thing? GH? Are the above mentioned that hard on the liver/body?
My base will be 500mg test E again for 12 weeks

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
First off, kudos on being so dialed in and responsible with your PCT and bloodwork. At 57, you are 100% right to be extremely cautious about organ stress, especially regarding blood pressure and liver values.

To answer your question directly: yes, Anadrol, Dbol, and especially Superdrol are very harsh on the body. Superdrol in particular will trash your lipids and liver enzymes within just a couple of weeks. It’s definitely not worth the risk at your age just for some quick water weight and glycogen retention that you'll mostly lose post-cycle anyway.

As for GH, it is absolutely amazing for recovery, sleep, and anti-aging, but for pure 'bang for the buck' bulking, it’s actually not that great. You’d need to run it for 6+ months at a higher dose to see actual new tissue growth, which gets very expensive.

If you are setting your base at 500mg of Test E again, the safest additions that build quality, keepable tissue without liver toxicity would be Primobolan or a low dose of NPP. NPP is fantastic for joint lubrication which is a godsend as we get older. I ran a similar Test and NPP bulk last winter (ended up getting my vials from 10xmuscle pw since I wanted to make sure it was properly dosed and smooth) and the fullness was incredible without messing up my AST/ALT markers at all. Primo is also an incredibly safe option, though it requires higher volumes of oil.

I'd highly recommend sticking to safe injectables over harsh orals. Keep your Exemestane handy just like you did before, and enjoy the slow, steady gains. How are your joints feeling on just the test base?
 
dayfit009 said:
I'd highly recommend sticking to safe injectables over harsh orals. Keep your Exemestane handy just like you did before, and enjoy the slow, steady gains. How are your joints feeling on just the test base?
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Thank you so much for the thorough reply!
In fact, thank you all who have replied with great, knowledgeable advice...I really appreciate it.
While we're in a group hug here, I'll add that I'm so impressed with the amount of people who are cautious about our health as we navigate through all of this. I guess I was thinking that on a roid forum, everyone would just be throwing caution to the wind and "gearing up", but that's not the case here...very pleasing to see/read.

That said, to answer you dayfit009, knocks on wood joints are great and body in general feels great right now. Now, I do have to admit, I just started Var this morning for the last 6 weeks pre-contest. I'm doing 20mg/day, split am/pm for 6 weeks...is this not recommended or is var mild enough to give this a go?

In the future, would NPP replace the var?
Can I run NPP my entire 12 weeks with test?
Dosages?

Thanks again all :)
 
OnceNatty said:
^^^Thank you Smont! And as I read my OP, i realized I wasn't too clear.
I'm on my 3rd cycle now, have 2 shows in 6 weeks, that's when this cycle will end.

When do I start the GH and how long do I run it? My source has 360iu for $500 which he says is very good and supposedly 3rd party tested for purity. So at 2iu/day, 360iu would last 6 months.
Click to expand...
If you have a show to do in only 6 weeks I would not add it. You don't know how you will respond and it could be a mess, some people retain a lot of water on HGH (I don't) but that's a variable that could be really risky 6 weeks out. Save it for your next off-season.
 
Competing changes everything.

Mast or primo for sure and you will probably want some winni the last 3 weeks to get dry and hard
 
Even guys in there 50's and 60's are running over a gram into there shows. I can't see someone doing extremely well in a enhanced show on just a couple hundred milligrams of test. You're going to be walking into guys who are running closer to a gram of test or more, they're probably going to be taking 50 to 100% of their testosterone dose in Primo or masteron they're probably going to be on 300 mg of tren and some orals at the end. 0 you're going to be standing on stage with guys running stacks that look like the following

750 test, 500 primo, 300 tren, 350 winni. No I'm not telling you to do that nor do you have enough time to do that anyways, honestly I've never used that much myself, I'm just saying that's the type of things you're going to be up against even in an over 50 category. That's just the reality of enhanced bodybuilding.
 
OnceNatty said:
Background:
57 yrs old...long training history....dialed diet...natty up until last year...have done 3 cycles:
300mg test for 9 weeks
400mg test for 12
500mg test for 12

All test E...used exemestane as needed...pct was Nolva 40/40/20/20 with great bloods after.

I'd like to add something for my next bulking cycle but am still cautious of doing too much bodily/organ damage at my age. So I'm not sure if anadrol, dbol, superd etc...are my choices.
What would you suggest that's a "bang for the buck" sort of thing? GH? Are the above mentioned that hard on the liver/body?
My base will be 500mg test E again for 12 weeks

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I wouldn’t use orals - not worth the harahness
 
I'll go a bit against the grain here. I know quite a few guys running var going into a competition. These are guys in their 50s and 60s. Just find the minimum effective dose and keep an eye on bloods, quite a few things you could take to help mitigate lipids. I'll go with the grain on staying away from orals if just trying to gain size and not competing though. Otherwise primo or mast but being only 6 weeks out and not knowing how you will react is a bit risky but both are good for comp prep.
During the offseason if you are really trying to gain size I'd recommend NPP but the nandralones carry a bit more risk, really you'd probably be good sticking with the DHTs. And big plus on adding in hgh just not for this comp.
 
zaareleq said:
Man it's been aong times since I ran GH. For a couple years my insurance covered it but that part ended. Bought tons of pharma grade and Chinese back in the day too. Is it really that cheap now?
Click to expand...
I've had sources as cheap as $1.50 per unit for a few years. Right now there's not as much generics around, but the price of generics has dropped significantly in recent years and the quality is good. GH isint as expensive or hard to find as it used to be.

Although currently at this moment it's a little harder to come across like mast n primo
 
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