NPP vs Anavar

[YamahaC76]

This is sort of an easy question for some Vets on here I am hoping. I am starting a cycle in a couple weeks and wanted to determine if Anavar would give me keepable size in the 12 week period comparable to NPP. I actually don't like NPP all that much. It gives me anxiety. It's gym benefits are great but I notice a mental head change right away. Test Is perfect and I quite like Anavar though I know it's capabilities are somewhat limited. Let me know! Diet is dialed in thankfully. Boring and I hate it but it's whats needed. It really is 70% of the game.

 

[jrock645]

I wouldnt run anavar 12 weeks.

 

[CroLifter]

Yeah man anavar is often said to be mild (heck, females run it) but what is often forgotten is that male dosages are very different from female dosages.
What may not be that toxic at 10mg a day sure as hell can be at 50.

It is still c17 aa. If i were to run test and anavar i would start with test only and add anavar as a finisher.

 

[YamahaC76]

I guess the main purpose of the cycle was to add a very solid amount of size and keep it off cycle. Im on trt. Anyway yeah It would be 50mg of VAR and wanted to keep androgens down. Thats why those are my two compounds of choice. I love test but didn't exactly want to run it at 500mg for 12 weeks.

Unless 500mg of test would be good? I actually already planned on running Var as a finisher and am starting with TBOL as well. Should be a good cycle I just hate NPP mental side effects. I am more hyper aware then most though. Some people don't notice any mental effects on tren, but they're there. Buddy of mine lost his GF on Tren, just doing weird **** and getting too insecure and needy. Other people notice it if you don't necessarily.

 

[CroLifter]

Between the two, npp and var, i would personally choose var, just because the whole 19 nor neurotoxicity scares me a bit, and nandrolone is supposed to be worse than tren in that regard.

What is wrong with 500 test a week?
You could always do a little less if you think 500 is too much, say 350-400mg and then when the gains start to slow down (week 6-7 for me) add in anavar for the last 4-5 weeks.
Also run some secretagogue/gh alongside,

From what i am seeing with mk677, i reckon that little less test + mk677 is superior to more test without it,

 

[YamahaC76]

Haha I bought so much NPP already but that doesn't matter much. Can you elaborate more on the 19-Nor Neuro Toxicity? I haven't heard of that before...Now I really am second guessing.

Just because theres a lot of androgen with Test...Trying to keep my hair.

I haven't had any shedding on 200mg a week though and have been doing that for a year now.

EDIT: I have used mk677 and it works great. I may do this in fact.

 

[CroLifter]

Toxic Impact of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids in Primary Rat Cortical Cell Cultures

The use of anabolic androgenic steroids (AASs) among non-athletes is a public health-problem, as abusers underestimate the negative effects associated…

www.sciencedirect.com

"According to the present results, the order of the examined AASs regarding their toxicity was found to be nandrolone > trenbolone > testosterone > stanozolol"

i GUESS anavar in theory should be something like stanozolol regarding toxicity.

nandrolone and tren usage is usually where users report changes in behavior and mental states. Makes you wonder...

they definitely phuk with serotonin and dopamine that is for sure.

Only problem with anavar is cholesterol...but if you run it for no more than 4-5 weeks and only other steroid you run is testosterone, AND you keep your diet clean avoiding saturated fat and keeping healthy fat intake up there, i dont think there is too MUCH to worry about.

 

[YamahaC76]

Im going to give that a read right now. Damn sort of feel dumb for not getting more anavar now. But the toxicity is long term?

Honestly my head is clearest on 200mg of test E once a week. I may do Anavar and just take 2 week breaks after 4 week periods running it for 16 weeks total.

 

[CroLifter]

Im going to give that a read right now. Damn sort of feel dumb for not getting more anavar now. But the toxicity is long term?

Honestly my head is clearest on 200mg of test E once a week. I may do Anavar and just take 2 week breaks after 4 week periods running it for 16 weeks total.

Idk man test is really the only one i dont have some kind of apprehension about when running. Anavar would be close 2nd if my lipids didnt go south too much (would depend on the bloodwork, but again, a month shouldnt be terrible).

Primo is another one that seems forgiving, but since i wont do 12 week + cycles, i dont think there is a place for it in my regimen.

I would also much prefer gh to mk677 since gh is a natural hormone. But damn it is expensive and while i can afford it, i simply cant justify it for the small level of enhancement i seek.

Even though i believe that with a little test + little gh, and say anavar for a short burst, one could have an amazing physique.

 

[YamahaC76]

Yeah man I really avoided cycling because I wanted to avoid mental sides. I can attest that even 50mg of NPP has me out of my homeostasis. High test I never had an issue with.

Im sort of thinking 350mg of test, 50mg of VAR and MK677 mat be the way to go for this cycle for 12 - 16 weeks.

Copious amounts of TUDCA for liver protection. My diet and training will be whatever my IFBB pro instructs me and even 1 week in on this diet outside of TRT I look insanely better. Can only imagine at this point what adding in other things will do. But I am considering dropping NPP now. I have 5 vials but I hate it's mental sides.

 

[CroLifter]

Yeah man I really avoided cycling because I wanted to avoid mental sides. I can attest that even 50mg of NPP has me out of my homeostasis. High test I never had an issue with.

Im sort of thinking 350mg of test, 50mg of VAR and MK677 mat be the way to go for this cycle for 12 - 16 weeks.

Copious amounts of TUDCA for liver protection. My diet and training will be whatever my IFBB pro instructs me and even 1 week in on this diet outside of TRT I look insanely better. Can only imagine at this point what adding in other things will do. But I am considering dropping NPP now. I have 5 vials but I hate it's mental sides.

What kind of mental sides? Just anxiety or?

 

[YamahaC76]

Yeah anxiety man . I lose my chill and I actually had anxiety issues before TRT. So I’m pretty aware of it. That’s a big no no for my life at the moment . Never had this issue on 50mg if VAR

 

[Mathb33]

This debate of keepable muscle needs to stop. There’s no such thing as muscle more keepable than others. Muscle is muscle. What gives the impression that some products give lesd keepable muscle is the extra glycogen weight in the muscle,intra muscular water and general "bloat" that some compound give that people can’t see the freaking difference. Some people will gain 18 lbs on dbol or superdrol and then say it’s not keepable muscles because they only kept 7 lbs out or 18 well guess what, the 11 lbs were nothing but water and stored glycogen. You kept the muscle. Then diet and training AND GENETIC will determine if you’re able to keep those muscles or not long term.

 

[YamahaC76]

12 weeks of VAR with two week breaks every 4 weeks ? I think that may be the one boys , with some MK677 in the mix. Does anybody really know what the blood concentration for Test should be for optimal results before diminishing returns ? My blood at the moment is reading 2140 Ng/dL of blood on the sensitive test.

 

[Joshinator]

12 weeks of VAR with two week breaks every 4 weeks ? I think that may be the one boys , with some MK677 in the mix. Does anybody really know what the blood concentration for Test should be for optimal results before diminishing returns ? My blood at the moment is reading 2140 Ng/dL of blood on the sensitive test.

I heard 1700 from a physicians assistant

 

[Joshinator]

12 weeks of VAR with two week breaks every 4 weeks ? I think that may be the one boys , with some MK677 in the mix. Does anybody really know what the blood concentration for Test should be for optimal results before diminishing returns ? My blood at the moment is reading 2140 Ng/dL of blood on the sensitive test.

I heard 1700 from a physicians assistant

 

[Jinsun]

NPP has lots of sides regarding SERT and the dopamine system. At 200mg's (I just did that) it had a profound effect on my mental state. Felt like I was on top, and there was a certain I don't give a fuack feeling I had. Alpha.. Didn't contribute to anxiety. But definitely had a profound dopaminergic effect. It elevated my resting heart rate to much and messed with my sleep, so I cancelled it. But if it didn't mess with my sleep, boy o boy, yes please What does this tell you? A lot of brain chemistry getting jumbled up!

I wouldn't have a problem running var for 12 weeks though. Not at 50mg's the whole 12 weeks, but a taper. From 25 to 50. I mean, 350 test plus 25 var is plenty if you know what you are doing training vise. If you'r program is dialled in, even small amounts of aas will do.

 

[Mathb33]

NPP has lots of sides regarding SERT and the dopamine system. At 200mg's (I just did that) it had a profound effect on my mental state. Felt like I was on top, and there was a certain I don't give a fuack feeling I had. Alpha.. Didn't contribute to anxiety. But definitely had a profound dopaminergic effect. It elevated my resting heart rate to much and messed with my sleep, so I cancelled it. But if it didn't mess with my sleep, boy o boy, yes please What does this tell you? A lot of brain chemistry getting jumbled up!

I wouldn't have a problem running var for 12 weeks though. Not at 50mg's the whole 12 weeks, but a taper. From 25 to 50. I mean, 350 test plus 25 var is plenty if you know what you are doing training vise. If you'r program is dialled in, even small amounts of aas will do.

Oh didn’t know your NPP run didn’t turn out the way you wanted bro. What happend exactly?

 

[Cmseabee24]

The only side I experience with NPP is lack of sleep and horrible nightmares but there are plenty of supplements or remedies to help with sleep. A lot of times I believe people focus on sides that the drugs produce and any fluctuations make you think it’s solely the drug which you focus on more giving you anxiety. Yes of course some of the fluctuations are the drug but like I said I believe focusing on it intensifies the anxiety etc.

 

[Jinsun]

Oh didn’t know your NPP run didn’t turn out the way you wanted bro. What happend exactly?

Nothing special really. Just messed with my sleep more then I was willing to tolerate. That's it. Otherwise I loved it. It felt like dbol, only better.

 

[Mathb33]

The only side I experience with NPP is lack of sleep and horrible nightmares but there are plenty of supplements or remedies to help with sleep. A lot of times I believe people focus on sides that the drugs produce and any fluctuations make you think it’s solely the drug which you focus on more giving you anxiety. Yes of course some of the fluctuations are the drug but like I said I believe focusing on it intensifies the anxiety etc.

100% agree with that. One cycle I was so concerned about my anxiety and my heart rate that I would think about that 24/7 and it actually made my fucking heart rate thru the roof and my anxiety shot up badly. I’m not saying these sides aren’t real but the mind is very strong and can definitely make things worse sometimes.

 

[Mathb33]

Nothing special really. Just messed with my sleep more then I was willing to tolerate. That's it. Otherwise I loved it. It felt like dbol, only better.

Yeah I remember mentioning you about the sleep. NPP is awesome I’m starting my cycle in a week but the sleep deprivation on it is real and it sucks. It really sucks.

 

[Jinsun]

NPP is awesome

It really is yeah. It would be my fav aas probably, if I could sleep on it. It's really androgenic, more then I thought it would be. It needs something to lower it's effect on CNS at night. Maybe coupled with some peptides before bed. I mean, you can take sleep aids, but taking sleep aids for the duration of the whole cycle is really a bad thing. What do you take? I tried taking a beta blocker with it before sleep and it didn't really do much. Maybe should have taken more. What helped me were only strong meds like ambien, valium, xanax, and quetiapine. Quetiapine being the least or not at all addictive, but you're IQ is 50% lower for half of the next day, so no thank you ...

 

[YamahaC76]

Yeah I think I would rather get away with less. Honestly only right now do I notice the nervousness from NPP. Iv'e ran it twice and didn't notice anything before. Anavar actually calms me down quite a bit.

But if I can get the same gains on just taking Var with higher Test id rather skip a compound entirely. As far as overall effects though, NPP just does so much, really everything which kinda is a bummer I don't want to run it at this time.

 

[Mathb33]

It really is yeah. It would be my fav aas probably, if I could sleep on it. It's really androgenic, more then I thought it would be. It needs something to lower it's effect on CNS at night. Maybe coupled with some peptides before bed. I mean, you can take sleep aids, but taking sleep aids for the duration of the whole cycle is really a bad thing. What do you take? I tried taking a beta blocker with it before sleep and it didn't really do much. Maybe should have taken more. What helped me were only strong meds like ambien, valium, xanax, and quetiapine. Quetiapine being the least or not at all addictive, but you're IQ is 50% lower for half of the next day, so no thank you ...

aside of sleep meds nothing helped much. It’s not like I tried a lot too. Weed/high cbd did help a bit but I had to vape my cbd 2-3 times a night. Tbh I just accepted it and my nights were basically 8 hours but 4 hours sleeping and 4 turning around.

 

[Jinsun]

aside of sleep meds nothing helped much. It’s not like I tried a lot too. Weed/high cbd did help a bit but I had to vape my cbd 2-3 times a night. Tbh I just accepted it and my nights were basically 8 hours but 4 hours sleeping and 4 turning around.

Wow you're just ok with that? For how long?

 

[CroLifter]

Wow you're just ok with that? For how long?

When you are sleep deprived for any amount of time you tend to get desperate, i know from experience.