New Cycle

[Scottfalcon]

Hey bros... some background

Been on trt for 2 years now at 160mg split into 2 injections weekly. Bloodwork 2 weeks ago had my total T at the trough at 750, but my estrogen has slowly crept up from the mid 30's 2 years ago to about 75 2 weeks ago. Doc bumped my anastrazole from .5mg/2x a week 12 hours after each injection to now .5mg e3d.

Since everything on my bloodwork was good except for my estrogen being a little high, I decided to start my 2nd blast. 1st blast was this past winter, ran up to 500mg test/50mg tbol. The tbol shot my BP way up, fortunately it was towards the end of the cycle anyway so I just dropped back to trt dose and ditched the tbol. This time I'm trying to keep it a little lighter, mainly looking to preserve muscle on my cut right now and for aesthetic improvements, not necessarily strength or size, just a good look. Here's what I started this week-

Test c - 250mg/week
Primo e- 200mg/week
Anavar- 25mg/day

I know it's a very light cycle and I've used var solo before trt up to 50mg and had no issues.

My question is regarding primo and it's effects on estrogen. Should I just keep running my AI like my doc wants, and then deal with low estrogen in a couple weeks if the primo ends up having that effect on me? Or should I go 4 weeks at current Ai dose and then drop it when the primo is starting to really kick in so that I hopefully don't end up crushing my estrogen? Obviously I'm a fairly high aromatizer. Also wanted to keep the test higher than the primo for same estrogen reasons.

 

[klbsa]

I know that I would get really good results using that cycle...... I prefer lower doses as I don't see an increase in gains proportional to higher mg. Just how it is for me.

Keep us posted on your progress

 

[Ironpirate]

Hey bros... some background

Been on trt for 2 years now at 160mg split into 2 injections weekly. Bloodwork 2 weeks ago had my total T at the trough at 750, but my estrogen has slowly crept up from the mid 30's 2 years ago to about 75 2 weeks ago. Doc bumped my anastrazole from .5mg/2x a week 12 hours after each injection to now .5mg e3d.

Since everything on my bloodwork was good except for my estrogens being high. Here's what I started this week-

Test c - 250mg/week
Primo e- 200mg/week
Anavar- 25mg/day

My question is regarding primo and it's effects on estrogen. Should I just keep running my AI like my doc wants, and then deal with low estrogen in a couple weeks if the primo ends up having that effect on me? Or should I go 4 weeks at current Ai dose and then drop it when the primo is starting to really kick in so that I hopefully don't end up crushing my estrogen? Obviously I'm a fairly high aromatizer. Also wanted to keep the test higher than the primo for same estrogen reasons.

If 160 test is putting you at 75 estro than the primo definitely won't crush your estro especially since you are already on adex and only increasing by .5mg a week. I think it will work out great with taking the adex 3x and the primo added.

 

[Mikereyn513]

Honestly this looks pretty good compared to most of the "first cycle " or " cut cycle " we see most of the time. You might want to log it if not on here definitely for your personal journey

 

[Scottfalcon]

Thanks guys, really excited to see what it can do for me. I'll tag you guys if I decide to log.

 

[LeanEngineer]

I'd follow a long on this if you logged it as well!

 

[Scottfalcon]

If 160 test is putting you at 75 estro than the primo definitely won't crush your estro especially since you are already on adex and only increasing by .5mg a week. I think it will work out great with taking the adex 3x and the primo added.

Thanks for the help man. I'll ride it out and keep a look out for low estrogen sides. I guess I've finally confirmed I'm a higher aromatizer, lucky me

 

[Scottfalcon]

Also I know the better idea is to use orals at as a finisher, but the primo is going to run into the end of October/beginning of Nov for 14-16 weeks on primo, and I wanted the quick results from var for beach season, so I'm using it as a kicker lol

 

[Scottfalcon]

Quick update guys, this var is amazing. 25mg/day only, 6 days in, on workout days take it pre-workout.. insane pumps and workouts overall, feel super strong and adding reps here and there already.. also noticing some increased muscle fullness already. I heard this sources var was great, a friend of mine started with 50mg and dropped to 25 after a few days.

 

[Mikereyn513]

Quick update guys, this var is amazing. 25mg/day only, 6 days in, on workout days take it pre-workout.. insane pumps and workouts overall, feel super strong and adding reps here and there already.. also noticing some increased muscle fullness already. I heard this sources var was great, a friend of mine started with 50mg and dropped to 25 after a few days.

Keep it bro just use these quick results to stay on track and stay motivated. It's one of the benefits of running an oral kicker for me

 

[MadStax]

The Primo will not lower estrogen levels, it will just bind to receptors and lower the effects of the estrogen. Make sure you understand the difference and don't crash your E2 because a blood test looks high. You need to really wait for symptoms, then treat as needed. That said, with only 200mg of Primo, it won't come close to negating your already high aromatization. I'd suggest trying 0.5mg eod starting at the end of week two.

 

[Kronic]

The Primo will not lower estrogen levels, it will just bind to receptors and lower the effects of the estrogen. Make sure you understand the difference and don't crash your E2 because a blood test looks high. You need to really wait for symptoms, then treat as needed. That said, with only 200mg of Primo, it won't come close to negating your already high aromatization. I'd suggest trying 0.5mg eod starting at the end of week two.

is there a receptor affinity for primo? like how ralox is for tissue but enclomiphine is for hpta

 

[Scottfalcon]

The Primo will not lower estrogen levels, it will just bind to receptors and lower the effects of the estrogen. Make sure you understand the difference and don't crash your E2 because a blood test looks high. You need to really wait for symptoms, then treat as needed. That said, with only 200mg of Primo, it won't come close to negating your already high aromatization. I'd suggest trying 0.5mg eod starting at the end of week two.

Thanks man yeah I get that it doesn't actually lower estrogen, but that it can mask it and give you low e2 symptoms despite estro being high.. I just wanted some opinions on my current AI usage, but it seems like the general consensus is stick with the AI, and I'll back off if I start to feel too low.

 

[manifesto]

The Primo will not lower estrogen levels, it will just bind to receptors and lower the effects of the estrogen. Make sure you understand the difference and don't crash your E2 because a blood test looks high. You need to really wait for symptoms, then treat as needed. That said, with only 200mg of Primo, it won't come close to negating your already high aromatization. I'd suggest trying 0.5mg eod starting at the end of week two.

E2 numbers will in fact be lower on bloodwork with the Primo

 

[manifesto]

I've checked several times during test/primo runs

 

[Scottfalcon]

Just figured I'd give you guys a final update here.. ended the cycle at 200 test/400 primo which I think was my sweet spot. It seems like anything over 200 test and my BP starts to get too high, so good learning experience to just keep test at 200 for me. When I dropped the test to 200, BP issued went away, and then upped the primo to 400 with no noticeable sides, so i guess I really need to just use the test as a base and let whatever else running do the work.

Results were amazing, started at 215lbs, goal was a slow cut. Mid cycle I was down to 203, and then I upped the primo, continued to lean out the remainder of the cycle and now I'm sitting around 207 and the leanest I've ever been. Shoulders popping, vascular.. I love primo. Like most people say, I never woke up one day and felt "on". I didn't really feel much from the primo but the visual results are drastic.

Overall, I look thicker everywhere, leaner, and at 200/400 felt great in general and sex drive was amazing. Again, very subtle compound but if you just stay patient the results come. Definitely got some strength gains also. Nothing insane like adrol or anything like that, but it just seemed like my "normal" gains were all accelerated. Finally deadlifted conventional 500lbs which I've been chasing for a little, and getting comments all the time about looking huge.

TLDR.. I love primo. You should run it. Doesn't need to be super high doses like alot of people say, just need to be patient and you'll be rewarded.

 

[manifesto]

Just figured I'd give you guys a final update here.. ended the cycle at 200 test/400 primo which I think was my sweet spot. It seems like anything over 200 test and my BP starts to get too high, so good learning experience to just keep test at 200 for me. When I dropped the test to 200, BP issued went away, and then upped the primo to 400 with no noticeable sides, so i guess I really need to just use the test as a base and let whatever else running do the work.

Results were amazing, started at 215lbs, goal was a slow cut. Mid cycle I was down to 203, and then I upped the primo, continued to lean out the remainder of the cycle and now I'm sitting around 207 and the leanest I've ever been. Shoulders popping, vascular.. I love primo. Like most people say, I never woke up one day and felt "on". I didn't really feel much from the primo but the visual results are drastic.

Overall, I look thicker everywhere, leaner, and at 200/400 felt great in general and sex drive was amazing. Again, very subtle compound but if you just stay patient the results come. Definitely got some strength gains also. Nothing insane like adrol or anything like that, but it just seemed like my "normal" gains were all accelerated. Finally deadlifted conventional 500lbs which I've been chasing for a little, and getting comments all the time about looking huge.

TLDR.. I love primo. You should run it. Doesn't need to be super high doses like alot of people say, just need to be patient and you'll be rewarded.

Did you do any bloodwork during the cycle? Specially for test levels and E2?

The reason I ask is because I would be a little concerned estradiol would get too low with the primo dose double the test dose.

And 200 mg test is like a TRT dose, but if it felt good...thats good. Just curious of how low your E2 was

 

[Scottfalcon]

I did not get E checked during the cycle, I just had hct/lipids/liver done. Before this cycle, on 160mg a week trt my E was pretty high in the mid 70s, so my doc bumped my AI to .5mg anastrazole 3x a week. I kept that going when I added the primo and figured as the primo kicked in, I'd start lowering the AI. Apparently I'm a pretty high aromatizer, because when the primo started to kick in libido went through the roof, everything was great and no signs of low or high E2. Now that the primo is clearing out I'm starting to feel like my E2 is creeping up a little. I see my trt doc in a few weeks so we'll see where my E2 is at then.

 

[manifesto]

I did not get E checked during the cycle, I just had hct/lipids/liver done. Before this cycle, on 160mg a week trt my E was pretty high in the mid 70s, so my doc bumped my AI to .5mg anastrazole 3x a week. I kept that going when I added the primo and figured as the primo kicked in, I'd start lowering the AI. Apparently I'm a pretty high aromatizer, because when the primo started to kick in libido went through the roof, everything was great and no signs of low or high E2. Now that the primo is clearing out I'm starting to feel like my E2 is creeping up a little. I see my trt doc in a few weeks so we'll see where my E2 is at then.

Sounds good bro....keep an eye on your HDL being on the arimidex long term like that....could wreak havoc on your cholesterol

Two things to consider

1) switch to Exemstane
2) increase injection frequency

 

[Scottfalcon]

Sounds good bro....keep an eye on your HDL being on the arimidex long term like that....could wreak havoc on your cholesterol

Two things to consider

1) switch to Exemstane
2) increase injection frequency

Ugh yeah I know man, that's my only worry. I really don't want to lower my normal 160mg/week trt dose because I feel great at it and my numbers are all in the higher end of the normal range which is perfect.

 

[Scottfalcon]

Sounds good bro....keep an eye on your HDL being on the arimidex long term like that....could wreak havoc on your cholesterol

Two things to consider

1) switch to Exemstane
2) increase injection frequency

Ugh yeah I know man, that's my only worry. I really don't want to lower my normal 160mg/week trt dose because I feel great at it and my numbers are all in the higher end of the normal range which is perfect.

 

[Uncle_E]

I’m preparing to start a Primo/Test cycle very soon, so there is a lot of good info in this thread for me. Good to hear that you had good results at 200T/400P. I’m on 200mg test cyp/ week for TRT, I was thinking of doing 400T/400P. My recent bloods showed that my estrogen is already crushed, so I was going to drop the AI and wait and see if I need to add it back in.


What are the specific symptoms you personally feel from high BP and from high estrogen?

 

[Scottfalcon]

High BP my face is always hot, sometimes a slight headache, and people will comment that my head is very red. Check my BP and sure enough it will be high. I just can't seem to handle test over 300.

For high E, I start to lose my libido, I put on a few pounds of water weight and overall I look more bloated. If it really gets too high then ED issues, less hard than normal or not hard at all. Also definitely can get overly sensitive and emotional.

 

[botk1161]

Daily injection allowed me to continue my cycle totally side effect free and feeling amazing when I was about to stop due to all the side effects.