Unanswered Need help for my lady

[blongo804]

Hey guys,

So my fiance is really struggling with losing weight/body fat, and it's not just the scale that won't budge but also measurements she's been taking have not moved. Below are some stats:

26 years old, about 5'2" height
144.4lbs

Current Macros:
130g protein
120-130g carbs
50g fat
Total ~1500 calories daily

Only one cheat meal a week and it's usually not even that heavy.

She does a 5 day workout split targeting all muscle groups and includes compound lifts like squat and bench (she doesn't like deadlifting too much yet). She does HIIT cardio and/or steady state each of the 5 days. One thing is certain, she gains weight VERY easy and really struggles to knock it down.

When she was younger and much heavier (like 170-180lbs I believe), she saw a dietitian who mentioned something about her thyroid. It's been a long time since then so she forgets exactly what it was, but could this be a thyroid/insulin production issue? Would bloodwork help, and if so, what should be looked at?

I'd really like to help her out because I know she's struggling and losing hope. Let me know what you guys think and if more info is needed. Thanks!

 

[The Solution]

Get a blood panel done
Lipids, Thyroid (TSH), Estrogen, Testosterone, .. If you see a red flag in the bloodwork that will need addressed. If she does not get it done yearly there could be an underlying issue that modifying nutrition, cardio, or training will not fix. Health is priority.

other factors:
- Stress
- Sleep
- Proper water intake daily
- Modifying nutrition to keeping carbs peri-workout
- Daily NEAT (try to increase extra steps for extra caloric expenditure) especially if she has a desk job

 

[ValiantThor08]

Hey guys,

So my fiance is really struggling with losing weight/body fat, and it's not just the scale that won't budge but also measurements she's been taking have not moved. Below are some stats:

26 years old, about 5'2" height
144.4lbs

Current Macros:
130g protein
120-130g carbs
50g fat
Total ~1500 calories daily

Only one cheat meal a week and it's usually not even that heavy.

She does a 5 day workout split targeting all muscle groups and includes compound lifts like squat and bench (she doesn't like deadlifting too much yet). She does HIIT cardio and/or steady state each of the 5 days. One thing is certain, she gains weight VERY easy and really struggles to knock it down.

When she was younger and much heavier (like 170-180lbs I believe), she saw a dietitian who mentioned something about her thyroid. It's been a long time since then so she forgets exactly what it was, but could this be a thyroid/insulin production issue? Would bloodwork help, and if so, what should be looked at?

I'd really like to help her out because I know she's struggling and losing hope. Let me know what you guys think and if more info is needed. Thanks!

Has she thought about doing a carnivore or ketogenic diet? Most people easily lose body fat doing that. Under eating also can cause one to not lose body fat believe it or not, due to down regulated hormones. Bodies defense mechanism.

 

[blongo804]

Get a blood panel done
Lipids, Thyroid (TSH), Estrogen, Testosterone, .. If you see a red flag in the bloodwork that will need addressed. If she does not get it done yearly there could be an underlying issue that modifying nutrition, cardio, or training will not fix. Health is priority.

other factors:
- Stress
- Sleep
- Proper water intake daily
- Modifying nutrition to keeping carbs peri-workout
- Daily NEAT (try to increase extra steps for extra caloric expenditure) especially if she has a desk job

Thanks, Bob! I think bloodwork is an easy quick thing to get done so we'll probably take that route asap.

As for the other factors.. She's a pre-school teacher so she does get a lot of steps in daily, but that also adds a lot of stress to her days because her kids are animals. She does get about 1 gallon of water a day easily i'd say. As for carbs, they are peri-workout, but a few are consumed at night since her dinner is usually 4oz chicken, 4oz potato.

Has she thought about doing a carnivore or ketogenic diet? Most people easily lose body fat doing that. Under eating also can cause one to not lose body fat believe it or not, due to down regulated hormones. Bodies defense mechanism. Under eating also can cause one to not lose body fat believe it or not, due to down regulated hormones. Bodies defense mechanism.

I did suggest she maybe try keto because I'm *thinking* she's reallllly sensitive to carbs. Honestly I don't know much about the carnivore diet so i'll have to check into that.

There's always been the thought that she's under eating. I remember a time she increased calories slowly and lost weight, so that may be worth trying again. Maybe she can add a little fat or protein to her days?

 

[ValiantThor08]

Thanks, Bob! I think bloodwork is an easy quick thing to get done so we'll probably take that route asap.

As for the other factors.. She's a pre-school teacher so she does get a lot of steps in daily, but that also adds a lot of stress to her days because her kids are animals. She does get about 1 gallon of water a day easily i'd say. As for carbs, they are peri-workout, but a few are consumed at night since her dinner is usually 4oz chicken, 4oz potato.

I did suggest she maybe try keto because I'm *thinking* she's reallllly sensitive to carbs. Honestly I don't know much about the carnivore diet so i'll have to check into that.

There's always been the thought that she's under eating. I remember a time she increased calories slowly and lost weight, so that may be worth trying again. Maybe she can add a little fat or protein to her days?

Look up Shawn Baker on YouTube. Look up Jordan Peterson carnivore diet on YouTube. One of my friends is prepping for a BB contest doing carnivore. Put on a ton of muscle and got very strong being natty and eating mostly red meat.

 

[DR.D]

Yeah, get her a T7 test from the doc and then you'll know what her thyroid is doing.

If she is low maybe she can get some T4. T4 is the fastest way to lose weight IME. It's just as effective as T3, and far more forgiving.

 

[HIT4ME]

Has she thought about doing a carnivore or ketogenic diet? Most people easily lose body fat doing that. Under eating also can cause one to not lose body fat believe it or not, due to down regulated hormones. Bodies defense mechanism.

Sorry here - eating too little will NOT hinder fat loss. Dead Ethiopians wish you were right. Sorry man. If you believe in Gravity, then you HAVE to believe in the laws of thermodynamics. The laws of thermodynamics have held up to more experimental scrutiny than even the laws of gravity.

To the OP - here is what I think. Get thyroid tested, fine - but I bet it comes back normal and that will leave her frustrated after getting her hopes up that she can fix something with a pill.

At 5'2'' and 144 her BMI is 26.3. This means her bodyfat is pretty likely around 30-35%. This places her lean mass at around 98 pounds.

Basically what all this suggests is that she needs to eat 1100 - 1350 calories/day for weight loss. She is simply eating too many calories.

I like the macro break down that I see.

Hormones do not overcome thermodynamics. I actually do have some crazy theories that carb sensitivites may hinder fat loss - but keto would only serve to make it worse, not better.

Sure a slow thyroid will slow metabolism a bit - but even a 5'2'' woman with a normap thyroid won't lose much on a 1500 calorie/day diet.

 

[Resolve10]

Sorry here - eating too little will NOT hinder fat loss. Dead Ethiopians wish you were right. Sorry man. If you believe in Gravity, then you HAVE to believe in the laws of thermodynamics. The laws of thermodynamics have held up to more experimental scrutiny than even the laws of gravity.

To the OP - here is what I think. Get thyroid tested, fine - but I bet it comes back normal and that will leave her frustrated after getting her hopes up that she can fix something with a pill.

At 5'2'' and 144 her BMI is 26.3. This means her bodyfat is pretty likely around 30-35%. This places her lean mass at around 98 pounds.

Basically what all this suggests is that she needs to eat 1100 - 1350 calories/day for weight loss. She is simply eating too many calories.

I like the macro break down that I see.

Hormones do not overcome thermodynamics. I actually do have some crazy theories that carb sensitivites may hinder fat loss - but keto would only serve to make it worse, not better.

Pretty much what I came to say.

She could try lower carb if she likes/prefers that, but switching to Keto isn’t going to magically make her lose weight unless it coincides with a drop in calories and/or an increase in her activity levels/NEAT somehow.

 

[HIT4ME]

Also, just some further math.

Cheat meals can be devestating if not REALLY checked. Let's say she maintains on 1600 calories. She eats 1500 calories. Over a week that is a 700 calorie deficit. She hits 5 hour long workouts a week and burns 500 calories each workout. This is 2500 calories + 700 from diet.

Then you go out to eat and in one meal get 2500 calories. This seems like it would require a ton but it does not. A standard meal at Olive Garden will hit those caloric intakes.

IMO, this is actually all the more reason to hit a bigger deficit daily. If you are going to have "cheats" fine, but calculate your weekly numbers and be sure of the actual impact.

 

[Resolve10]

Also, just some further math.

Cheat meals can be devestating if not REALLY checked. Let's say she maintains on 1600 calories. She eats 1500 calories. Over a week that is a 700 calorie deficit. She hits 5 hour long workouts a week and burns 500 calories each workout. This is 2500 calories + 700 from diet.

Then you go out to eat and in one meal get 2500 calories. This seems like it would require a ton but it does not. A standard meal at Olive Garden will hit those caloric intakes.

IMO, this is actually all the more reason to hit a bigger deficit daily. If you are going to have "cheats" fine, but calculate your weekly numbers and be sure of the actual impact.

I wrote something earlier today saying this but my tone sounded mean so I deleted it haha

This would be my guess at the main issue. I know cheat meals are lkke this sacred thing, but they aren’t free and if left unchecked do more harm than good. It’s better to just find a healthy balance all the time than super restrict then crazy cheats (not saying hers are crazy though!).

 

[HIT4ME]

I wrote something earlier today saying this but my tone sounded mean so I deleted it haha

This would be my guess at the main issue. I know cheat meals are lkke this sacred thing, but they aren’t free and if left unchecked do more harm than good. It’s better to just find a healthy balance all the time than super restrict then crazy cheats (not saying hers are crazy though!).

I often sound like a dick. It isn't intentional or to be mean.

Just like calling out ValiantThor above. I hope he knows I see him as a valuable contributor on here and it isn't personal. The whole "starvation mode" thing is a pet peeve of mine. It is repeated so often, and it actually helps to make people afraid of eating too little and remain fat, which leads to the frustration the OP's fiance is facing.

People fear eating too little, but smashing a pizza is seen as acceptable...in a country where a small % have anorexia and 70% of the population is overweight.

 

[HIT4ME]

Also, my math above is very liberal. Not many women can legit burn 500 calories/hour in a workout and even at that, it would only be 440 calories above what they would have burned on a couch, which means the actual math is closer to 2200 calories/week than 2500.

 

[ValiantThor08]

I often sound like a dick. It isn't intentional or to be mean.

Just like calling out ValiantThor above. I hope he knows I see him as a valuable contributor on here and it isn't personal. The whole "starvation mode" thing is a pet peeve of mine. It is repeated so often, and it actually helps to make people afraid of eating too little and remain fat, which leads to the frustration the OP's fiance is facing.

People fear eating too little, but smashing a pizza is seen as acceptable...in a country where a small % have anorexia and 70% of the population is overweight.

I'm cool. I personally haven't tried cutting, but have heard from different people that even on a deficit they stalled losing fat, and raising calories for a bit caused the fat loss to continue. My guess is hormones.

 

[love2liftkat]

I can 100% relate with your fiancé. It can be beyond frustrating! I do have a thyroid condition/autoimmune disease that make my metabolism crap- however it is still calories in vs calories out like @HIT4ME was saying. Getting her bloods checked will help at least give her some answers. Even if it is her thyroid and they put her on medication, she may still need to drop calories more. As for bloods I would suggest a full thyroid panel including but not limited to the free T3/T4 and RT3. Feel free to have her reach out to me if she just wants to vent/have someone to relate to!

 

[blongo804]

Man I have a lot to take in, but I just want to first say thank you to everyone providing what seems like sound advice. My fiance and I will be reading all replies later today when we're together.

 

[blongo804]

Sorry here - eating too little will NOT hinder fat loss. Dead Ethiopians wish you were right. Sorry man. If you believe in Gravity, then you HAVE to believe in the laws of thermodynamics. The laws of thermodynamics have held up to more experimental scrutiny than even the laws of gravity.

To the OP - here is what I think. Get thyroid tested, fine - but I bet it comes back normal and that will leave her frustrated after getting her hopes up that she can fix something with a pill.

At 5'2'' and 144 her BMI is 26.3. This means her bodyfat is pretty likely around 30-35%. This places her lean mass at around 98 pounds.

Basically what all this suggests is that she needs to eat 1100 - 1350 calories/day for weight loss. She is simply eating too many calories.

I like the macro break down that I see.

Hormones do not overcome thermodynamics. I actually do have some crazy theories that carb sensitivites may hinder fat loss - but keto would only serve to make it worse, not better.

Sure a slow thyroid will slow metabolism a bit - but even a 5'2'' woman with a normap thyroid won't lose much on a 1500 calorie/day diet.

HIT4ME,

What macro breakdown should she go for if we start at 1350 cals/day? Should she start with decreasing carbs but leave protein/fat where they're at?

I really do appreciate your response and I'm sure she will too.

 

[HIT4ME]

So, I kind of like where she is at for the macro ratios right now.

One thing I will ask is, it sounds like she is struggling with her current setup. Why? Is she eating foods she doesn't really like? What exactly, including measurements, is she eating?

I ask because, if it works for her then I would suggest sticking to it for the most part and either just dropping one thing out or adjusting portion sizes down 10-20%. If she really isn't happy with WHAT she is eating, maybe adjustments need to be made to make it more palatable and easy to prep and follow.

But the shorter answer to your question is, if she eats 1250 calories/day - with 98 pounds of lean mass I would say her real goal only needs to be about 100 grams of protein/day. If she gets 120 and stays below her calories, great...if she has a day hear or there where she is at 80-90 grams, fine. But 100 would be my target.

Beyond that I would shoot for 1250 calories, and I would maybe get the bulk of that from carbs and protein. It isn't that carbs are bad - but you need fat and carbs and her fats seem to be in a good range. Maybe try something like:

100 grams protein
100-110 grams carbs
45 grams fat

Again, if you're off on these macros by 5-10 grams, but under calories, I wouldn't worry too much.

Does she prepare her own foods? Or eat a lot of pre-packaged foods?

 

[The Solution]

^^^^ You are missing one key piece of information
how is her digestion?
if she is eating foods that constantly don't agree with her there needs to be modifications in her daily nutrition. A lot of females (not being gender specific) like to mimic others on social media or follow a trend of "Clean" eating and limit their sources. yet the sources they consider "clean" dont digest properly. That will backtrack your progress when you dont absorb the proper vitamins/minerals you do consume. if she is having some bloating or GI distress you may need to play the elimination game with her dietary choices.

 

[Marcia]

And also - as she drops weight she’ll need to decrease total calories to keep losing. And increase cardio.

 

[blongo804]

So, I kind of like where she is at for the macro ratios right now.

One thing I will ask is, it sounds like she is struggling with her current setup. Why? Is she eating foods she doesn't really like? What exactly, including measurements, is she eating?

I ask because, if it works for her then I would suggest sticking to it for the most part and either just dropping one thing out or adjusting portion sizes down 10-20%. If she really isn't happy with WHAT she is eating, maybe adjustments need to be made to make it more palatable and easy to prep and follow.

But the shorter answer to your question is, if she eats 1250 calories/day - with 98 pounds of lean mass I would say her real goal only needs to be about 100 grams of protein/day. If she gets 120 and stays below her calories, great...if she has a day hear or there where she is at 80-90 grams, fine. But 100 would be my target.

Beyond that I would shoot for 1250 calories, and I would maybe get the bulk of that from carbs and protein. It isn't that carbs are bad - but you need fat and carbs and her fats seem to be in a good range. Maybe try something like:

100 grams protein
100-110 grams carbs
45 grams fat

Again, if you're off on these macros by 5-10 grams, but under calories, I wouldn't worry too much.

Does she prepare her own foods? Or eat a lot of pre-packaged foods?

She is eating food she likes, but perhaps not the greatest food sources. I'm thinking she may drop the dinner potato and throw in some vegetables instead. I think those macros you gave sound good to start with. Her meals are below:

Meal 1/Pre-workout - One english muffin, 32g peanut butter
Meal 2/Post-workout - Two cheese sticks, two cups Dannon "light & fit" greek yogurt with 40g added granola
Meal 3 - 1 scoop protein isolate, 6oz almond milk, 1 pack of tuna
Meal 4 - 4oz chicken, 148g potato, salad with some croutons (2 servings, 10c, 2f) and light dressing (4.5f, 3c)

We're definitely capable of getting her on more prepped foods that would make her meals more simple. I eat chicken, beef and rice all day to keep it simple, but i'm not sure she wants to eat "boring" food like that.

 

[blongo804]

^^^^ You are missing one key piece of information
how is her digestion?
if she is eating foods that constantly don't agree with her there needs to be modifications in her daily nutrition. A lot of females (not being gender specific) like to mimic others on social media or follow a trend of "Clean" eating and limit their sources. yet the sources they consider "clean" dont digest properly. That will backtrack your progress when you dont absorb the proper vitamins/minerals you do consume. if she is having some bloating or GI distress you may need to play the elimination game with her dietary choices.

Good point. Her digestion seems decent right now compared to usual, but it can probably be better.

 

[HIT4ME]

She is eating food she likes, but perhaps not the greatest food sources. I'm thinking she may drop the dinner potato and throw in some vegetables instead. I think those macros you gave sound good to start with. Her meals are below:

Meal 1/Pre-workout - One english muffin, 32g peanut butter
Meal 2/Post-workout - Two cheese sticks, two cups Dannon "light & fit" greek yogurt with 40g added granola
Meal 3 - 1 scoop protein isolate, 6oz almond milk, 1 pack of tuna
Meal 4 - 4oz chicken, 148g potato, salad with some croutons (2 servings, 10c, 2f) and light dressing (4.5f, 3c)

We're definitely capable of getting her on more prepped foods that would make her meals more simple. I eat chicken, beef and rice all day to keep it simple, but i'm not sure she wants to eat "boring" food like that.

Good deal. You passed the first test, which is - do you actually have your measurements!! So many people don't measure, this is huge.

My first thoughts on this are that the peanut butter, granola, protein isolate are the items I would focus on. The reason being is, they are easy to overeat. However, they may be the flavor that is necessary to keep her sticking to this. I need to think on this to remove my own personal food choices, etc.

What I often find is that foods I make myself can have a lot more volume with less calories vs. something I buy. She doesn't look to be doing this a lot, which is good. On the protein powder/shake though - that's probably 165 calories that she could actually eat rather than drink if she is still hungry. 2 cups of low fat cottage cheese can have 26 grams of protein and 165 calories and it will fill me the heck up.

I am not really against the potato - but maybe mixing it up with some veggies like broccoli or spinach or riced cauliflower could help from time to time.

I have some thinking to do here though...

 

[The Solution]

She is eating food she likes, but perhaps not the greatest food sources. I'm thinking she may drop the dinner potato and throw in some vegetables instead. I think those macros you gave sound good to start with. Her meals are below:

Meal 1/Pre-workout - One english muffin, 32g peanut butter
Meal 2/Post-workout - Two cheese sticks, two cups Dannon "light & fit" greek yogurt with 40g added granola
Meal 3 - 1 scoop protein isolate, 6oz almond milk, 1 pack of tuna
Meal 4 - 4oz chicken, 148g potato, salad with some croutons (2 servings, 10c, 2f) and light dressing (4.5f, 3c)

We're definitely capable of getting her on more prepped foods that would make her meals more simple. I eat chicken, beef and rice all day to keep it simple, but i'm not sure she wants to eat "boring" food like that.

M1 - why does she not have any protein with pre workout? That is odd
M2 - I would try to limit dairy (just yogurt) and use a different source (not cheese sticks) for carbs and protein
M3 - totally fine here, tuna doesn't bother here? if not keep it in
i would shift the carbs from M4 to meal 1 or meal 2

If carbs are limited to ~ 100g I would divide into pre/post and eliminate in meals 3/4 to help with insulin sensitivity. Try throwing in rice cakes, rice, or cream of rice which are very easy to digest and will settle easy around a workout. I would nix the granola. her calories are too low give her something with such little satiety.

I would also like to see eggs (unless she can't tolerate them), 95/5 beef or 93/7 turkey thrown into the mix if possible. Whole foods will always trump powders, especially in a deficit when nutrients/vitamins/minerals are hard to come by due to caloric restriction.

I would disagree on cauliflower or broccoli due to being very high in FODMAP, which is an easy way to bloat someone (unless they tolerate it). I would rather play it safe with sauteed peppers, asparagus, or green beans for veggies. But everyone is different in what they digest, how they feel, and how they are absorbing the food sources they eat. Ask her how these things are sitting and adjust if needed

 

[HIT4ME]

M1 - why does she not have any protein with pre workout? That is odd
M2 - I would try to limit dairy (just yogurt) and use a different source (not cheese sticks) for carbs and protein
M3 - totally fine here, tuna doesn't bother here? if not keep it in
i would shift the carbs from M4 to meal 1 or meal 2

I would personally if carbs are around 100g to pre/post and eliminate in meals 3/4 to help with insulin sensitivity. Try throwing in rice cakes, rice, or cream of rice which are very easy to digest and will settle easy around a workout. I would nix the granola. her calories are too low give her something with more volume and satiety.

I would also like to see eggs (unless she can't tolerate them), 95/5 beef or 93/7 turkey thrown into the mix if possible.

I would disagree on cauliflower or broccoli due to being very high in FODMAP which is an easy way to bloat someone (unless they tolerate it) I would rather see sauteed peppers, asapragus, or green beans thrown into the mix for veggies.

I agree with this...I can look for differences but it would just be about how we skin the cat. The broccoli thing is an example of my own personal preferences invading here a little...if she can tolerate it, I think it's great because it can be filling. If there are issues, the other options are great options. Funny - I was also thinking about eggs and the cheese and the meats.

Also, to clarify - when The Solution says "her calories are too low give her something with more volume and satiety." I interpret him to (and believe that he does) mean that, when you're eating calories this low, you want to eat enough food volume to satiate you. Since we had the discussion about "calories being too low" - I just wanted to clarify.

 

[Resolve10]

She is eating food she likes, but perhaps not the greatest food sources. I'm thinking she may drop the dinner potato and throw in some vegetables instead. I think those macros you gave sound good to start with. Her meals are below:

Meal 1/Pre-workout - One english muffin, 32g peanut butter
Meal 2/Post-workout - Two cheese sticks, two cups Dannon "light & fit" greek yogurt with 40g added granola
Meal 3 - 1 scoop protein isolate, 6oz almond milk, 1 pack of tuna
Meal 4 - 4oz chicken, 148g potato, salad with some croutons (2 servings, 10c, 2f) and light dressing (4.5f, 3c)

We're definitely capable of getting her on more prepped foods that would make her meals more simple. I eat chicken, beef and rice all day to keep it simple, but i'm not sure she wants to eat "boring" food like that.

That doesn’t look too bad to me.

If she’s tolerating it then I see no need to randomly force her to change those options if they are allowing her to meet her intended macronutrient amounts.

My only possible switch would be drop some protein from the protein and tuna meal and put it with the first meal, since it seems to be the least protein rich meal. Overall though the total amount she gets per day will be most important.

Outside of maybe some more veggies and/or swapping some of those around to make the food volume higher while keeping the calories similar (or lower whenever they get lowered), you have a good start going.

 

[BlockBuilder]

I would drop the cheat meals. Cheat meals are for people making steady progress. She hasn’t made any progress. No more cheat meals

 

[blongo804]

Hey everyone, hopefully some/most of you get notification of this post. If not, I will tag when on a computer.

Since reworking her diet, my fiance is down 5.5lbs in the 4 weeks since taking the advice from this thread and still keeping at it. She's really happy of her progress so far and it's nice to see her this way.

Many thanks to the helpful people of this thread!

 

[HIT4ME]

5.5 pounds in about 4 weeks is pretty darned good! I know we all want it to come off faster, but that is good progress! Nice job!

 

[blongo804]

5.5 pounds in about 4 weeks is pretty darned good! I know we all want it to come off faster, but that is good progress! Nice job!

I'll send her your congrats. She's definitely proud of herself. I knew she could do it because she has before, but I think her and I, for some reason, thought her previous macros were correct for knocking some fat down. Live and learn I suppose!

She's already seeing arm/leg/hip measurements changing. I can even notice changes and I see her daily. Everyone was a great help here, especially you, HIT4ME!

 

[HIT4ME]

I'll send her your congrats. She's definitely proud of herself. I knew she could do it because she has before, but I think her and I, for some reason, thought her previous macros were correct for knocking some fat down. Live and learn I suppose!

She's already seeing arm/leg/hip measurements changing. I can even notice changes and I see her daily. Everyone was a great help here, especially you, HIT4ME!

Thank you for the kind words!! I am sure we are all thrilled to be a help and you got a lot of good advice. Advice is easy, doing it is hard. You guys are putting in the work!