Need help/advice please - Currently on week 3 Ostarine

Michael_grant

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Hi guys,

I’m 3 weeks into a 12 week cut with Ostarine and having good results, losing about 2lbs a week but looking bigger and more pumped and all my lifts have increased so it’s working.

Anyhow, I have just received some Brawn 5-AT (5-Eitoallocholen-3b,7b,17b-triol) and whilst it has great feedback for fat loss/cortisol control I don’t understand it or how to run it….I can’t seem to find anything on the net!?!!

Is it suppressive?
Is it a prohormone that will have the same side effects eg increased blood pressure/liver stress/dodgy lipid values??
I’m asking as I’m not sure whether to add this in now to assist with fat loss/recomp now or save it for PCT?
All help appreciated, especially how it works and if any of you have run it please let me know.
 

johnny412

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Hi guys,

I’m 3 weeks into a 12 week cut with Ostarine and having good results, losing about 2lbs a week but looking bigger and more pumped and all my lifts have increased so it’s working.

Anyhow, I have just received some Brawn 5-AT (5-Eitoallocholen-3b,7b,17b-triol) and whilst it has great feedback for fat loss/cortisol control I don’t understand it or how to run it….I can’t seem to find anything on the net!?!!

Is it suppressive?
Is it a prohormone that will have the same side effects eg increased blood pressure/liver stress/dodgy lipid values??
I’m asking as I’m not sure whether to add this in now to assist with fat loss/recomp now or save it for PCT?
All help appreciated, especially how it works and if any of you have run it please let me know.
no offense but why did you even buy it then?
 
Michael_grant

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no offense but why did you even buy it then?
None taken matey, got thick skin lol.

I work a high pressure job where I deal with up to 100 members of staff a day, from daily planning to disciplinaries.
Since I started researching with Ostarine I started to feel a little more stressed,I have been tracking BP daily so not that.

I tried to add some ashwagandha as a natural product but it didn’t do **** (quite predictably). Read up on cortisol blockers and 5-AT seemed to be working for people.

I managed to find some studies last night about it which seems to suggest it has anabolic properties, blocks cortisol which assists in fat loss and does not have any side effects except increased estrogen on longer cycles..not for PCT then. No effects were seen on the heart, liver or lipids etc.

That was all I needed, I’m good to go now.
 
KvanH

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No, 5AT (=androstrenetriol) should not be suppressive or have major health impacts (to my knowledge). I don't know how it can raise estrogen? It would be nice to hear more about that. Maybe you're mixing it up with the effects of DHEA, which the 5-AT is a metabolite of? It should lower cortisol, like you said, at least in theory. But it has very low bioavailability to my knowledge and I've never heard any good feedback from it.

If you are not satisfied with it and/or wish to try something else, then there are better cortisol controlling supps, than 5-AT. Capsule version SNS Reduce XT. Transdermal b-Aet (Apex Alchemy AET-50, Iron Legion Invictus, XPG Suppress C) come to mind.
 
Michael_grant

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No, 5AT (=androstrenetriol) should not be suppressive or have major health impacts (to my knowledge). I don't know how it can raise estrogen? It would be nice to hear more about that. Maybe you're mixing it up with the effects of DHEA, which the 5-AT is a metabolite of? It should lower cortisol, like you said, at least in theory. But it has very low bioavailability to my knowledge and I've never heard any good feedback from it.

If you are not satisfied with it and/or wish to try something else, then there are better cortisol controlling supps, than 5-AT. Capsule version SNS Reduce XT. Transdermal b-Aet (Apex Alchemy AET-50, Iron Legion Invictus, XPG Suppress C) come to mind.
Yep, seems I am getting it confused. I will give it a go as I have it in hand and next time I’ll try Reduce XT that has good feedback everywhere I’ve looked.

5-AT was on special offer at one of the UK online retailers and frankly, they might aswell have been giving it away over the Queens Jubilee bank holiday so I grabbed a bottle and some other goodies on offer for my next cycle like Epistane.
 
gphagan1

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For Cortisol control I’d definitely go with SNS Reduce XT, very effective and great price.
 
KvanH

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I think 11-KT would be a nice addition to your run. Would help with cortisol some, with shredding fat, with muscle retention and would bring a little androgenicity to the cycle. And shouldn't meaningfully add to sides, when you're already running Osta. Iconic Formulations Ultra Eleven can still be found in UK I think. It ain't the cheapest stuff, but your high pressure job should mean higher income too, right? So probably no problems there.

Are you on trt or running something, that converts to estrogen or test? If not, I highly recommend adding something that does. I doubt you'll make it through 12 weeks otherwise, or at least are not going to enjoy the latter part of your run.
 
Michael_grant

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I think 11-KT would be a nice addition to your run. Would help with cortisol some, with shredding fat, with muscle retention and would bring a little androgenicity to the cycle. And shouldn't meaningfully add to sides, when you're already running Osta. Iconic Formulations Ultra Eleven can still be found in UK I think. It ain't the cheapest stuff, but your high pressure job should mean higher income too, right? So probably no problems there.

Are you on trt or running something, that converts to estrogen or test? If not, I highly recommend adding something that does. I doubt you'll make it through 12 weeks otherwise, or at least are not going to enjoy the latter part of your run.
Thanks for the reply pal, I’m paid above the uk average I guess, money isn’t a big deal but I still don’t like wasting it lol.

I’m not on TRT so I am ready to throw in some 4AD or Dermacrine when the dreaded lethargy and low mood hits home. Hopefully this will be a strong enough test base to combat that?

I’ve been looking at 11-KT as it happens, it’s readily available here at several online retailers and is actually cheap per bottle but to get an effective cycle I think mulitiple bottles will be needed.

The bottles suggest 2-3 capsules (200-300mg) a day but I’ve read elsewhere that at the dose it won’t do anything at all and has poor oral bioavailability.

I did spot a transdermal product that has peaked my interest though 😉
 
KvanH

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Than


Thanks for the reply pal, I’m paid above the uk average I guess, money isn’t a big deal but I still don’t like wasting it lol.

I’m not on TRT so I am ready to throw in some 4AD or Dermacrine when the dreaded lethargy and low mood hits home. Hopefully this will be a strong enough test base to combat that?

I’ve been looking at 11-KT as it happens, it’s readily available here at several online retailers and is actually cheap per bottle but to get an effective cycle I think mulitiple bottles will be needed.

The bottles suggest 2-3 capsules (200-300mg) a day but I’ve read elsewhere that at the dose it won’t do anything at all and has poor oral bioavailability.

I did spot a transdermal product that has peaked my interest though 😉
Are you perharps referring to 11-oxo? 11-oxo is a PH to 11-KT. 11-oxo I've only seen oral products and 11-KT only transdermals. For 11-oxo you want at least 600 mg a day, many like it at 1 gram a day and even beyond. I would grab 2 tubes of Ultra Eleven and run the full dose (5 pumps - 200 mg) for the last 8 weeks of your run or how ever long you have left when you get them and adjust dosing accordingly.

4-AD or Dermacrine should do just fine.
 
Michael_grant

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Are you perharps referring to 11-oxo? 11-oxo is a PH to 11-KT. 11-oxo I've only seen oral products and 11-KT only transdermals. For 11-oxo you want at least 600 mg a day, many like it at 1 gram a day and even beyond. I would grab 2 tubes of Ultra Eleven and run the full dose (5 pumps - 200 mg) for the last 8 weeks of your run or how ever long you have left when you get them and adjust dosing accordingly.

4-AD or Dermacrine should do just fine.
You got it buddy, I was thinking of 11-oxo. Thanks so much for the advice!!

I will grab some 11-KT and a test base online today. I’m really after some profound changes in body composition over this period, I have a 2 week holiday in the sun at the end of the cycle and I’ll be basically shirtless 24/7 due to the awesome weather…call me vain but that’s kinda the point of bodybuilding right 😂
 
KvanH

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You got it buddy, I was thinking of 11-oxo. Thanks so much for the advice!!

I will grab some 11-KT and a test base online today. I’m really after some profound changes in body composition over this period, I have a 2 week holiday in the sun at the end of the cycle and I’ll be basically shirtless 24/7 due to the awesome weather…call me vain but that’s kinda the point of bodybuilding right 😂
Heh, we all have our goals, none better or worse, than the others = )

I hope you have a proper PCT set up (=serm).
 
Michael_grant

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Heh, we all have our goals, none better or worse, than the others = )

I hope you have a proper PCT set up (=serm).
Was planning to go with this, with “was” being the optimum word as I’m being told I may need something stronger…I have these on hand ready but willing to grab something stronger if necessary, what do you think? Will it get me running again?

Sustain Alpha
Nolvadren XT
Vit D 4000iu
Pure Labs Coomadex (for the arimistane)
 
Michael_grant

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Ostarine is supressive, so why do you care if the other thing is supressive?
Totally get that pal, reason for the question is whether or not to save it for PCT or throw it in now.
Thanks for the reply too 😃
 
Smont

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Totally get that pal, reason for the question is whether or not to save it for PCT or throw it in now.
Thanks for the reply too 😃
My reason for asking was to make sure you didn't think osta was not surpressive, cus a lot of guys seem to think that. "I hate osta by the way, I found it to be the least effective sarm with the most side effects" but 5at is another oddball dhea, is a very weak androgen, it may become supressive at very high doses, probably fine in pct but I wouldn't expect much out of it.

If your going to mess with your hormones you should work on cycle design so that your cycles are actually productive. There's nothing wore them screwing around with your hormones for little to no progress.

In my opinion, to make these Andro and sarm cycles most effective you need 3 things.

A test/estrogen source, something that fills those needs- 4 Andro 300mg or more

A dht- epiandro 300mg or more (more is better with epiandro

A anabolic- 1 Andro 300 or more or a sarm like lgd, yk11, s23, maybe rad 140. Sarm doses will vary greatly but most of them are good in the 15-30+ range

Having those 3 components will make for a good OTC non injectable cycle.

Or if you wanted something stronger sarms at 30-50mg or designer steroids like epistane, hdrol, msten, dmz ect.

And if you want better results and save a **** ton of money........ Testosterone
 
KvanH

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Was planning to go with this, with “was” being the optimum word as I’m being told I may need something stronger…I have these on hand ready but willing to grab something stronger if necessary, what do you think? Will it get me running again?

Sustain Alpha
Nolvadren XT
Vit D 4000iu
Pure Labs Coomadex (for the arimistane)
You might be running again without any pct, given time. But I would recommend a serm. Serm is 95% of the pct, rest is just nice to have additions.
 
Smont

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Screenshot_20220611-053328~2.png

That's not a pct, also I'm curious what all those cost because a bottle of nolvadex is about $40 USD.

Vd you should already be taking that much year round, arimistane and nolvadren xt I would return and get my money back and I would use the sustin alpha with nolvadex
 
Michael_grant

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My reason for asking was to make sure you didn't think osta was not surpressive, cus a lot of guys seem to think that. "I hate osta by the way, I found it to be the least effective sarm with the most side effects" but 5at is another oddball dhea, is a very weak androgen, it may become supressive at very high doses, probably fine in pct but I wouldn't expect much out of it.

If your going to mess with your hormones you should work on cycle design so that your cycles are actually productive. There's nothing wore them screwing around with your hormones for little to no progress.

In my opinion, to make these Andro and sarm cycles most effective you need 3 things.

A test/estrogen source, something that fills those needs- 4 Andro 300mg or more

A dht- epiandro 300mg or more (more is better with epiandro

A anabolic- 1 Andro 300 or more or a sarm like lgd, yk11, s23, maybe rad 140. Sarm doses will vary greatly but most of them are good in the 15-30+ range

Having those 3 components will make for a good OTC non injectable cycle.

Or if you wanted something stronger sarms at 30-50mg or designer steroids like epistane, hdrol, msten, dmz ect.

And if you want better results and save a **** ton of money........ Testosterone
Thanks mate, Testosterone will be where I end up 😊
 
Smont

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Are you perharps referring to 11-oxo? 11-oxo is a PH to 11-KT. 11-oxo I've only seen oral products and 11-KT only transdermals. For 11-oxo you want at least 600 mg a day, many like it at 1 gram a day and even beyond. I would grab 2 tubes of Ultra Eleven and run the full dose (5 pumps - 200 mg) for the last 8 weeks of your run or how ever long you have left when you get them and adjust dosing accordingly.

4-AD or Dermacrine should do just fine.
Back in it's heyday lots of guys were using 11oxo at 1200-1800, I'm wondering if anyone has brought 11kt up to the 600+ range
 
Michael_grant

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View attachment 217592
That's not a pct, also I'm curious what all those cost because a bottle of nolvadex is about $40 USD.

Vd you should already be taking that much year round, arimistane and nolvadren xt I would return and get my money back and I would use the sustin alpha with nolvadex
I can’t get nolvadex here in the uk, it’s sucks my man. I would need to use an underground source as such, and if I could get a trusted one of those I’d probably jump straight onto Test too.
 
KvanH

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I wonder what does the rules of the forum say about mentioning former board sponsors 🤔 Or legally operating source, that's not a board sponsor and offers RC's.
 
Smont

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I wonder what does the rules of the forum say about mentioning former board sponsors 🤔 Or legally operating source, that's not a board sponsor and offers RC's.
I'm pretty sure all research cam companies are fair game, we just don't share legit steroid sources and prescription drugs that are made for " human consumption "
 
KvanH

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Back in it's heyday lots of guys were using 11oxo at 1200-1800, I'm wondering if anyone has brought 11kt up to the 600+ range
I think @stankyleg and @HIT4ME have played around with 11-KT dose. Probably not 600+ though.
 
HIT4ME

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Are you perharps referring to 11-oxo? 11-oxo is a PH to 11-KT. 11-oxo I've only seen oral products and 11-KT only transdermals. For 11-oxo you want at least 600 mg a day, many like it at 1 gram a day and even beyond. I would grab 2 tubes of Ultra Eleven and run the full dose (5 pumps - 200 mg) for the last 8 weeks of your run or how ever long you have left when you get them and adjust dosing accordingly.

4-AD or Dermacrine should do just fine.
I think @stankyleg and @HIT4ME have played around with 11-KT dose. Probably not 600+ though.
Wow, good memory. I ran 11-KT during my PSMF log. I enjoyed it. As I have gotten older I am more skeptical off all these things and I don't really think it was totally worth the cost. But it has applications I guess.

I ran 11-KT up to 750 mg transdermally and 11-Oxo up to 1200 mg orally at different times. It is really hard to explain because ethe 11-KT effects were so mild but I can see lower dose and higher dose uses. I felt like 400-600 mg was a sweetspot, but probably marginally better than say, 200-300 mg.

For me, I might actually give the 11-Oxo at 1.2g/day a slight edge even, which isn't what is supposed to happen.

But the measurable results were tough to show. I lost weight. I retained muscle. I was on a PSMF and my results with/without were marginally different at best.

If someone is in a high stress job, I would focus more on good quality sleep and magnesium intake at proper levels. SNS reduce xt is a good product for cortisol, so is the bAET. Having to do a PCT for the marginal improvements of 11-KT at 300+ mg makes the cost/benefit return very small IMO.
 
KvanH

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Wow, good memory. I ran 11-KT during my PSMF log. I enjoyed it. As I have gotten older I am more skeptical off all these things and I don't really think it was totally worth the cost. But it has applications I guess.

I ran 11-KT up to 750 mg transdermally and 11-Oxo up to 1200 mg orally at different times. It is really hard to explain because ethe 11-KT effects were so mild but I can see lower dose and higher dose uses. I felt like 400-600 mg was a sweetspot, but probably marginally better than say, 200-300 mg.

For me, I might actually give the 11-Oxo at 1.2g/day a slight edge even, which isn't what is supposed to happen.

But the measurable results were tough to show. I lost weight. I retained muscle. I was on a PSMF and my results with/without were marginally different at best.

If someone is in a high stress job, I would focus more on good quality sleep and magnesium intake at proper levels. SNS reduce xt is a good product for cortisol, so is the bAET. Having to do a PCT for the marginal improvements of 11-KT at 300+ mg makes the cost/benefit return very small IMO.
I pretty much agree with your notion, although I've never tried over 200 mg 11-KT myself, so can't comment on the higher dosing. But I'll just restate the reasoning for my recommendation to add 11-KT for OP. Since he's running Osta already and looking to cut, then adding 11-KT in would imho basically add nothing on the negative (with the Osta in the picture), but could assist with the leaning out and muscle retention. And he is looking for cortisol control. Some users report great fat loss enhancement with 11-KT and some get a little better mood and libido too.
 
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stankyleg

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I think @stankyleg and @HIT4ME have played around with 11-KT dose. Probably not 600+ though.
I've definitely not ran it that high. I've not taken it above 300. Without going back and looking at logs and things like that, I think 225 is as hard as I've taken it. I would have to refinance my house to run it that high. And in my experience, after a certain point, all these compounds have a significant diminishing return of efficacy, and side effect ratios. If you do decide to run it that high, please tag me in it. I would love to see what shakes out. My main purpose for the compound is the cortisol modulating effects in the fat cells. Not as an anabolic agent. I couldn't help but think that you would get some pretty serious growth at 600. Would be really interesting to see. I'm glad this compound is getting attention. I'd like to see it more readily available, and the price come down. The last time I ran it, I ran it up pretty high, took milk thistle and omega-3s, then did blood work. My blood work came back absolutely stellar. It seems to be extremely mild on the liver and lipid profile. I wonder if that would change when you got this high with it.
 
Michael_grant

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Thanks all for the advice, it’s been an interesting learning curve. Fortunately I came to you guys before fucking my self up down the line.

I am continuing the Ostarine cut but adding a test base of Dermacrine. (This missing might be why I have felt so crap and anxious heading into week 4 right? My BP is good but my anxiety is incredible!)

I also have a proper SERM ready for pct, thanks to a helpful board member I was able to get a good source in the UK.
 
HIT4ME

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I pretty much agree with your notion, although I've never tried over 200 mg 11-KT myself, so can't comment on the higher dosing. But I'll just restate the reasoning for my recommendation to add 11-KT for OP. Since he's running Osta already and looking to cut, then adding 11-KT in would imho basically add nothing on the negative (with the Osta in the picture), but could assist with the leaning out and muscle retention. And he is looking for cortisol control. Some users report great fat loss enhancement with 11-KT and some get a little better mood and libido too.
Gotcha. I missed this part. Makes sense to me. It's worth a try and I did enjoy it.
 

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I need to research ostasrine again. Where is a list of our forum sponsors? I know one had some really cool stuff like DMZ but i got a new computer. Last one crashed and could not save bookmarks. Might look into some peptides as well? Is there a list here someplace?
 

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