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MY NEW STACK!!! SD+EPI...HARD STUFF

Porrabolan

New member
Hi! i'm just about to begin a new cycle stacking epistane (dragon nutrition) and pro sd (dragon nutrition). Previously I ran E-pol (sd+tren) by purus labs during 4w at 30/60ed and Epistane 6w 40mg ed.

Stats: 5'10 ft , 190 pounds 25 years old, 12% bf.

Just trying to get some lean muscle, not bloated with water.

sd:20/20/20/20
epi:40/50/50/50

running it with hawthorn berry, potassium, 10g omega3 ed, taurine, and liv52.

pct: tamoxifen 30/20/10/10, daa,6-bromo + creatine and all that stuff.

PD: The lenght off the cycle could move, depending on the feelings.

How do you see that guys??
 
yeah very true, esp during a stack up like this; it's prob an essential to throw in either dermacrine/transderm. I used transderm when I did my hella/beast cycle and never had an issue with libido or getting too depressed; however, near the end (my last week), I crashed pretty good, but I ran everything to the limit. I went over the suggested 6 weeks for transderm, I pushed hella to 8 and did beast for 4 all together; recovered perfectly well, but I think adding in an extra test base would not hurt at all.
 
finally i'm gonna keep the epi for my cutting cycle stacked with tren and maybe low doses of sd. This one is going to be 20/30/30/30...i've run epol before at 30mg x day.

-i've got 1 bottle of p5p do you think it's necessary to stack it or just in the pct?
-for letargy? 3-4g vit c ed + 3g of taurine or maybe some pro stano stacked to de sd??

thankss
 
Porrabolan said:
finally i'm gonna keep the epi for my cutting cycle stacked with tren and maybe low doses of sd. This one is going to be 20/30/30/30...i've run epol before at 30mg x day.

-i've got 1 bottle of p5p do you think it's necessary to stack it or just in the pct?
-for letargy? 3-4g vit c ed + 3g of taurine or maybe some pro stano stacked to de sd??

thankss
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Alright I was gonna say, that makes hard stuff look soft; def very interested if you plan on running epi+tren and SD. You plan on running SD 20/30 throughout on top of that or I trust that is your doses for epi? You could use the p5p either way, but I'd use that in conjunction with your PCT. People might tell you differently, but some serms will drain out sodium, magnesium and potassium levels, where the p will help regulate that and help the function of muscles, nerves and heart. Also, it will release stored energy from your liver, which on cycle (you have liver/organ protects) and off cycle, I'd run a cleanse as well.

For lethargy the test base we recommend would be up there for sure; either topical or inj. However, st johns wort helped me out; just take 2 or 3x the recommended doses as you'll be feeling alright. Vit C is good for stress and control of cortisol; which is enemy #1 for muscle building as once cortisol is pumping through, it'll eat your muscles up. Taurine is good for back/calf pumps that may or may not occur depending on certain exercises and routines; it's also decent for mental focus, but that may be subjective on user. Stano would help out actually fighting off some lethargy and keeping a decent sex life going on as well; because let's face it a good mix of tren/sd will def give ya limp dick, sorry bro. Everything is looking pretty decent, I'd suggest maybe throwing in osta between 12/5-20 during pct to keep gains and to build more on top of that as well. You might catch a bit of bloat of SD and like Black says, if you run epi an extra 2 weeks, start your 2 weeks first with that, then introduce the SD and finish off your cycle all at the same time with epi+sd ya know.
 
im running 20mg ostarine now from mechabol/stano200. workn out pretty good so far
 
Well...what I'm planning to do now is just and SD cycle (maybe adding some epi if you say its nice). Let's make that clear. Now: I have 2 bottles of pro epi, 1 bottle of pro sd, 1 bottle of 6bromo, 1 bottle of p5p, and 1 bottle of DAA, and tamoxifen. so I want to prepare a cycle with this. How would you do that work togheter? I'm def not buyin test because I dont know any good source where I live, so maybe I have to buy some stano 200.

The question is, i've done ph cycles before and now i need a good one, which will be a decent cycle? (20mg sd and up) I will be very pleased if you could help me.
 
test base....dermacrine, m1d, stano (isnt exactly a test base), alphatest, etc....
 
Porrabolan said:
Well...what I'm planning to do now is just and SD cycle (maybe adding some epi if you say its nice). Let's make that clear. Now: I have 2 bottles of pro epi, 1 bottle of pro sd, 1 bottle of 6bromo, 1 bottle of p5p, and 1 bottle of DAA, and tamoxifen. so I want to prepare a cycle with this. How would you do that work togheter? I'm def not buyin test because I dont know any good source where I live, so maybe I have to buy some stano 200.

The question is, i've done ph cycles before and now i need a good one, which will be a decent cycle? (20mg sd and up) I will be very pleased if you could help me.
Click to expand...

I'm literally out the door, but when I get back in a couple hours I'll help ya out; if someone beats me to do it, I'll still give some advice for ya.
 
Porrabolan said:
Well...what I'm planning to do now is just and SD cycle (maybe adding some epi if you say its nice). Let's make that clear. Now: I have 2 bottles of pro epi, 1 bottle of pro sd, 1 bottle of 6bromo, 1 bottle of p5p, and 1 bottle of DAA, and tamoxifen. so I want to prepare a cycle with this. How would you do that work togheter? I'm def not buyin test because I dont know any good source where I live, so maybe I have to buy some stano 200.

The question is, i've done ph cycles before and now i need a good one, which will be a decent cycle? (20mg sd and up) I will be very pleased if you could help me.
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what are your goals? sd for bulk and epi for recomp/cut. dont complicate things with multiple compounds. sd is pretty harsh solo
 
hvactech said:
test base....dermacrine, m1d, stano (isnt exactly a test base), alphatest, etc....
Click to expand...

This is what mainly we're trying to tell you, as hvac mentioned before and I wrote to try out derma/trans those are gonna be some good options and no stano isn't a test base. Their all good sources whether you choose derma/alpha/trans it's up to you and your wallet.
 
SinX said:
This is what mainly we're trying to tell you, as hvac mentioned before and I wrote to try out derma/trans those are gonna be some good options and no stano isn't a test base. Their all good sources whether you choose derma/alpha/trans it's up to you and your wallet.
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stano did keep me from being lethargic and kept libido high...
 
I appreciatte your help. I'm going to ask you a favor, i'm not very good at english and i'm not from the states, so if you could try to not abreviate words and compounds it would be much easier for my to understand. Purpose of the cycle: clean bulk.

alphatest is that product from muscletech?? I'd apreciatte if you tell my which are all those test compounds, and then we redesign the cycle and i'll buy whats necesary. Thanx
 
Porrabolan said:
trenazone is demacrine?...i'm very confused
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no bro, not even close, please be wary of what you're buying before you do. They are both topicals/sprays if you will, but please look and research the active ingredients before you do anything.

Dermacrine/Transderm/Alphatest are test bases for cycles; unlike injections, you apply it to your body to keep your levels up. It is wise to use something like this on top of any PH/DS you plan on using for many reasons.

For tried and true, can't go wrong with either derma or transderm; checkout a site called un*****ed supplements and they'll have things a bit cheaper too. However, with these topicals, there are some estrogenic properties and you might notice bloating and what not depending on how long you run this with your PH. DO NOT USE THESE TOPICALS DURING PCT! Do not confuse these with test boosters such as DAA, unleashed, forged and things like that.

You will also need an organ shield or some kind of cycle assist, because hawthorn berry, potassium, 10g omega3 ed, taurine, and liv52; as you listed won't be enough for vital organs (liver, kidneys, heart), BP, cholesterol. I would still take what you have on top of a cycle assist, nothing wrong with a bit more protection for this. Throw in a multi as well, unless you're diet is extremely on point hitting all the essentials, then you'll be fine.

I would personally consider run an AI (aromatase inhibitor) such as formasurge or formastanzol; even erase pro/erase, but you'll have to listen to your body with that one, because you will already get dried joints from the SD; so take a joint supp as well, that's highly recommendable for this run. I would start using this at a couple of pumps a day if you start to notice more bloating than usual; otherwise, use this in PCT from the first day and then extend two weeks past the last day of your serm to prevent any E rebound that might occur.
 
Now as for your cycle, since all you want to do is clean bulk; SD might be tricky, due to it holds a great deal of glycogen and water retention on top of that. However, that will all go away during your pct and will be fine afterwards. As mentioned, it is probably one of the, if not the, harshest compound around; well it's banned now, but you still get the idea. To stack it is not recommended, but if you already made up your mind and have your heart set alls I'm saying is get ready for some ish.

Most importantly, let me know what you really want to use, write here whenever you can, I'll be on for sometime now and then later; I see what you have, but that doesn't mean you want to utilize everything. I'm assuming you took the time to see the sides of each PH/DS so when you factor everything in, let me know if you want to run SD solo, stacked with EPI or all three used together. Since you have some previous experience with these compounds I think you have a good idea of how your body can handle it. But lemme know whats good and I'll get at ya.
 
SinX I appreciate your help. Well so i've already told you what i got and obviusly i can purchase another things, but i'm from Spain. I want to run the SD solo because i will kept the epi for my next cycle. But if you think that is a good idea i can stacked it with the test thing that you've said. I'm already preloading the cycle with the hawthorn berry and omega3 so i want to start as quick as possible. My idea is to run the sd like 20/20/30/30 or 20/30/30/30 because two years ago i ran epol at 2 caps x day. I need help about what stack to the sd in odds to fight the lethargy, libido etc, and which will be a proper pct (remember all the products that i already have). Thank you again!!
 
i want to add, i never did a proper pct in my previous cycles and i never experiences any loss of libido, sides...had run epol 2 caps x day which is 30mg sd +60 tren ed during 4 weeks followed by 5w of recycle and i was perfect. The same with the epistane. Now i saw hoy crazy i was but i trust the wrong people.
 
no worries familia I got you; gimme a few mins please, I'm helping my girl move a few things around the place and when I'm done helpin her I'll read and answer everything ya wrote
 
On top of the Hawthrone Berry, make sure you're preloading Milk Thistle as well, very important. It's really up to you, if you want to stack just make sure you're extra covered with protection; however, if you plan to save tren+epi and use that at a different time, that's also a good idea. I'll outline a couple of things for ya.

To eliminate some of the sides on SD would be a test base product that we highly suggest (dermacrine/transderm). St johns wort helps lethargy; as mentioned take 2x to 3x the recommended doses. Vit C start with 3g and slowly work your way down and that will help with stress. Also be sure to keep active, even on non workout days and that will help out as well. B12 will give ya energy and will help out with your mood as well.

Get an organ shield/cycle assist + a good multi like Orange Triad (this will have joint supplement ingredients as well) or Vital Core (this will have great liver antioxidants and protection); since you already have liv 52, I'd still suggest vitcal core and get a joint supp such as forged joint repair or something similar to this (amazon, drugstore, etc). Even though it's been a couple of years, I'd still suggest keeping an eye on your BP and cholesterol; machine and bloodwork. Be sure to drink at least 1.5-2gallons of water a day and of course eat cleanly as possible. What's your diet lookin like if you don't mind me asking.

If you're going to run SD solo, you're doses look fine at 20/30/30/30, just listen to your body, if it gets too intense don't be afraid to drop it back a bit. Make sure you space your SD doses and cycle assist, multi and other supps, by at the very minimum 4 hours; however, you can take fish oil with your sd; I wouldn't go past 4 weeks of SD either.

I will say that's pretty damn crazy your last cycle with a proper pct and I trust you've done some bloodwork or that you plan on doing some bloodwork sometime in the future; however, next time don't trust the wrong ppl and don't feel embarrassed to ask anything that's on your mind; because if it's in your body fand you're getting the wrong advice then doing the wrong thing, that's gonna lead to a lotta trouble. However, this time do a proper pct for 4 weeks, you're pretty much covered in your PCT. To be on the safe side, I'd throw in one more test booster like unleashed/forged pct/testopro and looks like you'll pretty much be covered. Also, to prevent certain other sides get in a good source of B6/B12.

I think you're just about there, take those things into consideration and let us know what you plan on doing bro. If you have any more questions or need more explanation on certain things, type it in and we'll sort ya out.
 
excuse me I meant to say that's pretty damn crazy that you did not perform a PCT and from here on out, after every cycle, do yourself a favor and do a proper 4 week PCT.
 
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SinX said:
1.To eliminate some of the sides on SD would be a test base product that we highly suggest (dermacrine/transderm). St johns wort helps lethargy; as mentioned take 2x to 3x the recommended doses. Vit C start with 3g and slowly work your way down and that will help with stress. Also be sure to keep active, even on non workout days and that will help out as well. B12 will give ya energy and will help out with your mood as well.


2.If you're going to run SD solo, you're doses look fine at 20/30/30/30, just listen to your body, if it gets too intense don't be afraid to drop it back a bit. Make sure you space your SD doses and cycle assist, multi and other supps, by at the very minimum 4 hours; however, you can take fish oil with your sd; I wouldn't go past 4 weeks of SD either.
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1. ok i can get some st johns wort, by it find difficult to find dermacrine here in spain. What about TITANIUM XL (athletix)? or TESTABOLAN V2.
2. So how i have to take the sd? 1 with breakfast and 1with preworkou meal? when i take all the other supps? I don't know this point, which is the reason?

3. AND WHAT THE PCT LOOK LIKE (DOSAGES PER DAY TAMOXI, DAA, ETC)

thx again
 
Porrabolan said:
1. ok i can get some st johns wort, by it find difficult to find dermacrine here in spain. What about TITANIUM XL (athletix)? or TESTABOLAN V2.
2. So how i have to take the sd? 1 with breakfast and 1with preworkou meal? when i take all the other supps? I don't know this point, which is the reason?

thx again
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I don't think you'll find those in stores, but there's a few sites you can get them online and I'm sure they ship internationally. Those two other products you mentioned are just test boosters; that's something I would add into your PCT on top of what you have already, I think the Titanium would be better between the two, but if you could order online I'd get something else.

I took my first dose an hour or so before working out with a meal, and then my other dose again after eating dinner. However, once you start upping your doses, take the larger dose before your workout. Just be cautious after week 3, most call it there, but if you really want to, just make you're taking in more cycle supps for liver, cholesterol and BP.

This is what I've done, for example:

breakfast -- take sd + fish oil
w/o
lunch -- take cycle assits + other supps
supper -- take sd + fish oil
later dinner -- take cycle assits + other supps

Be sure to throw in a good amount of healthy snacks and other small meals throughout the day to build more muscle and faster recovery. Space apart 4 hours from SD and cycle assist, because there are certain properties that fight each other causing one to be less effective than the other; when in practicality you want everything working to it's fullest extent.
 
now depending on your schedule it can be worked around differently
 
ok...the only problem that i see is getting this test base, this dermacrine is impossible to find here in spain. International shippings are not an option because i need this product now. I need alternatives.
 
gimme a few secs, I got a few things coming at ya...
 
PM sent, just have to do a bit of research; plus I have friends over there in the UK, The Dam and depending on where you are Madrid and Malaga; I used to live all around those areas a long time ago and I miss it over there, some great experiences from partying living and working there. Great times, beautiful woman great weather, get swole and tear it up fam. Hala Madrid! Hahah sorry couldn't resist, I'm also a huge CFC fan; but as long as you're not barca we're all good hahahah I'm jus messin arround.

Get your hands on all that stuff we we're telling ya about and you'll be golden; but if you want to get things right now, right now look into DHEA, resveratrol, saw palmetto; but I'd go with the topicals and make it easier. Get dermacrine, formasurge, and a good cycle support as well as either pct support/another test booster.
 
gettin me all antsy over here wanting to end my sarms cycle and start my ph + ds again hahah
 
1 bottle is plenty enough at 130 servings; depending on your weight will determine how many pumps you will use. Some will even use less than directed and still get good results with that. You'll get a good 5 weeks if you use it between 4-5 pumps a day; but depending on how you react to it, you may need less. You'll get some acne [face, shoulders, back] maybe slightly or a little bit more. After a certain point, you'll get a bit of water retention as your test goes up so will your E, but it won't go up as much and obviously, you still want a bit of that in your body. Other than that, it'll keep you feeling good while on sd, keep your libido up, focused, and after the first few days it'll be easier to sleep and recover quicker.
 
I might have the servings off, but you should be good.
 
"The biggest effect that I noticed, however, along with lessened side effects, is that I did not get the testicular ache or the drop in libido or any other sides of shutdown or restart. Sure my libido was decreased slightly, but I think that this product may have prevented complete shutdown, which has made everything return to normal very very quickly. Also, I barely gained any weight on this cycle, around 4 lbs. Since PCT, I have put on another 5-6 pounds (probably from eating over maintenance to keep gains). This showed me that the Dermacrine was indeed effective at keeping weight off and I will consider this product whenever I am on a cut or recomp to maximize benefits."

what does it mean by not putting weight? I supose putting weight is a good thing!!
 
Porrabolan said:
"The biggest effect that I noticed, however, along with lessened side effects, is that I did not get the testicular ache or the drop in libido or any other sides of shutdown or restart. Sure my libido was decreased slightly, but I think that this product may have prevented complete shutdown, which has made everything return to normal very very quickly. Also, I barely gained any weight on this cycle, around 4 lbs. Since PCT, I have put on another 5-6 pounds (probably from eating over maintenance to keep gains). This showed me that the Dermacrine was indeed effective at keeping weight off and I will consider this product whenever I am on a cut or recomp to maximize benefits."

what does it mean by not putting weight? I supose putting weight is a good thing!!
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That's just one person's review and there's a lot of factors not present, but to put on an extra 5-6 pounds in PCT is really good on top of cycle gains. But if you upped your calories to a certain point you'll gain weight; but at some point through your PCT you'll lose water retention from a cycle and glycogen storage; which sd is notorious for. We don't know what cycle he ran on top of that nor what his diet was; he wasn't really specific with numbers or anything other than saying eating over maintenance. If you hit 3-4k calories and it's not loaded with tonnes of fat, sugar and sodium you'll be alright. Also remember, everyone is different; one will have different results from others without a doubt, way too many different variables to factor in.
 
ok but dermacrine does not limit the capacities of sd I supose. Today i'll go to de doc to apply for a blood test. Hope everything s fine
 
Porrabolan said:
ok but dermacrine does not limit the capacities of sd I supose. Today i'll go to de doc to apply for a blood test. Hope everything s fine
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No, it will not limit the capacities at all; if anything derma is an enhancement to your cycle.



Porrabolan said:
I need help wiht the pct, what it'll be like? tamoxifen, daa,6bromo...at which doses x week?
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Tamox could be ran 20 all the way through for four weeks or even 40/40/20/20; friends have done 20/20/10/10 after certain cycles, but if someone wants to chime in here I think you can't go wrong with the 20 all the way through or the 40 drop.

DAA 3g before workout for no more than 6-8 weeks

The 6 Bromo, try not to go past 50mg during PCT.

Also on that same site ya looked, pick up a bottle of an on cycle protection (organ shield/protection), get Formasurge, a good Support Cycle and get either a great test booster or PCT assist and you should be golden.
 
Also get a joint supp and a multivitamin as well, you could get those in your local stores; might be closing soon, but tomorrow or so get something with glucosamine chondroitin and that'll help out with dry/achy joints and ligaments.
 
When you get a moment please write here what you purchased or what you're considering, my posts above will have you covered; I just want to make sure that everything is lined up for ya.
 
OK. So that's what i got at the moment:
-whey
-bcaas+glutamine
-seriouss mass(not as a gainer, only for some carbs in the pwo shake)
-multivitamin: got animal pak and multipro
-vitamin c
-fish oil (omega 3) 300caps-
1 bottle of DAA
-1 bottle of p5p
-2 bottles of hawthorn berry
-1 bottle of taurine
-1 bottle glucosamine chorindrine
-liv52
-1 bottle of 6 bromo
-1bottle of pro sd
-1bottle of potassium

...i think that's all...I gotta get some tamoxifen

.Ok i'll buy the cycle suport but i think it's not really necessary with all that stack. The test booster...daa by itself works great, i dont think i need more, but we can talk about it, that's something that i can get nearby if i need it.I got blood test next week and the results by the first week of march so i'll wait till that day and if everything it's fine i'll start.how do ya see it?
 
Porrabolan said:
OK. So that's what i got at the moment:
-whey
-bcaas+glutamine
-seriouss mass(not as a gainer, only for some carbs in the pwo shake)
-multivitamin: got animal pak and multipro
-vitamin c
-fish oil (omega 3) 300caps-
1 bottle of DAA
-1 bottle of p5p
-2 bottles of hawthorn berry
-1 bottle of taurine
-1 bottle glucosamine chorindrine
-liv52
-1 bottle of 6 bromo
-1bottle of pro sd
-1bottle of potassium

...i think that's all...I gotta get some tamoxifen

.Ok i'll buy the cycle suport but i think it's not really necessary with all that stack. The test booster...daa by itself works great, i dont think i need more, but we can talk about it, that's something that i can get nearby if i need it.I got blood test next week and the results by the first week of march so i'll wait till that day and if everything it's fine i'll start.how do ya see it?
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Well, if you haven't gotten your nolva yet, if you could get it, I would have to recommend using Torem instead. You will feel much better on Torem rather than Nolva and it's a lot less toxic for your liver; use that in conjunction with formasurge + DAA and you're good to go. I used that during my helladrol and beastdrol stack and on top of proper supps and a lot during pct; the only thing that came back bad was a bit of high cholesterol. This is why I'm strongly suggesting to you to get a few more items, because sd alone is harsh enough.

Yes, please buy the cycle support it will help you out a lot and let me know which ones you are looking at and we can look at the ingredients. If anything, you might have to go to your drugstore and get maybe a couple more things; better safe than sorry and no matter what anyone tells you superdrol is a steroid, do it right and you will have a great cycle. Do your pct right and proper, and you will recover. The taurine will cover you from pumps, take 3-5g's of that pre-workout. Take the vitamin c 500mg to around 2k on cycle and when you're in PCT boost it up to 3k the first 3 weeks then slowly cut down on the last week from 3k to 2k to 1k to 500 then stop.

The test booster (on top of pct assist) + DAA + formasurge (AI) will work great together during pct on top of your serm. Use that formasurge from the first day of your PCT and then use it 2 weeks after the last day of your PCT to prevent E rebound; which may or may not occur. They claim you won't get gyno, but I say bull-ish to that, because I've read and heard of some ppl catching that, so keep an eye on bloating, your emotions, libidio and in that case, you use a few pumps of forma; hopefully it won't happen, but it's something to keep an eye out for.

Other than that I think you're just about set; however, doing more research and reading more when you have free time will help you a lot during and after your cycle as well.
 
ok thank you very much!! but i def go with the nolvadex because it's a lot easier to get here in spain and I think it's good enough.
 
Porrabolan said:
ok thank you very much!! but i def go with the nolvadex because it's a lot easier to get here in spain and I think it's good enough.
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cheers for the reps and no worries bro that's what we're here and this is prob one of the best forums I've looked and been around to get info and yeah you'll definitely be good to go with nolva.
 
Hey guys, i'm thinking if it would be nicer to get 2 bottles of stano and runnit 1 week before de pro sd like:600/600/800/800/800 stanomeanwhile the pro sd will: 0/20/20/30/30it's a lot easier to get stano than dermacrine here. It will help with the libido too? or just with the lethargy...may I let this stuff apart and go for the dermacrine(which is more expensive btw)?. Let me know fellas. thx!!
 
Well, another use pointed out for the stano to really shine you'll need a bit more; although I think those doses are good. Definitely as hvac mentioned, start it at the same time or a week after. This will help with your libido and also with lethargy; still not a test base, but will have rather similar positive effects, ya know.

Can't go wrong with the derma in my opinion and if you stack all that together then that's even more beast; however, it's up to you, just whatever you plan on doing throw it on here and we'll help ya out. Nothing wrong with changing your mind here and there [we all do it, and I'm in the middle of going back and forth now], however, at one point get everything ready to go so you won't have to run looking at diff supps/ diff meal outlines n regiments and etc.

The only thing you should pre-load before your SD, is your hawthrone berry and get milk thistle. If you get a cycle assist, pre-load it 2 weeks before then; some will say only a week, but rather safe than sorry. This is also very subjective, but I also preloaded my transderm (in your case dermacrine) 2 weeks prior to starting my cycle, some will say do and others don't.
 
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