Unanswered MSTEN and DMZ brew for first timer, advice, expectations

mikem456

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I just purchased a bottle of DMZ*MSTEN 20mg DMZ, 10mg M-sten, 60 capsules.

I am 28 1/2 years old, male 220lbs 6’3”. Been training for over 10 years, but no real progress. I recently bough some Reduce XT to try and help with insomnia. Have had insomnia for a long time now, but I am experimenting with melatonin, and reduce xt thanks to guys in the supplements forum. I've only tried natty test boosters up to now, and I am currently on M-test, and some tribulus powder now for past month or so. I've been taking tribulus, nettle root, and test-HD (muscletech test booster) for years now.

Also, I have tried regular dhea for about two weeks inconsistently and than stopped (a month ago).

Is the DMZ*MSTEN mentioned above an effective dosage for a first timer (It is 20mg DMZ, and 10mg M-sten)?

Bottle says 1-2 per day.. Which should I choose, and at what time, and on an empty stomach?

Do I need other supplements to run with this or is the test boosters I have good enough for PCT, I also have a lot of liver-supportive herbs on hand.

Still not sure if I am going to this, ordered them just incase I decide to take them.

Goals are to put on some muscle/strength/power, lose fat, and too just feel good.
 
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ChocolateClen

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30mg a cap for both dmz and Msten? If so then helllll no. I wouldn’t go past 20 as a first timer, I took 30 a day for both and am running a log. I stopped after 4 weeks the sides were so bad

You must have clomid and or nolva to run this cycle. You also must have on cycle support for your liver and kidneys cause it’s very harsh on both.
 
Renew1

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I just purchased a bottle of DMZ*MSTEN 60*30mg, 60 capsules.

I am 28 1/2 years old, male 220lbs 6’3”. Been training for over 10 years, but no real progress. I recently bough some Reduce XT to try and help with insomnia. Have had insomnia for a long time now, but I am experimenting with melatonin, and reduce xt thanks to guys in the supplements forum. I've only tried natty test boosters up to now, and I am currently on M-test, and some tribulus powder now for past month or so. I've been taking tribulus, nettle root, and test-HD (muscletech test booster) for years now.

Also, I have tried regular dhea for about two weeks inconsistently and than stopped (a month ago).

Is the DMZ*MSTEN mentioned above an effective dosage for a first timer?

Bottle says 1-2 per day.. Which should I choose, and at what time, and on an empty stomach?

Do I need other supplements to run with this or is the test boosters I have good enough for PCT, I also have a lot of liver-supportive herbs on hand.

Still not sure if I am going to this, ordered them just incase I decide to take them.

Goals are to put on some muscle/strength/power, lose fat, and too just feel good.
The label says to run 30mg DMZ and 30mg Msten, or 60mg DMZ and 60mg Msten a day??
Wow.
I definitely wouldn't take over 1 cap a day, if I were you.
 

mikem456

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I misread the label it is 20mg DMZ, and 10mg M-sten
 
ChocolateClen

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Ah I’d start off at 1 cap for like 2 weeks then go to 2 for 2 weeks, or just 2 for 4 weeks if you have a lot of liver support on hand and a solid pct plan
 

mikem456

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Ah I’d start off at 1 cap for like 2 weeks then go to 2 for 2 weeks, or just 2 for 4 weeks if you have a lot of liver support on hand and a solid pct plan
So 1 month of it and than come off? How about if I do 1 for 30 days, and than I'll have enough for another cycle.
 

NGtrains

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Yes it is
I just got 2 bottles of that in. It’ll probably be my next cycle with trest. I’m going to take 2 a day until the bottle runs out. Keep the second one for a second cycle down the road
 

mikem456

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I just got 2 bottles of that in. It’ll probably be my next cycle with trest. I’m going to take 2 a day until the bottle runs out. Keep the second one for a second cycle down the road
I thought this stuff was a steroid by itself, why is it recommended to take it with test?
 

NGtrains

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I thought this stuff was a steroid by itself, why is it recommended to take it with test?
It is but it’ll suppress you like anything else. And I’m not using test, I’m using trest. Diff stuff but same idea. It’ll make me feel better and I’ll get the added benefits of the trest itself.

If I’m wrong, someone more experienced chime in. @Renew1?
 

mikem456

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It is but it’ll suppress you like anything else. And I’m not using test, I’m using trest. Diff stuff but same idea. It’ll make me feel better and I’ll get the added benefits of the trest itself.

If I’m wrong, someone more experienced chime in. @Renew1?
what do you mean by suppress? I was thinking this stuff was going to make me feel powerful
 

NGtrains

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what do you mean by suppress? I was thinking this stuff was going to make me feel powerful
I’m not being funny, but did you research on here any? Do you have PCT set up? All steroids suppress you. I think it’ll make you feel stronger in the gym for sure, but since it does suppress you there will be some sides.
 

mikem456

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I’m not being funny, but did you research on here any? Do you have PCT set up? All steroids suppress you. I think it’ll make you feel stronger in the gym for sure, but since it does suppress you there will be some sides.
No I read the rules, but I am looking for the FAQ they mentioned in there. Can you clarify what you mean by suppress. I understand PCT is needed after the cycle, but I have a lot of herbs for kidney and liver like nettle leaf, schischandra, turmeric, etc.
 

NGtrains

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No I read the rules, but I am looking for the FAQ they mentioned in there. Can you clarify what you mean by suppress. I understand PCT is needed after the cycle, but I have a lot of herbs for kidney and liver like nettle leaf, schischandra, turmeric, etc.
I’m talking about PCT for your hormones, not just your liver. Getting a SERM is a must. Basically your balls will be somewhat suppressed from the cycle, and you need something to kick them back on after the cycle. Otherwise you’ll feel like ****.
 

mikem456

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I’m talking about PCT for your hormones, not just your liver. Getting a SERM is a must. Basically your balls will be somewhat suppressed from the cycle, and you need something to kick them back on after the cycle. Otherwise you’ll feel like ****.
Tribulus and natty test boosters aren't enough for this?
 
Renew1

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It is but it’ll suppress you like anything else. And I’m not using test, I’m using trest. Diff stuff but same idea. It’ll make me feel better and I’ll get the added benefits of the trest itself.

If I’m wrong, someone more experienced chime in. @Renew1?
Yes, they're steroids.

Many people use some type of "base" of some type, to fight possible lethargy.
But I wouldn't necessarily recommend Trest, as it is one of the most suppressive steroids in existence.

Definitely need a SERM PCT.
 

mikem456

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Yes, they're steroids.

Many people use some type of "base" of some type, to fight possible lethargy.
But I wouldn't necessarily recommend Trest, as it is one of the most suppressive steroids in existence.

Definitely need a SERM PCT.
I don't mind lethargy, I actually want some lethargy so I can fall asleep easier, currently have insomnia. Other than that it is not required?

Also I take this pill on a empty stomach in the morning?
 
Renew1

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I don't mind lethargy, I actually want some lethargy so I can fall asleep easier, currently have insomnia. Other than that it is not required?

Also I take this pill on a empty stomach in the morning?
No. It isn't required.

I'd take it with food.
 

NGtrains

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To clarify @Renew1 is saying the base isn’t necessary, which it isn’t. But the SERM for PCT is.
 

jrock645

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I don't mind lethargy, I actually want some lethargy so I can fall asleep easier, currently have insomnia. Other than that it is not required?

Also I take this pill on a empty stomach in the morning?
Trust me youre not going to like this lethargy. Guaranteed. If it hits you like it does me, youll barely be able to hold your eyes open.

Basically, these hormones are similar or derivative of testosterone. So youll get some benefits of supra-physical levels of test but you dont have any actual test to carry out normal functions. And your body is going to know something is off.

If youve never taken this stuff before, read up and be prepared for this. Hits me about 2 weeks in without running test and makes it absolutely brutal to finish out the 4 weeks. In my 20’s, i felt fine without test but not anymore. You may have to experience it for yourself to be able to understand it. But once you do, trust me youll never want to feel like that again.
 
ChocolateClen

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Trust me youre not going to like this lethargy. Guaranteed. If it hits you like it does me, youll barely be able to hold your eyes open.

Basically, these hormones are similar or derivative of testosterone. So youll get some benefits of supra-physical levels of test but you dont have any actual test to carry out normal functions. And your body is going to know something is off.

If youve never taken this stuff before, read up and be prepared for this. Hits me about 2 weeks in without running test and makes it absolutely brutal to finish out the 4 weeks. In my 20’s, i felt fine without test but not anymore. You may have to experience it for yourself to be able to understand it. But once you do, trust me youll never want to feel like that again.
The lethargy is awful on this stuff, I mean absolutely awful. It hits you like a train and you just drag ass the rest of the time
 

mikem456

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Trust me youre not going to like this lethargy. Guaranteed. If it hits you like it does me, youll barely be able to hold your eyes open.

Basically, these hormones are similar or derivative of testosterone. So youll get some benefits of supra-physical levels of test but you dont have any actual test to carry out normal functions. And your body is going to know something is off.

If youve never taken this stuff before, read up and be prepared for this. Hits me about 2 weeks in without running test and makes it absolutely brutal to finish out the 4 weeks. In my 20’s, i felt fine without test but not anymore. You may have to experience it for yourself to be able to understand it. But once you do, trust me youll never want to feel like that again.
do you atleast sleep good on it?
 

mikem456

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The lethargy is awful on this stuff, I mean absolutely awful. It hits you like a train and you just drag ass the rest of the time
Is there a simpler route, that is stronger than natty test boosters, but not as strong as these that require PCT, and stuff... maybe a derivative of DHEA, that is good for testosterone? Or what about SARMS, do those require PCT and base as well?
 

jrock645

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The lethargy is awful on this stuff, I mean absolutely awful. It hits you like a train and you just drag ass the rest of the time
I know a lot of people chalk it up to liver stress but i dont think thats it. I felt just as bad if not worse worse on havoc. Im almost 6 weeks into var and 3 into msten with no signs of lethargy. Difference is im pinning test. Makes all the difference in the world for me.
 

jrock645

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do you atleast sleep good on it?
Not really. Usually pretty restless cause hormones are all out of whack and no matter how much i slept i disnt feel like id slept much at all. Ymmv though.
 
Wobmarvel

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Is there a simpler route, that is stronger than natty test boosters, but not as strong as these that require PCT, and stuff... maybe a derivative of DHEA, that is good for testosterone? Or what about SARMS, do those require PCT and base as well?
Where are you from?
 

mikem456

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Not really. Usually pretty restless cause hormones are all out of whack and no matter how much i slept i disnt feel like id slept much at all. Ymmv though.
Well I know my cortisol is naturally high, so maybe this lethargy would balance out my insomnia. I am not looking for more problems, just looking to feel good, and make progress faster
Where are you from?
I'm from New Jersey, USA
 
Wobmarvel

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Is there a simpler route, that is stronger than natty test boosters, but not as strong as these that require PCT, and stuff... maybe a derivative of DHEA, that is good for testosterone? Or what about SARMS, do those require PCT and base as well?
Believe me, if you have never done this stuff before less is more. Go with one and run 1 pill a day for a week maybe two and see how you respond. If your all good then run two a day for a 4 to 6 week cycle then call it a day for a couple of months. Track your food and workouts. Then plan a more advanced cycle for next time. On paper a low dose cycle like that seems a waste but don't underestimate the slow and steady approach.

You won't balloon up on this and look like Mr Olympia. So many guys run oral cycles, are inconsistent with diet and training and also feel disappointed that they look the same in the mirror after a week. Then they will add more stuff in thinking it's time to jack up the cycle. Big mistake. You will end up feeling like crap and falsely assume your stuff is bunk.

A serm isn't a must but helps return to normal quicker. I've ran cycles in the past without and bounced back fine and they included superdrol. Didn't get bloods done but had no issues with sex drive, getting it on or conceiving two kids (both of which were actually conceived within a month or so of finishing the cycle.)
 

Jeremyk1

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Don’t take DMZ or M-Sten. You aren’t ready. Research more. You don’t know what you’re taking, or any of the things you should be doing along with it. Just wait.
 

mikem456

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Believe me, if you have never done this stuff before less is more. Go with one and run 1 pill a day for a week maybe two and see how you respond. If your all good then run two a day for a 4 to 6 week cycle then call it a day for a couple of months. Track your food and workouts. Then plan a more advanced cycle for next time. On paper a low dose cycle like that seems a waste but don't underestimate the slow and steady approach.

You won't balloon up on this and look like Mr Olympia. So many guys run oral cycles, are inconsistent with diet and training and also feel disappointed that they look the same in the mirror after a week. Then they will add more stuff in thinking it's time to jack up the cycle. Big mistake. You will end up feeling like crap and falsely assume your stuff is bunk.

A serm isn't a must but helps return to normal quicker. I've ran cycles in the past without and bounced back fine and they included superdrol. Didn't get bloods done but had no issues with sex drive, getting it on or conceiving two kids (both of which were actually conceived within a month or so of finishing the cycle.)
I am in no rush, I don't mind taking one a day for the whole cycle, I'm more concerned with having to purchase a bunch of other things, and the effects it will have on me. The shipment wont arrive for another few weeks
 
Wobmarvel

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I am in no rush, I don't mind taking one a day for the whole cycle, I'm more concerned with having to purchase a bunch of other things, and the effects it will have on me. The shipment wont arrive for another few weeks
Peoples opinions on cycle support and pct vary wildly. I'm currently running a low dose cycle of trenadrol and havoc with no cycle support whatsoever. Stuff like tudca does not agree with me and makes me feel worse and not better. I am taking electrolytes and extra taurine for back pumps and cramps plus fish oils but aside from that nothing else. Could be a bold statement but I'm willing to guarantee I don't suffer liver failure or become impotent. It's your choice to make at the end of the day but a few weeks of an oral steroid isn't gonna kill you. He'll more than one steroid advocate has gone on record to say that if someone swallowed a whole bottle of dianabol they wouldn't die. Incidentally they wouldn't magically get leaner and more muscular either .
 
Renew1

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Peoples opinions on cycle support and pct vary wildly. I'm currently running a low dose cycle of trenadrol and havoc with no cycle support whatsoever. Stuff like tudca does not agree with me and makes me feel worse and not better. I am taking electrolytes and extra taurine for back pumps and cramps plus fish oils but aside from that nothing else. Could be a bold statement but I'm willing to guarantee I don't suffer liver failure or become impotent. It's your choice to make at the end of the day but a few weeks of an oral steroid isn't gonna kill you. He'll more than one steroid advocate has gone on record to say that if someone swallowed a whole bottle of dianabol they wouldn't die. Incidentally they wouldn't magically get leaner and more muscular either .
Ha!
Let 'em swallow that bottle first, then I'll listen to their nonsense.
 
Wobmarvel

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Ha!
Let 'em swallow that bottle first, then I'll listen to their nonsense.
Yeah, not saying I would personally volunteer to try that experiment. It obviously wasn't proven scientifically but I've seen it mentioned in a couple of videos. Pro steroid ones but there were doctor's asked and it was more comments like "steroids get a bad rap, but we accept much more dangerous drugs in our everyday life. Accidentally leave a bottle of anabolic steroids in a room with child or leave a bottle of sleeping pills or painkillers and the steroids would be the safest of the three and less likely to cause death" something along those lines, I'm trying to find the documentary although in that case a trip to the emergency room would probably be recommended.

I've accidentally doubled my daily dose of superdrol from 30mg to 60mg back in the day for one day when I got my pill bottles messed up and you know what? Nothing happened. If I accidentally doubled my clen dosage it would probably have been game over.
 
Renew1

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Yeah, not saying I would personally volunteer to try that experiment. It obviously wasn't proven scientifically but I've seen it mentioned in a couple of videos. Pro steroid ones but there were doctor's asked and it was more comments like "steroids get a bad rap, but we accept much more dangerous drugs in our everyday life. Accidentally leave a bottle of anabolic steroids in a room with child or leave a bottle of sleeping pills or painkillers and the steroids would be the safest of the three and less likely to cause death" something along those lines, I'm trying to find the documentary although in that case a trip to the emergency room would probably be recommended.

I've accidentally doubled my daily dose of superdrol from 30mg to 60mg back in the day for one day when I got my pill bottles messed up and you know what? Nothing happened. If I accidentally doubled my clen dosage it would probably have been game over.
Having taken SD myself, I'd wager that a bottle of SD would do you in. I'd bet every cent.
 
TheMovement

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Glad to see you getting a lot of help on this man. I have to say I feel like we have VERY similar goals but there is plenty more to still look at as others have mentioned. Honestly for the first cycle why not just use 1 compound? I personally believe the sides outweigh the positives looking at this combined attempt. Especially when adding a dose later. I like to control all variables.

Every time I think Im ready to cross into that realm I pull back and see results continue to improve. Im glad you not in a rush and even if the first cycle costs a bit more make sure its solid!
 
Wobmarvel

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Having taken SD myself, I'd wager that a bottle of SD would do you in. I'd bet every cent.
Possibly, a four week cycle pretty much does for me at 30mg. Dunno if you were to neck them all in a oner if more pass through your system unassimilated. Eat 200gms protein a day for a week and you get some protein synthesis every day, eat 1400gms in one day and you get no more protein synthesis that day just constipation with possibly raised kidney stress. Stupid comparison I know, annoyingly can't find anyone having tried it on the net... For some reason.
 

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Glad to see you getting a lot of help on this man. I have to say I feel like we have VERY similar goals but there is plenty more to still look at as others have mentioned. Honestly for the first cycle why not just use 1 compound? I personally believe the sides outweigh the positives looking at this combined attempt. Especially when adding a dose later. I like to control all variables.

Every time I think Im ready to cross into that realm I pull back and see results continue to improve. Im glad you not in a rush and even if the first cycle costs a bit more make sure its solid!
The product he has is both Msten and dmz. No way to separate them
 
TheMovement

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The product he has is both Msten and dmz. No way to separate them
Yep I saw that. I meant I would have them both separate. Hence the idea of just paying a bit more so variable control of doses would be better.
 
Wobmarvel

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Yeah possibly shelve it and if you wanna go "proper" prohormone/designer steroid then go H-DROL or epistane. Or maybe a sarm. Research as much as you can but you will get mixed messages.

My point earlier was to say don't get too obsessed with the support and pct. If you run one compound at a low dose the requirements will be minimal, and in my opinion a serm is not necessary. Be prepared for slow gains too though. A year or so ago I had a guy from the UK pming me about an epistane cycle and basically ignoring any advice because he simply thought his body would instantly transform.

It was like

Day 1 took my first epistane pill, I think it must be legit cos I hit a couple of PBS in the gym.

Day 2 another amazing workout. This stuffs amazing.

Day 3 wtf I'm 2 pounds lighter, will try and eat more lol

Day 4 I think I need to up the dose I don't feel as strong as on day one, does your body get used to it and need more?

Nothing

Nothing

Day 7 I've ordered some superdrol cos I've heard that gives explosive gains so I'm gonna add that to my stack.

Day 8 come on superdrol

Day 9 skipped workout, waiting for superdrol.

Day 10 yaaas it's here bring on the gains

Day 11 amazing day in the gym pumps were crazy, felt like a beast.

Day 12 got a bad headache. My cycle support just turned up today so I've started taking it hope it works by tomorrow.

Day 13 feel **** today, don't understand why I'm not putting on size, been eating extra servings of dinner every night.

Nothing

Nothing

Nothing

Day 17 threw in the towel man, decided anabolics just don't agree with me so gonna stick to creatine from now on, was worth a try though.

Basically be patient, take it slow, you have years to make this work. Write down how you feel on stuff and yes, nail your diet and training as best you can but do not be blinded by the vision of your head on Ronnie Coleman body that you get when you are working out your cycle. Be realistic.
 

NGtrains

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Yep I saw that. I meant I would have them both separate. Hence the idea of just paying a bit more so variable control of doses would be better.
That would’ve been ideal honestly. But I know when I first started looking that’s one of the first things I found and it was really reasonably priced.

But as someone above said, I wouldn’t do anything without reading a bit more.

That dirty four letter word, R-E-A-D, has really helped me grasp all this.
 
Renew1

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Possibly, a four week cycle pretty much does for me at 30mg. Dunno if you were to neck them all in a oner if more pass through your system unassimilated. Eat 200gms protein a day for a week and you get some protein synthesis every day, eat 1400gms in one day and you get no more protein synthesis that day just constipation with possibly raised kidney stress. Stupid comparison I know, annoyingly can't find anyone having tried it on the net... For some reason.
Yeah....All of the toxicity would hit your body at once. You won't gain super powers by taking it all in one sitting, but the toxicity will still be in your body the same.
Like..two Asprin = headache gone. 1 bottle of Asprin doesn't equal euphoric pain relief... But it can definitely kill you.
 

NGtrains

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Yeah....All of the toxicity would hit your body at once. You won't gain super powers by taking it all in one sitting, but the toxicity will still be in your body the same.
Like..two Asprin = headache gone. 1 bottle of Asprin doesn't equal euphoric pain relief... But it can definitely kill you.
Brain bleed: activated
 
Rad83

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Is that the phantom anabolic brew?
Hey all,...looking at this anabolic brew company and curious if they are g2g on their other products? They have a nice selection...
Thanks
 

NGtrains

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Hey all,...looking at this anabolic brew company and curious if they are g2g on their other products? They have a nice selection...
Thanks
Honestly not sure yet. My first time with their products.
 

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