most effective creatine?

NO HYPE said:
CEE is mono with an ester attached. Please....Show me the REAL studies that show that larger amounts of mono ARE NOT needed when comparing to CEE. What do ya think a loading phase is and why do ya think u don't need it with CEE? Do ya have any studies that show where the mono and water goes once it saturates a cell? A 5 gram dose of mono saturates blood plasma for up to an hour? Then how long does CEE saturate blood plasma? And why would u only want the active ingredient to last an hour? Do you understand creatine and why we use it?:rofl:
Click to expand...

Do you know of any studies, papers, or any other literature attesting the efficacy of CEE? I've searched for quite a while and haven't found any. If anything, I've found literature that suggests that CEE is less effective than mono.

To answer the OP's question, I think kre-alkalyn is the bomb. Just speaking anecdotally, I started taking it after I quit CEE and frankly the stuff put my mind to rest as to whether CEE was garbage or not. The difference is night and day. I've made real strides in strength that just keep continuing. The stuff is cheap too. .........then again, it could always just be the placebo effect. Who knows.
 
ocyeoman said:
To answer the OP's question, I think kre-alkalyn is the bomb. Just speaking anecdotally, I started taking it after I quit CEE and frankly the stuff put my mind to rest as to whether CEE was garbage or not. The difference is night and day.
Click to expand...
what kre-alkalyn do you use?
 
I have used most types of creatine and I found that ordinary mono worked just as well for me. Well almost anyway, but considering price I really do prefer mono.

I have never hade problems with upset stomach when using it and as long as you can bare with a 5-7 day loading phase its worth a shot.
 
ocyeoman said:
Do you know of any studies, papers, or any other literature attesting the efficacy of CEE? I've searched for quite a while and haven't found any. If anything, I've found literature that suggests that CEE is less effective than mono.

To answer the OP's question, I think kre-alkalyn is the bomb. Just speaking anecdotally, I started taking it after I quit CEE and frankly the stuff put my mind to rest as to whether CEE was garbage or not. The difference is night and day. I've made real strides in strength that just keep continuing. The stuff is cheap too. .........then again, it could always just be the placebo effect. Who knows.
Click to expand...

as for the battle between CEE and Kre Alkalyn..i think we should just leave that fight for another cuz there will be plenty of opinions from everybody on that...

if my guess is correct..you are using scifit kre alkalyn? its a pity there is no real bulk powder for kre alkalyn...if not i will definitely give it a try...
 
ZoMbSta said:
as for the battle between CEE and Kre Alkalyn..i think we should just leave that fight for another cuz there will be plenty of opinions from everybody on that...

if my guess is correct..you are using scifit kre alkalyn? its a pity there is no real bulk powder for kre alkalyn...if not i will definitely give it a try...
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm so over arguing about CEE. I made the mistake of chiming in on the subject over at bodybuilding.com. 'Nuff said.

Actually, I'm using Physique Nutrition's kre-alk. I'm told the patent holder keeps tight quality control, so It's all the same across manufacturers. I guess the proprietary nature is why you won't see a bulk powder. However, if you search around you can find it just as cheap as bulk CEE. Do keep in mind that the suggested dose is even less than that of CEE so it does work out to be cheaper. ..........but personally I hold HMB in a higher position of importance in my supplement regime than any creatine, but that's just me.
 
unfortunately the board sponsors do not sell any kre-alkalyn(at least i tried finding but to no avail)...scifit kre-alkalyn looks good..but i think it is still rather steep compared to CEE..however i don't think that the dosage will be anymore different...from what i read..it goes the same as 2/3g a day too...
 
ZoMbSta said:
unfortunately the board sponsors do not sell any kre-alkalyn(at least i tried finding but to no avail)...scifit kre-alkalyn looks good..but i think it is still rather steep compared to CEE..however i don't think that the dosage will be anymore different...from what i read..it goes the same as 2/3g a day too...
Click to expand...

Custom has several products in stock. I think this is the cheapest: Invalid Link Removed. Nutraplanet had some on clearance but it looks to be gone.
 
caps are ex!!..you pay so much more for just them helping you to cap it...i rather have some bulk powder and down it like a man!!
 
CROWLER said:
Well you sound over joyed lol

Yes I received your email and tried to reply but it bounced.

Send me an email from an address I can reply to please.

CROWLER
Click to expand...
whats up crowler it been about 1 month and a half and i still have no chaos sample. What happened? BTW sorry for reviving this old thread.
 
Since this thread is back and I seen someone ask if Dex. increases uptake, I think I read somewhere that grapefruit juice increase uptake of medicines. I think it may have the same effect on creatine.
 
megadose, Orotine is a really good creatine with added benefits over mono and cee.
 
poison said:
megadose, Orotine is a really good creatine with added benefits over mono and cee.
Click to expand...

That's just what is being claimed. As of now, it's too soon to even speculate.
 
Too soon to speculate? How long should I wait after using it to start 'speculating'? :rolleyes:

I've used all three. Orotine give all the benefits of creatine along with a boost which really helps during sprints or supersets. It's easily felt.


Clout is even better, but more pricey.
 
poison said:
Too soon to speculate? How long should I wait after using it to start 'speculating'? :rolleyes:

I've used all three. Orotine give all the benefits of creatine along with a boost which really helps during sprints or supersets. It's easily felt.


Clout is even better, but more pricey.
Click to expand...


Hey, use whatever works best for ya.

Earlier you implied that Orotine had added benefits over CEE.

So would you say that the benefits of Orotine over CEE is a boost?

In my opinion, a boost of energy doesn't compare to the fast and efficient saturation of creatine into a cell when using CEE.

I'm not saying that the product doesn't work, but I'm also not buying into the hype that's being pushed behind it. This is why I mentioned speculation, I think a product needs much more time on the market along with more feedback before it can become a staple in our lifestyle, like Mono or CEE.
 
NO HYPE said:
Hey, use whatever works best for ya.

Earlier you implied that Orotine had added benefits over CEE.

So would you say that the benefits of Orotine over CEE is a boost?

In my opinion, a boost of energy doesn't compare to the fast and efficient saturation of creatine into a cell when using CEE.

I'm not saying that the product doesn't work, but I'm also not buying into the hype that's being pushed behind it. This is why I mentioned speculation, I think a product needs much more time on the market along with more feedback before it can become a staple in our lifestyle, like Mono or CEE.
Click to expand...

It's not a stim, so energy is not the right word. It give endurance and recovery when doing sprints or supersets, or similar. It's really noticable.
 
poison said:
It's not a stim, so energy is not the right word. It give endurance and recovery when doing sprints or supersets, or similar. It's really noticable.
Click to expand...

Cool. I'm glad you found something that works for ya.

I'm not sure what the correlation is between the words, energy and stimulant though. :blink:
 
NO HYPE said:
Cool. I'm glad you found something that works for ya.

I'm not sure what the correlation is between the words, energy and stimulant though. :blink:
Click to expand...


The same as the correlation between 'boost' and 'energy'. ;)
 
How about Di-Creatine Malate with Orotic Acid. I asked a Shawn Well of Man Sports about a good creatine, and his thoughts on Arginine, this is what he replied...

Invalid Link Removed

Arginine: Clinical potential of a semi-essential amino.

Appleton J.

Department chair, National College of Naturopathic Medicine, Portland, OR 97201, USA. [email protected]

Arginine, a semi-essential amino acid, is involved in numerous areas of human biochemistry, including ammonia detoxification, hormone secretion, and immune modulation. Arginine is also well known as a precursor to nitric oxide (NO), a key component of endothelial-derived relaxing factor, an endogenous messenger molecule involved in a variety of endothelium-dependent physiological effects in the cardiovascular system. Because of arginine's NO-stimulating effects, it can be utilized in therapeutic regimens for angina pectoris, congestive heart failure, hypertension, coronary heart disease, preeclampsia, intermittent claudication, and erectile dysfunction. In addition, arginine has been studied in the treatment of HIV/AIDS, athletic performance, burns and trauma, cancer, diabetes and syndrome X, gastrointestinal diseases, male and female infertility, interstitial cystitis, immunomodulation, and senile dementia. Toxicity, dosage considerations, and contraindications are also reviewed.

Invalid Link Removed

On the wikipedia you'll see the EAA and ariginie is an EAA in growth, development and trauma situations...guess what bodybuilding is? It may not be essential to many, but certainly it is in this case!

Ethyl Ester is garbage hype, the science is poor at best on CEE and the extrapolation to aminos is laughable. Bodybuilding hype and VPX and nutrabolics are pioneering the way towards garbage...will they still work...yes...any better...no...health risks...maybe...higher cost...yup.

Malate makes sense as a krebs cycle intermediate. Pyroglutamte is the form used with Lysine to ellicit GH release. And you'd better use lysine with whopping doses of arginine as it can trigger herpes outbreak (many people have simplex...cold sores). The best form in mind is AAKG removing ammonia and anticatabolic effects. The Diarginine form is interesting because dipeptides absorb faster than free form...this would apply to both AAKG and Diarginine Malate. NO products are overhyped, pumps does not equal mass...as creatine quite frankly is overhyped as pump/swole looking muscles are equated with mass as is water weight. Not saying both don't have their place, but certainly not more important than macronutrient timing or electrolytes/hydration as discussed in the thread. BTW for creatine the Tri-cretaine Orotate or Kre-Alkalyn are solid. CM is good to, but water weight and GI distress knock it down.
 
b_delgros said:
Ethyl Ester is garbage hype, the science is poor at best on CEE and the extrapolation to aminos is laughable. Bodybuilding hype and VPX and nutrabolics are pioneering the way towards garbage...will they still work...yes...any better...no...health risks...maybe...higher cost...yup.
Click to expand...

Can I get an amen? :head:
 
b_delgros said:
"Ethyl Ester is garbage hype, the science is poor at best on CEE and the extrapolation to aminos is laughable."

"BTW for creatine the Tri-cretaine Orotate or Kre-Alkalyn are solid."
Click to expand...

Why are you are stating an opinion, like it's fact? "Ethyl Ester is garbage hype". Could you explain to me how creatine monohydrate is hype, cuz that's what CEE is without the salt. Could you also explain how esterification is hype? If not, than your statement is only an opinion.

Actually, the science behind CEE.... is just science. Studies are what is lacking, but the same thing can be said about all creatine products, with the exception of mono.

Throughout the years, monohydrate is the only form of creatine that legitimate studies have been comprised of, so it's the only one that has been proven to be solid.

Invalid Link Removed
 
NO HYPE said:
Why are you are stating an opinion, like it's fact? "Ethyl Ester is garbage hype". Could you explain to me how creatine monohydrate is hype, cuz that's what CEE is without the salt. Could you also explain how esterification is hype? If not, than your statement is only an opinion.

Actually, the science behind CEE.... is just science. Studies are what is lacking, but the same thing can be said about all creatine products, with the exception of mono.

Throughout the years, monohydrate is the only form of creatine that legitimate studies have been comprised of, so it's the only one that has been proven to be solid.

Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...


Not trying to start another discussion on this topic, but I knew that statement would rile someone in particular's feathers.

In his defense, he never said that it was fact, but that it was the opinion of someone ostensibly knowledgable, Shawn Well of Man Sports. There are plenty of such "insiders" who share similar opinions.

BTW: the thread link provided does nothing but back up Mr. Well's position.
 
ocyeoman said:
Not trying to start another discussion on this topic, but I knew that statement would rile someone in particular's feathers.

In his defense, he never said that it was fact, but that it was the opinion of someone ostensibly knowledgable, Shawn Well of Man Sports. There are plenty of such "insiders" who share similar opinions.

BTW: the thread link provided does nothing but back up Mr. Well's position.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I realized after I posted, that ALL of the statements were made by someone else, so I apologize if anything was taken personally b delgros. So I redirect my previous statements to Mr. Well.

Yeah you're right about me quickly jumping into this subject. That's only due to the fact that I can't understand the reasoning for people who state opinion as fact. It just sounds silly for someone to say that something is all hype and not be able to prove it.

The thread that I linked to only backs up Mr.Well's position.... in your opinion.

The facts still remain.

CEE is creatine monohydrate with an ester attached, and there is nothing questionable about esterification.
 
NO HYPE said:
Yeah, I realized after I posted, that ALL of the statements were made by someone else, so I apologize if anything was taken personally b delgros. So I redirect my previous statements to Mr. Well.

Yeah you're right about me quickly jumping into this subject. That's only due to the fact that I can't understand the reasoning for people who state opinion as fact. It just sounds silly for someone to say that something is all hype and not be able to prove it.

The thread that I linked to only backs up Mr.Well's position.... in your opinion.

The facts still remain.

CEE is creatine monohydrate with an ester attached, and there is nothing questionable about esterification.
Click to expand...

NO HYPE, No problem, He (Shawn Wells) PM that over at BB.com, it was his advice but his company sells Tri-Creatine. I used CM and really like the results from it, but I didn't like the water weight gain and the gas and bloating. I am considering trying this because it will be a little more honest as far as weight gain because the gain won't be from water. I also thought his recommendation on AAKG was interesting most people say it is a waste of money, do anyone care to comment on that?
 
b_delgros said:
(1) "On the wikipedia you'll see the EAA and ariginie is an EAA in growth, development and trauma situations...guess what bodybuilding is? It may not be essential to many, but certainly it is in this case!"

(2) "The best form in mind is AAKG removing ammonia and anticatabolic effects. The Diarginine form is interesting because dipeptides absorb faster than free form...this would apply to both AAKG and Diarginine Malate."

(3) "NO products are overhyped, pumps does not equal mass."
Click to expand...

(1) None of this statement can be found at wikipedia. I think this guy is actually trying to imply that because we exercise and experience muscle hypertrophy, that L-arginine then becomes an essential amino acid, thereby requiring it's supplementation and that is just untrue. I didn't see the mentioning of the word trauma at wikipedia, so I don't know why he threw that word in there. L-arginine's assosiation with cell division and the healing of wounds, is due to it's precursor role, in the formation of L-ornithine, wich is the precursor to L-proline. L-proline is a key element in collagen biosythesis.

(2) These statements may infact prove to be true, but as of now, these statements are purely speculative, as no legitimate studies have used anything but L-arginine in it's natural form.

(3) As with any product, a company's main goal is to sell. Of course there is going to be hype pushed along with the product, but as long as you truly understand L-arginine's mechanism of action, you will be able to piece together the truth. No, a pump doesn't (directly) put on mass, it just allows more bloodflow throughout the body, wich in turn increases workload output and endurance. It also enhances the delivery of nutrients to the extremeties. These factors, combined with a steady workout regimen, WILL increase muscle mass.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top