Mitigating PCT sides

[ToxAF]

Starting PCT in about ten days, Im one of the lucky guys that has a pretty rough time on Clomid and Nolva. Any supplements you guys use that help mitigate the unpleasantness?

 

[Smont]

Starting PCT in about ten days, Im one of the lucky guys that has a pretty rough time on Clomid and Nolva. Any supplements you guys use that help mitigate the unpleasantness?

Depends on what you mean by unpleasantness, what are the side effects you get from those things

 

[ToxAF]

Typical emotional ****, lethargy, sleeplessness.

 

[Smont]

Emotional stuff, don't use clomid, pick nolva
Lathergy you just gotta tuff that one out, I was going to suggest some mild stimulants or something but not if your having sleep issues. If you go the stim route then take them first thing in the morning. I'm a rep for ma researchchems and ma labs. You could check this product out, it works like the name sounds like lol. It will help but again, morning only.

I wish I could help you with the sleep problem but I'm not really strong in that department myself. Mike's got a new sleep product on the way too but I haven't got to try it yet so I don't know anything about it. Even though I'm a rep for his company I'm not going to suggest you something I haven't tried myself because I don't wanna be that guy lol.

Just keep a positive mindset and you got to try to work out and do everything just as hard as when you were on your cycle and that's the best way around these things. Maybe lower the volume more intensity slightly to match up with your recovery ability

 

[Smont]

Aterall ER – MA Labs

masupps.com

 

[Smont]

If you do decide to try that product it's 20% off today with the code memorial

Or any other day my name : smont

Gets 10-15% off depending on what your getting. Just figure I'd shamelessly plug those while I'm here lol

 

[MadStax]

Maybe try the simple Clomid -> HCG route? Before I started TRT that was my preferred PCT and I found it much easier to manage. You can use a lower Clomid dose for a longer period of time if you feel a higher dose is too much for you. Once you start the HCG things will normalize very quickly in my experience.

 

[Smont]

Maybe try the simple Clomid -> HCG route? Before I started TRT that was my preferred PCT and I found it much easier to manage. You can use a lower Clomid dose for a longer period of time if you feel a higher dose is too much for you. Once you start the HCG things will normalize very quickly in my experience.

Clomid and hcg are going to cause more emotional problems then anything. Clomid is notorious for emotional side effects and hcg Jack's up your estrogen. And hcg is supressive, the reason you can use that method as trt is because your staying on it. But if you were to use HCG as your actual pct your supressing your testosterone levels and not recovering so you're going to run into problems after you come off the HCG.

If you wanna use HCG as part of a pct you run it before the serm with a ai, then follow up with a serm

 

[Kronic]

enclomiphine doesn't have the emo sides that chlomiphene does

 

[MadStax]

Clomid and hcg are going to cause more emotional problems then anything. Clomid is notorious for emotional side effects and hcg Jack's up your estrogen. And hcg is supressive, the reason you can use that method as trt is because your staying on it. But if you were to use HCG as your actual pct your supressing your testosterone levels and not recovering so you're going to run into problems after you come off the HCG.

If you wanna use HCG as part of a pct you run it before the serm with a ai, then follow up with a serm

Yes, for sure you should do the HCG at the end of the cycle. Also, make sure you're waiting long enough after the end of your cycle before starting PCT. The most common mistake is to start while you still have gear in your system. If you're using Test E/C you'll need to wait for 3-4 weeks.

 

[Smont]

So while your on hcg your testosterone levels will be high, but only because the hcg is making them high, then when you discontinued it they drop if you don't follow up with a serm

 

[Smont]

Yes, for sure you should do the HCG at the end of the cycle. Also, make sure you're waiting long enough after the end of your cycle before starting PCT. The most common mistake is to start while you still have gear in your system. If you're using Test E/C you'll need to wait for 3-4 weeks.

Ya, lots of guys waiting only 2 weeks then start a serm are still full of testosterone from there cycle.

 

[Smont]

Yes, for sure you should do the HCG at the end of the cycle. Also, make sure you're waiting long enough after the end of your cycle before starting PCT. The most common mistake is to start while you still have gear in your system. If you're using Test E/C you'll need to wait for 3-4 weeks.

Before trt this was my pct protocol with hcg I liked the best.

Take last shot of testosterone
Wait 2 weeks
Now pin 1000iu of hcg eod for 1 bottle or 5 pins over 10 days. During this time use exemestane as needed.
Now it's approximately 24 days from last pin of test, hcg has done its job and estrogen is under control and we start our serm.

For anyone new to cycles and wants to use HCG, that's a solid gameplan. And you absolutely can keep making gains during those 3 weeks before the serm

 

[NoAddedHmones]

Clomid and hcg are going to cause more emotional problems then anything. Clomid is notorious for emotional side effects and hcg Jack's up your estrogen. And hcg is supressive, the reason you can use that method as trt is because your staying on it. But if you were to use HCG as your actual pct your supressing your testosterone levels and not recovering so you're going to run into problems after you come off the HCG.

If you wanna use HCG as part of a pct you run it before the serm with a ai, then follow up with a serm

No hcg is not suppressing your testosterone, it is significantly more potent and longer acting than Lh and substantially increases ITT even at low doses.

An optimal pct method should be using hcg until testicular function returns to a point where serum testosterone is in normal range.

Serms are incredibly fast at restoring LH output, the lag is generally atrophied balls, leydig cells and overall steroidogenesis.

 

[Smont]

No hcg is not suppressing your testosterone, it is significantly more potent and longer acting than Lh and substantially increases ITT even at low doses.

An optimal pct method should be using hcg until testicular function returns to a point where serum testosterone is in normal range.

Serms are incredibly fast at restoring LH output, the lag is generally atrophied balls, leydig cells and overall steroidogenesis.

I'm going off personal experience and information provided by a endocrinologist. I'm not claiming to be a expert on anything. But what the doc explained to me years ago is the hcg provided a strong signal to produce more testosterone. But remove that signal "the hcg" and your testosterone levels will decline and temporarily drop lower then before you applied the hcg. This is not in a pct scenario. But in any situation, even tho hcg basically fires your nuts up to produce more testosterone it's mildly surpressive to your natural testosterone production. It's part of the reason we don't use HCG as a solo pct protocol.
This is coming from what a endocrinologist explained to me

 

[MadStax]

Personally, I'd spread the HCG out more. I did roughly 300iu per day and used two 5,000iu vials. I'd start Clomid 50mg for two weeks lower to 25mg for two more weeks. My restarts were great, even in my late 30's and early 40's. I've even used HCG on cycle to keep my normal production going on top of the pinned gear, but it tends to also cause a lot more aromatization for me, so I am forced to use Exem.

 

[ToxAF]

enclomiphine doesn't have the emo sides that chlomiphene does

Thanks for all the replies!

I cant source legit Enclomiphene to save my life, haha. Any clues?

 

[MadStax]

I should add that I never experienced sides from HCG other than increased E2 which definitely makes me emotional. I wonder if you've had your bloods done while on your PCT cycle? High E2 can be alright when your T is jacked, but with almost no T and high E2 I almost want to kill myself. If not, maybe try adding some Exem along side your PCT?

 

[KvanH]

I should add that I never experienced sides from HCG other than increased E2 which definitely makes me emotional. I wonder if you've had your bloods done while on your PCT cycle? High E2 can be alright when your T is jacked, but with almost no T and high E2 I almost want to kill myself. If not, maybe try adding some Exem along side your PCT?

Checking bloods is allways a good idea. I'll just add that it may very well be just the drugs. Even Tamoxifen, which isn't really known for effecting mood (like Clomid is) makes me feel like crap.