Micronizing powders with mortar/pestal

[tregar]

Attempts to make a test suspension failed because the test base crystal powder is too large. The powder would not dissolve in the BA/BB/polysorbate 80 in the vial in a pan of hot water that was taken off a stove burner brought to boiling.

Off to get a mortar & pestal.

For those of you who have used a mortar & pestal, did it aid in making the powder much finer? I need to go from granular looking powder to powdered-sugar looking powder so the stuff will disolve.

Will this also aid in making test cypionate and other powders much more finer?

I have made test base from synovex before, and the powder came out very fine--just like powdered sugar--you could even rub some onto your forearm, and it would dissolve instantly into the skin layer--but the test base powder from elswhere (not from synovex conversion) is much larger--the granules need a lot more processing to make them "powdery".

Smashing powder in a baggie with a hammer or using a razor blade to attempt to split the particles smaller is futile I have discovered.

Help much needed!

**If I continue to not get it to dissolve even after using mortar & pestal for a long time, perhaps I might be able to get a 50mg/ml concentration to dissolve in an oil suspension--afterall I'm not using USP micronized test base...and wouldn't know where to get it USP micronized anyways.


Below is the recipe being followed for test base suspension:
--------------------------------

WarriorWithin has a Protocol for making TNE (test no ester or test suspension in water) that I altered to make it even more effective, check it out:
First post here is His Method, the post just after this is my explaning how I changed his method to make it more effective:

"Guys, I've been working my butt off to perfect this and I finally got it. Here is a formula for Test no ester (water based suspention) at 75mg/ml that will pass through a 30ga slin pin with no clogging. ENJOY!!!


TNE suspention 75mg/ml
Supplies needed
1.5 Grams TNE powder
2 .22um whatman filter
1 10ml vial
1 20ml vial
2 18ga pins with 3ml plungers
1 5 ml plunger
1 10ml plunger
2 ml Benzyl Benzoate (10%)
.4 ml Benzyl Alcohol (2%)
.6 ml Polysorbate 80 (3%)***Trust me on this***
15.875 ml Distilled water

1. Add your BB and PS80 to your beaker (10ml vial) with your TNE powder and heat until it is in liquid form.

2. reduce heat enough to keep it liquid (med low temp on a hot plate) ***note: you must keep it on heat so it does not crash while filtering into the distilled water***

3 Put .4 ml BA and 15.875 ml distilled water in your 20ml vile.

4. Most of you will prefer to filter the BB/PS80/TNE mix which it great, but I prefer just to use a glass dropper to slowly drop it into the water 1ml at a time (BECAUSE GLASS WILL NOT MELT IN YOUR HAND) However, if you want to filter the concentrate use a .45um whatman filter and only do 1 ml at a time.

5. slowly add your BB/PS80/TNE mixture to your water 1 ml at a time, and after every ml you add put the stopper on the vile and shake vigerously. REMEMBER ONE ML AT A TIME. **THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT**

by the time you're done it should be milky white and perfect, with this method it won't clump or seperate to the bottom like it did with PEG. The TNE will stay milky and completely seperated and will go through a 30ga by 1/2" slin pin like pure water with no clogging and no pain at all!

Trust me you guys will love this!


Please note all credit for this info goes to Spydie at bolex."
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Here is my REVISED Version of TNE in Water @ 100mg/mL!

I just wanted to add the following info that makes this TNE recipe EASY AS HELL!!

Here is the problem to the origional recipe as noted above.
You have to SLOOOWLY add the TNE/BB/PS80 to the water. BUT, the TNE/BB/PS80 tends to crash as it cools in the syringe AND filter, thus clogging everything.

Here is what I did to solve this major problem.

.....I simply reverse titrated (if you want to call it that). I added the hot
TNE/BB/PS80/BA solution to the sterile vial 1st!

(I added the BA to the TNE/BB/PS80 solution which helps prevent crashing a little more I guess.) The origional reciepe calls for the BA to be added to the water. Not in this case though. I used it to help dissolve the TNE.

-Since the TNE/BB/PS80/BA solution is added 1st, I was able to QUICKLY filter it into the vial without it crashing. Since there was no water in the vial, I didn't have to worry about filtering slooowly.

- Now that the TNE/BB/PS80/BA has been 0.22um filtered into the vial, I can add my distilled water as slowly as I wish without having to worry about the TNE/BB/PS80/BA crashing since its already in the vial!

*It gets better!! ---> I kept the TNE/BB/PS80/BA solution in the vial hot by leaving it vented with a needle and left on the hot plate. I then just 0.22um filtered my water into the hot TNE/BB/PS80/BA as fast as possible! Took about 5 seconds to add 14.8mLs of water!

**NO clumping! Looks like milk!

RECAP: Add TNE/BB/PS80/BA solution to sterile vial 1st
-Add distilled water 2nd
-Shake the hell out of it

I made 4 X 20mL bottles @ 100mg/mL. Looks excellent. Went FAST!

Diablo
Last edited by Diablo570 : 10-09-2005 at 07:27 PM.

 

[tregar]

The mortar and pestal appears to be working very well, It has reduced the grainy test base to a fine fine powder that will even absorb into the skin when rubbed on it. Will re-attempt the tne suspension again a little later when done.

 

[jminis]

Keep us updated bro and let us know how your experiment goes.

 

[tregar]

Thanks Jminis.

All done, yes the experiment turned out perfect.

** The recipe below worked and is used to make 20 ML of test no ester (testosterone suspension in water) at 75mg per ML. **

Looks just like Milk too like Diablo said it would.

The original recipe is from Spidey, revised by Diablo (thanks Diablo!) and I added in as many details and comments as I could to further make this recipe do-able and understandable.

Supplies I used:

*2 ML Benzyl Benzoate (10%) (use a 3mL syringe to measure out)

*.4 ML Benzyl Alcohol (2%) (use a 3mL syringe to measure out)

*.6 ML polysorbate 80 (3%) (use a 3mL syringe to measure out)

* 1.5 grams very finely ground test no ester (testosterone base) powder

* one 5ML syringe used to suck up and hold the above hot solution ingredients. This is the syringe that is attached to the .20um whatman filter (which is in turn attached to an 18 gauge needle into a sterile crimped 20mL vial)

* Mortar and Pestal (usually run about $20 or so) This is very necessary to turn your grainy "sugary looking" test base powder into a test base powder with the consistency of powdered-sugar or talcum powder.

*butter knife (for scraping the test powder that gets stuck to the bottom of the mortar to free it so it can be re-pestalized some more)

*18 gauge and 25 gauge needles

*15.9 ML pre-sterilized water or distilled water your preference

*1 unsterile 20ML vial (no top) and 1 sterile 20ML vial (crimped and sealed)

*1 small funnel (pre-cleaned with rubbing alcohol) used to add the 1.5 grams TNE to the unsterile 20ML vial without spilling

*glass rod

*2 whatman filters (one to filter the hot BA,BB,polysorbate 80, tne solution) and (one to filter the 15.875 water) Note: I don't use .45 um micron filters, only the .20 um micron filters by Whatman..Spidey once talked about an experiment his friend did. His friend used a .45 um micron filter to filter an oil based hormone solution..his friend ended up with a staff infection..his friend had to take antibiotics in a hospital to get rid of the infection..Spidey then took the original vial his friend used and re-filtered it using a .22 um micron filter...Spidey used the newley .22 um micron filtered solution for weeks and did not get an infection of any kind. Some say Brave man Spidey! But apparently the .22 um micron filtering catches more of the stuff that a .45 can't catch.

*2" high frying pan filled about 3/4's high with water

*stove or hot plate

*clothes hanger

* 20ML syringe pre-filled with 15.875 distilled water or some pre-sterilized water.

* couple of 3ML syringes used to measure out the BA, BB, and the polysorbate 80.

* 30 or 29 gauge slin pins for shooting, would recommend twice a day (every 12 hours) injects,
however, William LLewellyn states in his new book "Anabolics 2006" that "Many reference materials have not given this steroid the proper credit, stating it to be a very crude and ineffective product. Although it may contain testosterone without the benefit of an ester, the MICRO-CRYSTAL design of this injectable will in fact sustain an elevated release for 2-3 days. The suspension we see today is clearly not the basic water plus testosterone design used in the 1940's. And since the drug will not leave circulation in a matter of hours, it is obviously useful. This is not news to the many Americans bodybuilders who have had a chance to experiment with this item, and regard it very highly...A quick shake will temporarily place the drug back into suspension, so that the withdrawn dosage should always be consistent."

* 1 unsterile vial used to hold the 1.5 grams of finely powdered test no ester (the 1.5 gram granular powder was measured out into 5 equal sections, and each section was ground by hand in the mortar and pestal for a total of 4 times. After each grind, the test powder would tend to adhere tightly to the bottom of the mortar, and had to be scraped off into the middle (with the end of a butter-knife) then re-ground with the pestal for a total of 4 times for each section, to achieve very very fine powder. I was pouring sweat after doing about 20 total grinds and had to turn the ac down some more! But I wanted to make sure it was as fine as I could get it. I want this final solution to be able to go thru a 30 gauge slin pin. The 5 finely powder ground sections were then re-combined and re-weighed to make sure I still had 1.5 grams of test no ether powder. The 1.5 grams of powder was added to the unsterile vial with the use of a small funnel... then the benzyl benzoate was added, then the benzyl alcohol was added, then the polysorbate was added.

The unsterile vial with the above ingredients was then put into a hot water bath which was brought to boiling, then reduced to a slow simmer. The vial was suspended into the middle of a pan with the hot water via a metal hanger with a circular loop on the end to hold the vial. As the solution became hotter and hotter, the ingredients would all merge until you could no longer see any test no ester granules floating anywhere, it became a nearly completely homogenous solution. The solution in the 20mL vial was stirred every now and then with a glass rod.

The pan was then removed from the slow simmer onto another burner which was not on. The solution was then sucked up with a 5ML syringe with an 18 gauge needle.

on the table to the side was a sterile vial setup with a .20 um micron whatman filter, 18 gauge needle and a 25 gauge needle off to the side to relieve pressure like you see used all the time.

The 5ML syringe with hot solution was then attached to the whatman filter and pushed through to the sterile vial. The solution dropped through the filter one drop at a time as long as necessary force was applied to the filter. After a few minutes, all of the solution was filtered into the sterile vial.

The pan of water was then put back on the burner and turned up to cause a slow simmer. The sterile vial was put into the clothes hanger and suspended in the hot water bath. After the solution became very hot again, then the 20ML syringe with 18 gauge needle holding the 15.875 of distilled water was .20 um micron whatman filtered into the sterile vial which was sitting in the hot water bath simmer. This took only about 15 seconds.

* I allowed the solution to sit in the hot water bath (on low-heat simmer) for about 10 additional minutes. This is not necessary however.

* the sterile vial was then removed, but the 25 gauge pin was still left in as the vial cooled to relieve excess pressure.

* While hot and even after the solution cooled to room temperature it took on the appearance of milk, the solution was shaken for a while for additional mixing, and is still holding its homogenous milk appearance even after 20 minutes or so.

* I used Diablo's revised method posted above instead of Spidey's, but just made it at 75mg/mL instead of at 100mg/ML.

* 2 hours later and the solution still looks just like milk at room temperature.

* May not be necessary, but I bake vial in the oven on bake at 250 degrees F for 15 min with 25 gauge pin stuck in it, then cool it in the fridge for 15 min, then back to the oven for 15 min, then back to the fridge for 15 min, then repeat this process one more time for a total of 3 times. If for some reason a microhole is left in the rubber top that compromises the integrety of the top after the 25 gauge pin is pulled out after all the baking, the micro-hole can be sealed with a tiny drop from a hot glue gun.

* Shake well before use

* I found the injection to be painless, flowed easily thru a 30 gauge BD insulin needle.

 

[Skye]

Attempts to make a test suspension failed because the test base crystal powder is too large. The powder would not dissolve in the BA/BB/polysorbate 80 in the vial in a pan of hot water that was taken off a stove burner brought to boiling.

worked fine when I tried it. but I put it in the oven for 10 min at 250 f. you have to melt everthing togather.