Maximizing gains

[Joshinator]

Let discuss any tricks/methods youve foud that help you maximize your gains. It could be supplements you take on cycle, it could be training methods, or supplements taken post cycle to preserve gains. Any thing.



Im leaning toward taking mk-677, combined with cjc after cycle to preserve strength and mass. I know alchemist uses a similar approach with good results. -- im on trt so pct needed.

I want to get the most out of my cycle without throwing more hormones into the equation. I want to maximize my lean mass gains on my next bulking cycle, and i want to keep as much strength post cycle as possible. Because as it stands i typically lose most of the strength gained (which i know is typical). but theres got to be a way to keep more strength.


once again, let discuss any tricks/methods youve found that help you maximize your gains. It could be supplements you take on cycle, it could be training methods, or supplements taken post cycle to preserve gains. Any thing.

 

[Whisky]

Just FYI you wouldn’t need to pct off mk and cjc anyway bro

if you respond well to the growth hormone pathway then sure that’ll help but in reality there are only two things that are pretty universal in terms of keeping gains (imo)

1) eating in a small surplus or at the very least at your new maintenance

2) training with intensity equal to or greater than what you did on cycle

 

[Nac]

I think the general idea of aiming for as much of a rebound as possible is about as good as you can get. So, some or all these factors to some degree:

*rebound growth from food: eat in a deficit (cutting, essentially) for at least 2-4 weeks prior to blasting/cycling. This should prime insulin sensitivity, glycogen uptake, etc

*rebound growth from training: train for a period with minimum effective volume, or even deload, then ramp up volume when the blast/cycle starts

*rebound from PEDs: run low drug quantities prior to the blast/cycle

Food, training, drug periodisation that is planned towards maximizing growth phases.

 

[Mathb33]

I think the general idea of aiming for as much of a rebound as possible is about as good as you can get. So, some or all these factors to some degree:

*rebound growth from food: eat in a deficit (cutting, essentially) for at least 2-4 weeks prior to blasting/cycling. This should prime insulin sensitivity, glycogen uptake, etc

*rebound growth from training: train for a period with minimum effective volume, or even deload, then ramp up volume when the blast/cycle starts

*rebound from PEDs: run low drug quantities prior to the blast/cycle

Food, training, drug periodisation that is planned towards maximizing growth phases.

Good advice. Except you don’t put yourself in a very anabolic spot for a rebound in 2-4 weeks. You need to severely deprive your body and get into single digit or at the very minimum 10% to really enter the full effect of a rebound. Also the longer you’re in a deficit that keeps getting lower and lower the more primed your metabolism is going to be and then better your insulin sensitivity is going to be.. 2-4 weeks won’t cut it tho. Also... when you go for a rebound people think they can eat whatever or go straight back into a surplus that’s absolutely wrong and will ruin your insulin sensitivity and your "anabolic window" straight away. Say your maintenance is 3100 and you ended up a 10-12 weeks diets at 1900 calories.. usually you’ll allow yourself a day of eating whatever and then you’ll bump to say 2300-2400 maximum for the upcoming week. 2700-2800 the second week and only by the third week or so will you be back at maintenance and then above maintenance. That’s something I see most people **** up on

 

[Mathb33]

To answer your question OP I see you’re looking at compounds and what not but to maximize gains you basically want to focus on EVERYTHING except steroids. You take them and then you forget about them. To maximize your gains and cycle you’ll want a coach. Otherwise you’re going pretty much left and right and it’s far from optimal. Weekly updates say Friday where you / he will adjust diet according to how things are going. Second thing is training. Everybody thinks they’re training hard but they are not. If you don’t want to give up mid training, I’d you’re enjoying your training, if you’re not wondering why the **** you’re going through all day.. you’re not training hard and you’re leaving gains behind. I would strongly suggest you start working on what it takes mentally to bring a set to true failure. When you think you’re at failure you have 6 more. THIS is what separates the guys who grow every single month and years and those who don’t. I can’t stress enough how important this is. Less volume more intensity. 2 sets per exercise not 4. That’s silly. 2 warm ups 3-4 reps to climb up to your top set and then top set to absolute failure. Second set is back off set where you’ll drop about 15% of the weight and do more volume 15 reps or so close to failure also. Mix that with consistency, perfect dieting tweaked weekly if needed and you’ll grow

 

[Joshinator]

To answer your question OP I see you’re looking at compounds and what not but to maximize gains you basically want to focus on EVERYTHING except steroids. You take them and then you forget about them. To maximize your gains and cycle you’ll want a coach. Otherwise you’re going pretty much left and right and it’s far from optimal. Weekly updates say Friday where you / he will adjust diet according to how things are going. Second thing is training. Everybody thinks they’re training hard but they are not. If you don’t want to give up mid training, I’d you’re enjoying your training, if you’re not wondering why the **** you’re going through all day.. you’re not training hard and you’re leaving gains behind. I would strongly suggest you start working on what it takes mentally to bring a set to true failure. When you think you’re at failure you have 6 more. THIS is what separates the guys who grow every single month and years and those who don’t. I can’t stress enough how important this is. Less volume more intensity. 2 sets per exercise not 4. That’s silly. 2 warm ups 3-4 reps to climb up to your top set and then top set to absolute failure. Second set is back off set where you’ll drop about 15% of the weight and do more volume 15 reps or so close to failure also. Mix that with consistency, perfect dieting tweaked weekly if needed and you’ll grow

I tend to prefer high intensity, low volume but im trying out the volume game this round. Could you clarify a bit on the workout you gave? Correct me where im wrong.

2 sets per exercise. The first set is 2 warm up sets of 3-4 reps and the second set is -15% weight an as many reps as i can do?

How many exercises would you do in a workout? And how many work out days per week?

 

[Joshinator]

I think the general idea of aiming for as much of a rebound as possible is about as good as you can get. So, some or all these factors to some degree:

*rebound growth from food: eat in a deficit (cutting, essentially) for at least 2-4 weeks prior to blasting/cycling. This should prime insulin sensitivity, glycogen uptake, etc

*rebound growth from training: train for a period with minimum effective volume, or even deload, then ramp up volume when the blast/cycle starts

*rebound from PEDs: run low drug quantities prior to the blast/cycle

Food, training, drug periodisation that is planned towards maximizing growth phases.

Thanks! I actually did this. I didnt know it was a thing though. Good confirmation.

 

[Mathb33]

I tend to prefer high intensity, low volume but im trying out the volume game this round. Could you clarify a bit on the workout you gave? Correct me where im wrong.

2 sets per exercise. The first set is 2 warm up sets of 3-4 reps and the second set is -15% weight an as many reps as i can do?

How many exercises would you do in a workout? And how many work out days per week?

It’s pretty much the new standard in bodybuilding especially the one that are new school. Depending on the muscle I’ll do 6 to 8 sets TOTAL per muscle. (Does not include warm ups). The warm ups are just there to climb up to your top set without wasting energy/fuel. Say someone is doing 3x10 or 4x10. How does that make sense? If you’re able to do the same weight and reps twice, let alone 3 sets then obviously it wasn’t heavy enough or you didn’t push to failure or it’s absolutely impossible to do the same weight/reps for two sets. That’s where people fail. Wasted energy and wasted effort/sets. So say you’re on leg day hack squats... 6 plates each side would be my top set, I’ll warm up 2 plates each side for 6-7, 3 plates for 5-6, 4 plates for 3-5, 5 plates and then I’ll take a good 2 mins+ rest and go for my top set. I’ll bring the intensity 100% absolutely failure and I would say certain exercise even past failure. (Failure then rest couple seconds and push 1-2-3 more). This is the first set. Second set is the back off set so that would be 4 plates for me. On the back off set it’s all about slow controled reps with more volume so I’ll hit 15-20. All my muscles will have 4 exercises total and some even just 3. Progressive overload (more weight or more reps or better contrôles reps are all progression) is the way to go here. It’s not a fun way to train, it’s consistently pushing yourself to the limits, it’s mentally draining but that’s how you grow. Trust me the only people that grow with volume and less intensity are the genetic freaks that would basically grow doing whatever the **** they want.

 

[Joshinator]

It’s pretty much the new standard in bodybuilding especially the one that are new school. Depending on the muscle I’ll do 6 to 8 sets TOTAL per muscle. (Does not include warm ups). The warm ups are just there to climb up to your top set without wasting energy/fuel. Say someone is doing 3x10 or 4x10. How does that make sense? If you’re able to do the same weight and reps twice, let alone 3 sets then obviously it wasn’t heavy enough or you didn’t push to failure or it’s absolutely impossible to do the same weight/reps for two sets. That’s where people fail. Wasted energy and wasted effort/sets. So say you’re on leg day hack squats... 6 plates each side would be my top set, I’ll warm up 2 plates each side for 6-7, 3 plates for 5-6, 4 plates for 3-5, 5 plates and then I’ll take a good 2 mins+ rest and go for my top set. I’ll bring the intensity 100% absolutely failure and I would say certain exercise even past failure. (Failure then rest couple seconds and push 1-2-3 more). This is the first set. Second set is the back off set so that would be 4 plates for me. On the back off set it’s all about slow controled reps with more volume so I’ll hit 15-20. All my muscles will have 4 exercises total and some even just 3. Progressive overload (more weight or more reps or better contrôles reps are all progression) is the way to go here. It’s not a fun way to train, it’s consistently pushing yourself to the limits, it’s mentally draining but that’s how you grow. Trust me the only people that grow with volume and less intensity are the genetic freaks that would basically grow doing whatever the **** they want.

Thanks for this. I think ill do this when i transition from volume.

 

[diesel x]

training, nutrition, and consistency

theres no secret just hard work

 

[CroLifter]

Anabolics will enhance what you are doing and give you potential for great gains, but if you dont follow through with diet training and rest you wont get far.

My greatest weakness has always been struggling to eat enough, and that alone will derail a mass cycle.

I find that high carb low fat works best for me in minimizing fat gains.

As far as anabolics go, test and mk677 is a staple mass building stack for me.

 

[Joshinator]

Anabolics will enhance what you are doing and give you potential for great gains, but if you dont follow through with diet training and rest you wont get far.

My greatest weakness has always been struggling to eat enough, and that alone will derail a mass cycle.

I find that high carb low fat works best for me in minimizing fat gains.

As far as anabolics go, test and mk677 is a staple mass building stack for me.

How do you keep your post cycle workout intensity up? When i ran anavar i got pretty strong but after the cycle i was got burnt out trying to do the same weight and volume and i dreaded going into the gym. I still dread lifting heavy now, a year later.

 

[Whisky]

How do you keep your post cycle workout intensity up? When i ran anavar i got pretty strong but after the cycle i was got burnt out trying to do the same weight and volume and i dreaded going into the gym. I still dread lifting heavy now, a year later.

that’s exactly the point I was making in post, post cycle it’s fucking hard to maintain intensity but note I said intensity not the same weight…..if you’ve gone past genetic potential on a cycle and used the anabolics correctly then post cycle you’ll never hit the same strength levels, however, you have to give your body as much reason as possible to keep what you gained. To use @Mathb33 example, your top set has to go to the same proper level of failure as it was on cycle, remember strength isn’t all about the size of muscle, it includes the ability to recruit the fibres as well. To hold onto size you can train with the same intensity or more even if the weight/number of reps decreases

 

[Mathb33]

How do you keep your post cycle workout intensity up? When i ran anavar i got pretty strong but after the cycle i was got burnt out trying to do the same weight and volume and i dreaded going into the gym. I still dread lifting heavy now, a year later.

That’s the thing, you don’t. Mentally you gotta try and still give your 100% but the reality is cycles and PCT are basically 3 steps ahead and then 3 steps behind. Or 2 if you’re mentally strong enough to keep pushing.

 

[Joshinator]

That’s the thing, you don’t. Mentally you gotta try and still give your 100% but the reality is cycles and PCT are basically 3 steps ahead and then 3 steps behind. Or 2 if you’re mentally strong enough to keep pushing.

Whats the point of cycling? Curious about your take.

 

[Mathb33]

Whats the point of cycling? Curious about your take.

The truth? Cycling is stupid (cycling and PCTING) and so is cruising. Maybe even more stupid. But option 1) you’re doing it for probably very little keepable gains and will be yoyoing from a cycle to another with very little progress post-cycle(this could be false for people with crazy genetics). Option 2) is as stupid but at least the steps forwards you do you’ll keep those gains. There’s no backwards. In reality whenever someone ask me I say don’t do it. Never should anyone do steroids. But if someone is going to do it and do 2 cycles a year of 3 months + PCT that’s 6 months ON cycle and about 8-10 weeks of PCT which is even harder on your body.. for what? Keeping 1-2 lbs of tissue at the end? No good answers really. But my thinking is if you’re going to possibly risk it all might as well make it worth it. (Obviously here I was talking about injectable cycles, real stuff. Not sarms and whatnot)

 

[Joshinator]

The truth? Cycling is stupid (cycling and PCTING) and so is cruising. Maybe even more stupid. But option 1) you’re doing it for probably very little keepable gains and will be yoyoing from a cycle to another with very little progress post-cycle(this could be false for people with crazy genetics). Option 2) is as stupid but at least the steps forwards you do you’ll keep those gains. There’s no backwards. In reality whenever someone ask me I say don’t do it. Never should anyone do steroids. But if someone is going to do it and do 2 cycles a year of 3 months + PCT that’s 6 months ON cycle and about 8-10 weeks of PCT which is even harder on your body.. for what? Keeping 1-2 lbs of tissue at the end? No good answers really. But my thinking is if you’re going to possibly risk it all might as well make it worth it. (Obviously here I was talking about injectable cycles, real stuff. Not sarms and whatnot)

This mirrors what ive been thinking. And to top it off: we spend our health and money for the sake of gains, and then coming off cycle we have to work out even harder just to watch everything/ most of what we worked for dwindle away. And it sucks trying to maintain roid strength. Man i get burnt out. Then i do some things that are sub optimal in diet and training and bam everything i worked for is gone. Muscle memory? Not past my genetics.

 

[CroLifter]

The truth? Cycling is stupid (cycling and PCTING) and so is cruising. Maybe even more stupid. But option 1) you’re doing it for probably very little keepable gains and will be yoyoing from a cycle to another with very little progress post-cycle(this could be false for people with crazy genetics). Option 2) is as stupid but at least the steps forwards you do you’ll keep those gains. There’s no backwards. In reality whenever someone ask me I say don’t do it. Never should anyone do steroids. But if someone is going to do it and do 2 cycles a year of 3 months + PCT that’s 6 months ON cycle and about 8-10 weeks of PCT which is even harder on your body.. for what? Keeping 1-2 lbs of tissue at the end? No good answers really. But my thinking is if you’re going to possibly risk it all might as well make it worth it. (Obviously here I was talking about injectable cycles, real stuff. Not sarms and whatnot)

This is so much truth man hahah. No matter what you do, you are reverting back. Its a fact of life.

The only reason I cycle is because i want a balance between gains and not being dependent on the drugs.

I find that by using hcg all throughout the cycles i can maintain my gonadal function pretty much completely, and recent blood test showing 790 ng/dl total test 3 weeks into pct after having been on for 6 Months, proves its possible.

But, it is essential to accept that you wont be big and strong all the time.

But since I dont compete, i think not being reliant on the drugs is more important.