losing body fat/gaining lean muscle mass

[rojasdave]

i use to weigh 330 pds, and now im down to 215. im 6'0 and 21 yrs old. ive been working out very hard since 2007-08 and finally got in better shape. the one thing that i know is preventing me from losing this gut and love handles is my diet. but im poor and i eat dominos with my girlfriend every now and then (please dont kill me.) i lift 6 days a week, and consume 150-200grams of protein a day. my usual eating plan is, 3 egg whites and toast in the morning. protein shake post breakfast. some sort of slow digesting protein rich food for lunch (chicken mostly), i workout for 2 hours then take another protein shake and for dinner i usually have chicken again then casein at night. i also take bcaas throughout the day. what can i adjust to lose MORE bodyfat while at the same time GAIN lean muscle mass. my training is very extensive and i do cardio 6 times a week for an hour a day.

 

[diablosho]

Well, my metabolism has always been pretty high (I have NEVER been on a diet to lose weight), but I will be starting the beginning of February. This is strictly WHAT I WOULD DO based on the research I've done (meaning I could be wrong LOL):
1. Don't skimp on Thanksgiving! ENJOY yourself today, that's what it's for!
2. I would ditch the intra-day shakes, and ONLY use the Casein shakes at night, unless you need a snack, and then a whey shake would work (try to limit these though). You're getting 600-800 calories from shakes currently, and if I were in your shoes, I would suspect that may be an easy way to reduce calories (protein still builds fat if it isn't used) without a negative effect on weight training. However, if your weight training does take a hit, add a little protein back into your diet at a time.
3. Eat 6 smaller meals per day (especially in place of the shakes if possible)
4. No carbs after 5:00pm (I forget why, but carbs later in the day get stored for later as fat-I think it had something to do with insulin response).

The thing is, from what I understand, you may be at the point where recomping just isn't going to happen (unless you are VERY on point with your diet, and even then very slowly unless with anabolic help), because, in order to lose weight, you must be calorie deficient, and to build muscle, you must have extra calories.

I think your portions may be too large as well. Figure out how many calories per day you need for maintenance at your current weight, subtract 200-400, divide that by 6, and you'll be able to figure out roughly how many calories per meal. Then you can figure out how much protein/carbs/fat you need to accomodate (protein & carbs=4 calories, fat=9 calories). And, after you lose some weight (usually a couple weeks I believe), re-adjust your calories/macros, and repeat!

When you think about it:
Calories in=Calories burned (maintenance-where you are right now apparently if your weight stopped changing)
Calories in<Calories burned (weight loss)
Calories in>Calories burned (weight gain)

I would say figure out if you would rather build muscle OR lose body fat, and then adjust accordingly. I think you should take a break from your current diet for the moment, and concentrate on building muscle (cleanly) until maybe the middle/end of January, and then start cutting again (that is exactly what I am doing). It'll refresh your motivation, give you time to work out a great diet that you can actually stick with (figure out how many calories you need for maintenace at whatever weight you want to be), and if you are catabolic now, get you anabolic to build muscle (catabolism breaks down muscle/stores fat, whereas anabolism builds muscle/raises caloric demand, meaning less fat storage/lipolysis). Hope I helped!

Please be sure to get other's opinions, because even though I'm pretty sure about this, like I said, I've never dieted like this before, and I'm still learning as well, just like you! Happy Thanksgiving!
--Brian
P.S.
It's possible you may be overtraining @ 2 hours per day, 6x a week

 

[diablosho]

And, great job on your weight loss man! Seriously, very good job! You're almost there. You should log your progress, I'd definitely follow!
--Brian

 

[rojasdave]

Well, my metabolism has always been pretty high (I have NEVER been on a diet to lose weight), but I will be starting the beginning of February. This is strictly WHAT I WOULD DO based on the research I've done (meaning I could be wrong LOL):
1. Don't skimp on Thanksgiving! ENJOY yourself today, that's what it's for!
2. I would ditch the intra-day shakes, and ONLY use the Casein shakes at night, unless you need a snack, and then a whey shake would work (try to limit these though). You're getting 600-800 calories from shakes currently, and if I were in your shoes, I would suspect that may be an easy way to reduce calories (protein still builds fat if it isn't used) without a negative effect on weight training. However, if your weight training does take a hit, add a little protein back into your diet at a time.
3. Eat 6 smaller meals per day (especially in place of the shakes if possible)
4. No carbs after 5:00pm (I forget why, but carbs later in the day get stored for later as fat-I think it had something to do with insulin response).

The thing is, from what I understand, you may be at the point where recomping just isn't going to happen (unless you are VERY on point with your diet, and even then very slowly unless with anabolic help), because, in order to lose weight, you must be calorie deficient, and to build muscle, you must have extra calories.

I think your portions may be too large as well. Figure out how many calories per day you need for maintenance at your current weight, subtract 200-400, divide that by 6, and you'll be able to figure out roughly how many calories per meal. Then you can figure out how much protein/carbs/fat you need to accomodate (protein & carbs=4 calories, fat=9 calories). And, after you lose some weight (usually a couple weeks I believe), re-adjust your calories/macros, and repeat!

When you think about it:
Calories in=Calories burned (maintenance-where you are right now apparently if your weight stopped changing)
Calories in<Calories burned (weight loss)
Calories in>Calories burned (weight gain)

I would say figure out if you would rather build muscle OR lose body fat, and then adjust accordingly. I think you should take a break from your current diet for the moment, and concentrate on building muscle (cleanly) until maybe the middle/end of January, and then start cutting again (that is exactly what I am doing). It'll refresh your motivation, give you time to work out a great diet that you can actually stick with (figure out how many calories you need for maintenace at whatever weight you want to be), and if you are catabolic now, get you anabolic to build muscle (catabolism breaks down muscle/stores fat, whereas anabolism builds muscle/raises caloric demand, meaning less fat storage/lipolysis). Hope I helped!

Please be sure to get other's opinions, because even though I'm pretty sure about this, like I said, I've never dieted like this before, and I'm still learning as well, just like you! Happy Thanksgiving!
--Brian
P.S.
It's possible you may be overtraining @ 2 hours per day, 6x a week

thank you for your help i really appriciate it and i will keep this post to look back onto everyday. so what im getting at is either build clean lean muscle or commit to losing bodyfat since both need different demands. im doing a workout regime that requires me to eat alot of food and stay energized. the program ends jan. 10th. and im going to start a cutting phase in feburary as well with a friend doing pyramids and cardio after every bodypart, so thats when i will decide to start focusing on losing bodyfat plus its winter time so i wanna get biggg! its really hard for me to count calories, sometimes i eat without thinking because im still a fatboy at heart and enjoy my self and then regret it right after. what would you recommend on doing to gain lean muscle mass when it comes to eating? stay away from mid day shakes and just go for the morning shake, nighttime shake and post workout shake? makes sense, and the reason why i drink so many shakes is due to me not having alot of food so i resort to that as a meal replacment. i drink them with water anyways which might help. will drinking bcaas during the day instead of protein shakes be a good substitute with still eating my protein food throughout the day?

 

[diablosho]

Yep, one or the other. Kinda sucks, but I think it's kinda cool cause when I start getting fat, I can just say I'm bulking! LOL! The wintertime is definitely the time to bulk, and with all the holidays, very convenient! As far as the eating without thinking thing, like I said, I'm just like you!!! I was blessed with a high metabolism, but I realize that is coming to an end, so I'm trying to get a jump on that now, rather than playing catchup later. I'm hoping that whatever works for you, will work for me, so make sure to let me know! LOL!
As far as gaining lean muscle mass, I would say watch the carb timing, and don't overdo it. Carbs are great, but also have a tendency in a lot of people to cause bloating and fat storage unless they are used (hence no carbs after 5:00, as they won't be burned up, and your body has already stored the carbs from earlier, and you want to use them up before bed time). I look at the shakes as gap-fillers (except the post-workout; these are necessary due to the anabolic windows that opens after a workout). So, figure out your diet, add in the post-workout shake, and go from there. So, if you're doing a 40/40/20 diet (that's 40% protein/40% carbs/20% fat) which I did recently, or whatever diet you choose, figure out how many calories you need for maintenance at your current weight, add a few hundred calories, and then calculate your macros. If you can't get enough protein in your diet, then add in a shake to meet your needs. I find I can easily get the protein and fat I need, but I have trouble with carbs!!! And, when that no longer adds mass, then recalculate and go from there. Same with cutting, but subtracting the calories from maintenance. And, what I started doing, is go around the house, and make a spreadsheet of EVERYTHING in the house. Include calories, protein, carbs, and fat. Now, since you know how many calories you need, and the content of those calories, now you can figure out how much to eat per meal, and what to eat. Maybe you ate junk for lunch #1. Well, compensate for that in the rest of the meals. Try to plan the meals out in advance on the spreadsheet, so that you are not caught off guard when you're hungry!!! Hopefully, this helps!
--Brian

 

[IronAndBeyond]

You've been given some good advce there. I would say shakes aren't a bad way to get protein in. Due to my job I rely on them, but I mix 1 scoop casein and 2 scoops whey with 40g of ultra fine oats. The mix of fast and slow and fast digesting protein with good carbs has made a big difference (whey alone will be excreted and it digests too quick). IMO 6 days training is too much. Rest is as important as exerciseas you need to recover, repair and grow. I do 4 days, 2 days on, 1 day off, 2 days on, 1 day off etc. Once I reached a certain size and strength I followed Dorain Yates heavy duty principles and at first it appeared wrong, doing 1 set per exercise. But it works well, if you do a quality set with strict form to absolute failure then what else is another 3 sets going to do to you other than drain energy which could be putto better use on another exercise. Your body will still grow, prob even more. Watch 'A week in the dungeon' and learn some good new ideas. It was the best decision I ever made. I've lost more body fatand gained more muscle than I imagined i could. He won 6 olympias doing it!!!

Good work so far though mate, your hard work and dedication is impressive. Keep it up and you'll get there. Keep us all updated bro. I wanna hear that you got to your goal.