Looking for review and recomendations

[KrunkChris]

AM, I am reaching out to help review my current situation and offer your way more experienced advice. Thanks in Advance.

32/M/5'11/190. About 4 years ago I suffered a lower back injury (2 herniated discs), that followed by not working out, high stress, and natural ageing I began to have less and less energy. I managed to heal my back naturally, and have been better for about 1.5 years, however the energy and fire has never come back. I've managed ups and downs in the gym but not much of anything and find it difficult to find routine, especially about 8 months ago I got vertigo and been managing that now, much better but not 100% and looking to get an MRI shortly just to be safe.

I decided I needed to take action to get me out of the 4 year rut I have been in so I went to a reputable TRT and wellness facility, starting with bloodwork, below are original lab key points.

Total T 625, Free T 14.8, Bio A T 350, DHEA 242
Cortisol 6.18
Vitamen D 21, B12: 481

The highlight for me from my consultation was my cortisol was stuck low from chronic stress, driving zero energy all day simply surviving on coffee.

From there I wanted to get going on a plan, so I did the following.

HCG - 500 units every other day to try and stimulate natural test
Anastrozole 0.2mg 2x/wk
DHEA 5mg every day
Natural blend they called adrenal calm to help with low adrenals
Multi V and B & D

I did that for about 6 weeks and got labs redone. Test was up to about 670, VD was still low. From there I was still not feeling great so I went ahead and took a different route with the below plan which I am currently on week 2:

Test Enanthate 200mg/ml / week
Vit D 0.5mlweek
HCG 500units 2x/week (the two days before test)
Anastrozole 0.25mg x3/week
BPC- 157 0.15mg 2x daily
DHEA 5mg every day
Collagen powder
Natural blend they called adrenal calm to help with low adrenals
BCAA's and a few other natural supplements to support healing, adrenals and hormones
Multi V and B & D

My main focus is to get energy back and feel healthy and my age again. I feel like I was in a whole and just need a little help getting out of. Overall diet is good (meaning clean foods), and I've starting cardio and lifting again. I plan to take diet and exercise as a main priority now as well, and would like to lean out and gain strength as additional items

I feel slightly better, probably a combination but the exercise def helps! I just don't want to risk any long-term health issues, and would also like your all's input on what I am currently doing. I know I should have came here first, but I'm only two weeks in so not too late. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!

 

[Renew1]

AM, I am reaching out to help review my current situation and offer your way more experienced advice. Thanks in Advance.

32/M/5'11/190. About 4 years ago I suffered a lower back injury (2 herniated discs), that followed by not working out, high stress, and natural ageing I began to have less and less energy. I managed to heal my back naturally, and have been better for about 1.5 years, however the energy and fire has never come back. I've managed ups and downs in the gym but not much of anything and find it difficult to find routine, especially about 8 months ago I got vertigo and been managing that now, much better but not 100% and looking to get an MRI shortly just to be safe.

I decided I needed to take action to get me out of the 4 year rut I have been in so I went to a reputable TRT and wellness facility, starting with bloodwork, below are original lab key points.

Total T 625, Free T 14.8, Bio A T 350, DHEA 242
Cortisol 6.18
Vitamen D 21, B12: 481

The highlight for me from my consultation was my cortisol was stuck low from chronic stress, driving zero energy all day simply surviving on coffee.

From there I wanted to get going on a plan, so I did the following.

HCG - 500 units every other day to try and stimulate natural test
Anastrozole 0.2mg 2x/wk
DHEA 5mg every day
Natural blend they called adrenal calm to help with low adrenals
Multi V and B & D

I did that for about 6 weeks and got labs redone. Test was up to about 670, VD was still low. From there I was still not feeling great so I went ahead and took a different route with the below plan which I am currently on week 2:

Test Enanthate 200mg/ml / week
Vit D 0.5mlweek
HCG 500units 2x/week (the two days before test)
Anastrozole 0.25mg x3/week
BPC- 157 0.15mg 2x daily
DHEA 5mg every day
Collagen powder
Natural blend they called adrenal calm to help with low adrenals
BCAA's and a few other natural supplements to support healing, adrenals and hormones
Multi V and B & D

My main focus is to get energy back and feel healthy and my age again. I feel like I was in a whole and just need a little help getting out of. Overall diet is good (meaning clean foods), and I've starting cardio and lifting again. I plan to take diet and exercise as a main priority now as well, and would like to lean out and gain strength as additional items

I feel slightly better, probably a combination but the exercise def helps! I just don't want to risk any long-term health issues, and would also like your all's input on what I am currently doing. I know I should have came here first, but I'm only two weeks in so not too late. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!

Did you say you had your back checked, to be sure it's good?

Your Cortisol is low?

Mls aren't a useful measurement in this case (vit D), iu, mg, mcg, etc is applicable.

Glad you're doing Cardio. I was going to mention it after the layoff.

 

[Carnivorecon]

Your test is twice mine when I got tested and I'm fine, why did you want it raising? Did your dr check your thyroid at all

 

[thebigt]

add in some pregnenolone to go with the dhea.

 

[TheVenom]

Your test is twice mine when I got tested and I'm fine, why did you want it raising? Did your dr check your thyroid at all

This. If my total test was > 600 i doubt theres a clinic in 500 miles that would advise trt to me. Something is a lil fishy here man.

 

[KrunkChris]

To answer a few things.

Regarding thyroid: t3 3.06, t4 1.06 3rd gen 1.1

Regarding my back: I never got a MRI again, but all pain is gone and mobility is pretty much back to normal. In addition to pretty much everything out there, I did spinal decompression for a few months and that is what, in my opinion, healed it.

To be clear, test was never recommended as a long term solution. They had provided it as a short term option to feel better during my correctional phase as I work to get other things aligned. At first I had chose to go the HCG route to try and boost it through pituitary stimulation, and then I opted for the Test E (14 weeks). No peer pressure or anything like that, simply my choice.

My questions still remain the same as I look for advice on getting adrenals back pumping, vitamins aligned and test boosted so that I can get back on track. If there is any advice on making tweaks to what I am taking, and what I should focus on, I am all ears. Thanks!

 

[Renew1]

To answer a few things.

Regarding thyroid: t3 3.06, t4 1.06 3rd gen 1.1

Regarding my back: I never got a MRI again, but all pain is gone and mobility is pretty much back to normal. In addition to pretty much everything out there, I did spinal decompression for a few months and that is what, in my opinion, healed it.

To be clear, test was never recommended as a long term solution. They had provided it as a short term option to feel better during my correctional phase as I work to get other things aligned. At first I had chose to go the HCG route to try and boost it through pituitary stimulation, and then I opted for the Test E (14 weeks). No peer pressure or anything like that, simply my choice.

My questions still remain the same as I look for advice on getting adrenals back pumping, vitamins aligned and test boosted so that I can get back on track. If there is any advice on making tweaks to what I am taking, and what I should focus on, I am all ears. Thanks!

Please be careful with your back brother, I'd hate to see you go back down.
I broke mine years ago, but thankfully I'm 100% now (I was monitored, checked, and released),

 

[heebs10]

To answer a few things.

Regarding thyroid: t3 3.06, t4 1.06 3rd gen 1.1

Regarding my back: I never got a MRI again, but all pain is gone and mobility is pretty much back to normal. In addition to pretty much everything out there, I did spinal decompression for a few months and that is what, in my opinion, healed it.

To be clear, test was never recommended as a long term solution. They had provided it as a short term option to feel better during my correctional phase as I work to get other things aligned. At first I had chose to go the HCG route to try and boost it through pituitary stimulation...

Not to hijack, but I was pondering this earlier: hcg, does it stimulate the pituitary to secrete LH or (my impression) was that hcg stimulated the testes in an identical fashion as they would with LH secretion? With the later, seems as though negative feedback would likely cause decreased LH secretion from the pituitary (likely minimal but still). I’m short, hcg stimulates the pituitary to release LH or hcg directly stimulates the testes to produce test in the same fashion as endogenous LH would?

Sorry for momentary hijack, thats my only question

 

[Carnivorecon]

Not to hijack, but I was pondering this earlier: hcg, does it stimulate the pituitary to secrete LH or (my impression) was that hcg stimulated the testes in an identical fashion as they would with LH secretion? With the later, seems as though negative feedback would likely cause decreased LH secretion from the pituitary (likely minimal but still). I’m short, hcg stimulates the pituitary to release LH or hcg directly stimulates the testes to produce test in the same fashion as endogenous LH would?

Sorry for momentary hijack, thats my only question

"I’m short, hcg stimulates the pituitary to release LH or hcg directly stimulates the testes" You're short?

 

[KrunkChris]

Hi all, wanted to bring this thread back up for more opinions and thoughts on additional things I can do to improve upon and tweak as well as to ensure things are as safe as possible, as I did not get too much initially.

As a correction, the Test E is 200mg/ml at 0.6ML per week for 15 weeks.

Overall I have been feeling better for sure, along with better diet and increased exercise (almost daily).

Any thoughts on getting my adrenals/cortisol levels back on track as that is the root cause I am chasing. Again this is not a long term plan, this is a short sprint to try and get things back on track and normalized.

Thanks!

 

[Whisky]

Hi all, wanted to bring this thread back up for more opinions and thoughts on additional things I can do to improve upon and tweak as well as to ensure things are as safe as possible, as I did not get too much initially.

As a correction, the Test E is 200mg/ml at 0.6ML per week for 15 weeks.

Overall I have been feeling better for sure, along with better diet and increased exercise (almost daily).

Any thoughts on getting my adrenals/cortisol levels back on track as that is the root cause I am chasing. Again this is not a long term plan, this is a short sprint to try and get things back on track and normalized.

Thanks!

just being honest bro your test looked fine, your running a trt dose but in theory (and everyone’s different) all your doing is replacing your in range test with endogenous test to get back to roughly the same level or a bit higher.

on the basis test wasn’t the issue I just don’t understand the protocol.

now there’s a lot of other interactions at play which could be impacted by test but there seems simpler solutions to address them?

sorry man, just not sure I understand the process here?

 

[jrock645]

just being honest bro your test looked fine, your running a trt dose but in theory (and everyone’s different) all your doing is replacing your in range test with endogenous test to get back to roughly the same level or a bit higher.

on the basis test wasn’t the issue I just don’t understand the protocol.

now there’s a lot of other interactions at play which could be impacted by test but there seems simpler solutions to address them?

sorry man, just not sure I understand the process here?

I agree. If cortisol is the problem and not test, why is the approach here to replace test but seemingly ignore cortisol? Seems like a completely wasted effort and unnecessary monkey wrench thrown into things. Now you have to worry about getting off the test and getting back to normal, and this process CAN negatively affect cortisol levels. You just took a detour that won't help you get to your final destination, so you're gonna have to turn around and go back.

 

[Mathb33]

Your test is twice mine when I got tested and I'm fine, why did you want it raising? Did your dr check your thyroid at all

I completly agree his test is completly fine but I can’t help but point out that if you think you’re fine with 300ish total test you’re fooling yourself. You may think you’re fine but That’s some shitty levels to think you can fully function with the same energy and drive as good as double or triple your levels. Why not get it fixed?

 

[KrunkChris]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the honest feedback and that is why I came here, which I should have done first but I dont think it is too late to take things into my own hands and tweak/change my path to get on a better route.

To some of the points, from my understanding I am taking things to help the adrenals/cortisol levels. Below is the full list, and in BOLD what I was told will help with healing, stress and overall cortisol levels (trying this was prior to trying things not as natural)

BPC- 157 0.15mg 2x daily
Daily BCAA & Collagen powder
Daily "Adrenal calm" - Vitamen C, B-2, B-6, Eleuthero, American Ginseng, Ashwagandha, Rhodiola, N-Acetyl, L-Tyrosine, Licorice
Daily "B-Vital" - 400mg L-Theanine
Daily B-Recovered - L-Glutamine 6K mg, L-Arginine 1K mg, L-Ornithine 1K mg, L-Lysine 1.2K mg, Glycine 1K mg

Multi Vitamin
Vitamin D 0.5ml/week @ 100,000IU/ML

Test E 200mg/ml @ 0.6ML 1x week for 15 weeks
HCG 500 units 2x/week (the two days before test)
Anastrozole 0.25mg x3/week
DHEA 5mg every day

Also, it was my understanding from researching that the Test E would be additional to my current test because I am running the HCG which would keep my natural testosterone producing as well.

Are there any recommendations or options based on what you all see that I could do to course correct, as a few examples I could come off the test and specifically target the cortisol issue, possible with some more powerful stuff. I could up the Test E for the remainder of the 10 weeks and then course correct. Any thoughts and recommendations would be appreciated, thanks!

 

[Mathb33]

Also, it was my understanding from researching that the Test E would be additional to my current test because I am running the HCG which would keep my natural testosterone producing as well.

What? The test you’re injecting will not be additional to your current natural testosterone production. It’s not a stack. The test you’re injecting will shut down your natural production. HCG won’t provient that by the way or everybody would be using it. In simple words HCG should make your PCT easier, it won’t prevent your natural test to go to ****. This whole thing is a mess you’re tying to fix a problem by creating an even bigger one man.

 

[Renew1]

What? The test you’re injecting will not be additional to your current natural testosterone production. It’s not a stack. The test you’re injecting will shut down your natural production. HCG won’t provient that by the way or everybody would be using it. In simple words HCG should make your PCT easier, it won’t prevent your natural test to go to ****. This whole thing is a mess you’re tying to fix a problem by creating an even bigger one man.

^^ That right there is 100% correct, brother. ^

 

[KrunkChris]

Got it, thanks I will do some further digging and plan to get off the test asap with PCT included, and transition to getting back to natural test and address the cortisol directly. Thanks.

 

[Whisky]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the honest feedback and that is why I came here, which I should have done first but I dont think it is too late to take things into my own hands and tweak/change my path to get on a better route.

To some of the points, from my understanding I am taking things to help the adrenals/cortisol levels. Below is the full list, and in BOLD what I was told will help with healing, stress and overall cortisol levels (trying this was prior to trying things not as natural)

BPC- 157 0.15mg 2x daily
Daily BCAA & Collagen powder
Daily "Adrenal calm" - Vitamen C, B-2, B-6, Eleuthero, American Ginseng, Ashwagandha, Rhodiola, N-Acetyl, L-Tyrosine, Licorice
Daily "B-Vital" - 400mg L-Theanine
Daily B-Recovered - L-Glutamine 6K mg, L-Arginine 1K mg, L-Ornithine 1K mg, L-Lysine 1.2K mg, Glycine 1K mg

Multi Vitamin
Vitamin D 0.5ml/week @ 100,000IU/ML

Test E 200mg/ml @ 0.6ML 1x week for 15 weeks
HCG 500 units 2x/week (the two days before test)
Anastrozole 0.25mg x3/week
DHEA 5mg every day

Also, it was my understanding from researching that the Test E would be additional to my current test because I am running the HCG which would keep my natural testosterone producing as well.

Are there any recommendations or options based on what you all see that I could do to course correct, as a few examples I could come off the test and specifically target the cortisol issue, possible with some more powerful stuff. I could up the Test E for the remainder of the 10 weeks and then course correct. Any thoughts and recommendations would be appreciated, thanks!

Ah **** bro. You’ve been given a bum steer on this one. The guys above have already said it but nope your test e isn’t not adding to your natural test, your natural test is now suppressed so the only testosterone your body is getting is from the test e you are injecting.

short version is that HCG mimics LH to stimulate testosterone production and is normally used in pct (higher doses) to speed up the body getting natural production started again. It can be used on cycle (lower doses) to keep the testes from atrophying and in theory that also helps smooth the transition into pct. It’s been looked at for men with low test and micro penis and shown some use in studies in that regard.

coming off the test will present its own problems tbh, you’ll need a full pct assuming you’ve been on a while now.

For cortisol that adrenal calm looks alright to be fair, ashwaganda is widely studied and effective. You should also consider lifestyle factors, mediation, breathwork, sleep optimisation etc

I use and like BPC 157, never seen it recommended for cortisol though. The potential to reduce gut inflammation makes sense from that standpoint but even here there are other options (turmeric for a start). I also dose it at twice the amount you currently are - Your on the low end.

you gotta a low of stuff going on here bro. Kinda feels like the cure could be worse than the disease.

I legit don’t know if I’d say to come off the test now, pct and readdress the cortisol or just run the cycle but at a higher dose to get some body comp improvements. Coming off is probably the smarter play.

 

[KrunkChris]

Ah **** bro. You’ve been given a bum steer on this one. The guys above have already said it but nope your test e isn’t not adding to your natural test, your natural test is now suppressed so the only testosterone your body is getting is from the test e you are injecting.

short version is that HCG mimics LH to stimulate testosterone production and is normally used in pct (higher doses) to speed up the body getting natural production started again. It can be used on cycle (lower doses) to keep the testes from atrophying and in theory that also helps smooth the transition into pct. It’s been looked at for men with low test and micro penis and shown some use in studies in that regard.

coming off the test will present its own problems tbh, you’ll need a full pct assuming you’ve been on a while now.

For cortisol that adrenal calm looks alright to be fair, ashwaganda is widely studied and effective. You should also consider lifestyle factors, mediation, breathwork, sleep optimisation etc

I use and like BPC 157, never seen it recommended for cortisol though. The potential to reduce gut inflammation makes sense from that standpoint but even here there are other options (turmeric for a start). I also dose it at twice the amount you currently are - Your on the low end.

you gotta a low of stuff going on here bro. Kinda feels like the cure could be worse than the disease.

I legit don’t know if I’d say to come off the test now, pct and readdress the cortisol or just run the cycle but at a higher dose to get some body comp improvements. Coming off is probably the smarter play.

Thank you, I appreciate the insights and opinion vs just the negatives point outs.

The BPC was more for my back, to help reduce any inflammation and promote continued healing. Which in turn could aid in less chronic stress, which is what I think is the root cause of this.

As you mentioned I have been implementing some lifestyle practices like mediation (need a bit more consistency) but I could certainly improve on the sleep optimization, mostly around screens.

I have only been on 5 weeks, with 10 remaining. Could you recommend what a proper PCT might look like in this situation for comparison purposes once I speak with my doctor this week.

Also, I've thought about just upping the dose and running this thing out. In addition to the cortisol, I believe I was at a point that needed a jump start that was beyond just the cortisol, and honestly I think it has helped me over the past couple of months (test has only been the last month+) to start getting back on track mentally and physically, so at the end I cant be that upset as I feel it's been working towards its purpose. With that said, I think next time I'll surly do my due diligence here before anything else.

Thanks again for the feedback, much appreciated.

 

[DemntedCowboy]

**whiskey already said what I was gonna say. I need to learn to read faster. Lol

 

[Whisky]

Thank you, I appreciate the insights and opinion vs just the negatives point outs.

The BPC was more for my back, to help reduce any inflammation and promote continued healing. Which in turn could aid in less chronic stress, which is what I think is the root cause of this.

As you mentioned I have been implementing some lifestyle practices like mediation (need a bit more consistency) but I could certainly improve on the sleep optimization, mostly around screens.

I have only been on 5 weeks, with 10 remaining. Could you recommend what a proper PCT might look like in this situation for comparison purposes once I speak with my doctor this week.

Also, I've thought about just upping the dose and running this thing out. In addition to the cortisol, I believe I was at a point that needed a jump start that was beyond just the cortisol, and honestly I think it has helped me over the past couple of months (test has only been the last month+) to start getting back on track mentally and physically, so at the end I cant be that upset as I feel it's been working towards its purpose. With that said, I think next time I'll surly do my due diligence here before anything else.

Thanks again for the feedback, much appreciated.

for sleep the blue light blocking glasses I find really make a difference. I use them at least an hour before I want to sleep. They look stupid but **** it.

I also sleep on a grounding sheet which appears to help somewhat.

IF you decide to come off now you’ll need to wait a couple of weeks for the esters to start clearing and then I’d run either clomid at 50/25/25/12.5 or nolva at 20/20/10/10. Some hcg would be helpful but it’s not like it’s been a long cycle so you only need a basic pct.

your literally at that point where you’ve been on long enough to be fully suppressed but not really long enough to get any benefits. IF you were to stay on Id increase test to 400 or 500 a week for another 8 weeks and then pct.

test is great in terms of how you feel, the amount your on will have you likely above range so it’s no wonder that your feeling good. However, I think that might just be a sticking plaster to be honest. From your post the cortisol appears to be a concern for you hence why I think just dialling everything back and focusing on that is the right move. High test for the sake of feeling good isn’t enough of a reason to accept the potential side effects imo.

bcp also works well with tb500 btw, they appear to work synergistically. In the original post you mention your back had been healed for some time hence why I thought it might be overkill, if your back is still causing issues then it certainly could help.

let us know what you decide to do bro