I just found this:
Q: What about the relationship between methylated compounds and liver toxicity? How significant is the threat they pose; is it overrated, or not emphasized enough??
Will Brink: I have not personally heard of increased liver values, but it would not surprise me. Of course increased liver values from oral steroids are as a rule overrated anyway, and usually go back to normal post cycle. This does not mean people should ignore increased liver values from the use of any steroid, or other medication, but as a rule, increased liver values are not an indication of liver damage when it comes to oral steroid use, whether it be andros or illegal steroids.
Par Deus: I think the dangers are overstated, as with about anything, but the potential for them to contribute to problems definitely seems to be there. If you do not have other predisposing factors, it probably would not be a problem, especially if appropriate caution were taken with dosing, adjunctive supplements such as NAC, silymarin, etc. are used, and enzyme levels are monitored, but most people do not do this. A large % of people treat these potent drugs like they were little more than creatine or vitamin C. As long as the companies are not misleading (which of course many are), I think that it should be the consumer’s responsibility if he or she wants to be a dumb****. But obviously our paternalistic government does not view it this way, not with the infantile masses, crying to be taken care of.
Patrick Arnold: The medical literature makes it very clear that the liver toxicity from methylated steroids is significant. Cases of benign and malignant tumors, and more commonly peliosis hepatitis (formation of blood filled cysts in the liver), related to use of these compounds has been widely reported.
One must understand of course that the development of these ailments is very rare in individuals with healthy livers. However, a substantial amount of people have compromised liver function, or pre-existing liver disease, and are totally unaware of it because individuals with such conditions are often asymptomatic. When one of these people starts abusing a methylated AAS they put themselves at risk for the development of one of the aforementioned serious liver disorders.
In addition to these potentially life threatening liver diseases, there is also the issue of adverse effects upon blood lipids. The usage of 17alpha-alkylated steroids is strongly linked to elevated total cholesterol, and decreased HDL cholesterol. Users should be aware of this, and if one has pre-existing blood lipid problems (high cholesterol) they probably should avoid these compounds.
Bruce Kneller: What liver toxicity? Has it been proven? Show me a study that shows methyldienolone or methyl-1-testosterone is liver toxic. Is it anywhere in any peer reviewed, referred journal? Yeah, hormones that are 17-aa'ed have been sometimes linked to transient rises in liver transaminase levels. So what? Tylenol and Jack Daniels have been linked to the same ****ing thing. This liver toxicity issue is way overblown. It is like an urban legend. Many pro bodybuilders use upwards of a gram of methylated steroidals per week. Are any of them dying of fulminant hepatic failure? Are any of them needing liver allografts? Are there hundreds of write-ups in journals about bodybuilders showing up in emergency rooms with clinical signs of yellow jaundice? The answer of course is "no". Used in moderation, methylated hormones are probably no more dangerous than Tylenol or a shot of Stolichnaya.
Obviously, you would agree with Bruce Kneller's argument.
I'm not willing to concede the point just yet. I respect PA immensely.
