Last Cycle Critique! (Msten/DMZ vs Tren/DMZ)

[ODoyle99]

Alright yall, one last critique before I start stock piling everything I'll need. Here's the two options:

Msten 20/20/20/20/0/0
DMZ 30/30/45/45/45-60/45-60
Trest or dermacrine throughout

vs

Trenavar 60/60/60/60/60/60 OR 90/90/90/90/0/0
DMZ 30/30/45/45/45-60/45-60
Trest or dermacrine throughout



And of course support supps throughout cycle and PCT. (PCT will include Nolva 20/20/10/10 + natty test booster)


Thoughts?


EDIT: I have experience with cycles and the goal for this cycle will be adding mass (strength would be nice, of course..but mass is the primary goal)

 

[Mystere3]

I'd go tren/dmz.

 

[ODoyle99]

I'd go tren/dmz.

Cool. Never used trenavar (have experience with dmz though) before so quick questions:
Which dosing would you suggest? 60 mg/day for 6 weeks or 90 mg/day for the first (or last) 4? Or should I just do 60 mg/day for 4 weeks?

Any new concerns to be aware about with tren? I always have nolva on hand in case gyno presents, but should I run an AI throughout the cycle? I think dermacrine has an AI in it, would that be sufficient?


Other opinions?

 

[Mystere3]

60 mg for 6 weeks. Run inhibit p with it.

 

[ODoyle99]

Awesome so this is the complete cycle so far:

Trenavar 60/60/60/60/60/60
DMZ 30/30/45/45/45-60/45-60 (Dosage last two weeks will depend on sides)
Dermacrine 3 pumps/day
Inhibit P 1-2 caps/day
AI Sports Cycle Support

PCT
Nolva 20/20/10/10
Test Booster for 4 weeks
AI Sports Cycle Support

Look good?

 

[Mystere3]

Tudca 500 mg/day.

 

[ODoyle99]

Tudca 500 mg/day.

Could that replace AI Sports Cycle Support? Could do Tudca + something like GNC Liver Support.

 

[Mystere3]

Tudca and cel cycle assist.

 

[fueledpassion]

NAC is good too.

I MIGHT have anout Tren on hand to get to 90mg for the last 2 or 3 weeks though...

 

[ODoyle99]

NAC is good too.

I MIGHT have anout Tren on hand to get to 90mg for the last 2 or 3 weeks though...

So you agree with tren/dmz over msten/dmz?

 

[fueledpassion]

So you agree with tren/dmz over msten/dmz?

Yes

 

[ODoyle99]

Tudca and cel cycle assist.

Yes

Thanks for the help yall! Starting to get everything together.

Quick question though, I know if gyno were to be an issue I'd have to use caber rather than nolva due to it being prolactin-induced. The only caber I've found though is super, super expensive. Would letro or anything else work? (I'd rather have something on hand and not need it then need it and not have it).

 

[Mystere3]

Prami would work.

 

[fueledpassion]

Thanks for the help yall! Starting to get everything together.

Quick question though, I know if gyno were to be an issue I'd have to use caber rather than nolva due to it being prolactin-induced. The only caber I've found though is super, super expensive. Would letro or anything else work? (I'd rather have something on hand and not need it then need it and not have it).

I dont think u'd get gyno myself unless u had lots of estrogen floatin around. Prami works but stomach will likely be upset if u dose it too high.

 

[ion26]

You need some inhibit-P.

 

[fueledpassion]

You need some inhibit-P.

I just took a dose of that myself. I use it for sleep purposes though.

 

[ODoyle99]

Both prami and cyber are out of my price range. If I take inhibit-p (I think there's also stuff in dermacrine that will be mildly helpful) I should be okay from prolactin induced gyno? Or should I play it safe and stay away from trenavar?

 

[permabulk]

2 most methylated phs ran at a high dose? Lol. I'd stick with dmz/tren bro.

 

[Mystere3]

Both prami and cyber are out of my price range. If I take inhibit-p (I think there's also stuff in dermacrine that will be mildly helpful) I should be okay from prolactin induced gyno? Or should I play it safe and stay away from trenavar?

You should be fine at 60. I honestly don't have problens on real tren so I think you'd be fine with trenavar.

 

[ODoyle99]

Awesome, appreciate the help man.

One LAST question, promise. I'm gonna start making it common practice to run an AI throughout my cycles. Can I run letro with trenavar or is that another no-no?

 

[Mystere3]

You shouldn't run letro with a cycle ever unless you're injecting high dose trest with dbol or smth.

 

[ODoyle99]

You shouldn't run letro with a cycle ever unless you're injecting high dose trest with dbol or smth.

Even if it's just .25 mg/day? What AI would you suggest for preventing gyno (rather than treating it once it pops up)?

 

[Mystere3]

Aromasin or formeron

 

[Driven2lift]

Aromasin or formeron

This.

OTC best option is Formeron

http://www.orbitnutrition.com/cart/black-lion-research-formeron.html

Out if stock I know but back very soon

 

[ODoyle99]

Aromasin or formeron

Thanks man, think I'm gonna go with aromasin. That'll PREVENT gyno on cycle, right? Tired of waiting for it to pop up and treating it then.
Should I start it 2 weeks before the start of my cycle to let it build up in my system or just start it the same time as the dmz and trenavar?

 

[Mystere3]

Start it on cycle. 12.5 mg E3D is a good dose. Yes it'll prevent gyno.

 

[ODoyle99]

Start it on cycle. 12.5 mg E3D is a good dose. Yes it'll prevent gyno.

Awesome. The AI will prevent even prolactin-induced gyno? And if I'm running an AI from day 1 will inhibit-P be necessary/beneficial at all?
How would you dose arimidex?

Seriously appreciate all your help man. I don't have much experience with AIs or prolactin and you've been immensely helpful

 

[stann123]

Start it on cycle. 12.5 mg E3D is a good dose. Yes it'll prevent gyno.

Wouldn't adex be better on cycle? cheaper and longer half life

 

[Mystere3]

Awesome. The AI will prevent even prolactin-induced gyno? And if I'm running an AI from day 1 will inhibit-P be necessary/beneficial at all?
How would you dose arimidex?

Seriously appreciate all your help man. I don't have much experience with AIs or prolactin and you've been immensely helpful

No, AI will only affect estrogen-related gyno. I have never used adex, I'd use aromasin but it's up to you.

 

[ODoyle99]

No, AI will only affect estrogen-related gyno. I have never used adex, I'd use aromasin but it's up to you.

dammit. I imagine I'm prone to gyno and I'm cautious in this arena. Since I can't get my hands on caber I'll forego the trenavar. *sigh* I was really looking forward to that

 

[Mystere3]

Why do you think you're prone to gyno?

 

[reps4jesus]

2 most methylated phs ran at a high dose? Lol. I'd stick with dmz/tren bro.

Define "most methylated"? That's a common stack. If OP wants mass then methylstenbolone is a great option.

 

[ODoyle99]

Why do you think you're prone to gyno?

I've been getting gyno on all my cycles lately. Most recently was epistane, gyno didn't show up until after the cycle and before that I got gyno in the middle of methadrol. Never had any gyno during puberty or anything like that, but recently it's been on all my cycles

Define "most methylated"? That's a common stack. If OP wants mass then methylstenbolone is a great option.

That's what I was thinking. If I don't do the trenavar out of fear of prolactin gyno (and no way to treat it) then I'll do the msten/dmz combo and stick to msten only the first 4 weeks

 

[permabulk]

legal wize most methylated ph's. msten isn't very good imo I've ran two brands of it, deca sten by warrior labs and other by anabolic technologies both gave me **** ton of acne and serious blood pressure issues i was having like 4 nose bleeds everyday around week 2-3 until i started taking hawthorn berry.

 

[reps4jesus]

legal wize most methylated ph's. msten isn't very good imo I've ran two brands of it, deca sten by warrior labs and other by anabolic technologies both gave me **** ton of acne and serious blood pressure issues i was having like 4 nose bleeds everyday around week 2-3 until i started taking hawthorn berry.

Well it just sounds like you didn't take precautions, and you don't react well to the compound but made the wise decision to run it again.
You also could have lowered the dose.
hawthorn berry causes an initial bp spike so that must have been nice when you already had high bp.

Really dude?

 

[permabulk]

really what? i solved my problem, it has the potential to raise it, nothing is 100% i lowered my dose and started taking hawthorn berry and cut down on my sodium, i was just saying what msten did for me. not a goddamn thing maybe 5pounds and 10lb increase in each lift.

 

[reps4jesus]

You just seem irresponsible judging by the posts i have seen from you thus far. Many of your replies are either incorrect or irrelevant. Obviously OP knows the risks of a cycle, and most people get great results from msten regardless of the sides. OP wants mass, and msten is great for mass if your diet is on point.