Is 200mg/week TRT enough to add muscle?

[BJE]

My doctor has increased my test cyp dose from 100 to 150 then to 200 per week. Though I realize it matters what effect the dose has on your testosterone level, should one expect to get boost in muscle mass at 200 per week or would it take a much higher dose?

 

[FL3X MAGNUM]

You could see results depending on how your body responds to it.
I know a guy that gets better gains on 250mg/week than I get at 500.

 

[The Matrix]

If thyroid, sleep hygiene adrenals e2 and mainly digestion is not optimal does not matter how much you take one will not get true benefits. I see it on a daily basis from people

 

[napalm]

I've put on ~20 lbs of decent mass in the 1 1/2 yrs I've been on trt. My dose has never been higher than 150/week, and is now 60 every 4 days. If you train hard and eat big, there's no doubt you'll put on some muscle.

And IMO, anything higher than 200/week isn't trt, it's a mini cycle.

The question is, what were your levels at 100/150 per week? If that wasn't getting you into the thousands, something else is going on.

150/week had me in the 1100's - waaaay too high for me...

 

[BJE]

My trough level at 150 per week was 276. My trough level at 200 is at 501. I don't know what my peak level is.

 

[napalm]

My trough level at 150 per week was 276. My trough level at 200 is at 501. I don't know what my peak level is.

My friend, there's something else going on. Is your trt through a pcp or endo?

 

[BJE]

My friend, there's something else going on. Is your trt through a pcp or endo?

An endo, but he's not too interested in TRT. I am switching to my regular physician in order to get more personalized care.

 

[napalm]

My trough level at 150 per week was 276. My trough level at 200 is at 501. I don't know what my peak level is.

How long after injection is the trough?

 

[BJE]

How long after injection is the trough?

I am injecting IM weekly. The tests were done on injection day before injecting.

 

[napalm]

I am injecting IM weekly. The tests were done on injection day before injecting.

Hmm, I don't think you need to increase your dose, I think you need to inject more frequently. I went from weekly injections to every 3 days for a while, now I'm every 4 days. The benefit is that you never really have a trough. Much more stable levels, and I'll bet you a dollar if you went to 75 (or less) every 3-4 days things would level out for you...

 

[BJE]

Hmm, I don't think you need to increase your dose, I think you need to inject more frequently. I went from weekly injections to every 3 days for a while, now I'm every 4 days. The benefit is that you never really have a trough. Much more stable levels, and I'll bet you a dollar if you went to 75 (or less) every 3-4 days things would level out for you...

I have tried sub q and IM once a week, twice a week, every three days, every other day and every day. It's true that I had a higher trough on more frequent injections, but I feel better now than I have felt ever on TRT. I am also using HCG at a dose of 250IU on each of the two days before injection. This should help raise the trough level. When I tested I did not use the HCG before because I wanted to find out what the test cyp by itself was doing. Probably next time I'll do the HCG injections before the test to see what my true trough is.

I think that with more frequent injections I didn't have a trough but also I didn't have a peak, and I don't think my level was ever high enough to feel well. I have not done more frequent injections on 200 per week.

 

[napalm]

I have tried sub q and IM once a week, twice a week, every three days, every other day and every day. It's true that I had a higher trough on more frequent injections, but I feel better now than I have felt ever on TRT. I am also using HCG at a dose of 250IU on each of the two days before injection. This should help raise the trough level. When I tested I did not use the HCG before because I wanted to find out what the test cyp by itself was doing. Probably next time I'll do the HCG injections before the test to see what my true trough is.

I think that with more frequent injections I didn't have a trough but also I didn't have a peak, and I don't think my level was ever high enough to feel well. I have not done more frequent injections on 200 per week.

Then I'm out of ideas, you need to find an endo that has a sizable trt practice.

60 every 4 days puts me from 700-900.

Good luck...

Edit: and I'm back to thinking something else is going on...

 

[FireRescue]

HCG will have a slight bump in T and also some HCG users report a better sense of well being while using HCG.

 

[texastea]

If thyroid, sleep hygiene adrenals e2 and mainly digestion is not optimal does not matter how much you take one will not get true benefits. I see it on a daily basis from people

Hygiene?

 

[BJE]

If thyroid, sleep hygiene adrenals e2 and mainly digestion is not optimal does not matter how much you take one will not get true benefits. I see it on a daily basis from people

However, I don't believe any of these things would effect the blood test results if you are injecting.

 

[BJE]

HCG will have a slight bump in T and also some HCG users report a better sense of well being while using HCG.

I've been using HCG for about two years. Dr. Crisler recommends that when on weekly injections that you do the HCG one and two days before injection. This timing he says gives a boost of natural testosterone just when the injected testosterone is running low.

Another benefit of HCG is fuller heavier testicles. When I'm not using HCG my testicles stay pulled up tight to my body. They don't hang even after a hot shower. On HCG they hang low as usual.

 

[The Matrix]

Adrenal imbalances will chew testosterone up quickly. Pmgamer aka phil has seen this happen numerous times in labs when trt was the same dosages. There is a reason you are chewing it up. Low shbg could be numerous things

 

[BJE]

Adrenal imbalances will chew testosterone up quickly. Pmgamer aka phil has seen this happen numerous times in labs when trt was the same dosages. There is a reason you are chewing it up. Low shbg could be numerous things

I have high SHBG. In my most recent test my SHBG was 44.4. Historically it has been in the 65-75 range. As my testosterone level has gone up my SHBG level has dropped although its still quite high.

 

[lboston]

Adrenal imbalances will chew testosterone up quickly. Pmgamer aka phil has seen this happen numerous times in labs when trt was the same dosages. There is a reason you are chewing it up. Low shbg could be numerous things

Matrix- how would one help treat adrenal issues?

 

[The Matrix]

Find the reason why through detailed history. Its very simple. I done seversl hundreds of these over the years. Do them in my sleep

 

[lboston]

Find the reason why through detailed history. Its very simple. I done seversl hundreds of these over the years. Do them in my sleep

I'm sure it's from drinking a ton of coffee and pre-workout drinks full of stims.

Any suggestions?

 

[BJE]

I for one have never used caffeine or any other stimulant.

 

[fame126]

i was just prescribed 200mg test cyp injections every two weeks. I've been readin Lot that this will have me on a roller coaster of emotions,energy etc...... i figured I'd ask people who have been through this. what are your experiences?

 

[lboston]

i was just prescribed 200mg test cyp injections every two weeks. I've been readin Lot that this will have me on a roller coaster of emotions,energy etc...... i figured I'd ask people who have been through this. what are your experiences?

Best is 80-100mg / week split in to two injections if you are injecting yourself. It will most certainly minimize the emotional sides.

 

[FireRescue]

Best is 80-100mg / week split in to two injections if you are injecting yourself. It will most certainly minimize the emotional sides.

If you are prescribed 200 EOW this is a much better type of administration.

 

[kisaj]

Take that 200 and split that into 100mg ew at minimum. Ideally, you'll be able to do 50mg e3.5d. That seems to be the sweet spot for a lot of us.

 

[fame126]

Take that 200 and split that into 100mg ew at minimum. Ideally, you'll be able to do 50mg e3.5d. That seems to be the sweet spot for a lot of us.

it's actually every three weeks i just read directions. does this change anything?

 

[lboston]

it's actually every three weeks i just read directions. does this change anything?

That's not much...are you self-injecting?

 

[fame126]

That's not much...are you self-injecting?

my wife is gonna do it. i have 2 refills left

 

[kisaj]

it's actually every three weeks i just read directions. does this change anything?

If you are self injecting then you have the ability to control the protocol. The only issue is that 200mg every 3 weeks breaks down to just under 70mg a week, which is not much. That is going to be on the low side weekly. It is 1000x better than the hormonal rollercoaster you would be on with that incredibly dated 3week recommendation.

 

[fame126]

can i take a test booster along with the injections to make up difference of weekly dose ?

 

[kisaj]

No. A test booster is designed to help assist natural test production (and they generally suck at that). You are no longer using your natural test production once you go on TRT and dependent on exogenous.

 

[Matthersby]

I know I'm a little late in the game here, but I can attest Matrix has a valid point. When I first came back around after an injury and a ton of health problems, I was about to go on TRT and was on 5 meds just to treat symptoms of hyperthyroidism. After testing my DNA, and consulting with a clinical nutritionist, making some changes, I'm off 4 of them and my test went from 258 to 840 and I'm 35 and have cycled many times.

 

[vassille]

I know I'm a little late in the game here, but I can attest Matrix has a valid point. When I first came back around after an injury and a ton of health problems, I was about to go on TRT and was on 5 meds just to treat symptoms of hyperthyroidism. After testing my DNA, and consulting with a clinical nutritionist, making some changes, I'm off 4 of them and my test went from 258 to 840 and I'm 35 and have cycled many times.

Valid point.

How did you end up with hyperthyrodism?

 

[Matthersby]

Genetic predisposition. But I wonder what AAS contributed. It did seem to get worse soon after I ended a 12 week cycle.

 

[lboston]

Genetic predisposition. But I wonder what AAS contributed. It did seem to get worse soon after I ended a 12 week cycle.

Hyper is the over active thyroid, correct?

 

[Matthersby]

Correct, typically resulting in lower TSH values and an elevated Total T4. However, Low T4 with low TSH can sometimes indicate a pituitary problem. There is no way, despite studies on aas and endocrine function, to know for sure how it will effect an individual. They could be predisposed to pituitary or thyroid disorder or be borderline, and introducing an exogenous hormone was all it needed to throw it out of balance.

 

[lboston]

Correct, typically resulting in lower TSH values and an elevated Total T4. However, Low T4 with low TSH can sometimes indicate a pituitary problem. There is no way, despite studies on aas and endocrine function, to know for sure how it will effect an individual. They could be predisposed to pituitary or thyroid disorder or be borderline, and introducing an exogenous hormone was all it needed to throw it out of balance.

What are symptoms?

 

[Matthersby]

Anxiety, high blood pressure and appetite loss. However, after reading every study I could get my hands on, I don't believe aas were a major factor in my hyperthyroidism. Here's a great read on the subject, you'll have to google it because it's on another bb site:

The Effects of Anabolic Steroids on Thyroid Function
by Karl Hoffman

 

[lboston]

Anxiety, high blood pressure and appetite loss. However, after reading every study I could get my hands on, I don't believe aas were a major factor in my hyperthyroidism. Here's a great read on the subject, you'll have to google it because it's on another bb site:

The Effects of Anabolic Steroids on Thyroid Function
by Karl Hoffman

Thanks. I appreciate you sharing. I'll definitely check it out.

 

[vassille]

Genetic predisposition. But I wonder what AAS contributed. It did seem to get worse soon after I ended a 12 week cycle.

Interesting, I felt that mine slowed down on AAS however it seems to have sped up after I did a small T3 supplemetation for a while and after cessation of the T3 I cant eat enough food to keep up my weight.
I have to check my thyroid again to see what happened.
I know that HGH slows it down too

 

[fame126]

can i run a 4 week ph cycle of epi while being on 200mg test cyp every 3 weeks?

 

[lboston]

can i run a 4 week ph cycle of epi while being on 200mg test cyp every 3 weeks?

I'd be much more concerned with getting my protocol squared away than I would be worrying about running a cycle...

 

[kisaj]

Truth.

 

[willib]

what about 128 ,just found out

 

[kisaj]

In what context? What does 128 mean?