High Hct and Hb after only 6 weeks

CroLifter

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Greetings everyone,
I wanted to post here because this section is more oriented towards health than the Anabolics section.
Basically, I am 9 weeks into blasting 500 mg/wk Test E and for the last 2 weeks I added in Mast E at 300 mg/wk.

2.5 weeks into my blast I had bloodwork done and these were the results

Hemoglobin 166
Hematocrit 0.477
RBC count 5.37

reference ranges should be the same as for the latter as the units are the same

And today's bloodwork (6.5 weeks have passed) says

Hemoglobin 176 ref 138 - 175
Hematocrit 0.53 ref 0.415 - 0.53
RBC count 5.67 ref 4.34 - 5.72

My blood pressure hovers at around 130/80 (i control e2 and i am not bloated)

I mean, I expected these numbers to go up, say, hct from 0.477 to maybe 0.5 in 6 weeks but this seems like too much. Also, I live at 400 feet elevation.
I will go ahead and donate blood because I have some events coming up in 4 weeks and I want my endurance to recover by then and dont want to risk waiting another 4 weeks as that would probably see my hematocrit at 0.55 or 0.56 and hemoglobin at least at 180.

Important thing to note is that the latter bloodwork was done in the morning and the former was in the afternoon. However, I drank 2x 200ml cups of water about 30 min before I had my blood drawn todays and also reckon that I have been pretty well hydrated since I had to get up to pee during the night and again in the morning. I purposefully hydrated myself a bit more yesterday evening, so these readings should be accurate and not based on dehydration after a night's sleep.

I also seem to have read that people are saying that no matter whether they draw blood in the morning or in the evening, it doesn't effect their hct and hb readings. Is this correct?
Provided that you are not extremely dehydrated, like seriously dehydrated, being in the sun all day sweating like crazy and having nothing to drink.

Also, my friends have been telling me I am red in the face from time to time. And I do have minor, dull headaches here and there. Oh, and, this might be just me and my mind playing tricks on me, but it seemed that on today's blood draw it took a little bit longer for the test tube to fill up with blood compared to previous blood draws. And it was the same sized needle every time.

I dont know. If it looks like duck, if it quacks like a duck...

So what do you more experienced guys think? Is this normal rise in hb and hct in only 6.5 weeks considering my dose (500 test e and for the past 2 weeks 500 test e and 300 mast e)?

I only have 3.5 more weeks of this blast and I considered waiting to give blood but like a said, I am not prepared to roll the dice that much.
 
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Brain5ick

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Go donate blood, take a regular aspirin once a day for a week with fish oil, after that use 81mg aspirin with fish oil daily. Get labs done after a week or two from donating/starting this routine. Should help a bit. Cut my H&H down by a good bit after a week, considering I didn’t donate at all.
 

CroLifter

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Go donate blood, take a regular aspirin once a day for a week with fish oil, after that use 81mg aspirin with fish oil daily. Get labs done after a week or two from donating/starting this routine. Should help a bit. Cut my H&H down by a good bit after a week, considering I didn’t donate at all.
I am going to donate today, but aspirin? Doesn't it cause gastrointestinal bleeding? How else could it thin the blood?

Good point about fish oil though.

I thought older guys were more prone to rise in hb and hct and this really surprised the hell out of me. But, I am eating lots of cerals (oats, wheat porridge) so that could be a factor too (they contain lots of iron, and supplementing with iron has been shown to accelerate hemoglobin recovery after blood donation).
 

Brain5ick

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I am going to donate today, but aspirin? Doesn't it cause gastrointestinal bleeding? How else could it thin the blood?

Good point about fish oil though.

I thought older guys were more prone to rise in hb and hct and this really surprised the hell out of me. But, I am eating lots of cerals (oats, wheat porridge) so that could be a factor too (they contain lots of iron, and supplementing with iron has been shown to accelerate hemoglobin recovery after blood donation).
Aspirin will thin your blood out, you’ll be fine man. Drink lots of water as well.
 

CroLifter

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So I went in and gave a pint of blood. Best decision I could have made atm. My ears don't ring anymore and most importantly, it is good to be able to breathe like a normal human being and not like a suffocating fish.

From your experience, by how many points does giving a pint of blood lower your hematocrit value? If my calculation is correct, it should be down by about 0.07 (so ideally to about 0.46). But I have hunch which is telling me it will not go down that much.

I would like to keep my hematocrit under or @ 0.45, but with the amount of muscle mass I am carrying, and being on exogenous T, it seems like a pipedream. Even more so as it has been hanging around 0.47 before I touched anything, with total T in high 300s.
 

Brain5ick

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So I went in and gave a pint of blood. Best decision I could have made atm. My ears don't ring anymore and most importantly, it is good to be able to breathe like a normal human being and not like a suffocating fish.

From your experience, by how many points does giving a pint of blood lower your hematocrit value? If my calculation is correct, it should be down by about 0.07 (so ideally to about 0.46). But I have hunch which is telling me it will not go down that much.

I would like to keep my hematocrit under or @ 0.45, but with the amount of muscle mass I am carrying, and being on exogenous T, it seems like a pipedream. Even more so as it has been hanging around 0.47 before I touched anything, with total T in high 300s.
I’ve been getting that fish out of water feeling a little here and there lately. I haven’t donated in a long time and I’m about to donate soon but probably .05 is what you’d be looking at.
Take the aspirin bro. Trust me. It helps a ton.
 

CroLifter

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I’ve been getting that fish out of water feeling a little here and there lately. I haven’t donated in a long time and I’m about to donate soon but probably .05 is what you’d be looking at.
Take the aspirin bro. Trust me. It helps a ton.
Man for me it was a sure sign of thick blood. It is no joke. Go ahead and donate.

I will look into aspirin.


Oh, and just a little anecdote. First of all, they had to stab me 3 times in the finger to get some blood to pour out (for hemoglobin test with copper sulfate).
Secondly, I remember lying down and having the needle inserted and about 3 minutes later comes another guy and boom, he is done like 3-5 minutes before me. So obviously it took much longer than normal for me to finish giving a pint.
 

CroLifter

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I should also add that I was waking up every morning with numb arm(s), and recently, even one of the legs would go numb. Its gone now.

So things were getting pretty bad.
 
dillface02241

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Greetings everyone,
I wanted to post here because this section is more oriented towards health than the Anabolics section.
Basically, I am 9 weeks into blasting 500 mg/wk Test E and for the last 2 weeks I added in Mast E at 300 mg/wk.

2.5 weeks into my blast I had bloodwork done and these were the results

Hemoglobin 166
Hematocrit 0.477
RBC count 5.37

reference ranges should be the same as for the latter as the units are the same

And today's bloodwork (6.5 weeks have passed) says

Hemoglobin 176 ref 138 - 175
Hematocrit 0.53 ref 0.415 - 0.53
RBC count 5.67 ref 4.34 - 5.72

My blood pressure hovers at around 130/80 (i control e2 and i am not bloated)

I mean, I expected these numbers to go up, say, hct from 0.477 to maybe 0.5 in 6 weeks but this seems like too much. Also, I live at 400 feet elevation.
I will go ahead and donate blood because I have some events coming up in 4 weeks and I want my endurance to recover by then and dont want to risk waiting another 4 weeks as that would probably see my hematocrit at 0.55 or 0.56 and hemoglobin at least at 180.

Important thing to note is that the latter bloodwork was done in the morning and the former was in the afternoon. However, I drank 2x 200ml cups of water about 30 min before I had my blood drawn todays and also reckon that I have been pretty well hydrated since I had to get up to pee during the night and again in the morning. I purposefully hydrated myself a bit more yesterday evening, so these readings should be accurate and not based on dehydration after a night's sleep.

I also seem to have read that people are saying that no matter whether they draw blood in the morning or in the evening, it doesn't effect their hct and hb readings. Is this correct?
Provided that you are not extremely dehydrated, like seriously dehydrated, being in the sun all day sweating like crazy and having nothing to drink.

Also, my friends have been telling me I am red in the face from time to time. And I do have minor, dull headaches here and there. Oh, and, this might be just me and my mind playing tricks on me, but it seemed that on today's blood draw it took a little bit longer for the test tube to fill up with blood compared to previous blood draws. And it was the same sized needle every time.

I dont know. If it looks like duck, if it quacks like a duck...

So what do you more experienced guys think? Is this normal rise in hb and hct in only 6.5 weeks considering my dose (500 test e and for the past 2 weeks 500 test e and 300 mast e)?

I only have 3.5 more weeks of this blast and I considered waiting to give blood but like a said, I am not prepared to roll the dice that much.

I have seen this with some of my older buddies (40's and 50's), but not so much with the younger guys, they tend to handle test just fine. When my HCT gets that high, it's hard to catch my breath so every 20-30 min or so I have to take a deep breath. Both my primary doctors were not overly concerned when my HCT hit 53. With that said, a lot of folks will tell you you're on your deathbed. I hate telling you this, but I would run out your cycle, keep a monitor on your HCT. Mine always goes down to baseline within three weeks to a month of not running test, although I only run 125mg a week.
 

CroLifter

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I have seen this with some of my older buddies (40's and 50's), but not so much with the younger guys, they tend to handle test just fine. When my HCT gets that high, it's hard to catch my breath so every 20-30 min or so I have to take a deep breath. Both my primary doctors were not overly concerned when my HCT hit 53. With that said, a lot of folks will tell you you're on your deathbed. I hate telling you this, but I would run out your cycle, keep a monitor on your HCT. Mine always goes down to baseline within three weeks to a month of not running test, although I only run 125mg a week.
3 more weeks to go and I am back to 125mg/week. It sucks, yeah, but it is what it is. Honestly i didn't think I would have complicarions of this degree. For example, masteron enanthate at over 200mg/week is giving me anxiety and panic attacks, that damn feeling like something is clamping down on my chest.
Been to the gym few hours ago (56 hours post donation) and it seems as if I lost almost a month worth of progress. I hope i will recover quickly.

I was thinking about looking into milder ànd longer blasts, say 300mg test and 200mg mast per week but i am pretty sure that would drive my hematocrit up too, just slower.

My frail body with its narrow ribcage just isn't meant to be carrying this amount of muscle I guess.

@dillface02241 you say you only run 125 mg/week, is that lifetime trt or do you come off?

I am under 25 and ever since i have been 18 years old, my natty test has been in 300s and 400s, with low to mid 300s coming up in the last year or two. As if my body rejects having testosterone. I am officially pissed.

I dont know, if this persists being an issue, i will have to resort to sarms alongside mminimal trt dosage of test.
 
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dillface02241

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3 more weeks to go and I am back to 125mg/week. It sucks, yeah, but it is what it is. Honestly i didn't think I would have complicarions of this degree. For example, masteron enanthate at over 200mg/week is giving me anxiety and panic attacks, that damn feeling like something is clamping down on my chest.
Been to the gym few hours ago (56 hours post donation) and it seems as if I lost almost a month worth of progress. I hope i will recover quickly.

I was thinking about looking into milder ànd longer blasts, say 300mg test and 200mg mast per week but i am pretty sure that would drive my hematocrit up too, just slower.

My frail body with its narrow ribcage just isn't meant to be carrying this amount of muscle I guess.

@dillface02241 you say you only run 125 mg/week, is that lifetime trt or do you come off?

I am under 25 and ever since i have been 18 years old, my natty test has been in 300s and 400s, with low to mid 300s coming up in the last year or two. As if my body rejects having testosterone. I am officially pissed.

I dont know, if this persists being an issue, i will have to resort to sarms alongside mminimal trt dosage of test.
Yes, that's my self prescribed TRT dose. My doc prescibes me 200 mg per week, but it's too much for me. 125 seems to be the sweet spot. I know what you mean by test being low in your 20's. Mine was the same way but I didn't get on TRT until a few years ago. It made such a huge difference in body composition. At 46, I now have an eight pack abs, something I could never get when I was younger and I lifted a lot.
 

CroLifter

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10 days post blood donation and I am officially pissed.

HCT: 0,513 ref(0,415-0,53)
Hb: 169 ref(138-175)
RBC count: 5,5 ref(4,34-5,72)

So obviously my body wants to put itself 6 feet under for me taking 500mg testosterone enanthate per week and 200mg of masteron enanthate

Could it be the masteron?

Ok, enough ranting, lets focus on constructive ideas.

1. Lower the testosterone to 125mg per week, that is a given

2. Another blood letting? I mean, i donated a pint 10 days ago and obviously they wont let me donate, however i might ask for therapeutic venepunction from my gp, even the doctor at blood donation ce ter suggested this when she saw my bloodwork ("i am going to let you donate tofay since your hemoglobin is only 1 point high, but otherwise you should go and do a therapeutic venepunction "(blood letting) )

So what do you suggest? Another blood letting ASAP?
 
Smont

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Those numbers are not that serious. Those are pretty normal elevations for being on cycle. If that small of a rise is freaking you out then don't use steroids
 
Smont

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You could try 4-6 week blasts with short esters and orals
 

CroLifter

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You could try 4-6 week blasts with short esters and orals
Hey man
4-6 week blasts are definitely interesting because i havent seen much gains past 6 weeks using test enanthate anyway! I am still gaining weight but now it seems that its going into fat. And strength has pretty much stalled.
first 6 weeks it was crazy, i blew up, week 4 i had 3d delts, 10kg to my bench every single week.

Would you suggest another phlebotomy though? While these numbers aint nothing crazy, hematocrit is on its way and it will be at 0.55 in few weeks, that is for sure.

edit: ignore the question above. I am going to get phlebotomy. I am getting dizzy at times again and feeling of pressure in my head, just like when my hct creeped up to 0.53.
Felt fine for about a week after blood donation.
 
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Brain5ick

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That’s crazy, donating helped me out a lot. I’ll post my labs on here later but I’m 100% in the clear on my third week of a 400mg blast of test and tbol. Liver enzymes are slightly elevated but not by much at all.
 

CroLifter

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And now the biggest problem is to find a medical proffesional willing to do phlebotomy for me as I obviously cant donate for over 2 months and my GP, of course, is useless.
I am thinking of going to the local medical college or highschool for nurses and asking someone there to do it for 20 bucks lol
 
Smont

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And now the biggest problem is to find a medical proffesional willing to do phlebotomy for me as I obviously cant donate for over 2 months and my GP, of course, is useless.
I am thinking of going to the local medical college or highschool for nurses and asking someone there to do it for 20 bucks lol
I honestly don't think you need one with your numbers but im no dr
 

CroLifter

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I want to do it as i am going on vacation so i wont be able to do it for the time being and want to have a peace of mind, and i know those numbers will climb higher as the test is built up in my system (even though i stopped injecting). Also, my head is feeling like its gonna pop and i am breathing like a fish out of water when i sit down.

Also, this high of a hematocrit is totally unnecessary as far as pumps and endurance go. I had way better pumps in the beginning when it was around 0.47 and also my endurance isnt any better than it was with hematocrit at 0.47 and hemoglobin at 166! If anything, my circulation seems worse as i get dizzy at times and i dont get good erections anymore, even though libido is great atm
 
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CroLifter

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Ok so I just did self phlebotomy, about 330ml. Tired of dealing with doctors. Might do another 150ml after a few days when plasma recuperates.
I mean this sh1t is so easy its not even worth breaking a sweat.
i do suggest having someone near you however in case you pass out, i am insane so i did it while i was alone.
 

Brain5ick

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Ok so I just did self phlebotomy, about 330ml. Tired of dealing with doctors. Might do another 150ml after a few days when plasma recuperates.
I mean this sh1t is so easy its not even worth breaking a sweat.
i do suggest having someone near you however in case you pass out, i am insane so i did it while i was alone.
You only live once 🤷🏻‍♂️. Take that in every way possible lmao.
 

CroLifter

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I just wanted to let you all know how much of a difference phlebotomy made. So on monday i pulled about 330ml and after every 100ml the damn 18g would clog, and after i would pull it out it would barely dribble out.
Today i went and pulled another 150ml and no sign of clogging and after i pulled the needle out, since i am doing everything with one hand obviously, it was like a small fountain (yes it is gross, sorry, but i cant describe it any other way). And the blood in the cup didnt clot after 15 minutes while on monday most of it has clotted in about 10 minutes.
So a mere 330ml made a tremendous difference when it comes to viscosity, all that sludge running through my veins cant be good.

And now i am going to convince my doc to give me a ferritin check.
 
muddertougher

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All your markers are fine, best of luck E-Docq
 

kisaj

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You may not want to run any cycles because you are paranoid. Those numbers are not an issue.
 
The Matrix

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Go donate blood, take a regular aspirin once a day for a week with fish oil, after that use 81mg aspirin with fish oil daily. Get labs done after a week or two from donating/starting this routine. Should help a bit. Cut my H&H down by a good bit after a week, considering I didn’t donate at all.
Word to the wise:
Watch your wording as this is considered prescribing medicine with out a license. Recommending an aspirin without known detailed history is very dangerous. I know you mean well but please beware in the future. The best to provide information legally is to share it from your own experience as you did in the last sentence.
 
Beau

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Look into nattokinase. I take it.

Your mileage may vary.
 
GreenMachineX

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You may not want to run any cycles because you are paranoid. Those numbers are not an issue.
I agree with this. I’m thinking his symptoms are from lowered e2 and just other steroid related symptoms, but not related to hematocrit. My numbers are around those all the time. But when my e2 goes too low, anxiety, paranoia, difficulty breathing, weak erections, weak gym pumps, dizziness...
 
Smont

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Ok so I just did self phlebotomy, about 330ml. Tired of dealing with doctors. Might do another 150ml after a few days when plasma recuperates.
I mean this sh1t is so easy its not even worth breaking a sweat.
i do suggest having someone near you however in case you pass out, i am insane so i did it while i was alone.
Just so you know, every time you let blood, if you go below what your body wants it will increase RBC as a means of homeostasis and the cycle begins. My rbc always gets a little high on cycle and comes down on its own
 
GreenMachineX

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Just so you know, every time you let blood, if you go below what your body wants it will increase RBC as a means of homeostasis and the cycle begins. My rbc always gets a little high on cycle and comes down on its own
How high does yours get on cycle?
 
Smont

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How high does yours get on cycle?
Depends on what I take. I got old bloodwork kicking around from a few different cycles. Test 500 and 50mg dbol at week 6 had my hemotacrit go from 49 to 54 so not a massive jump. Not sure where it was at week 16 but Was back in range 4 weeks post pct. 20 weeks on test eq had it to 57 and back in range after pct
 
Smont

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Keep in mind I really got no negatives from most gear other then oily skin all the time.
 

CroLifter

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Well I will try to keep it at or under 0.50, above that and i dont feel good plus my curculation gets worse, numb arms and even legs upon waking. I am on 125mg per week right now so i hope it wont climb higher anymore.
I am not going to use aspirin. I preffer to just bleed some.
 
GreenMachineX

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Depends on what I take. I got old bloodwork kicking around from a few different cycles. Test 500 and 50mg dbol at week 6 had my hemotacrit go from 49 to 54 so not a massive jump. Not sure where it was at week 16 but Was back in range 4 weeks post pct. 20 weeks on test eq had it to 57 and back in range after pct
No side effects with it at 57???
 
GreenMachineX

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Well I will try to keep it at or under 0.50, above that and i dont feel good plus my curculation gets worse, numb arms and even legs upon waking. I am on 125mg per week right now so i hope it wont climb higher anymore.
I am not going to use aspirin. I preffer to just bleed some.
I really don’t believe your getting sides from a hct of 51 or whatever. 55? Sure but it’s something else messing with you when your hct is around 50.
 
Smont

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Drinking a lot of water made the headaches go away
 
GreenMachineX

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What's the danger zone for this, I see all different ranges for normal, the highest normal I found was 52. At what number is it considered dangerous?
Like you’ve found, depends on who you ask. Mine was 58 a few years ago when I was on 160mg test per week. I don’t really know if I had symptoms except red hands and face sometimes, but that could’ve been unrelated as I have histamine issues too. And a few days before that blood test, I was at a fair and a spinning ride made me far more dizzy than it should’ve. I wanted to vomit for hours.

Some claim 52 is the “donate now” level, while others its 54. I can’t find anything concrete, but mine crept up to 54 another time and I had no idea. Mine was 50.9 last week and BP was 114/72. I’m pretty sure 60 is “about to stroke out”, but I don’t know what happens from 55-59.
 

CroLifter

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Just ordered an anti snoring mandibular advancement device.
Maybe it helps a bit (i snore a lot).
That is the thing, the heavier i get, the more i snore and make the problem worse.

@GreenMachineX i dont feel good with hct over 0.50. Buzzing in my ears and constant pressure in my head. Interesting how these go away after i phlebotomize my a$$.
Also a big one, i am waking up with numb arms. For exapmle i am lying in my bed now and just by holding my tablet on top of my abdomen with my left hand makes it go numb.
When hct was at 0.53-0.54, even legs would go numb during sleep.
 
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CroLifter

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So these 2 bloodworks were done 7 days apart. I may end up with a guiness world record for red blood cell production.

PicsArt_07-18-07.58.59.jpg

Zeljezo means iron btw, and as you can see, i am anemic from blood letting.
PicsArt_07-18-08.01.43.jpg

So my red blood cell count is creeping up real nice. Since i cant do a phlebotomy as i am anemic, do you suggest aspirin? I am currently only basting hcg, 750 iu eod for 20 days to kick start my nuts.
And i mean this is serious. My hct will be 0.55 in a matter of couple of weeks.
And also, started with caber (which i am scared sh1tless of) for this damn prolactin as it isnt going down.
 

CroLifter

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Which one is more important guys, rbc count or hematocrit?

If it is rbc count, then i am fucked. I am stuck. I cant do a phlebotpmy as i am iron deficient and yet my hct is rising rapidly.

I mean, is the hcg the culprit of rapidly increasing rbc count or is it iron supplementarion?

And when i lay down i feel kind of tingling in my legs, as if my circulation is not good. Can that be connected to the rbc count?
 
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GreenMachineX

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Which one is more important guys, rbc count or hematocrit?

If it is rbc count, then i am fucked. I am stuck. I cant do a phlebotpmy as i am iron deficient and yet my hct is rising rapidly.

I mean, is the hcg the culprit of rapidly increasing rbc count or is it iron supplementarion?

And when i lay down i feel kind of tingling in my legs, as if my circulation is not good. Can that be connected to the rbc count?
Man, your estrogen is crushed. Are you taking an AI at all? Your hct and red blood cells are fine right now. Drop to 100mg per week if you think it’s going to get higher. But that crushed estrogen is the source of your anxieties.

I don’t know what’s causing your tingling, but it’s not the hct. Maybe you have bad circulation too, but I don’t know. What I do know is your hct is fine and your symptoms aren’t the culprit at 51 hct like everyone has said.
 
GreenMachineX

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And I have wondered if hcg increases red blood cells as well, because when my hct got to 58, I was using 160mg test per week and hcg.
 

CroLifter

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And I have wondered if hcg increases red blood cells as well, because when my hct got to 58, I was using 160mg test per week and hcg.
I am blasting 750 iu of hcg eod. I have stopped all exogenous gear and am on my road to recovery.
Yeah, my hct is fine, i am worried about my rbc count though.

which value is a better representation of blood viscosity? Hematocrit or RBC count?
 
GreenMachineX

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I am blasting 750 iu of hcg eod. I have stopped all exogenous gear and am on my road to recovery.
Yeah, my hct is fine, i am worried about my rbc count though.

which value is a better representation of blood viscosity? Hematocrit or RBC count?
Hematocrit, Hemoglobin and platelets give the best representation in my opinion. I’d be using clomid, not hcg, if I were you.
 

CroLifter

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Hematocrit, Hemoglobin and platelets give the best representation in my opinion. I’d be using clomid, not hcg, if I were you.
clomid is the second phase.
3 weeks of hcg first.

platelets...you mean thrombocytes (responsible for clotting)?
they have been on the lower end throughout the cycle.
 

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