Hi Tech 1-Test and Dymethazine.

Eckoteer

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Will this make a good cutting cycle? Will I need anything else (other than PCT) like a test base? If so, what's recommended? Will standard DHEA (like Life Extension brand) work? I have read 1-Andro will give you bad lethargy without a test base.
 
KvanH

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If you want to use DHEA, then go for transdermal. Iconic's Dermacrine, Apex Hyperion and Iconic's DHEA are good options.

Transdermal 4-Andro would be even better, imo. I'm assuming you're not going to pin. Test is king of course.
 
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Dermacrine did nothing for me. Not putting it down as it obviously has worked for thousands
 

Eckoteer

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If you want to use DHEA, then go for transdermal. Iconic's Dermacrine, Apex Hyperion and Iconic's DHEA are good options.

Transdermal 4-Andro would be even better, imo. I'm assuming you're not going to pin. Test is king of course.
The Dymethazine is epiandro, will that help with the lethargy? I'm wanting to cut, isn't the 4-andro for bulking? I would use test but no longer know where to get it. I've found a lot of sites but not sure which ones can be trusted. Haven't used it in years.
 

Jeremyk1

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The Dymethazine is epiandro, will that help with the lethargy? I'm wanting to cut, isn't the 4-andro for bulking? I would use test but no longer know where to get it. I've found a lot of sites but not sure which ones can be trusted. Haven't used it in years.
Yeah it can. But with two suppressive compounds, neither of which convert to estrogen, you could run into low E. So you’d want the 4 or even plain DHEA, as suggested, to help that angle. Feel free to try without, but you may end up wishing you had some.
 
KvanH

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The Dymethazine is epiandro, will that help with the lethargy? I'm wanting to cut, isn't the 4-andro for bulking? I would use test but no longer know where to get it. I've found a lot of sites but not sure which ones can be trusted. Haven't used it in years.
Yes, Epiandro will help with energy levels, but many times the lethargy and other unwanted sides come from not having adequate amounts of sex hormones in your system, like estrogen. Epiandro doesn't convert to estro, but to DHT, which has some antiestrogenic properties and could even make things worse, estro wise.

I think people do 1-Andro + Epiandro runs and some do fine with it, but I would first and foremost stack something, that converts to estro (and/or test) with 1-Andro. Throwing Epiandro in the mix should make it even better.

There isn't many if any cutting and bulking compounds, diet determines that. Sure Epiandro and other dry compounds can make you look better on your cut, than dbol or something of that nature. But (unwanted) bloat is usually due to high estro levels and it's very rare for someone to suffer that side with 4-Andro.
 

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Yes, Epiandro will help with energy levels, but many times the lethargy and other unwanted sides come from not having adequate amounts of sex hormones in your system, like estrogen. Epiandro doesn't convert to estro, but to DHT, which has some antiestrogenic properties and could even make things worse, estro wise.

I think people do 1-Andro + Epiandro runs and some do fine with it, but I would first and foremost stack something, that converts to estro (and/or test) with 1-Andro. Throwing Epiandro in the mix should make it even better.

There isn't many if any cutting and bulking compounds, diet determines that. Sure Epiandro and other dry compounds can make you look better on your cut, than dbol or something of that nature. But (unwanted) bloat is usually due to high estro levels and it's very rare for someone to suffer that side with 4-Andro.
Thanks for your help. So, I can still loose fat with the 4-andro as long as I eat right? Would 1-andro, 4-andro, and epiandro be too much for my first prohormone cycle? I have cycled steroids but it's been 15 years. I am 39, 255lbs, if that matters.
 

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Yeah it can. But with two suppressive compounds, neither of which convert to estrogen, you could run into low E. So you’d want the 4 or even plain DHEA, as suggested, to help that angle. Feel free to try without, but you may end up wishing you had some.
When you say plain DHEA, like this...
Screenshot_20220927-091912_Chrome.jpg
 
KvanH

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Thanks for your help. So, I can still loose fat with the 4-andro as long as I eat right? Would 1-andro, 4-andro, and epiandro be too much for my first prohormone cycle? I have cycled steroids but it's been 15 years. I am 39, 255lbs, if that matters.
That is a classic Andro stack, not too much by any means, imo.

For the DHEA, I would prefer transdermal. Oral DHEA has a low bioavailability and a short half life.

You can of course cut fat while on 4-Andro. It doesn't change the laws of physics - calories in vs calories out - ya know 😉 I would assume the cutting to go better with 4-Andro in that stack, than without.

At 255 lbs, you're either quite tall, super jacked, or you have quite a bit to lose. If it's the last one, then you would probably be better off cutting natty at first for some time and when getting closer to finishing touches, then add PED's (if desired).
 

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That is a classic Andro stack, not too much by any means, imo.

For the DHEA, I would prefer transdermal. Oral DHEA has a low bioavailability and a short half life.

You can of course cut fat while on 4-Andro. It doesn't change the laws of physics - calories in vs calories out - ya know 😉 I would assume the cutting to go better with 4-Andro in that stack, than without.

At 255 lbs, you're either quite tall, super jacked, or you have quite a bit to lose. If it's the last one, then you would probably be better off cutting natty at first for some time and when getting closer to finishing touches, then add PED's (if desired).
Unfortunately, I'm the last one. I still have some fat to loose. I was 302, so I have lost almost 50lbs, but it's slowing down A LOT. If I continued to loose weight before trying the prohormones, do you recommend anything to help? The only problem is I have terrible anxiety I can't handle large amounts of caffeine or ephdra, so most diet supplements are a no go for me. Any suggestions?
 
KvanH

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Unfortunately, I'm the last one. I still have some fat to loose. I was 302, so I have lost almost 50lbs, but it's slowing down A LOT. If I continued to loose weight before trying the prohormones, do you recommend anything to help? The only problem is I have terrible anxiety I can't handle large amounts of caffeine or ephdra, so most diet supplements are a no go for me. Any suggestions?
First of all, how long have you been cutting? Any maintenance phases in between? If you've been cutting more, than 12-16 weeks straight, then you would most likelt benefit a lot from a maintenance phase, where you eat at a level where your BW doesn't go up or down. 8 weeks at minimun of that.

Apex Alchemy Ursa Major is my favorite supp to add to a cut. It's a transdermal Ursolic acid. A lot of info and talk can be found on here about it.

One stim free supp, that gets a lot of love is SNS Lean Edge. I'm currently on 5th week of cutting and I added Ursa Major last week and Lean Edge this week. It's my first try of Leand Edge, so no personal opinion yet.

Cort ontrol supps, like TD B-Aet and SNS Reduce XT are also popular additions to cutting phases.
 
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Eckoteer

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If you want to use DHEA, then go for transdermal. Iconic's Dermacrine, Apex Hyperion and Iconic's DHEA are good options.

Transdermal 4-Andro would be even better, imo. I'm assuming you're not going to pin. Test is king of course.
Something I meant to ask you earlier. Would 19-Norandro help with the lethargy effects of 1-andro, like the 4-andro does?
 
KvanH

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Something I meant to ask you earlier. Would 19-Norandro help with the lethargy effects of 1-andro, like the 4-andro does?
I don't think so, but am not completely sure. But I've been under the impression, that it's a crappy compound overall.
 

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Look at Hi Tech Carnislim and SNS Lean Edge, SNS Thermo Scorch.

I wouldn’t touch PH for what you’re aiming for. Too easy to get bloated, hungry and/or lethargic.
 
BCseacow83

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Look at Hi Tech Carnislim and SNS Lean Edge, SNS Thermo Scorch.

I wouldn’t touch PH for what you’re aiming for. Too easy to get bloated, hungry and/or lethargic.
I agree with Lean Edge and Thermo Scorch but nothing in 1/4-dhea or epiandro will make you bloated or hungry. Lethargic maybe.

OP look into the non-stim burners and maybe something like Ursa Major or Recomp20.
 

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I agree with Lean Edge and Thermo Scorch but nothing in 1/4-dhea or epiandro will make you bloated or hungry. Lethargic maybe.

OP look into the non-stim burners and maybe something like Ursa Major or Recomp20.
I have some Lean Edge, ReduceXT, and CLA. Should I add the Thermo Scorch or Recomp20 (or both) to it? I also have some epicatichin and turkesterone.
 
LeanEngineer

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I agree with Lean Edge and Thermo Scorch but nothing in 1/4-dhea or epiandro will make you bloated or hungry. Lethargic maybe.

OP look into the non-stim burners and maybe something like Ursa Major or Recomp20.
I would agree with this. Ursa Major has quit a bit of love on the forums. We carry Ursa Major over at Strong Supplement Shop as well.

 

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I would agree with this. Ursa Major has quit a bit of love on the forums. We carry Ursa Major over at Strong Supplement Shop as well.

Do you think ursolic acid in pill form would have the same effect as the transdermal?
 

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The bioavailability of oral Ursolic acid is very low. So maybe with a huge dose.
In my experience, it’s not even close. I dosed a boatload of oral ursolic acid years ago, I think over 1200mg. Didn’t notice anything. Apex Ursa was amazing at 4 pumps a day.
 

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