Good prohormones for a cut?

SR83

SR83

Member
To clarify any added size is a bonus, but my primary focus is maintaining muscle cutting bodyfat. I have lost almozt 20 so far but would like to lose even more
Started at 205-210 19-20%
Current stats
23y/o. 5'6. 186 lbs. approx 13-14% bf
I have used injectables. Test c, deca, oral anadrol and dbol

I just wanted to try prohormones
So far I have found dieselbolan, helladrol, katanadrol and epi-strong from mrsupps

Any advice would be helpful
 
A clean diet and cardio works wonders..... < these 2 things make you lean not the drugs you take. Unless your takin DNP if you don't eat clean you will not get lean, simple as that.

I'm sure it's not the answer your lookin for but it does work.
 
I would advice you on our new products about to hit the market but you are still young and perhaps focus on non-hormonal first. Just give it a bit of research because you can attack fatloss form many areas. You'd be surprised whats out there.
 
Trenavar 60ED.
T3
Clen/Albuterol/ECA

Personally I like Albuterol/ECA as Clen makes me shake b-a-a-a-a-d.

Ostarine is also a good between cycles.
 
Epi is great at sparing muscle during a cut.
 
Epistane and H-drol at mid dosages are easy on the liver and great for cutting with relatively low side effects! They're also fairly easy to find around, just google them and also whilst cutting, you also have the chance to pack on a couple/few pounds of muscle while losing a few bodyfat percentage. BUT If you'd really like to pack on some muscle and drop down to a 10% - ish bodyfat, I'd go with M-sten Rx (Methylstenbolone) and Epistane. I'm on a M-sten cycle now, in my first week and this stuff is amazing. By FAAAAAAR my favorite oral prohormone/designer steroid and even to take it a step further, it is DEFINITELY my favorite oral steroid ever created, surpassing dianabol, anavar and anadrol.
 
absolutely not. No methyl is "easy on the liver"
smh

Edit. Btw OP, when did prohormones become "old school hormones?".......wrong section
 
Do your homework brother, some methyls resist metabolic breakdown more than others causing more liver stress. H-drol is a prohormone causing some of the least side effects and very low stress on the liver, due to easy breakdown.
 
Nsutton15 said:
Do your homework brother, some methyls resist metabolic breakdown more than others causing more liver stress. H-drol is a prohormone causing some of the least side effects and very low stress on the liver, due to easy breakdown.
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Ohh no he didn't! Its on now!
 
Nsutton15 said:
Do your homework brother, some methyls resist metabolic breakdown more than others causing more liver stress. H-drol is a prohormone causing some of the least side effects and very low stress on the liver, due to easy breakdown.
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Using scientific words like "More," "Some," and "Easy"
How about some sources on your Bro Science? Let's see your blood work showing before and after of how halodrol is "very low stress on the liver"

You are an idiot. If you actually believe the retarded words you are telling others, you need to stop right now.
Please go back to the general section to talk about movies and race cars. You have no business being here.
 
Nsutton15 said:
I'm on a M-sten cycle now, in my first week and this stuff is amazing. By FAAAAAAR my favorite oral prohormone/designer steroid and even to take it a step further, it is DEFINITELY my favorite oral steroid ever created, surpassing dianabol, anavar and anadrol.
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Again, no. Raving about a compound's effectiveness in your first week.

Please make it stop.
 
Nsutton15 said:
BUT If you'd really like to pack on some muscle and drop down to a 10% - ish bodyfat, I'd go with M-sten Rx (Methylstenbolone) and Epistane.
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Really??????? Why don't you throw in halodrol as well since it is also 'easy on the liver?'
 
If you're not injecting reconstituted M1T into your ass cheeks everyday, you're doing it wrong. This is the ONLY verified broscience method of avoiding liver toxicity with methyls.

Some people, OP.
 
Yeah any methylated oral is bad for your liver. Some more then others but it's not negligible.....
 
wow....this thread took a shortcut to ****creek...

OK first things first:

OP....very few PHs arent worth their use IMO. The conversion rates of most PHs are very poor and they are made even less effective when they are not converted into the target/intended hormone. If you want to "cut" the best advice you can do is carb cycle and use HIT principles in your training. If your dead set on a suppliment to help, some of your better options are clen/T3 combo or smaller doses of GH frag.

now the next order of buisness, hepatotoxicity.

Sutton, bro there is no such thing as an "easy" 17aa compound on the liver. Even though the the cleave may exert less metabolic stress on the liver with compounds such as H-drol and M-sten (and in all reality M-sten is an active steroid in itself and not a PH, its actually more potent than SD and is equally hepatotoxic) does not mean they are easier on the liver. Methylation is used in these class of drugs during the manufacturing process because it is easy and cheap to produce. Where the real danger enlies with any methylated compound isnt neccesarily with the parent compound, rather with its metabolites. There are certain methyl compounds (fluoxymesteron comes to mind) that have metabolites that are upwards of 7 to 8 times more toxic than the parent compound. Human physiology doesnt allow for the metabolism or utilization of the methyl compound in most processes, so it is cleaved in the liver and eventually excreted renally which is a whole other topic in itself.
The take away of this is any kind of methyl-compound is harsh on the body. thats why things like METHYL-alcohol, METH-amphetamine, METHYL-ketomine are all bad...so just because a certain compound gives you big muscles doesnt make it good for you....like methasteron and methylstenbolone.
 
MANotaur said:
wow....this thread took a shortcut to ****creek...

OK first things first:

OP....very few PHs arent worth their use IMO. The conversion rates of most PHs are very poor and they are made even less effective when they are not converted into the target/intended hormone. If you want to "cut" the best advice you can do is carb cycle and use HIT principles in your training. If your dead set on a suppliment to help, some of your better options are clen/T3 combo or smaller doses of GH frag.

now the next order of buisness, hepatotoxicity.

Sutton, bro there is no such thing as an "easy" 17aa compound on the liver. Even though the the cleave may exert less metabolic stress on the liver with compounds such as H-drol and M-sten (and in all reality M-sten is an active steroid in itself and not a PH, its actually more potent than SD and is equally hepatotoxic) does not mean they are easier on the liver. Methylation is used in these class of drugs during the manufacturing process because it is easy and cheap to produce. Where the real danger enlies with any methylated compound isnt neccesarily with the parent compound, rather with its metabolites. There are certain methyl compounds (fluoxymesteron comes to mind) that have metabolites that are upwards of 7 to 8 times more toxic than the parent compound. Human physiology doesnt allow for the metabolism or utilization of the methyl compound in most processes, so it is cleaved in the liver and eventually excreted renally which is a whole other topic in itself.
The take away of this is any kind of methyl-compound is harsh on the body. thats why things like METHYL-alcohol, METH-amphetamine, METHYL-ketomine are all bad...so just because a certain compound gives you big muscles doesnt make it good for you....like methasteron and methylstenbolone.
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Great post... I'm not so sure I'd recommend T3 to him, but if done right it can work.
 
DetroitHammer said:
Great post... I'm not so sure I'd recommend T3 to him, but if done right it can work.
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The reason i say t3 is its easy to use and its hard to eff your self up to bad as the thyroid is actually very resilient. Also t3 isn't as catabolic and hard to gain with as ppl claim. As long as your eating enough and working out and resting properly, it can actually be anabolic to a degree.

There would be better options potentially...but the are quite a bit more expensive ans harder to come by. Also doing is a little bit more complicated. (gw1516+AICAR, gh frag, DNP and a few others)

T3 and clen are always available, easy to use, cheap and relatively safe...note i said relatively...there's always the potential for idiots to hurt themselves....but lets allow Darwin to do his thing!
 
MANotaur said:
The reason i say t3 is its easy to use and its hard to eff your self up to bad as the thyroid is actually very resilient. Also t3 isn't as catabolic and hard to gain with as ppl claim. As long as your eating enough and working out and resting properly, it can actually be anabolic to a degree.

There would be better options potentially...but the are quite a bit more expensive ans harder to come by. Also doing is a little bit more complicated. (gw1516+AICAR, gh frag, DNP and a few others)

T3 and clen are always available, easy to use, cheap and relatively safe...note i said relatively...there's always the potential for idiots to hurt themselves....but lets allow Darwin to do his thing!
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Haha "lets allow Darwin to do his thing" excellent way to put it!
 
Nsutton15 said:
Do your homework brother, some methyls resist metabolic breakdown more than others causing more liver stress. H-drol is a prohormone causing some of the least side effects and very low stress on the liver, due to easy breakdown.
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H drol... Easy on liver .... I just I just ....... O_O
 
not sure if i want to get involved with the liver debate haha...... but although halodrol and something like anadrol or methyl tren are all methylated compounds and hard on the liver there is definately a difference on how brutal it is. if you took the right dose of hdrol for say 8 weeks your liver values will probably be crap and your urine will be dark but if you run anadrol or methy tren at their right dose for 8 weeks youd probably be pissing blood and going to the hospital.

with all that said i started taking CLA Fish Oil and Carnitine to lose some bodyfat while still gaining muscle and so far pretty good a month ago i was over 200lbs and now like 190 with abs and seratus looking alot better and strength increasing. I just started trenavar and have been taking it for 5 days now its non methylated and will hopefully assist in getting me shredded
 
TomGreen said:
with all that said i started taking CLA Fish Oil and Carnitine to lose some bodyfat while still gaining muscle and so far pretty good a month ago i was over 200lbs and now like 190 with abs and seratus looking alot better and strength increasing. I just started trenavar and have been taking it for 5 days now its non methylated and will hopefully assist in getting me shredded
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trenavar is good stuff, its one of the few PHs out there right now that I would actually consider running. Just be careful with it and keep it to under 10 weeks if you can, and get a full on proper PCT on with it...hCG prolly wouldnt hurt either, but im sure you already knew that ;)

CLA and carnintine are a killer combo for BF reduction.
 
MANotaur said:
trenavar is good stuff, its one of the few PHs out there right now that I would actually consider running. Just be careful with it and keep it to under 10 weeks if you can, and get a full on proper PCT on with it...hCG prolly wouldnt hurt either, but im sure you already knew that ;)

CLA and carnintine are a killer combo for BF reduction.
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yea im hopeful ill get some good results from it. im only one week in at 60mgs nothing real yet, but ya if it actually converts to trenbolone and my body can handle a high dosage then i think it can be pretty successful.
 
Cutting is diet, diet, diet, and then training, training, training. When you hit the point of needing chemical assistance you are around maybe 12%. I know thats crappy but even I a relatively pudgy person my entire life have come to terms with it. Thus I am sitting here typing this eating my cold lean steak out of a ziplock bag after eating almost only eggs and veggies all day.

Abs are made in the kitchen.
 
Gerbil said:
Cutting is diet, diet, diet, and then training, training, training. When you hit the point of needing chemical assistance you are around maybe 12%. I know thats crappy but even I a relatively pudgy person my entire life have come to terms with it. Thus I am sitting here typing this eating my cold lean steak out of a ziplock bag after eating almost only eggs and veggies all day.

Abs are made in the kitchen.
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the things we do.... i love this video of ronnie coleman at work
Invalid Link Removed
 
MANotaur said:
OP....very few PHs arent worth their use IMO. The conversion rates of most PHs are very poor and they are made even less effective when they are not converted into the target/intended hormone.
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Sorry old post quote but what would you consider the few PH's worth use? Superdrol IMO is fantastic and can be run low dosed (12mg or so) and give better results then most others run at the upper end doses. Im actually a HUGE fan of the pulse method with superdrol (1 week on 1 week off) because for me I feel it almost immediately and you don't get shut down at all, infact I'm pretty sure superdrol boosts LH and test at the start. I do week on with higher volume and week off higher weight (5 reps) you keep most gains and all though it's slower than 4 week straight run you actually keep gains and look really impressive without having the look where most people assume your on roids.
Any one else a fan of this?
I f you havn't done it I recommend giving it a try.
I dose higher though cause you want it to kick in and only doing 1 week so less liver damge.
I do 15mg super/15mg dymethazine first few days then last few I do 20mg super/20 dmz.
I'd personally prefer not to even have the dmz in there adding extra stress but I stocked up on a generic superdmz so cant avoid it.
might post a log?
 
seanghetto said:
Sorry old post quote but what would you consider the few PH's worth use? Superdrol IMO is fantastic and can be run low dosed (12mg or so) and give better results then most others run at the upper end doses. Im actually a HUGE fan of the pulse method with superdrol (1 week on 1 week off) because for me I feel it almost immediately and you don't get shut down at all, infact I'm pretty sure superdrol boosts LH and test at the start. I do week on with higher volume and week off higher weight (5 reps) you keep most gains and all though it's slower than 4 week straight run you actually keep gains and look really impressive without having the look where most people assume your on roids.
Any one else a fan of this?
I f you havn't done it I recommend giving it a try.
I dose higher though cause you want it to kick in and only doing 1 week so less liver damge.
I do 15mg super/15mg dymethazine first few days then last few I do 20mg super/20 dmz.
I'd personally prefer not to even have the dmz in there adding extra stress but I stocked up on a generic superdmz so cant avoid it.
might post a log?
Click to expand...

well....sd is a different story because it isnt a PH in any sense of the word lol. Its methylated masteron. so its an orally bioavailble AAS just like dbol or abombs. SD is appealing cause it acts as a very mild AI and it can lower SHBG. it will shut you down, just not to the extent that others do like nandrolones and other progestins.

I have heard of the pulse method and it is intriguing. Ive never done it but would love to follow a log on it if your willing to donate your liver.
The problem out there right is that there are few PHs that are still legal or "grey market" right now. Trenavar (trendione) is a PH that is good because it is a direct conversion of >90% to the active hormone trenbolone. Dienolone or dienone is the current "tren" ph and its terrible. its really not worth a damn imo cause the conversion isnt there. Hdrol is marketed to convert to tbol, but the conversion is less that 5%, what good does that do? theres a boldenone ph (boldione) out right now that has good conversion rates (nearly 100%) but boldenone is reletively week and has to be run for long periods of time to really acheive the desired results of boldenone. This makes it reletively hard or impractical to use because of the stress of the conversion process and its effing spendy to buy an appreciable amount of the product to achieve the desired results. This is all in light of when you can spend half as much for twice the real deal, and get twice the benefits and results for the same amount of time. Sure theres the inherent risk of buying black market drugs, but the reward is greater too.

the good original PHs out there that are now banned like andro, norandro, REAL 1-AD, are all but gone because once they became illegal, the market crashed because you might as well go ahead and buy the real deal at that point.


but FYI i actually am considering a SD kicker sometime in the future, I just wanna find a legit source for it. Ive actually got another thread here called SD vs Dbol if you wanna check it out. theres actually a really good debate going on about it.
 
MANotaur said:
I have heard of the pulse method and it is intriguing. Ive never done it but would love to follow a log on it if your willing to donate your liver.
The problem out there right is that there are few PHs that are still legal or "grey market" right now. Trenavar (trendione) is a PH that is good because it is a direct conversion of >90% to the active hormone trenbolone. Dienolone or dienone is the current "tren" ph and its terrible. its really not worth a damn imo cause the conversion isnt there. Hdrol is marketed to convert to tbol, but the conversion is less that 5%, what good does that do? theres a boldenone ph (boldione) out right now that has good conversion rates (nearly 100%) but boldenone is reletively week and has to be run for long periods of time to really acheive the desired results of boldenone. This makes it reletively hard or impractical to use because of the stress of the conversion process and its effing spendy to buy an appreciable amount of the product to achieve the desired results. This is all in light of when you can spend half as much for twice the real deal, and get twice the benefits and results for the same amount of time. Sure theres the inherent risk of buying black market drugs, but the reward is greater too.

the good original PHs out there that are now banned like andro, norandro, REAL 1-AD, are all but gone because once they became illegal, the market crashed because you might as well go ahead and buy the real deal at that point.


but FYI i actually am considering a SD kicker sometime in the future, I just wanna find a legit source for it. Ive actually got another thread here called SD vs Dbol if you wanna check it out. there's actually a really good debate going on about it.
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What about topically applied Trenazone (Dienolone). Doesn't require conversion and bypasses direct liver/kidneys etc. So would the availability/use rate of this be 100%??
Do you think Dienolone is a good steroid? Do people inject Dienolone? ( I don't mean trenazone! lol )

I'm new to oral steroid/PH cycles...the reason I do it is more or less (and I think this applies for a lot of others) because I don't have access to/or know how obtain AAS.
Any tips on helping increase the chances of me "stumbling" upon them?
 
seanghetto said:
What about topically applied Trenazone (Dienolone). Doesn't require conversion and bypasses direct liver/kidneys etc. So would the availability/use rate of this be 100%??
Do you think Dienolone is a good steroid? Do people inject Dienolone? ( I don't mean trenazone! lol )

I'm new to oral steroid/PH cycles...the reason I do it is more or less (and I think this applies for a lot of others) because I don't have access to/or know how obtain AAS.
Any tips on helping increase the chances of me "stumbling" upon them?
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NO SOURCING!! lol i kid...best thing i can say is talk to gym rats or run a google search of what you want and you should be able to find all you would ever need/want.

the route though of PH is irrelevant. Dienolone is less effective because its either a 2 or 3 step conversion process (debateable which one it is...which is scary imo) to tren. the more steps a ph has to go through to reach its intended hormone, the less target hormone that is produced which in turn makes it less effective because you are required to have more and more of the PH to achieve desired serum concentrations of the active hormone.

think of it this way, your body is very complex and adept at doing its job. But when you add a bunch of **** to it that it doesnt use naturally, you forcing the body to use tools (enzymes, carrier protiens, and other things) for purposes other than what they are intended to do. So the more steps that a ph has to go through to get into the intended hormone, the more room there is for error to occur.

Thats why supps like DHEA and DHEAS can be great, cause your body already makes them and uses them so your body knows what to do with them, but on the flipside, you cant force DHEA to turn into testosterone, you just have to take a sh*tton and hope that the majority of it gets converted. So with people taking hyper doses of DHEA and DHEAS (be it transdermally or orally or injecting it or whatever) it will still be used to make other hormones like estradiol, progesterone, and a slew of other sex hormones and sex protiens that may or may not build muscle.

thats why I feel the way I do about PHs, I just dont like them. are they bad? not inherently, and i understand why people use them i guess, i just dont wanna fool with em.

dienolone is no better imo than any of the other OTC ph/ds/hormonal support supps on the market right now. and i suppose you can inject it...i dont know of anybody that does but...if you wanna run a log of it ill gladly follow lol.
 
The 19 nor Tren ph that converts to dienolone has Alot more solid user feedback then Trenavar ever has.
 
MANotaur said:
the route though of PH is irrelevant. Dienolone is less effective because its either a 2 or 3 step conversion process (debateable which one it is...which is scary imo) to tren.
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I thought Dienolone was the target homone? Trenazone is transdermally applied dienolone... It's active and doesn't require conversion...right?
 
Trendione logs are always hit cause its a direct conversion to tren...the miss are trnaval clones that were produced after trnedione products were banned...

Just like the sd logs are hit or miss. ..ad clones aren't near as effective as the real deal sd
 
And i mistakenly typed Dienolone when i should have typed diendione...sorry auto correct and i didn't realize it

But Dienolone either way is a tren clone and is nowhere near as effective. Diendione is a ph to the Dienolone active hormone.

My opinion is unchanged however because the same principle applies.

Trnasdermal application helps with absorption of the drug and prevention of hepatic degradation bit it doesn't improve conversion rates
 
MANotaur said:
But Dienolone either way is a tren clone and is nowhere near as effective. Diendione is a ph to the Dienolone active hormone.
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Nowhere near as effective as what? superdrol?....hell no lol, Ive found you hardly get any strength gains from dienolone either..
 
MANotaur said:
And i mistakenly typed Dienolone when i should have typed diendione...sorry auto correct and i didn't realize it

But Dienolone either way is a tren clone and is nowhere near as effective. Diendione is a ph to the Dienolone active hormone.

My opinion is unchanged however because the same principle applies.

Trnasdermal application helps with absorption of the drug and prevention of hepatic degradation bit it doesn't improve conversion rates
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The old tren dienolone ph was one the strongest non methyl ph of all time. Everyone blew up on it. unlike trenavar which myself and many others got nothing from.
 
MANotaur said:
But Dienolone either way is a tren clone and is nowhere near as effective.
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And dienolone is not a tren clone. It's just dienolone. The unmethylated version of the pre ban steroid methyldienolone
 
Bigchourico said:
The old tren dienolone ph was one the strongest non methyl ph of all time. Everyone blew up on it. unlike trenavar which myself and many others got nothing from.
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Have u tried the transdermal Trenazone? low dose trnzone (1ml/day) stacked with stano is IMO the best and most effective stack for cut. Bump up to 2-2.5ml and increase calories and you gain some serious lbs. I gained 7lbs on an attempted cut. So wasn't taking in huge amounts of calories.
 
Bigchourico said:
And dienolone is not a tren clone. It's just dienolone. The unmethylated version of the pre ban steroid methyldienolone
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Dienolone was marketed as an alternative to trenbolone...which would make it a clone..

Maybe not in the literal context of a clone..but it was still promised to deliver the same results as trenbolone...which it did not and could not
 
Bigchourico said:
The old tren dienolone ph was one the strongest non methyl ph of all time. Everyone blew up on it. unlike trenavar which myself and many others got nothing from.
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To say everyone blew up in it inaccurate and an opinion. It was nowhere near the strongest..it has an AA rating of 100/10...trenbolone has one of 500/500.

Did it work for some people? Absolutely. Did it deliver as promised? Maybe for some. But either way it wasn't as good as some of your other preban phs that were out there


If y'all like them, then use them. Im hot a fan, and i gave my opinion as to why. If you don't like my opinion, then take it with a grain of salt.

Im not claiming that they don't save a role in many cycles or that they can't be used efficiently, i just don't have use for them in cycles and routines and would rather use the real deal
 
MANotaur said:
And i mistakenly typed Dienolone when i should have typed diendione...sorry auto correct and i didn't realize it

But Dienolone either way is a tren clone and is nowhere near as effective.

My opinion is unchanged however because the same principle applies. /QUOTE]

MANotaur said:
Dienolone was marketed as an alternative to trenbolone...which would make it a clone..

/QUOTE]

Do you know what you're talking about dienolone is a powerful steroid of itself.
The people who believed that it was a ph with a conversion to Trenbolone were just not that bright.
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vidapreta said:
The 19 nor Tren ph that converts to dienolone has Alot more solid user feedback then Trenavar ever has.
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What 19-nor tren ph are you talking about? The only one Im aware of is trendione...which was the original trenavar
 
MANotaur said:
What 19-nor tren ph are you talking about? The only one Im aware of is trendione...which was the original trenavar
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The original 19 nor tren that was everywhere, that not too long ago was banned. It did not convert to dienolone it was straight dienolone.
 
Bigchourico said:
The original 19 nor tren that was everywhere, that not too long ago was banned. It did not convert to dienolone it was straight dienolone.
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I said in an earlier post that it converted to dienolone but I now remember it was just straight dienolone.
 

I know they weren't all that bright...but it doesn't change the fact that that is how it was marketed.

I know it is an active steroids hormone, how powerful it is debatable. I tried it once and wasnt impressed. I might have gained 5 lbs from an 8 week run. Im sorry, that was my last experience with a ph/ds and wasn't impressed.
To say that i don't know what Im talking about is wrong. I tried to stay objective both it and explain Ehh i prefer not to use any phs
 
MANotaur said:
I know they weren't all that bright...but it doesn't change the fact that that is how it was marketed.

/QUOTE]
So what if they did??
If they marketed Pink Magic as the clone to Anadrol.. I'm not going to post on a forum saying "pink magic is an Anadrol clone"
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I ran pro dienolone, the 19nor version of "tren". Was it tren? The answer is no. Was it good? The answer is yes. Are PH/PS a waste? I'd say that that question can only be answered by the user and his/her personal experience with the product itself. Some people are non-responders to different compounds, whereas those same compounds can have astounding results with others.
The best an individual can do, when trying to decide on what compound to use in order to achieve their desired results is to gather as much information as possible on which compound to use, analyze that information, narrow down best possible compounds for said goals, and start eating pills.
The fact is, this argument can go on all day long and no one will be right or wrong, unless they deliberately posted inaccurate information. That being said, we all have our personal opinions on this matter, and most of these opinions are pretty respectable. There are facts, though, that are indisputable. Methyls ARE harmful to the liver. The extent to which they are harmful is individually dependent, and risks can be mitigated through proper supplementation.
On the subject of transdermals...epidermal permeability barrier. That's all I have to say.
OP, there are risks to everything you are going to do. Do your best to mitigate risk, PCT through one of many known and proven protocols, find out for yourself which is your best option and call it a day. Truthfully, that's how most of us found out...

Oh, and this should have been posted in the cycle info spot. It's on your app.
 
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