Good "Beginner" Cycles

[ma70]

Hello everyone. I've never really posted in this section before but I posted here for years before a break. I have 8 years of training experience (on/off in different disciplines of running/lifting etc) and I turned 30 recently and figure I want to try one of these. I used to read back in the day that these were the "beginner" cycles to try:

11-oxo/11-kt
1-andro

I'm well aware there people recommend SERMs and all but it's been years since I've done research here. Are there any new compounds that I can try that are mild and for "first time users"? Also, on a side note, is 11-oxo effective at all if you dose it at something that can be okay with OTC PCT?

 

[Afi140]

Those two compounds are good. The andros are great for beginners and still yield results. You can run 1-andro and 11x together. Do not run 11x during pct as it is mildly suppressive. You can add a base (4-andro or dermacrine) to those two and it will be a very pleasant cycle.

You do want to aim for 300mg+ of 1-andro (many products are underdosed) so take a look at super mandro for the highest dosing on the market.

Super Mandro by Hard Rock Supplements

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[ma70]

Those two compounds are good. The andros are great for beginners and still yield results. You can run 1-andro and 11x together. Do not run 11x during pct as it is mildly suppressive. You can add a base (4-andro or dermacrine) to those two and it will be a very pleasant cycle.

You do want to aim for 300mg+ of 1-andro (many products are underdosed) so take a look at super mandro for the highest dosing on the market.

Super Mandro by Hard Rock Supplements

Super Mandro by Hard Rock Supplements is the strongest legal bulking agent available today and is exclusively available here! Order Now! Same Day Shipping!

www.strongsupplementshop.com

Is it still confirmed that 450-600mg 11-oxo is still good? I prefer caps over transdermal/gels.

 

[Whisky]

1 andro plus 4 andro would be a standard starter ph cycle (as above 300+ of each) for 8 weeks.

if you want the best chance of recovering your natural test production quickly then you use a serm (anything worth taking in terms of results will need one). Quicker you recover more gains you keep/less **** you feel.

 

[Afi140]

Is it still confirmed that 450-600mg 11-oxo is still good? I prefer caps over transdermal/gels.

Yeah those are Good oral doses. I run 250mg TD so those oral doses will yield decent results.

 

[ma70]

Should I run 11-oxo as long as I run the 1-andro? Or should I do a longer 11-oxo cycle then add 1-andro later?

 

[Afi140]

Should I run 11-oxo as long as I run the 1-andro? Or should I do a longer 11-oxo cycle then add 1-andro later?

Depends on funds but both for 6-8 weeks is optimal.

 

[blynch1]

After doing 1Andro for my first, I’d choose DMZ any day. Way more affordable and way more quality gains imo

 

[Afi140]

After doing 1Andro for my first, I’d choose DMZ any day. Way more affordable and way more quality gains imo

Dmz is going to produce more gain of course but some people don’t want the sides and risks associated with it. I have run hard stuff and andros. They both have their place.

I would always suggest andros to start and I myself go back to them regularly. Dmz can be pretty harsh for some people in terms of sides (if it is in fact real Dmz). There is also a general concern with the liver from only methylated compounds but the further risk with dimethylation. I am not saying your wrong in terms of gains but most people with experience won’t suggest jumping into DMZ as a first cycle. To each their own though.

For OP- there is A 4 week study in well trained individuals that showed an 8lb gain in lbm on 1-andro alone. So there is some evidence to support they are much more effective than initially believed. I have also found that my andro gains tend to be more keepable.

 

[wfreiling]

Find someone that is selling Halodrol, also can be ordered from the U.K. and run that. Minimal sides with awesome gains as a first cycle. Buy 2 bottles and a proper pct and call it a day. Probably cost you around $150 for a 6wk run with pct

 

[wfreiling]

Find someone that is selling Halodrol, also can be ordered from the U.K. and run that. Minimal sides with awesome gains as a first cycle. Buy 2 bottles and a proper pct and call it a day. Probably cost you around $150 for a 6wk run with pct

 

[jim2509]

Find someone that is selling Halodrol, also can be ordered from the U.K. and run that. Minimal sides with awesome gains as a first cycle. Buy 2 bottles and a proper pct and call it a day. Probably cost you around $150 for a 6wk run with pct

I agree, Halodrol would be a very good beginner cycle with quality gains and little sides. Make sure it's an actual Halodrol 'Clone' not the Hi Tec Pharma 'Halodrol'as it's not what I'm referring too. Alot of UK sites have Halodrol.

 

[Smont]

Hello everyone. I've never really posted in this section before but I posted here for years before a break. I have 8 years of training experience (on/off in different disciplines of running/lifting etc) and I turned 30 recently and figure I want to try one of these. I used to read back in the day that these were the "beginner" cycles to try:

11-oxo/11-kt
1-andro

I'm well aware there people recommend SERMs and all but it's been years since I've done research here. Are there any new compounds that I can try that are mild and for "first time users"? Also, on a side note, is 11-oxo effective at all if you dose it at something that can be okay with OTC PCT?

I don't see how long you plan to run this cycle.

6 weeks minimum at 450 for the 11 and 330 for the 1 andro.

If the length of cycle is shorter or the doses are lower your wasting your time and money. While a otc pct will work for the 11, probably still a good idea to use a serm because of the 1andro.

And just a fyi, lots of ppl report negetive sexual side effects from 1 andro if you know what I mean. I've seen it kill people's sexdrive even when added to trt.

 

[Smont]

Dmz is going to produce more gain of course but some people don’t want the sides and risks associated with it. I have run hard stuff and andros. They both have their place.

I would always suggest andros to start and I myself go back to them regularly. Dmz can be pretty harsh for some people in terms of sides (if it is in fact real Dmz). There is also a general concern with the liver from only methylated compounds but the further risk with dimethylation. I am not saying your wrong in terms of gains but most people with experience won’t suggest jumping into DMZ as a first cycle. To each their own though.

For OP- there is A 4 week study in well trained individuals that showed an 8lb gain in lbm on 1-andro alone. So there is some evidence to support they are much more effective than initially believed. I have also found that my andro gains tend to be more keepable.

I think 1 andro has more negetive sides then dmz

 

[Whisky]

I don't see how long you plan to run this cycle.

6 weeks minimum at 450 for the 11 and 330 for the 1 andro.

If the length of cycle is shorter or the doses are lower your wasting your time and money. While a otc pct will work for the 11, probably still a good idea to use a serm because of the 1andro.

And just a fyi, lots of ppl report negetive sexual side effects from 1 andro if you know what I mean. I've seen it kill people's sexdrive even when added to trt.

I had more lethargy on 1-andro that any other compound aside from sdrol.....BUT I only ran 4-andro and epiandro alongside the 1. Everything else I’ve run with test or trest. But yeah 1-andro is not joke. Libido wise I didn’t have a problem but I’m dangerously horny all the time anyway, I’m the guy that can be too ill to get out of bed but still manages to beat the meat no problems.

not run DMZ so can’t compare but epistane, tbol, winny, var, 1-t, dien, nanodrol didn’t cause me the same level of lethargy.

 

[Smont]

I had more lethargy on 1-andro that any other compound aside from sdrol.....BUT I only ran 4-andro and epiandro alongside the 1. Everything else I’ve run with test or trest. But yeah 1-andro is not joke. Libido wise I didn’t have a problem but I’m dangerously horny all the time anyway, I’m the guy that can be too ill to get out of bed but still manages to beat the meat no problems.

not run DMZ so can’t compare but epistane, tbol, winny, var, 1-t, dien, nanodrol didn’t cause me the same level of lethargy.

Ya my thinking is obviously dmz has the liver toxicity but it's not that serious and even if it goes out of range it goes right back to normal after the cycle. But dmz also has the potential to produce big gains in size.

1 andro is weak when it comes to packing on size but the negatives of feeling drained and possibly not being able to perform in bed are way worse then the sides you will "feel" from dmz

 

[blynch1]

Couldn’t agree more, guys. I felt like a damn beast on DMZ and only started losing libido toward the end of the run and through/after PCT (not taking Clomid ever again as I got depressed af which I believe is the reason I had extensive libido loss). I could literally fall asleep standing up at work on 1 Andro and there’s zero comparison on the feels and keepable gains when comparing the two compounds.

 

[Smont]

Couldn’t agree more, guys. I felt like a damn beast on DMZ and only started losing libido toward the end of the run and through/after PCT (not taking Clomid ever again as I got depressed af which I believe is the reason I had extensive libido loss). I could literally fall asleep standing up at work on 1 Andro and there’s zero comparison on the feels and keepable gains when comparing the two compounds.

How did you dose clomid. You don't need to to the 50,50,25,25 like everyone says is standard. Even 25mg EOD will work for mild cycles. That's actually what some hormone replacement therapy is prescribed at for clomid

 

[Smont]

Nolva at 20mg daily should have no sides for pretty much anyone

 

[blynch1]

Nolva at 20mg daily should have no sides for pretty much anyone

Yep I did the ‘standard‘ dosage. Got a T test sent into the lab so I’ll see how that turns out since I got off around Jan this year. If I do decide to run again I’ll for sure be stocking up on Nolva

 

[ma70]

It seems the only US-source for 11-oxo I can find is out of stock of this stuff. Does anyone have any recommendations?

 

[delsolrob]

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