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Furuza first cycle sandalone ?

flamini

flamini

Member
As a standalone will I gain any muscle off of it ? im thinking not but rather hear from someone with experience I'm only looking to out on 6-7 lean pounds nothing crazy
 
Okay cool , but one last question ... I'm not new to fitness but I am just learning in depth about PH cycles ... I'm under the impression the epi is a non aromatizing PH ... So I would assume it means less chance for gyno ... Although it seems to be a side effect for most on epi ... I know oestrogen can rebound after any non aromatizing PH post cycle BUT I'm talking about during te cycle ... If epi is non -a , then why is it givin people gyno ?
 
flamini said:
Okay cool , but one last question ... I'm not new to fitness but I am just learning in depth about PH cycles ... I'm under the impression the epi is a non aromatizing PH ... So I would assume it means less chance for gyno ... Although it seems to be a side effect for most on epi ... I know oestrogen can rebound after any non aromatizing PH post cycle BUT I'm talking about during te cycle ... If epi is non -a , then why is it givin people gyno ?
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While many ph/ds dont aromatise they will bind to some degree with SHGB which can increase freely circulating estrogen which in some can equal gyno symptoms. Also your body may try to balance things out by adding estrogen which again can cause symptoms. But with all that being said I would guess that 8 out of 10 that think they have gyno actually don't. Rule of thumb is to be prepared and have proper supports on hand if needed.... I never run a cycle without the following on hand just to be safe: letrozole, aromasin, Nolva, Clomid
 
Epi was actually as a treatment for breast cancer; many people have noted it gets rid of gyno.
 
2α 3α-Epithio-5α-androstan-17β-ol in Treatment of Gynecomastia
Authors
Abstract

1. The clinical effect of epitiostanol, a new anti-estrogen agent (2α,3α-epithio-5a-androstan-17β-ol) against gynecomastia was studied in comparison with dromostanolone propionate in fifty-four patients ranging from twenty to fifty years in age without previous history of hormone therapy and with normal liver function. The experiment was performed for eight weeks by double blind methods in three dosage groups, epithiostanol 10 mg, and 20 mg and dromostanolone propionate 50 mg.
2. Epithiostanol 20 mg was most effective with regards to effect on mass size and tenderness, (effective in 96%, 20/21), followed by 10 mg epitiostanol (effective in 89%, 16/18) and dromostanolone propionate 50 mg (effective in 89%, 16/18) in descending order. No side effects were observed in any of the three groups.
3. Based on the results of the present study, epitiostanol is concluded to be at least as effective as dromostanolone propionate against gynecomastia and to be safe from the viewpoint of side effects. A satisfactory therapeutical effect on gynecomastia can be expected with a weekly dosage of 20 mg of epitiostanol for an administration period of between five to eight weeks.
 
Epi is:

2a,3a-epithio17a methyl-17b-hydroxy-5a-androstane or 2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol
 
Mystere3 said:
Epi is:

2a,3a-epithio17a methyl-17b-hydroxy-5a-androstane or 2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol
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I don't need you to google compound nomenclature for me, I already know most on the market, and I know what all those numbers and words mean.
 
Obv it's the 17 alkylated version but that doesn't change the fact that it's antiestrogenic. One could argue reduction in shbg could in theory lead to gyno but I'd argue that the antiestrogenic effect is substantially stronger. Most ppl who get gyno with epi are stacking it with something else.
 
Mystere3 said:
Obv it's the 17 alkylated version but that doesn't change the fact that it's antiestrogenic. One could argue reduction in shbg could in theory lead to gyno but I'd argue that the antiestrogenic effect is substantially stronger. Most ppl who get gyno with epi are stacking it with something else.
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Incorrect again.
 
Mystere3 said:
Obv it's the 17 alkylated version but that doesn't change the fact that it's antiestrogenic. One could argue reduction in shbg could in theory lead to gyno but I'd argue that the antiestrogenic effect is substantially stronger. Most ppl who get gyno with epi are stacking it with something else.
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pretty much changes everything..
 
jbryand101b said:
Incorrect again.
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<shrug>

"it likely also also imparts some anti-estrogenic effect, further stregthening the association between this agent and dieting, cutting, and lean muscle mass phases of training as opposed to bulking." anabolics 2007 by william llewellyn pg234 under havoc.

"as a dht derivative, this prosteroid is androgenic but has also been investigated as an antiestrogen. it is rumored to be very effective at reducing breast tissue growth." anabolic pharmacology by seth roberts pg 232 under methylepitiostanol.
 
All rumors and speculation.

If it does have any anti estrogenic effect, it isn't any more so than regular dht.

Adding a 17a methyl group to the compound changes it dramatically.
This is seen time and again for numerous compounds.

And time to upgrade your out of date literature, as well as start reading actual studies on androgenic/anabolic compounds.
As well as info from people who know about chemistry, like Patrick Arnold and henryv.
Epi is a oral anabolic/androgenic steroid. If there is any anti estrogenic effect it is insignificant.

ANABOLICS and anabolic pharmacology are great starting points for beginners, but they are just that, the beginning.
 
I'm not denying adding a 17-a group changes the compound. It certainly makes it far more anabolic.

As far as comparing the anti-estrogenic effects of epi to DHT or the precursor, certainly you wouldn't use epi as an anti-estrogen compound, but it also wouldn't be a compound that would go out of its way causing gyno. Might someone who is gyno prone get it from epi? Sure, but they might whether or not they are on an anabolic. In any case, even an OTC AI would be fine in taking care of it.
 
Mystere3 said:
I'm not denying adding a 17-a group changes the compound. It certainly makes it far more anabolic.

As far as comparing the anti-estrogenic effects of epi to DHT or the precursor, certainly you wouldn't use epi as an anti-estrogen compound, but it also wouldn't be a compound that would go out of its way causing gyno. Might someone who is gyno prone get it from epi? Sure, but they might whether or not they are on an anabolic. In any case, even an OTC AI would be fine in taking care of it.
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Anecdotally, a majority of users report raised estrodiol levels from bloodwork while using epistane.

It is a highly anabolic, low androgenic steroid (a/a ratios are compared against methyl test)

Non aromatizing androgens will cause estrogen rebound. If you don't control estrogen while on them, you are playing with fire.

Btw, I'm running epi and masteron right now as well as test an trenadione. They got nothing on an actual aromatase inhibitors. (epi & mast)
 
Patrick Arnold said:
epi may conceivably slowly decompose to dmt, although its probably so slow its not of significance

Its also possible that epi is not even the active drug in the body but merely a pro-drug. that is, it converts to dmt in the body and that is what is active. but i said that is only possible, i dunno

if someone can find metabolite studies for epitiostanol then that might give some clues
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Some info
 
Mystere3 said:
Obv it's the 17 alkylated version but that doesn't change the fact that it's antiestrogenic. One could argue reduction in shbg could in theory lead to gyno but I'd argue that the antiestrogenic effect is substantially stronger. Most ppl who get gyno with epi are stacking it with something else.
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I have a friends right now who ran it as a standalone and he is 3 weeks in with mild gyno so it definitely CAN happen when taking alone even if thts rare
 
Methylation changes the compound completely. Look at superdrol. U seem pretty good with google so I'm not going into any details.
 
Yes u can run furaz solo, I'd run it at 400mg for 8-10weeks. It will be pricy and u would be hard press to put in 6lbs of mass. But u could run it as a cutter. If ur looking to bulk with a non methyl I'd say run 150mg of lmg for 6 weeks. Of coarse adding a methyl would r cheaper and more effective but u can use non methlyl. 11oxo is also a good cutter, fish test!
 
I rather go with a non methylated stack or stand alone but I am aware high doses of non methylated PH can still tax the liver if doses to hight , but yeah I only wanna out on about 5 pounds an cut up even more , if furuz can do that and if I can keep all 5-6 pounds ill do that
 
jbryand101b said:
Yes, 6chloro testosterone is what is supposedly in those products
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hecadrol is what I found seems interesting ... But I'm finding some skeptics that say it doesn't work at all ? I doubt that's the case the nomenclature looks ok I'm just worried about how effective it is when all is said and done with the cycle
 
I've run epi/hexa and it's a pretty good combo IMO. You need to dose the hexa pretty high, though; I'd use 200 min.

flamini said:
hecadrol is what I found seems interesting ... But I'm finding some skeptics that say it doesn't work at all ? I doubt that's the case the nomenclature looks ok I'm just worried about how effective it is when all is said and done with the cycle
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I'd probably stick to just furaz. I'd imagine u'll be wasting ur money on hex
 
Im actually gunna run excel - tren estra-4 9 11-triene-3 17-dione... hoping to gain 6 lbs and get leaner
 
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