Donald Trump running for president

[thebigt]

Carlos DeLuna
Ruben Cantu
Larry Griffen
Joseph Odell
David Spence
Leo Jones
Gary Graham
Claude Jones
Cameron Willingham
Troy Davis
Brian Terrell
Richard Masterson
Robert Pruett
Carlton Gary

Approx 40 people have been executed despite strong claims of innocence.

144 people have been exonerated while on death row (often leads to mental illness and ptsd).

Study also claims 1 in 25 people are wrongly convicted of a crime and killed for it, however a lot of these go unnoticed because noone is seeking to exonerate someone after they are dead. A lot of peoe are presumed guilty, the evidence seems that way and they are killed for it and noone looks any further.

Hard to prove, but still a factor that we kill people who never committed the crime and we never find out they were innocent.

Invalid Link Removed

Id be for it if it was 100% open closed case. But a lot of cases are not like that.

would have been nice if you had posted dates...I agree execution should only be for the most heinous crimes and only after the most strident due diligence has been applied. if in doubt don't execute, but john wayne gacy/ted bundy/Richard ramirez...hang em in the public square

 

[Aleksandar37]

oprah likes being popular, she won't run...warren has too much baggage...michelle Obama is just to damned dumb....I see Hillary running again, she probably won't win nomination but that won't stop her.

but being dumb hasn't stopped people from running and actually becoming president, if michelle decides to run she has the best chance of those you have listed---she is way more popular than Hillary, and people[media] would make excuses for her due to popularity and color of skin just like they did for barrack.


omg...I just read what I posted---I hope I don't have nightmares thinking about michelle Obama as president:run:

You can say a lot about Michelle, but dumb? Based on what? She accomplished a hell of a lot before she even took the Obama name.

 

[Aleksandar37]

would have been nice if you had posted dates...I agree execution should only be for the most heinous crimes and only after the most strident due diligence has been applied. if in doubt don't execute, but john wayne gacy/ted bundy/Richard ramirez...hang em in the public square

Dates are listed here Invalid Link Removed

 

[Aleksandar37]

Id be for it if it was 100% open closed case. But a lot of cases are not like that.

Yep, I'm not saying we just sign a bill and now everybody accused gets tossed in a hole. There is a need to reform quite a bit at the level of police, courts, and prisons. Right now there are issues with all of them and we'd have more resources to address the issues if they all stopped wasting time on kids selling drugs on a corner.

 

[thebigt]

Dates are listed here Invalid Link Removed

serious reforms need to be made...in particular prosecutors who withhold evidence and police who plant it should be the ones prosecuted. also I stand corrected, the appeal system needs to be looked at very closely.

the state executing a person is something that should be done only if there is overwhelming evidence of guilt.


with that being said I am still in favor of the death penalty in the most severe case and after a rigorous independent investigation, we should err on the side of certainty.

 

[thebigt]

Yep, I'm not saying we just sign a bill and now everybody accused gets tossed in a hole. There is a need to reform quite a bit at the level of police, courts, and prisons. Right now there are issues with all of them and we'd have more resources to address the issues if they all stopped wasting time on kids selling drugs on a corner.

isn't kids selling drugs on corners why many murders happen?

 

[ax1]

isn't kids selling drugs on corners why many murders happen?

Thats due to the War on Drugs empowering drug cartels and gangs. Leaving them alone and simply decriminalizing all drugs will take them out of the job. Maybe they will find crime elsewhere but we have to deal with that.

 

[Aleksandar37]

isn't kids selling drugs on corners why many murders happen?

Sure, but so is oil and I'm pretty sure we're not all driving Teslas.

 

[Aleksandar37]

Thats due to the War on Drugs empowering drug cartels and gangs. Leaving them alone and simply decriminalizing all drugs will take them out of the job. Maybe they will find crime elsewhere but we have to deal with that.

Yeah, there's always going to be a black market for something. It puzzles me how many people I've run into on these boards that freely talk about how they acquire illegal anabolics and rant about how big pharma doesn't want them to have their freedom, yet pump the brakes on any conversation about making other drugs legal.

 

[thebigt]

Yeah, there's always going to be a black market for something. It puzzles me how many people I've run into on these boards that freely talk about how they acquire illegal anabolics and rant about how big pharma doesn't want them to have their freedom, yet pump the brakes on any conversation about making other drugs legal.

there is hypocrisy everywhere...I often struggle with what I believe is right and being a Christian....the older I get the more gray area i see and very few things seem to be set in stone.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

Yeah, there's always going to be a black market for something. It puzzles me how many people I've run into on these boards that freely talk about how they acquire illegal anabolics and rant about how big pharma doesn't want them to have their freedom, yet pump the brakes on any conversation about making other drugs legal.

This. So much this. Just like being able to buy testosterone from a legitimate pharmacy is safer than buying it from the trunk of gym-bro’s car, buying drugs with an assurance of potency and purity from a pharmacy would be safer than buying them from your friendly neighborhood drug dealer and his gang of merry men. It’s not even like making them illegal stops people from using them. No one ever smoked weed when it was illegal, right? Prohibition worked so well too lol. It fixed our organized crime shortage. And how many people here buy steroids illegally?

 

[muscleupcrohn]

Yep, I'm not saying we just sign a bill and now everybody accused gets tossed in a hole. There is a need to reform quite a bit at the level of police, courts, and prisons. Right now there are issues with all of them and we'd have more resources to address the issues if they all stopped wasting time on kids selling drugs on a corner.

It really depends on what drugs the kids are selling. Weed? Whatever, but if you’re selling something laced with fentanyl, even if you claim to not know it, I have no sympathy for you. Especially if you were (illegally) armed while “conducting business.” I am generally for legalization of most things as a libertarian, but that’s a little different lol.

 

[thebigt]

It really depends on what drugs the kids are selling. Weed? Whatever, but if you’re selling something laced with fentanyl, even if you claim to not know it, I have no sympathy for you. Especially if you were (illegally) armed while “conducting business.” I am generally for legalization of most things as a libertarian, but that’s a little different lol.

this is where my hypocrisy really shines...I would be all in for legalization of EVERYTHING if it were only for me!!!


the unintended consequences scare the crap out of me, the people I see everyday are already stupid and dangerous enough without legalization of most things--can you imagine driving to work?

 

[muscleupcrohn]

this is where my hypocrisy really shines...I would be all in for legalization of EVERYTHING if it were only for me!!!


the unintended consequences scare the crap out of me, the people I see everyday are already stupid and dangerous enough without legalization of most things--can you imagine driving to work?

In all fairness, it'd still be illegal to drive on crack lol.

 

[justhere4comm]

Hell, drugs are illegal. Have you driven in Florida? Maybe they need the drugs legalized so the old farts will stay home and not endanger my $&@($ life by not staying in the lanes...

I will reiterate a short story I had shared a while back. My wife was having her license renewed and taking the eye exam. Next to her was an elderly lady taking her test. Well, she got quite a few wrong, and instead of not qualifying, the girl testing her said, try again dear... Are you snapping kidding me? She's goign to be on the road while I am one day possibly. Me on my bike, her in her 2000 pound death machine.

Give them drugs. Free of charge. Stay home and watch whatever on TV and order out.
Or, maybe I'll hit it big (pun) and they'll be rich; I won't die; and retire.

Either way. Legalize all of it.
LEAP: Law Enforcement Against Prohibition. Say G'night Gracie.

 

[thebigt]

Hell, drugs are illegal. Have you driven in Florida? Maybe they need the drugs legalized so the old farts will stay home and not endanger my $&@($ life by not staying in the lanes...

I will reiterate a short story I had shared a while back. My wife was having her license renewed and taking the eye exam. Next to her was an elderly lady taking her test. Well, she got quite a few wrong, and instead of not qualifying, the girl testing her said, try again dear... Are you snapping kidding me? She's goign to be on the road while I am one day possibly. Me on my bike, her in her 2000 pound death machine.

Give them drugs. Free of charge. Stay home and watch whatever on TV and order out.
Or, maybe I'll hit it big (pun) and they'll be rich; I won't die; and retire.

Either way. Legalize all of it.
LEAP: Law Enforcement Against Prohibition. Say G'night Gracie.

should lock the old people up in cages-eh?

 

[justhere4comm]

should lock the old people up in cages-eh?

How about don't give them a driver's license renewal until they can pass a vision test?
I am however against locking up anyone in cages, especially children.

 

[ax1]

How about don't give them a driver's license renewal until they can pass a vision test?
I am however against locking up anyone in cages, especially children.

+1 vote for children.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

How about don't give them a driver's license renewal until they can pass a vision test?
I am however against locking up anyone in cages, especially children.

Anyone? You’re against the very concept of jails? Lol jk.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

Side note, I LOVE when people say “I don’t believe in X.” What do you mean you don’t believe in it? Like someone saying “I don’t believe in guns.” You don’t get to say that. You can not believe in Santa. Or the tooth fairy. But guns exist.

 

[justhere4comm]

Anyone? You’re against the very concept of jails? Lol jk.

In a way, yes but not what the comment was about. I don't know the numbers of non-violent offenders, but remove the inscentive for prisons for profit and a great many of them would not be in prison. We create far worse criminals by putting them in prison, so yeah, I'm against it mostly.

Not to engage in a philisophical discussion of pseudo luxury prison phenoms around the world, but those inmates would still rather not be there. Treat people like human beings and not placing them in criminal training camps would be better, or do I mean, be best? lol.

 

[thebigt]

Hell, drugs are illegal. Have you driven in Florida? Maybe they need the drugs legalized so the old farts will stay home and not endanger my $&@($ life by not staying in the lanes...

I will reiterate a short story I had shared a while back. My wife was having her license renewed and taking the eye exam. Next to her was an elderly lady taking her test. Well, she got quite a few wrong, and instead of not qualifying, the girl testing her said, try again dear... Are you snapping kidding me? She's goign to be on the road while I am one day possibly. Me on my bike, her in her 2000 pound death machine.

Give them drugs. Free of charge. Stay home and watch whatever on TV and order out.
Or, maybe I'll hit it big (pun) and they'll be rich; I won't die; and retire.

Either way. Legalize all of it.
LEAP: Law Enforcement Against Prohibition. Say G'night Gracie.

don't lock them up in cages just drug old people and force them to stay in their houses watching tv then-eh?

 

[justhere4comm]

don't lock them up in cages just drug old people and force them to stay in their houses watching tv then-eh?

There is something wrong with you. lol.

 

[thebigt]

In a way, yes but not what the comment was about. I don't know the numbers of non-violent offenders, but remove the inscentive for prisons for profit and a great many of them would not be in prison. We create far worse criminals by putting them in prison, so yeah, I'm against it mostly.

Not to engage in a philisophical discussion of pseudo luxury prison phenoms around the world, but those inmates would still rather not be there. Treat people like human beings and not placing them in criminal training camps would be better, or do I mean, be best? lol.

lol...are you kidding me,please tell me you are using those drugs you want to be legal.

treat people like human beings?...tell that to their victims, the ones in cemeterys or suffering from ptsd after being gang raped.

 

[thebigt]

There is something wrong with you. lol.

I am quoting what you posted and there is something wrong with me????

why don't you go back and read that stupid post you made.

 

[justhere4comm]

I am quoting what you posted and there is something wrong with me????

why don't you go back and read that stupid post you made.

Haha, you mad at something bro. Here, this old guy can go to jail, and no more drugs for him.

Invalid Link Removed

 

[muscleupcrohn]

In a way, yes but not what the comment was about. I don't know the numbers of non-violent offenders, but remove the inscentive for prisons for profit and a great many of them would not be in prison. We create far worse criminals by putting them in prison, so yeah, I'm against it mostly.

Not to engage in a philisophical discussion of pseudo luxury prison phenoms around the world, but those inmates would still rather not be there. Treat people like human beings and not placing them in criminal training camps would be better, or do I mean, be best? lol.

I was joking man. I agree way too many nonviolent criminals are in prison, but that doesn’t change the fact that a serial rapist, a career armed robber, a murderer, etc. probably don’t deserve resort-quality lodging for 50+ years. But yeah, putting nonviolent criminals in prison sort of sets them up to escalate to actual violent offenses.

Edit: victimless is a better discussion than nonviolent. You can still REALLY **** up multiple people’s lives in a nonviolent way. But getting caught smoking pot at home is victimless.

 

[justhere4comm]

I was joking man. I agree way too many nonviolent criminals are in prison, but that doesn’t change the fact that a serial rapist, a career armed robber, a murderer, etc. probably don’t deserve resort-quality lodging for 50+ years. But yeah, putting nonviolent criminals in prison sort of sets them up to escalate to actual violent offenses.

Edit: victimless is a better discussion than nonviolent. You can still REALLY **** up multiple people’s lives in a nonviolent way. But getting caught smoking pot at home is victimless.

Oh sure, I realise that. The whole non-violent / victimless can be addressed with maybe house arrest / fine or make it legal progression. The benefactors are the prisons for profit which are motivation.

 

[thebigt]

I was joking man. I agree way too many nonviolent criminals are in prison, but that doesn’t change the fact that a serial rapist, a career armed robber, a murderer, etc. probably don’t deserve resort-quality lodging for 50+ years. But yeah, putting nonviolent criminals in prison sort of sets them up to escalate to actual violent offenses.

Edit: victimless is a better discussion than nonviolent. You can still REALLY **** up multiple people’s lives in a nonviolent way. But getting caught smoking pot at home is victimless.

smoking a joint at home is different than while driving....just like drinking and driving, you endanger the lives of my family I want your ass locked up in a cage!!! unfortunately their are too many repeat offenders who keep doing it until they kill, because they don't lock them up in cages where they belong!!!

your right to smoke a joint or drink can take a backseat to my family's safety when it comes to driving.


you drink and drive or drug and drive your ass belongs in a cage!!!

 

[muscleupcrohn]

Oh sure, I realise that. The whole non-violent / victimless can be addressed with maybe house arrest / fine or make it legal progression. The benefactors are the prisons for profit which are motivation.

So someone who commits a nonviolent crime that destroys the lives of a ton of people a la Bernie Madoff should only get house arrest? There is a HUGE, MASSIVE, GARGANTUAN, TITANIC difference between a VICTIMLESS crime and a NONVIOLENT one.

Smoking weed in your house is VICTIMLESS. No one is, or could be, harmed.

Running a $50 billion+ Ponzi scheme is NONVIOLENT, but there are a a plethora of victims.

Someone who destroys many lives in a malicious and intentional manner deserves jail, not house arrest in their mansion.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

smoking a joint at home is different than while driving....just like drinking and driving, you endanger the lives of my family I want your ass locked up in a cage!!! unfortunately their are too many repeat offenders who keep doing it until they kill, because they don't lock them up in cages where they belong!!!

your right to smoke a joint or drink can take a backseat to my family's safety when it comes to driving.


you drink and drive or drug and drive your ass belongs in a cage!!!

Why are you yelling at me lol. I said at home. Smoking at home puts no one at risk. Smoking and driving does, so runs the inherent risk of not being victimless. Therefore it’s entirely different.

 

[thebigt]

How about don't give them a driver's license renewal until they can pass a vision test?
I am however against locking up anyone in cages, especially children.

rapist's murderers child molesters...you don't want to lock them up in cages-eh?

 

[thebigt]

Why are you yelling at me lol. I said at home. Smoking at home puts no one at risk. Smoking and driving does, so runs the inherent risk of not being victimless. Therefore it’s entirely different.

ok...we are on the same page then.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

isn't that what I said?...don't tell me you are suffering from lack of reading comprehension also...I suggest you reread my post.

I was just talking about your response to me having a ton of exclamation points.

 

[justhere4comm]

So someone who commits a nonviolent crime that destroys the lives of a ton of people a la Bernie Madoff should only get house arrest? There is a HUGE, MASSIVE, GARGANTUAN, TITANIC difference between a VICTIMLESS crime and a NONVIOLENT one.

Smoking weed in your house is VICTIMLESS. No one is, or could be, harmed.

Running a $50 billion+ Ponzi scheme is NONVIOLENT, but there are a a plethora of victims.

Someone who destroys many lives in a malicious and intentional manner deserves jail, not house arrest in their mansion.

My man.
Oh sure, I realise that. The whole non-violent / victimless can be addressed with maybe house arrest / fine or make it legal progression. So, the escelation in crime (non-violent) based on victims and severity. I'm not savvy with that topic as referred to victimless crimes (Financial), now we are in a philisophical discussion. Where to put them. How many of those people are in prison?

We are on the same field and quite in line with regard to the housing bubble and people who lost their homes because of the bankers who not only got bailed out, but gave themselves bonuses. So, right on with what you stated for sure. I'm not married to the entire scope of non-violent offenders versus victemless and am open to learning about it. It's a solid discussion. There are more than enough victimeless 'criminals' in jail that would offset the balance of true injustice. They could be out there making a contribution.

rapist's murderers child molesters...you don't want to lock them up in cages-eh?

LOL. What? Those are all violent crimes. You're playing hockey with a footbal while skydiving and wearing scuba gear... yeah.

 

[thebigt]

I was just talking about your response to me having a ton of exclamation points.

lol….I like exclamation points, what can I say!!!!

 

[thebigt]

My man.
Oh sure, I realise that. The whole non-violent / victimless can be addressed with maybe house arrest / fine or make it legal progression. So, the escelation in crime (non-violent) based on victims and severity. I'm not savvy with that topic as referred to victimless crimes (Financial), now we are in a philisophical discussion. Where to put them. How many of those people are in prison?

We are on the same field and quite in line with regard to the housing bubble and people who lost their homes because of the bankers who not only got bailed out, but gave themselves bonuses. So, right on with what you stated for sure. I'm not married to the entire scope of non-violent offenders versus victemless and am open to learning about it. It's a solid discussion. There are more than enough victimeless 'criminals' in jail that would offset the balance of true injustice. They could be out there making a contribution.




LOL. What? Those are all violent crimes. You're playing hockey with a footbal while skydiving and wearing scuba gear... yeah.

lol...you are kidding right? you just said you are against locking ANYONE in cages...:jester:

 

[muscleupcrohn]

My man.
Oh sure, I realise that. The whole non-violent / victimless can be addressed with maybe house arrest / fine or make it legal progression. So, the escelation in crime (non-violent) based on victims and severity. I'm not savvy with that topic as referred to victimless crimes (Financial), now we are in a philisophical discussion. Where to put them. How many of those people are in prison?

We are on the same field and quite in line with regard to the housing bubble and people who lost their homes because of the bankers who not only got bailed out, but gave themselves bonuses. So, right on with what you stated for sure. I'm not married to the entire scope of non-violent offenders versus victemless and am open to learning about it. It's a solid discussion. There are more than enough victimeless 'criminals' in jail that would offset the balance of true injustice. They could be out there making a contribution.




LOL. What? Those are all violent crimes. You're playing hockey with a footbal while skydiving and wearing scuba gear... yeah.

In simplest terms, if a “crime” harms no one, and has no potential to harm anyone, then there is no victim, and it is a victimless crime. Examples include smoking pot at home and illegally collecting rainwater on your property.

A nonviolent crime may be victimless, see the above examples, but it is not inherently victimless. Examples include Ponzi schemes, and Nigerian prince email scams. Or on a more likely example, identity theft and credit card fraud.

There is contention to this next point, but I posit that if a crime carries the POTENTIAL to become violent, it is a violent crime. For example, if I rob your house and it happens to be empty, there was no violence, but robbing a house inherently means a potential to become violent, even deadly. Similarly, drunk driving doesn’t always become violent (cause physical harm), but it inherently has the possibility to injure/kill people. So ANY robbery or DUI is a violent crime in my book.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

lol….I like exclamation points, what can I say!!!!

 

[thebigt]

In simplest terms, if a “crime” harms no one, and has no potential to harm anyone, then there is no victim, and it is a victimless crime. Examples include smoking pot at home and illegally collecting rainwater on your property.

A nonviolent crime may be victimless, see the above examples, but it is not inherently victimless. Examples include Ponzi schemes, and Nigerian prince email scams. Or on a more likely example, identity theft and credit card fraud.

There is contention to this next point, but I posit that if a crime carries the POTENTIAL to become violent, it is a violent crime. For example, if I rob your house and it happens to be empty, there was no violence, but robbing a house inherently means a potential to become violent, even deadly. Similarly, drunk driving doesn’t always become violent (cause physical harm), but it inherently has the possibility to injure/kill people. So ANY robbery or DUI is a violent crime in my book.

you can't rob a empty house...robbery occurs to a person...a empty house is burglary. but there is the potential to be robbery if someone is unexpectedly home, so burglary falls into the potential of being a violent crime.

 

[Aleksandar37]

Hell, drugs are illegal. Have you driven in Florida? Maybe they need the drugs legalized so the old farts will stay home and not endanger my $&@($ life by not staying in the lanes...

They are on drugs, just legal ones. They're bad everywhere, but Florida seems to have the highest concentration.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

you can't rob a empty house...robbery occurs to a person...a empty house is burglary. but there is the potential to be robbery if someone is unexpectedly home, so burglary falls into the potential of being a violent crime.

Ok. You know what I mean; burglary has the inherent possibility of violence, and is therefore violent, just as a DUI doesn’t always lead to bodily harm, but it inherently has that possibility.

 

[thebigt]

Ok. You know what I mean; burglary has the inherent possibility of violence, and is therefore violent, just as a DUI doesn’t always lead to bodily harm, but it inherently has that possibility.

I know, just felt like playing...time for bed but i'm on vacation this week so I might be back for some more sandbox playtime tomorrow.

 

[Aleksandar37]

I know, just felt like playing...time for bed but i'm on vacation this week so I might be back for some more sandbox playtime tomorrow.

Clearing my calendar!

 

[Aleksandar37]

Back in Trump land...no big surprise since he worked with Mattis, but the Pentagon chief of staff has resigned. It's going to be an interesting year!

 

[thebigt]

Clearing my calendar!

my wife and I picked up our 5 year old granddaughter from school today and took her to her gymnastics class...then went to ihop for Belgian waffles with all the trimmings. diet went out the window but had a great time.

 

[Studhorse]

my wife and I picked up our 5 year old granddaughter from school today and took her to her gymnastics class...then went to ihop for Belgian waffles with all the trimmings. diet went out the window but had a great time.

Grand kids will do that! It's a great excuse however! got to be a Grandpa!

 

[thebigt]

Grand kids will do that! It's a great excuse however! got to be a Grandpa!

you bet...this is 1st vacation in quite awhile. usually I am limited to weekends, holidays or occasions to spend time with grandkids...it was a real treat!!!

 

[Studhorse]

you bet...this is 1st vacation in quite awhile. usually I am limited to weekends, holidays or occasions to spend time with grandkids...it was a real treat!!!

Grandkids are the best!

 

[thebigt]

Grandkids are the best!

oh, man...I spoil em rotten, but my wife has me beat by a mile. I don't think the word no is in her vocabulary when it comes to the grandkids!!! I didn't have a lot as a kid, it's nice to be able to do things for the kids/grandkids!!!