deca and test E

[mattk15]

gonna run a deca. test e and var cycle this fall/winter. Gonna front load the test at 750 for the first two wks and finish at 500 a wk. just wanting some input on the deca. Ive done some research and some say 400 a wk and some say 500. 500 would be easier to load. just curious what you guys would suggest. Gonna run at least 12 wks, maybe 14. this will be my third cycle, but first time with deca. Have my AI( anastrozole) and my PCT ( nolva) on hand

 

[Mathb33]

Cycle history just so we can give proper advices?

 

[mattk15]

Cycle history just so we can give proper advices?

my first was just test E. 500 a wk for 10 wks, went decent, my second was 12 wks, sustanon ,750 first 2 wks, then 500 the rest and var, a mix of 50 and 75 mg, good results with that one. this will be my third cycle

 

[Mathb33]

It really depends what ratio you like and if you’re a believer of high test with nandrolone or not. Personally for NPP I’ve always liked my test lower than my nandrolone as it helps control sides and estrogen. At the end of the day there’s no good answer... 5:5 would be fine so would 4:6 ( test to deca) but so would 4:5. Hell some people run test twice higher than deca... which is pretty stupid to me but to each their own I guess. If you wanna keep it simple 500mg of each idk. Make sure you’re ready to control prolactin and estrogen.

 

[Nac]

Yeah Id do 500:500, if for no other reason than its guaranteed results and not *too* excessive. 1ml of each twice a week, easy (assuming 250mg ml for each).

Id be inclined to maybe increase AI dose (whatever you ran for 750mg tesr, run for this). And have ralox at the very least on hand as an extra.

 

[CroLifter]

Not sure about nandrolone but as far as trenbolone goes people seem to grow better on higher test because of more estrogen and igf 1.

If you take a look at some studies, testosterone only builds more muscle than either of 19 nors used by themselves, due to estrogen conversion and higher igf 1.

But a stack blows test only out of the water obviously.


Of course, higher test doesnt literally mean that test needs to be higher than the other 19 nor, if you are running 700mg of tren or npp test doesnt need to be at a gram, 500 will still provide more than enough estrogen to support growth.

It just means that you need an adequate dose of test to hit those high levels of estrogen which will support growth and igf 1 production.

 

[Whisky]

I ran deca test c at 400:400 last winter and liked it.

planning to do 500:500 this winter. As above either are gonna work.

personally I use orals as a kicker rather than front loading test (no technical reason, just always have) - probably looking at adrol next winter for that

 

[CroLifter]

I ran deca test c at 400:400 last winter and liked it.

planning to do 500:500 this winter. As above either are gonna work.

personally I use orals as a kicker rather than front loading test (no technical reason, just always have) - probably looking at adrol next winter for that

A bombs


I personally like to start off lighter as i grow anyway and increase as time goes by as it gets harder and harder to grow.


Not a fan of orals, so I would love to try some test suspension or base in oil.

 

[UNX]

Once question related to test/deca cycles: should you stop the deca 2 weeks before the test? Deca is a very long ester.

 

[CroLifter]

Once question related to test/deca cycles: should you stop the deca 2 weeks before the test? Deca is a very long ester.

I would personally do this, i honestly like to end with just test, like this cycle i stopped tren and continued with test only for a bit more.

Unless it sth low suppressive like proviron or mast then i would run that also to the end.

 

[bad rad]

I've done 500 Test with 300 Deca and 250 Test with 450 NPP. I liked both but think diet played a bigger role in results. I've noticed less 19-Nor sides with a DHT derivative included too but mostly with Tren. As suggested, I'd stop the Deca 2 weeks before the cycle ends. On paper it shouldn't matter but in personal practice it helps transition into PCT.

 

[CroLifter]

I've done 500 Test with 300 Deca and 250 Test with 450 NPP. I liked both but think diet played a bigger role in results. I've noticed less 19-Nor sides with a DHT derivative included too but mostly with Tren. As suggested, I'd stop the Deca 2 weeks before the cycle ends. On paper it shouldn't matter but in personal practice it helps transition into PCT.

Cant emphasize the diet enough!

Often times we get caught up in these drug protocols when in fact its all the other stuff that we are doing on the cycle are going to determine 80% of the gains we get.

test, npp, tren...they are all going to catalyze what we are doing anyway.

 

[StarScream66]

Sounds like a good cycle. One thing you didn't mention was how long you were planning on taking the var for. Just FYI, the var is only meant to be taken in a 6 week cycle max, not throughout the whole thing.

 

[Whisky]

I've done 500 Test with 300 Deca and 250 Test with 450 NPP. I liked both but think diet played a bigger role in results. I've noticed less 19-Nor sides with a DHT derivative included too but mostly with Tren. As suggested, I'd stop the Deca 2 weeks before the cycle ends. On paper it shouldn't matter but in personal practice it helps transition into PCT.

stopping the longer Ester earlier is definitely sensible. The best strategy I’ve seen is to switch to NPP and test prop for the last 3-4 weeks so when you stop everything clears much quicker and your natural production can start quicker (I.e less time with low test levels).

 

[Rocket3015]

Threads like this remind me how clueless I am when it comes to roids !!

 

[Codybenz]

Make sure to have caber and cialis/viagra on hand.

 

[CroLifter]

Make sure to have caber and cialis/viagra on hand.

Cialis and/or viagra wont do anything if libido is non-existent

Been there done it.


All cialis did for me in combination with caber was drop my blood pressure to 95/55 where i felt like i was gonna pass out if i even sat up so i decided to pound salt water throughout the evening because i was worried bp would drop too much during my sleep and possibility of me going into a shock.

Heart rate also went down to low 40s, was feeling really unwell. Really bad experience, so i said no more caber or cialis for me


Also i found out i dont need caber for nipple issues. For me at least its all about controlling estrogen, mainly avoiding massive doses of hcg.

This time was running test, tren, mk677 no ai no inhibit p nothing, and i had 0 nipple issues. Probably because i skipped the darn hcg.

 

[Whisky]

Cialis and/or viagra wont do anything if libido is non-existent

Been there done it.


All cialis did for me in combination with caber was drop my blood pressure to 95/55 where i felt like i was gonna pass out if i even sat up so i decided to pound salt water throughout the evening because i was worried bp would drop too much during my sleep and possibility of me going into a shock.

Heart rate also went down to low 40s, was feeling really unwell. Really bad experience, so i said no more caber or cialis for me


Also i found out i dont need caber for nipple issues. For me at least its all about controlling estrogen, mainly avoiding massive doses of hcg.

This time was running test, tren, mk677 no ai no inhibit p nothing, and i had 0 nipple issues. Probably because i skipped the darn hcg.

interesting you’ve found that. I don’t have a libido issue at all but I do like cialis and find even if I’m not bang up for it (or I’ve beat the meat a few hours before) I’m rock solid without fail for days.

now viagra the strength of the erection was unbelievable (I literally thought my cock my explode) but the effect on my sinuses makes it not worth it for me (that said I’ve never suffered from Ed some would re evaluate if that were the case)

 

[CroLifter]

interesting you’ve found that. I don’t have a libido issue at all but I do like cialis and find even if I’m not bang up for it (or I’ve beat the meat a few hours before) I’m rock solid without fail for days.

now viagra the strength of the erection was unbelievable (I literally thought my cock my explode) but the effect on my sinuses makes it not worth it for me (that said I’ve never suffered from Ed some would re evaluate if that were the case)

Well if the brain - d1ck axis works correctly then sure they will help.

I dont have practically any sensitivity on cycle for some reason. It seems to also be an issue with guys on trt as i managed to dig up, if tuey increase their dose a bit libido and erections go down in the dumps.

And with me its not an estrogen issue as i feel worse when i take an AI, feel completely dull.

It could be the prolactin from mk677. But caber doesnt help (didnt in the past) so hm, who knows maybe i am simply wired that way. I honestly 100% never felt the urge to masturbate.




Just wanted to say that they (cialis/viagra) will not help the libido, and many guys who experience low libido on cycle seem to think they can rely on a pde5 inhibitor when in fact they cant

 

[Whisky]

Well if the brain - d1ck axis works correctly then sure they will help.

Just wanted to say that they will not help the libido, and many guys who experience low libido on cycle seem to think they can rely on a pde5 inhibitor when in fact they cant

fair point, I hadn’t looked at it from that point as I’ve not been in zero libido position for a long time (first pct) and didn’t try anything then as I was still able get it up.

 

[Codybenz]

Cialis and/or viagra wont do anything if libido is non-existent

Been there done it.


All cialis did for me in combination with caber was drop my blood pressure to 95/55 where i felt like i was gonna pass out if i even sat up so i decided to pound salt water throughout the evening because i was worried bp would drop too much during my sleep and possibility of me going into a shock.

Heart rate also went down to low 40s, was feeling really unwell. Really bad experience, so i said no more caber or cialis for me


Also i found out i dont need caber for nipple issues. For me at least its all about controlling estrogen, mainly avoiding massive doses of hcg.

This time was running test, tren, mk677 no ai no inhibit p nothing, and i had 0 nipple issues. Probably because i skipped the darn hcg.

Don’t take this the wrong way. But I think you experience the worst of everything, lol.

yes I know pde5 inhibitors do not raise libido just help with erections. However most people that experience “deca Dick” do not have a lack of desire to have sex, they want to, they just can’t get an erection. Which is where cialis and viagra come in.

I would not run any 19nor with out having caber on hand or some other prolactin control on hand. Period. If you don’t need it great but if you do and don’t have it, it’s really bad.

And the vast majority of people don’t have any issues with cabergoline.

 

[CroLifter]

Don’t take this the wrong way. But I think you experience the worst of everything, lol.

yes I know pde5 inhibitors do not raise libido just help with erections. However most people that experience “deca Dick” do not have a lack of desire to have sex, they want to, they just can’t get an erection. Which is where cialis and viagra come in.

I would not run any 19nor with out having caber on hand or some other prolactin control on hand. Period. If you don’t need it great but if you do and don’t have it, it’s really bad.

And the vast majority of people don’t have any issues with cabergoline.

As far as i know, some DHN gets into the penile tissue and since it occupies the receptor yet it cant express androgenic effects effects fully since it is weak, orevents one from getting a strong erection.

I just dont see how cabergoline can help with that. In my opinion having sufficient amount of DHT is the way to go.

Perhaps cabergoline increases sex drive via the other pathway (prolactin inhibition / dopamine elevation) so in a sense it kinda counteracts the issues nandrolone can cause.

But pharmacologically speakijgni simply dont see how cabergoline could help directly at the source of the issue, imho only sufficient amount of DHT can remedy that.





As far as me having libido issues, i think it is to be expected that messing with the hormones can lead to impaired libido and erection quality. Such are the rules of the game.

 

[Codybenz]

Well if the lack of libido is due to high prolactin which is associated with 19 nors then yes cabergoline can help.

however I was recommending caber to control prolactin not specifically for libido as I know there is debate on what exactly causes deca dick. But nobody wants to lactate from a 19 nor. Which anecdotal evidence shows happens often. 19nors mess with prolactin, period. No reason to not be prepared.

I also would run proviron as I agree with your dht statement, this helps me tremendously.

 

[CroLifter]

Well if the lack of libido is due to high prolactin which is associated with 19 nors then yes cabergoline can help.

however I was recommending caber to control prolactin not specifically for libido as I know there is debate on what exactly causes deca dick. But nobody wants to lactate from a 19 nor. Which anecdotal evidence shows happens often. 19nors mess with prolactin, period. No reason to not be prepared.

I also would run proviron as I agree with your dht statement, this helps me tremendously.

I just want to add that even testosterone will raise prolactin.

I think i watched a video from dave crossland on the topic, how all AAS are eventually going to elevate prolactin due to their interaction with dopamine receptor or sth like that.

We are talking super pharmacological doses here of course, not legit mid range trt.

It definitely did in my case.