deca and or npp weight gain versus recomp v cut

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
I know this one will be one of those questions that are kind of dumb, but as they saying goes "the dumbest question is the one not asked".

So next cycle is coming up and based on things i can get my hands on i was going to run eq or deca and poss an oral kickstarter. Now may people do run deca to gain size, but some people are small and really need to gain size.

During my first run with bodybuilding I naturally was about 217 at 8% bodyfat and in pretty good shape. I ended up not going all the way with it as I got involved in sports in college and the diet and such went to hell and then i got a sit on my ass job at a bank. Long story short I took like 17 years away from the gym. When i returned at 38 years old I was 400lbs and Doctor was VERY CONCERNED. I had high triglycerides ( still do and she told me that was genetic more than weight and diet), high cholesterol and borderline dabetic. this sounded really out of whack but by bf% was like 39%??????

Well I have gotten myself down to my football playing weight of 300lbs ( bulked up to that in college) and i have had my bodyfat meassured at 18.5% but that was at 320. I am guessing i am about 16-16.5%. NO more cholesterol meds and no diabetes. I did this by hard training and also better choices in eating. I will say i eat more like a semi-in shape powerlifter in the heavier weight classes or in shape offensive/defensive linemen. I am on trt so I am already on gear and have done two test only cycles. If you count the trt doses i have ran a 450mg 12 weeker and a 600-650mg 14 weeker. Seems i get stronger but have not put on weight on cycle an except for minor acne have not really had any side effects. A couple times when I have been on cycle ( only ran two and have been on trt 1 year now) my blood pressure was "A tad high, but nothing to worry about" HBP does run in my family thought. High tryglcerides is the only health issue i have and i am on medication that controls it. All medical professioanls i see are ware including my trt doc. I do some bodyguard work so I am not really interested in shrinking but I dont want to carry the kind of off season look the pros do. Goals are really a good "off season" look

So at first I had planned on running this cycle
500 mg test ( plus 200mg trt) a week total 700 I would assume i should count it as. I have a habit of not counting trt dose 15-16 weeks
500-600mg eq week 15-16 weeks
30mg dbol for 33 days as a kicker

Well after reading and watching various videos on youtube it seems that deca is the go to second compound when you do your first stack
500mg test ( plus 200 trt) 15-16 weeks
400mg deca 15-16 weeks
30 mg dboll for 33 days as a kicker

So as happens often people get confused and I got confused. So The main thing I am wondering is will deca and dbol guarantee a huge weight gain particualarly the kind that will increase pant size and so forth if i keep my eating smart.

My understanding is guys back in the 70s used deca to prepare for shows so i figure guys could get lean from it depending on dose.
Now I am concerned about my hair as why masteron had not been looked at and with my lack of experience i figure i want to do at least two more cycles before i try tren. If any has ideas for other compounds please feel free. I have been told sdrol or dmz in place of dbol could result in leaner gains. One other friend was telling me since I have not had much sides with test that maybe go up to 750mg test ( plus 200trt) and see how that works and then add a compound.

I have clen, but am not really sure how to use it so i possibly will do a 12 week eca stack run. The way i often do it is one yohimbe with my first dose then two more eca and the a is only 81mg.

Thanks.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
6 even. Like i said built like a player. I should mention i have always huge legs compared to other guys.
 
dezzy84

dezzy84

Member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
OK. I'd be thinking cutting, lower bodyfat etc if I were in your position. I definately wouldn't be doing dianabol. I think if you get your bodyfat low/body comp change, you will be happier. Also for health reasons.

Think a leaner meaner you. Look are Joe Thomas former O lineman for the Browns. Guy looks great. Sounds like you have plenty of size.

I'd really focus on my diet, stick to test maybe some GH and something MAYBE something like anavar or winstrol if you wanna spice it up a little.
 
dezzy84

dezzy84

Member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
OK. I'd be thinking cutting, lower bodyfat etc if I were in your position. I definately wouldn't be doing dianabol. I think if you get your bodyfat low/body comp change, you will be happier. Also for health reasons.

Think a leaner meaner you. Look are Joe Thomas former O lineman for the Browns. Guy looks great. Sounds like you have plenty of size.

I'd really focus on my diet, stick to test maybe some GH and something MAYBE something like anavar or winstrol if you wanna spice it up a little.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Ok. so i will save the dboll. Sounds like deca is out. I know eq is more for size for many. Teh thing then is what about sdrol or dmz for a kicker? Oh if this helps any i am in better shape than many of the strongmen out there. I am concerned about health, but since i am 44 i also want to gain the muscle while i have the youth. There is not a history of Cancer, but GH is something i am not planning on fooling with. I have thought about finding out which peptides work the best. I once asked about mk677 and was told for the cost to run more gear.
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
Your TRT dose always counts for overall intake. Everything counts.

You sound like you wanna build muscle, but not gain weight or bodyfat. That’s called recompostioning, and is largely done through the addition of drugs, cardio, and nutrition manipulation. You need to eat a bit more and be a bit more active for that to really work.

I would not be jumping from 650mg/wk total to 1,300mg total test and eq or deca. That’s double the gear, and overkill. Why not try 500 total test and 4-500mg deca or eq, respectively? That’s still a big step up in drug use per week and you are going to see the changes over 4 months. Eq will probably make you hold less water and less likely to have libido sides.

Adding some cardio and limiting your carbs to pre, intra, post workout and maybe the meal after that are probably good ideas. And don’t jack your calories up a bunch just because you go on cycle. You need to lose some bodyfat to recomp and ultimately look better at the same weight.
 
Cmseabee24

Cmseabee24

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
I was gonna suggest just doing test and EQ maybe 300 test 600 EQ you can still cut you will stay very lean and gains will be solid with EQ. Whatever you do don’t throw a 19nor in there. You could also end your cycle with anavar or winstrol. Or both maybe 40mg of var and 25-50 of winstrol for 4 weeks maybe 6 if your gonna get bloodwork. You will make huge changes but your diet has to be 95% strict. Find a good macro balance for each meal and weight your food and just cook bulk so all your meals have same macros making it easier. It sucks eating the same **** but when I do my body responds best.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
HYDE

Thanks

I will include trt does now. So my first cycle was 500mg and second was 650mg.

So i guess I should use 500mg total test 300 etra and 200 trt for this cycle?

I thought about just running 300mg deca a week to see how the body reacts? Thoughts on that?

Yes recomp is what i am looking for. Now a few lbs of fat with lots of muscle is ok. Even if its solid muslce i would not want to blow up more than 20lbs total from a cycle.

I do cardio typically 1 hour 3 times per week on the treadmill. Never mentioned it but thought it was standard I guess not everyone does it.

Cmseabee24

Yeah i am leaning towards the eq at 500-600mg. I need to check the exp date on dbol. my understanding is its pretty hard for it to go bad unless it is like years. I menber here mentioned turnibol as a kicker, but the sources i use have some coming in. I was figuring as good as the deca/test/dbol stack is that i wanted to get in on it when i would make the most gains, which i understand is when you are starting. I guess its on of those devils deals of the mass and power but the water and fat.

Once source has a deca/eq mix 200mg each. I had wondered if 200mg would not be that bad do a shot of that a week and 300mg of eq and then the 400mg test ( 200extra 200 trt) just to see how deca will work. I have a hunch i am going to do the eq.

I have two bottles of cardarine 10mg eacth. I am wondering if there is a benefit of throwing that in. I have clen ut am not sure how to use it and will probably do the eca stack with yohimbie once per day with this.

Thanks guys really appreciate the help.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
HYDE

Thanks

I will include trt does now. So my first cycle was 500mg and second was 650mg.

So i guess I should use 500mg total test 300 etra and 200 trt for this cycle?

I thought about just running 300mg deca a week to see how the body reacts? Thoughts on that?

Yes recomp is what i am looking for. Now a few lbs of fat with lots of muscle is ok. Even if its solid muslce i would not want to blow up more than 20lbs total from a cycle.

I do cardio typically 1 hour 3 times per week on the treadmill. Never mentioned it but thought it was standard I guess not everyone does it.

Cmseabee24

Yeah i am leaning towards the eq at 500-600mg. I need to check the exp date on dbol. my understanding is its pretty hard for it to go bad unless it is like years. I menber here mentioned turnibol as a kicker, but the sources i use have some coming in. I was figuring as good as the deca/test/dbol stack is that i wanted to get in on it when i would make the most gains, which i understand is when you are starting. I guess its on of those devils deals of the mass and power but the water and fat.

Once source has a deca/eq mix 200mg each. I had wondered if 200mg would not be that bad do a shot of that a week and 300mg of eq and then the 400mg test ( 200extra 200 trt) just to see how deca will work. I have a hunch i am going to do the eq.

I have two bottles of cardarine 10mg eacth. I am wondering if there is a benefit of throwing that in. I have clen ut am not sure how to use it and will probably do the eca stack with yohimbie once per day with this.

Thanks guys really appreciate the help.
 
bad rad

bad rad

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
What's your waist circumference at the navel? If it's over 40" focus on cutting weight. You're not getting younger and that specific measurement is a good predictor of potential longevity. Navel circumference is tied directly to visceral fat levels.
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
I would go with EQ over deca for sure since I don’t need to worry about prolactin control or decadick that way.

I would leave Clen alone for now, that’s for serious cutting. Used for a recomp you’re just going to end up having to eat more. And it’s bad for your heart. And counterproductive even to a lean bulk.

You could even just add 600 eq to your TRT dose and just see how that goes over several months.

Cardarine has no noticeable impact on fat burning - it’s useful for increasing training endurance taken preWO and for positively affecting your cholesterol profile. I only use 10mg per day for up to 10 weeks.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Thanks guys. Ill try to get that meassurement. I am pretty sure its over 40 though. The thing is am more interested in a strongman build and power. I mean i was accused of being on gear totally natural so i always was a big guy. I am guessing that now that i am on gear my "lean" build would be over 250. which would be ok. I treated myself to one honey bun ( okay 1.5 as the golden retriever had half) and am already thinking of a treat when i get to 280.

And the eq takes it. Way too many advising it. Ill hold off on deca till under 12% bodyfat. and for a kicker i am thinking if i can find epistaine or dmz or turnibol.
 
Hyde

Hyde

Legend
Awards
5
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
  • First Up Vote
You can order DMZ from board sponsor Vicious Labs. Great recomp compound, best of the 3 you listed for that in my experience.
 
bad rad

bad rad

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
You can be big, strong, and lean. Look at Mariusz Pudzianowski. Most of the WSM competitors are dropping fat these days while getting stronger. Hafthor Bjornsson switched to the Vertical diet and dropped a lot of fat while still winning. The Body Opus plan is another great one for recomp but it will take longer than pure fat loss based eating. I used to treat diet the same way through my 20-30s and finally accepted it was an excuse it eat crappy. I always said I'd lose it later, later got here and it's way harder now.

As little as 300mg Test and 10mg M-sten will maintain muscle while recomping. High triglycerides is a sign of too many carbs, usually sugar, in the diet.
 
Last edited:

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
You can order DMZ from board sponsor Vicious Labs. Great recomp compound, best of the 3 you listed for that in my experience.
I need to look back up the password. Yeah they are good guys from what everyone says.

You can be big, strong, and lean. Look at Mariusz Pudzianowski. Most of the WSM competitors are dropping fat these days while getting stronger. Hafthor Bjornsson switched to the Vertical diet and dropped a lot of fat while still winning. The Body Opus plan is another great one for recomp but it will take longer than pure fat loss based eating. I used to treat diet the same way through my 20-30s and finally accepted it was an excuse it eat crappy. I always said I'd lose it later, later got here and it's way harder now.

As little as 300mg Test and 10mg M-sten will maintain muscle while recomping. High triglycerides is a sign of too many carbs, usually sugar, in the diet.
Thanks man. I am going to check them out. I am not an MD, but my doc said the high tryglycerides was more genetic as i asked if losing weight would help. it did help the cholesterol and borderline diabetes though. Now m-stem i had not thought of but I think that is a wet compound right?

I am going to read up on those diets.
 
bad rad

bad rad

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
M-sten is a little like Superdrol-lite. It's dry but not quite as potent mg per mg. Was your Doc overweight? They're not trained in diet unless a specialist. Triglycerides are fats your body wants to use as energy but if your carb intake is too high they float around until the body can find somewhere to store them like the belly, around organs, in the organs (fatty liver), or in the arteries when extreme.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
M-sten is a little like Superdrol-lite. It's dry but not quite as potent mg per mg. Was your Doc overweight? They're not trained in diet unless a specialist. Triglycerides are fats your body wants to use as energy but if your carb intake is too high they float around until the body can find somewhere to store them like the belly, around organs, in the organs (fatty liver), or in the arteries when extreme.
Not too much, but a little plump, so i get the weight down the trigylcerides might go away as well? Sounds good. I really hear deca, dbol, test is good, but i am going hold off on that for at least another 20lbs weight loss. The funny thing is i have been losing weight since on gear and that includes trt.
 
Cmseabee24

Cmseabee24

Member
Awards
2
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
Not too much, but a little plump, so i get the weight down the trigylcerides might go away as well? Sounds good. I really hear deca, dbol, test is good, but i am going hold off on that for at least another 20lbs weight loss. The funny thing is i have been losing weight since on gear and that includes trt.
Just cause your on gear doesn’t mean you can’t lose weight. Gear is good when dropping weight to preserve muscle.
 

jtbull

Active member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
That for all the help guys. I was checking out some vicious labs stuff. I figure his dmz is good stuff. I was wondering though is there any benefit into using epiandro as a kickstarter or is that more just for those who are not on the gear? I also thought about LGD. Only thing n ow i know is that it will be test/eq and probably eca and cardarine since I probalby am going to wait to run clen
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
Mathb33 Anabolics 23
sloganslimms General Chat 4
LaserGoPewPew Anabolics 24
YamahaC76 Anabolics 29
Anabolics 0

Similar threads


Top