Cutting Cycle Advice

[PatWheeler]

I'm going to try a cutting cycle and would like to get some advice. I'm 44, been on TRT for two years (100mg twice weekly). No AI. 6' even, 237lbs and probably 25% bf.

Beyond test, I have access to clen, winny, equipoise and possibly others. All injectable no orals. What would you guys do and at what levels? Not looking to increase the test but never tried anything else so I'm gathering info.

'Preciate the help.

 

[Ironpirate]

I would just work on your diet/nutrition. At 200mg trt you should be able to cut just fine with a calorie deficit diet.

 

[PatWheeler]

I would just work on your diet/nutrition. At 200mg trt you should be able to cut just fine with a calorie deficit diet.

You're probably right, but I wasn't having problems down below and was already a competitive powerlifter before TRT and I did it anyway because I wanted more. So here we are.

 

[Hyde]

You're probably right, but I wasn't having problems down below and was already a competitive powerlifter before TRT and I did it anyway because I wanted more. So here we are.

I guess the point is, the diet is what will determine the success of the cut. Adding gear will do what gear does (added strength, fullness, vascularity, improved muscle retention ). Pick the androgens you like and add them as you see fit. I would avoid injectable Winny due to its propensity to cause infections, PIP, required injection frequency and generally unnecessary temporary increase in hardness. Winny is hard on the tendons, and you will already be at higher risk of injury due to the caloric deficit.

I would not use Clen right now. It will increase basal metabolic rate, therefore caloric expenditure, but also heart rate significantly. Save that for now until you get deep into the cut. It’s your trump card. You want to play it at the end when you need it most.

EQ is user dependent; if it makes you hungry that could make the diet tougher to adhere to.

 

[Mikereyn513]

I would just work on your diet/nutrition. At 200mg trt you should be able to cut just fine with a calorie deficit diet.

Yep

 

[PatWheeler]

I guess the point is, the diet is what will determine the success of the cut. Adding gear will do what gear does (added strength, fullness, vascularity, improved muscle retention ). Pick the androgens you like and add them as you see fit. I would avoid injectable Winny due to its propensity to cause infections, PIP, required injection frequency and generally unnecessary temporary increase in hardness. Winny is hard on the tendons, and you will already be at higher risk of injury due to the caloric deficit.

I would not use Clen right now. It will increase basal metabolic rate, therefore caloric expenditure, but also heart rate significantly. Save that for now until you get deep into the cut. It’s your trump card. You want to play it at the end when you need it most.

EQ is user dependent; if it makes you hungry that could make the diet tougher to adhere to.

Yeah I've never heard much good about clen other than it works, but at a potentially hefty price. I read the same about winny and EQ but, what you read...ya know. Good advice, thanks man.

I know nutrition is paramount, but is everyone saying no one uses gear on a cut or is this just dogmatic internet talk? Honest question.

 

[CasperKValentine]

Yeah I've never heard much good about clen other than it works, but at a potentially hefty price. I read the same about winny and EQ but, what you read...ya know. Good advice, thanks man.

I know nutrition is paramount, but is everyone saying no one uses gear on a cut or is this just dogmatic internet talk? Honest question.

I liked the above idea about using Clen as a trump card. Once you get down to a low enough body fat that your body wants to hold onto if for dear life is when Clen shines.

I'm pretty sure a lot of the pro bodybuilders use more gear on a cut then on a bulk. Lots of folks run gear on a cut, myself included. It will spare muscle loss which in turn allows you to lower calories even lower and indirectly burn more fat. This is were a lot of people get mixed up and think compounds like whinny, var, etc. burn fat. Any gear can help but it's in an indirect way. Hopefully some of my babble makes sense. LOL

 

[CasperKValentine]

Just to add to above. Some dry compounds like var, whinny, masteron etc. can have a cosmetic effect if you are lower end of bodyfat due to muscle hardening and vascularity. This is why these are often chosen for a cut.

Honestly in your position for a cut, most I'd do is up that test a little to help spare muscle loss. It will also help with recovery in a calorie deficit. (Another indirect way gear helps on a cut). If you keep your Estrogen in check with the amount of test your using you shouldn't hold water.

 

[klbsa]

At your age I'd stay away from stimulants...... 200 mg of test a week is a high maintenance dose. You should be burning fat pretty fast already. Like others said, try cutting your calories.

That being said, I am 45 and I had a very positive cutting experience this year using test E and anavar @ 20-30mg a day.

 

[Mikereyn513]

Yeah I've never heard much good about clen other than it works, but at a potentially hefty price. I read the same about winny and EQ but, what you read...ya know. Good advice, thanks man.

I know nutrition is paramount, but is everyone saying no one uses gear on a cut or is this just dogmatic internet talk? Honest question.

Yea don't know where you heard that. On a cut us when the most drugs are used. Bulking you let the food do the work only thing that's really used are test and deca/ eq granted the doses are extremely high

 

[PatWheeler]

Ok point taken. I know the diet needs more attention and I was looking for a way to kick start the process. I’ll stick with what I’m doing with maybe a small increase in test.

Many thanks for the replies. I’m glad I asked.

 

[gphagan1]

If your body fat is around 25% you really are better off dialing in your diet and I would add cardio, if your not already doing it. Your TRT should help you maintain muscle, as long as you cut your calories slowly and not too aggressive to start. Evaluate each week with the scale and measuring your waist, and adjust calories as needed. That’s a healthier way to start a cut.
Numerous anabolics can help through different mechanisms, but I would hold off until you can drop your fat down. Then maybe after say 8 to 12 weeks, if you’ve been disciplined enough to lower your body fat significantly, you could run a cycle of say Test 400 a week and Mast 400 a week for 12 weeks and maybe finish the last 4 weeks with Anavar about 40 to 50 a day.
That’s a good and fairly safe cycle, and let’s you see how you respond to a little higher Test with adding another oil, and finishing with an oral.
Be sure to check blood pressure, and monitor any health issues you may already be dealing with.
I agree with Hyde on saving Clen at the end if you even will need it, you probably won’t. And like he said Clen is notorious for raising heart rate and blood pressure in many. Truthfully I don’t think Clen should be used by most, unless prepping for a competition or maybe a special event, like a beach vacation.
Keep us posted….there’s a lot of knowledge on here with nutrition, training, and anabolics.

 

[Hyde]

Everyone’s points in here mirror my thoughts. Yes people cut with gear, but that is often for deep cuts for competition, for a peak event. At 25% bodyfat, I’d assume your goal is a general reduction you’d like to reach and maintain. Like getting down to something like 15% where you can generally begin seeing some abs.

Using things like Winny, Masteron, Proviron in bodybuilding preps where guys are getting down under 10%, it produces a temporary muscle hardening cosmetic effect that is desirable for a bodybuilding show. Soon as you stop those drugs, the cosmetics cease. The actual anabolic, muscle-retentive properties are fairly similar across most AAS.

The thing with Clen is, it creates a greater caloric need for baseline. If you keep upping the dose, it can increase that further, but when you reduce or discontinue it the reverse is true - if you burned 300 more calories a day using Clen, when you stop suddenly you have to eat 300 calories less or you can begin regaining bodyfat/slowing loss. Typically you see it at the end of a cut, and then it’s tapered off over a few weeks while the diet is steadily reversed until a new caloric maintenance point is established. It’s not as simple as just taking it every day, if you are after results that stick. Just like any proper weight loss plan.

I would drop a few easy pounds on your TRT as you tighten the diet a little, then consider bumping test up a little and or adding a little bit of primo or masteron if you need more mg. Remember it’s about tracking/consistency in your diet that will be doing the work. As you get deeper & lower calories more, try to eat more fibrous vegetables to fill up more. Eventually you may need to add more activity, like some routine cardio - but you really want to add the bare minimum, because if you can’t sustain it then it becomes just like the Clen scenario. So adding hours a week is useless as a longterm solution. But maybe you make a habit of a 30 min walk nightly or something, or add three 30 min sessions on a stationary bike at your house weekly before you have breakfast to start the day.