Could Longjack 100:1 help restore HPTA function?

Justlooking5

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So about 5 years ago at age 28 I had my test levels checked. They came out at around 395 total, 90 free (range 45-220), which we all know is pretty low, especially for 28. At this particular time I was also quite stressed, depressed, and had high anxiety, to a degree that was unusual for me and was situational. I also probably was not eating enough, and was doing mostly cardio.

I had done several cycles of gear in the past, with the most recent cycle when I was age 24. I do not think I came off my last cycle (test enanthate, t-bol) as effectively as I had on prior cycles (took OTC anti-estrogen ATD rather than clomid/nolva).

At this time after my test came back at 400 ng/dl, my urologist prescribed clomid to me which I took at between 25-50mg/day. It raised my test from about 400 to around 1100, however, upon stopping clomid my test levels returned to 400 ng/dl. Now, whether that is because I was still really stressed/depressed at this time, or because my HPTA was not malfunctioning for other reasons, I'm not sure.

I got busy with other things and did not do anything else to address the situation, because my urologist basically told me my choice was clomid or TRT, which I didn't want to do at that time.


Fast forward a few years and I definitely feel better, less depressed and anxious, and I'm eating well and am back into bodybuilding. I haven't gotten my test levels checked recently, and it is something I plan to address this coming year. However, I still sense that my levels may be a little lower than optimal. I am able to make gains pretty decently, but I don't feel the same amount of aggression/libido/passion etc. that I did when I was in my early 20s. And I look a bit soft even at lower BF%.

Right now to boost/support test levels I am taking ZMA (great for sleep at least), and taurine which has shown to raise test substantially in some animal studies. I also have Longjack 100:1 extract on the way, and plan to cycle this by taking it 3-4 days per week at a dose to be determined, probably on the high side. If it doesn't dry me out too much, I'll probably take it 5x/week, but I want some water retention for lifting heavy.

I have read Longjack acts similarly to Nolvadex, and that people sometimes use it as part of PCT. I know this is possibly wishful thinking, but any thoughts about whether it may be possible to "jump-start" or improve HPTA function with Longjack if it does increase my test levels?
 
Justlooking5

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Yes I have. So far I have been taking 4/day of Now's TestoJack 300 with 300mg of Longjack of unspecified purity ($30 bottle though) while waiting for Bulk Supplements 100:1 extract which arrived today. I can already tell my balls are bigger to a degree I wasn't expecting and I do feel a bit more energy and improved mood/sleep.

I guess I'm wondering if Longjack can actually be useful as part of an HPTA restart, as I know some people use it for PCT.

Also, does it act at all like HCG? (I've read on another forum it does but how it does wasn't specified).

It seems like people who have successful HPTA restarts often use HCG rather than just clomid/AI as I have in the past.

Regardless, this year I am going to address this with a physician but it would be great to get some improvement from LJ.
 

criticalbench

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Maybe you should ask you doctor about what to do.. srs. I don't encourage playing with hormones.
 
Danes

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So about 5 years ago at age 28 I had my test levels checked. They came out at around 395 total, 90 free (range 45-220), which we all know is pretty low, especially for 28. At this particular time I was also quite stressed, depressed, and had high anxiety, to a degree that was unusual for me and was situational. I also probably was not eating enough, and was doing mostly cardio.

I had done several cycles of gear in the past, with the most recent cycle when I was age 24. I do not think I came off my last cycle (test enanthate, t-bol) as effectively as I had on prior cycles (took OTC anti-estrogen ATD rather than clomid/nolva).

At this time after my test came back at 400 ng/dl, my urologist prescribed clomid to me which I took at between 25-50mg/day. It raised my test from about 400 to around 1100, however, upon stopping clomid my test levels returned to 400 ng/dl. Now, whether that is because I was still really stressed/depressed at this time, or because my HPTA was not malfunctioning for other reasons, I'm not sure.

I got busy with other things and did not do anything else to address the situation, because my urologist basically told me my choice was clomid or TRT, which I didn't want to do at that time.


Fast forward a few years and I definitely feel better, less depressed and anxious, and I'm eating well and am back into bodybuilding. I haven't gotten my test levels checked recently, and it is something I plan to address this coming year. However, I still sense that my levels may be a little lower than optimal. I am able to make gains pretty decently, but I don't feel the same amount of aggression/libido/passion etc. that I did when I was in my early 20s. And I look a bit soft even at lower BF%.

Right now to boost/support test levels I am taking ZMA (great for sleep at least), and taurine which has shown to raise test substantially in some animal studies. I also have Longjack 100:1 extract on the way, and plan to cycle this by taking it 3-4 days per week at a dose to be determined, probably on the high side. If it doesn't dry me out too much, I'll probably take it 5x/week, but I want some water retention for lifting heavy.

I have read Longjack acts similarly to Nolvadex, and that people sometimes use it as part of PCT. I know this is possibly wishful thinking, but any thoughts about whether it may be possible to "jump-start" or improve HPTA function with Longjack if it does increase my test levels?
Longjack is definitely the best Testbooster on the marked right now. Studies are proving T increase and not only T increase but musclemass too +++.
The most important is to pick the right one. (To many fake TA products and low quality).
The dosage is VERY important too. 200mg of LJ100 was given to hypogonadism patients and it worked. The Doctor who ran the study recommended me 800mg LJ100(patent pended extract) daily. (To get even more out of TA).
 
drseuss6969

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Longjack is definitely the best Testbooster on the marked right now. Studies are proving T increase and not only T increase but musclemass too +++.
The most important is to pick the right one. (To many fake TA products and low quality).
The dosage is VERY important too. 200mg of LJ100 was given to hypogonadism patients and it worked. The Doctor who ran the study recommended me 800mg LJ100(patent pended extract) daily. (To get even more out of TA).
So is the 200:1 ratio double as potent or half?
 
thebigt

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So about 5 years ago at age 28 I had my test levels checked. They came out at around 395 total, 90 free (range 45-220), which we all know is pretty low, especially for 28. At this particular time I was also quite stressed, depressed, and had high anxiety, to a degree that was unusual for me and was situational. I also probably was not eating enough, and was doing mostly cardio.

I had done several cycles of gear in the past, with the most recent cycle when I was age 24. I do not think I came off my last cycle (test enanthate, t-bol) as effectively as I had on prior cycles (took OTC anti-estrogen ATD rather than clomid/nolva).

At this time after my test came back at 400 ng/dl, my urologist prescribed clomid to me which I took at between 25-50mg/day. It raised my test from about 400 to around 1100, however, upon stopping clomid my test levels returned to 400 ng/dl. Now, whether that is because I was still really stressed/depressed at this time, or because my HPTA was not malfunctioning for other reasons, I'm not sure.

I got busy with other things and did not do anything else to address the situation, because my urologist basically told me my choice was clomid or TRT, which I didn't want to do at that time.


Fast forward a few years and I definitely feel better, less depressed and anxious, and I'm eating well and am back into bodybuilding. I haven't gotten my test levels checked recently, and it is something I plan to address this coming year. However, I still sense that my levels may be a little lower than optimal. I am able to make gains pretty decently, but I don't feel the same amount of aggression/libido/passion etc. that I did when I was in my early 20s. And I look a bit soft even at lower BF%.

Right now to boost/support test levels I am taking ZMA (great for sleep at least), and taurine which has shown to raise test substantially in some animal studies. I also have Longjack 100:1 extract on the way, and plan to cycle this by taking it 3-4 days per week at a dose to be determined, probably on the high side. If it doesn't dry me out too much, I'll probably take it 5x/week, but I want some water retention for lifting heavy.

I have read Longjack acts similarly to Nolvadex, and that people sometimes use it as part of PCT. I know this is possibly wishful thinking, but any thoughts about whether it may be possible to "jump-start" or improve HPTA function with Longjack if it does increase my test levels?
lol...at age 33 with test level of 400 you wouldn't even get a urologist appointment thru the VA.
 

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So would running OL LJ100 more than recommended 2caps 5 days on 2 days off be more beneficial?
 
kboxer7

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So would running OL LJ100 more than recommended 2caps 5 days on 2 days off be more beneficial?
Not much if any imo.

Also, LJ100 will NOT restore HPTA function.

One of the believed MOA for increasing testosterone levels is the purported ability of eurypeptides in LJ to increase enzyme activity (CYP17) in the testes, resulting in greater conversion rate of pregnenoline substituants into dehyroepiandrosterone and androgens.

Another purported (and proven MOA) is via increasing the release rate of “free” testosterone from its binding hormone, sex-hormone-binding-globulin (SHBG).

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3669033/

In light of the above, you can see it does not have a direct impact on the HPTA axis, but rather works via other MOAs. Increases in test in hypogonadal men have been as high as 46%.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21671978

However, depending on the severity of your low T, even a 46% increase may not be enough. Perhaps you could look at stacking with Alphamax or Sup3rPCT (which cover you from a number of angles).

Honestly though, if you really want to try and restore your HPTA, the first thing to do is to try a SERM. If that doesn't work, then TRT is typically recommended as a last resort.
 
Justlooking5

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Longjack is definitely the best Testbooster on the marked right now. Studies are proving T increase and not only T increase but musclemass too +++.
The most important is to pick the right one. (To many fake TA products and low quality).
The dosage is VERY important too. 200mg of LJ100 was given to hypogonadism patients and it worked. The Doctor who ran the study recommended me 800mg LJ100(patent pended extract) daily. (To get even more out of TA).
That's what I'm taking (800mg/day). So far, I've noticed an improvement in mood, ball size/fullness, and erection quality/frequency (particularly at night/waking up).
 
Justlooking5

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lol...at age 33 with test level of 400 you wouldn't even get a urologist appointment thru the VA.
Mmm... my urologist agreed with me that my test level of 400 (at age 28) which is in the lower percentiles for my age group (closer to avg. test levels of someone much older) + my symptoms suggested a need for intervention, hence the clomid Rx. 33 isn't that much older and with symptoms consistent with hypogonadism and a test level of 400 is still quite low.

Here's a chart showing that for a 28 y/o, a test level of 400 is around the 5th percentile (as in 95% of guys have higher test). http://www.doyouhavelowt.co/uploads/2/4/9/0/24901271/2012246_orig.png
For 33, it's around the 10th percentile. Still quite plausibly hypogonadic.
 
Justlooking5

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Not much if any imo.

Also, LJ100 will NOT restore HPTA function. LJ's main mechanism for increasing T is by making more T available (i.e. free testosterone). Being that your T levels are LOW to begin with, I wouldn't suggest increasing FREE T as your best route. Or at least not the best route to try solo.

Have you looked at Sup3rPCT and/or Alphamax? Both cover a LOT of angles in one supp.

Honestly though, if you really want to try and restore your HPTA, the first thing to do is to try a SERM. If that doesn't work, then TRT is typically recommended as a last resort.
What are you basing your comment on that LJ doesn't increase total T, but only free T?
 
kboxer7

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What are you basing your comment on that LJ doesn't increase total T, but only free T?
One of the key studies surrounding Long Jack purports a 37% increase in testosterone NOT from synthesis of T, but rather from increasing the release rate of “free” testosterone from its binding hormone, sex-hormone-binding-globulin (SHBG).

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3669033/

J Int Soc Sports Nutr. 2013; 10: 28.
Published online 2013 May 26. doi: 10.1186/1550-2783-10-28
 
Danes

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So would running OL LJ100 more than recommended 2caps 5 days on 2 days off be more beneficial?
First of all, the 5 days on and 2 days off is just made up and it is nothing than "hearsay". Even the doctor who ran studies on LJ100 said its just made up and all studies done on TA, it was taken daily and no short cycles! He said TA was decreasing SHBG, Increasing Serum and Free T. and he said some of testers was taking 800mg and had even better results than 100-200mg doses .

He recommended 800mg dose to people with low T, over 40+ and those who do sports (weightlifting etc).

Start with 200mg, 4 days later increase to 400mg, 4 days later to 600 and 4 days later to 800mg.
 
thebigt

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bighulksmash

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I will make a thread about LJ100 tomorrow or sunday. Will contain all the info its needed to know
Thanks !!!! And try to list places to purchase unless thats against rules?
 
Danes

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Thanks !!!! And try to list places to purchase unless thats against rules?
It would be against the rules.
Olympus Labs use the patended TA owned by HP ingredients (the water soluble extract used in many TA studies)
 
bighulksmash

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It would be against the rules.
Olympus Labs use the patended TA owned by HP ingredients (the water soluble extract used in many TA studies)
Ok so ol is g2g .ive been trying to find a good lj thats dosed high enough.
 

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It would be against the rules.
Olympus Labs use the patended TA owned by HP ingredients (the water soluble extract used in many TA studies)
Add Universal N1T to that list
 
thebigt

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OL LJ100 is the same extract used in many studies :)
I have used both viron and tonvara. tonvara worked better than viron for me...I am going to have to try OL LJ100 and see how it compares!!!
 
drseuss6969

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so half this with the 2% extract from powder city?
 
Volvo140G

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I'm somewhat leary about powdercity...
 

kisaj

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Why? They have a solid reputation and will provide lab testing for their products.
 
Volvo140G

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Why? They have a solid reputation and will provide lab testing for their products.
based on experience....

phenibut: completely ineffective, even high dosed

phenylpiracetam: compared to others, very very weak

adrafinil: again, felt very underdosed compared to another other source

I wouldn't recommend powder city to a friend for nootropics.
 
digitalpimp

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based on experience....

phenibut: completely ineffective, even high dosed

phenylpiracetam: compared to others, very very weak

adrafinil: again, felt very underdosed compared to another other source

I wouldn't recommend powder city to a friend for nootropics.
My girlfriend and I have been very pleased with their Phenibut.
Their Phenylpiracetam, I completed an hour workout in 20 minutes not too long ago on it.
 
Volvo140G

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My girlfriend and I have been very pleased with their Phenibut.
Their Phenylpiracetam, I completed an hour workout in 20 minutes not too long ago on it.
I'm happy for you

comparing the phenylp from powder city with demiurge, is like generic ibuprofen to oxycodone.
 

kisaj

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You forgot to add, In Your Opinion. You may have had a poor experience but most do not and they have a great reputation. Sorry yours does not match.
 
Volvo140G

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You forgot to add, In Your Opinion. You may have had a poor experience but most do not and they have a great reputation. Sorry yours does not match.
wasn't my opinion so much as my experience with them. no biggie - I know lots of folks enjoy em. thank goodness to the free market I suppose :)
 
thebigt

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I usually go with SNS, haven't been disappointed yet.
 
digitalpimp

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I literally have 30 - 40 different packets from PowderCity around the house. I wouldn't waste my money on something that didn't work.
 

criticalbench

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I'm somewhat leary about powdercity...


Same.. i hate to say it, but there prices are so damn low you have to question it.

I was looking into there adrafinil until i found out 300mg ABSOLUTELY trashes my liver worse than oral steroids confirmed by blood work..
 

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There bacognize and epedium seem to work just fine
 
The_Old_Guy

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I'd hazard a guess that their stuff is the same as everybody else's - Bulk Powder from China/India (nobody's growing Tongkat Ali in Texas or California). Maybe they just buy a crap ton more and get a better price? kisaj giving them a thumbs up carries some weight - he has skin in the game to say they suck.
 
kboxer7

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Same.. i hate to say it, but there prices are so damn low you have to question it.

I was looking into there adrafinil until i found out 300mg ABSOLUTELY trashes my liver worse than oral steroids confirmed by blood work..
Thanks for posting that. I've been trying to tell people to be carful with adrafinil.
 

ma70

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I'd hazard a guess that their stuff is the same as everybody else's - Bulk Powder from China/India (nobody's growing Tongkat Ali in Texas or California). Maybe they just buy a crap ton more and get a better price? kisaj giving them a thumbs up carries some weight - he has skin in the game to say they suck.
Mixelflick also vouches for PowderCity..which for me means a lot.
 
Volvo140G

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Same.. i hate to say it, but there prices are so damn low you have to question it.

I was looking into there adrafinil until i found out 300mg ABSOLUTELY trashes my liver worse than oral steroids confirmed by blood work..
how long had u been running it?
 

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