Clomid for overtraining

ericos_bob

Active member
Anyone here used clomid for this purpose, to speed up recovery from a period of overtraining? I'm going to run clomid at 25mg ED for 4 weeks to help bounce back faster as I've run into this position again. Gains slowed, sore joints, cns fatigue, the usual symptoms. I had this idea that with all the spare clomid I have lying around perhaps it could be of benefit to hasten my recovery in the down time. I've found atleast one study in which an overtrained athlete was administered clomid to alleviate overtraining symptoms.
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I've never used it for this reason but i'd say try it out and let us know how you liked it.
 
Hmmm maybe someone who knows can shed some light here. What exactly are the effects of clomid on cortisol levels? I thought blocking cortisol was the typical way to increase recovery? I thought this was part of how AAS increases recovery.
 
I went by the basis that testosterone levels plummet when in an overtrained state and men with naturally low t levels are likely to OT more easily. No doubt cortisol plays an important role in hormonal balance too. I'll give it a try. Day 2 at 25mg. Too early to report anything but will report how I feel a week in. I normally take a couple weeks to bounce back from this state.
 
Don't think it'll do much. The article quoted simply raised his Test levels back to normal or higher simply because overtraining kills test levels. I don't think it said it led to any kind of recovery from OT. In true OT'ing, it kinda depends how deep you are in it.

I was a runner and experienced long term OT'ing years ago and did a ton of research on it. It's a very complicated and hard to figure out, diagnosis, and cure. Researchers don't even have a final answer to what causes it...whether it's the training, lifestyle, existing issues plus they only recently discovered the lymphocytes (I think thats thre name) and how they may be a cause of the symptoms. Theres a lot on the net but many pages and sites don't really know what they are talking abiut.

You can try the Clomid or inject straight Test to raise levels but I and research into OT'ing do not list low test as the reason for OT'ing itself. Higher Test may help, but the true answer to OT'ing is REST, plain and simple. Relax, recover, take it easy, try and rid life of extra stress and rest.
 
Clomid is not the right way to attack true overtraining.

It's more of a cns and cortisol issue which would not be helped by clomid. There's no htpa damage or estrogen receptor issues...

Save your clomid, get something like reduce xt for cortisol, take a deload week, or even a few days off completely, eat, rest, recover.
 
booneman77 said:
Clomid is not the right way to attack true overtraining.

It's more of a cns and cortisol issue which would not be helped by clomid. There's no htpa damage or estrogen receptor issues...

Save your clomid, get something like reduce xt for cortisol, take a deload week, or even a few days off completely, eat, rest, recover.
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Already running reduce xt. Normally takes me a month+ to recover at this point. Onset is overnight. I always know if my progress is too good for a week I'm on the verge of OT. Usually I deload in time but occasionally it catches me out. It's uncertain the exact effects high test can have on the CNS. There's enough literature out there in regards to testosterone levels role in CNS development to the effects of high testosterone on CNS function. Ofcourse there's a study to confirm findings of almost any convenience that comes to mind. Considering nobody posting here has actually trialed a clomid run while overtrained I'll definitely stay the course and report back.
 
ericos_bob said:
Already running reduce xt. Normally takes me a month+ to recover at this point. Onset is overnight. I always know if my progress is too good for a week I'm on the verge of OT. Usually I deload in time but occasionally it catches me out. It's uncertain the exact effects high test can have on the CNS. There's enough literature out there in regards to testosterone levels role in CNS development to the effects of high testosterone on CNS function. Ofcourse there's a study to confirm findings of almost any convenience that comes to mind. Considering nobody posting here has actually trialed a clomid run while overtrained I'll definitely stay the course and report back.
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High test and htpa functioning vs not (which is what clomid would help are not necessarily tied tho. You can have average function and have high or low test depending on your body's natural set point. Clomid should only improve your test levels if your htpa wasn't functioning, otherwise the difference would only be slight and temporary.

I'm very interested to see what you discover tho for sure.

Do you have a baseline (i.e. How long it takes to recover without any supps/clomid) to compare to?
 
You can try this but pretty sure it won't do much, rest will.If you try and continue heavy/intense training in the middle of overreaching/OT'ing, you'll dig yourself deeper. If anything, boosting Test past physiological levels would help and not Clomid.

Never recall seeing Pubmed articles showing Clomid as a fix for OT'ed athletes. I might remember seeing one dosing test injections but seems like it didn't help because low test is simply a symptom of OT'ing and not the reason for it.
 
ericos_bob said:
Anyone here used clomid for this purpose, to speed up recovery from a period of overtraining? I'm going to run clomid at 25mg ED for 4 weeks to help bounce back faster as I've run into this position again. Gains slowed, sore joints, cns fatigue, the usual symptoms. I had this idea that with all the spare clomid I have lying around perhaps it could be of benefit to hasten my recovery in the down time. I've found atleast one study in which an overtrained athlete was administered clomid to alleviate overtraining symptoms.
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It is incredibly hard to overtrain. For most of us it's basically impossible.
 
Rhadam said:
I highly doubt you are overtraining.
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How could you come to this conclusion with only the information provided here? I have definitely over trained and it's a real thing. I can think of a couple routines I did where I was overtraining.

OP, the best solution to prevent overtraining is to maybe look at changing your routine. Also look at diet, sleep, stress, etc.
 
210LBS said:
How could you come to this conclusion with only the information provided here? I have definitely over trained and it's a real thing. I can think of a couple routines I did where I was overtraining.

OP, the best solution to prevent overtraining is to maybe look at changing your routine. Also look at diet, sleep, stress, etc.
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I agree with this. I have too but it is more common in endurance sports due to the fact of the volume of training that can be done (running hours 6-7 days a week). It's really a overload of STRESS with too little recovery for too long. Life stuff, sleep, diet, training, etc all ffect it. Overreaching is the short term OT'ing and is commonly used to acquire gainz but unless you are aware of where you are, it's easy to keep going too much.

I agree with the other guy, most people don't come close to OT;ing. Heck, go look in most gyms and people don't even do enough to make gains and progress. I think I red a Type A personality can fall victim into it. For me, I was "addicted" to running races and always wanted to improve my times and seriously though tht more running, more tempos, more mile repeats were the way to progress and not cut back. I learned my lesson the HARD way.
 
rgurleyjr said:
I agree with this. I have too but it is more common in endurance sports due to the fact of the volume of training that can be done (running hours 6-7 days a week). It's really a overload of STRESS with too little recovery for too long. Life stuff, sleep, diet, training, etc all ffect it. Overreaching is the short term OT'ing and is commonly used to acquire gainz but unless you are aware of where you are, it's easy to keep going too much.

I agree with the other guy, most people don't come close to OT;ing. Heck, go look in most gyms and people don't even do enough to make gains and progress. I think I red a Type A personality can fall victim into it. For me, I was "addicted" to running races and always wanted to improve my times and seriously though tht more running, more tempos, more mile repeats were the way to progress and not cut back. I learned my lesson the HARD way.
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I can think of several times where I have over trained. One was just a weight training routine of resistance training 12X per week (twice per day mon-sat). Another time was strength training 4X per week high volume hitting each muscle 2X per week combined with boxing 5-6X per week, which also consisted of some strength training as well. Put it all together and I was getting weaker not stronger doing these. I used to black out in the gym mid exercise (thank god I didn't get hurt). Trust me, overtraining is real.
 
210LBS said:
How could you come to this conclusion with only the information provided here? I have definitely over trained and it's a real thing. I can think of a couple routines I did where I was overtraining.

OP, the best solution to prevent overtraining is to maybe look at changing your routine. Also look at diet, sleep, stress, etc.
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Look up what the difference between overtraining and overreaching is. People think they overtrain, no. What they actually do is overreach. Lyle McDonald has some good info on these aforementioned terms.
 
People tend to use overreaching and "overtraining" interchangeably
 
I am familiar with both terms. I'm quite happy to use the terms interchangeably as most will understand the main difference is the extent of under recovery relating to duration of subsequent recovery. It's been a week since I've last trained. No real improvements yet. Sore muscles and joints all round. Anyway regardless this is to assess whether Clomid has any effect on my recovery. Still running MK677 at 25mg ED aswell. Someone posted bloodwork in another thread running clomid+MK and noticed a decrease in IGF levels eunning clomid yet levels were still above baseline prior to starting MK. I'll try to dig it up
 
ericos_bob said:
I am familiar with both terms. I'm quite happy to use the terms interchangeably as most will understand the main difference is the extent of under recovery relating to duration of subsequent recovery. It's been a week since I've last trained. No real improvements yet. Sore muscles and joints all round. Anyway regardless this is to assess whether Clomid has any effect on my recovery. Still running MK677 at 25mg ED aswell. Someone posted bloodwork in another thread running clomid+MK and noticed a decrease in IGF levels eunning clomid yet levels were still above baseline prior to starting MK. I'll try to dig it up
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As someone pointed out earlier, if you haven't check out Bodyrecomposition.com and find the 8 piece article on Overtraining. I read Lyles articles many times and they are some of the best out there. Very informative.
 
One thing that might help is Lysine but it helps a little, isn't a perfect cure for recovery.
When you are overtrained then your immune system is under a lot of pressure and possibly quite weak. High dose Lysine (like 5-10g split througout the day) will help your immune system.
Also good before drinking if you don't want to get very drunk.
 
cheers man yeah I'm running lysine 3g ED now for a cold sore so my immune system is down. Not noticing anything from the clomid. Haven't really improved it's nearing the 2 week mark since I stopped training. Typically a month until I'm feeling well enough to resume training so we'll see then. It's probably not a bad experiment either way as I've never run clomid so nice to see how I respond to it before I run an actual cycle and really need it.
 
ericos_bob said:
cheers man yeah I'm running lysine 3g ED now for a cold sore so my immune system is down. Not noticing anything from the clomid. Haven't really improved it's nearing the 2 week mark since I stopped training. Typically a month until I'm feeling well enough to resume training so we'll see then. It's probably not a bad experiment either way as I've never run clomid so nice to see how I respond to it before I run an actual cycle and really need it.
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Have you noticed any benefits so far?

Active recovery might help you bounce back faster to your regular training, some stretching and yoga might work as well.
 
ericos_bob said:
cheers man yeah I'm running lysine 3g ED now for a cold sore so my immune system is down. Not noticing anything from the clomid. Haven't really improved it's nearing the 2 week mark since I stopped training. Typically a month until I'm feeling well enough to resume training so we'll see then. It's probably not a bad experiment either way as I've never run clomid so nice to see how I respond to it before I run an actual cycle and really need it.
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Honestly you're not getting any kind of idea of what the clomid will do for you tho compared to in pct. you're trying to compare normal hormone levels and running clomid to completely tanked htpa and restarting natural test production. These are completely different scenarios and the effects will be drastically different. Sides (or lack) too.
 
Two things...I'm assuming your not on any hormonal PED's atm, as if you were the clomid would be pretty much a waste and if your just feeling "run down" from typical over training (i.e constantly over sore, getting weaker, exhausted during the day, CNS burn out, immune system low, etc) then I suggest you take a week off from lifting and any high intensity cardio vascular activity. Do some mobility work so you keep blood flowing, maybe even some LISS cardio, keep protein consistent, and catch up on sleep and increase electrolytes along w/hydration.

Now if your not on any PED's and you are know for a fact that your Test levels are low, like -300, then a combination of Clomid (@ 40~100mg), nolva (@ 10~20mg), hcg (@ 500-1g), aromasin (@ 6.25~12mg) or even armistane (@75~100mg) for 4-6 weeks will definitely JACK UP your test levels to healthy physiological levels. Will this have a direct correlation to reducing over training? Not really...but possibly an indirect correlation that can definitely help with many physiological process' in the body over the long haul. Many HRT doctors prescribe similar protocols for men suffering from low T before they ever put them on hormones. Also if you decide to go this route I really believe 25mg/day of clomid wont do the trick. I and most HRT Dr recommend 40-100mg/day.
 
Why is noone addressing adrenal fatigue as a possible cause of OTing, or even liver cleansing? Consistent strenuous workouts raise AST and ALT levels and even though its clearly not permanent if you really are working out hours everyday, the liver could play a role too. I'd say take a liver cleanser, take something to help with adrenal fatigue and something like 7-DHEA or the likes for cortisol. See how that pans out before jumping for a pharmaceutical.
 
Feeling pretty good on Clomid. I've bounced back from OT. It took around 3 weeks off training to feel myself again or 2 weeks into clomid. It's my understanding clomid can raise T levels to the high normal range through an increase in FSH and LH acting as an effective estrogen agonist/antagonist. It's most effective for treatment of low T but if you do a google you'll be able to inform yourself of the possibility to raise T levels even in men with normal T levels to high normal. Really I wasn't expecting any kind of "cure" or quick fix to OT by taking clomid. I wanted to trial it as a supplement in a broscience experiment to see how i'd feel in terms of my recovery from OT. Having bounced back in 3 weeks is faster than i usually experience and I'm happy to be making good progress in the gym again. Feel great and very energized. Only sides I get from clomid or nolvadex for that matter is loss of libido which is a non issue as my libido could do with a little suppression at times lol. It's good to know I shouldn't have to worry about too many sides running clomid in PCT for a first cycle either.
 
anabolicgainz said:
Why is noone addressing adrenal fatigue as a possible cause of OTing, or even liver cleansing? Consistent strenuous workouts raise AST and ALT levels and even though its clearly not permanent if you really are working out hours everyday, the liver could play a role too. I'd say take a liver cleanser, take something to help with adrenal fatigue and something like 7-DHEA or the likes for cortisol. See how that pans out before jumping for a pharmaceutical.
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This is one of the worst posts i've ever read lol. Not a single truth was posted that day.
 
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