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Chris's Epi/1 andro cycle log

Cs1992 said:
Hi man thanks for the reply,

I will knock my 1 Andro back to 330 for now, however why not up the Epi Andro? (I'm curious is all)

I'm not entirely sure why a transdermal would Help please would someone explain that!

Cheers lads
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The Epi-Andro is a dry and slightly anti-estrogenic compound, which is probably lowering your estrogen too much, hence the low libido and crappy feeling.
Transdermals like Dermacrine or Sup3r-DHEA will provide a very small estrogen boost, as they have slightly estrogenic conversion rates, but not too much like 4-Andro does.
 
Too much epiandro will give you more clicky joints, and it might lower your estrogen too much leaving you feeling even more tired. 500mg is fine, just leave it there. I made a mistake of upping the dose, and it just caused random severe cramping with no benefits at all. If you don't overdo it, it will give you extra strength and good muscle hardness.

Why DHEA? Because it's gentle on your body, gives good libido, combats lethargy nicely. Transdermal products are easy to apply in the morning after shower, and then you don't have to think about it at all. It will release the compounds slowly, making you feel good all day, every day. Finally, these products are fairly cheap and they will probably last you the entire cycle.
 
InItForGainz said:
The Epi-Andro is a dry and slightly anti-estrogenic compound, which is probably lowering your estrogen too much, hence the low libido and crappy feeling.
Transdermals like Dermacrine or Sup3r-DHEA will provide a very small estrogen boost, as they have slightly estrogenic conversion rates, but not too much like 4-Andro does.
Click to expand...
Just ordered dermacrine it will come faster
 
gagandugan said:
Too much epiandro will give you more clicky joints, and it might lower your estrogen too much leaving you feeling even more tired. 500mg is fine, just leave it there. I made a mistake of upping the dose, and it just caused random severe cramping with no benefits at all. If you don't overdo it, it will give you extra strength and good muscle hardness.

Why DHEA? Because it's gentle on your body, gives good libido, combats lethargy nicely. Transdermal products are easy to apply in the morning after shower, and then you don't have to think about it at all. It will release the compounds slowly, making you feel good all day, every day. Finally, these products are fairly cheap and they will probably last you the entire cycle.
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This is what I thought aswell, I just ordered dermacrine, ,clearly the 1 Andro and Epi Andro has killed my estro. That's quite rare isn't it?
 
Also I'm taking Ar1imcare pro which has arimistane in this could also be causing low estro no?

The Armistane I used before destroyed my libido and dried me out.
 
gagandugan said:
Arimistane can make you drier and is a mild diuretic. Won't do much for estrogen though.
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Fair enough these effects are consistent with my use!

Day 18

Weight 163.4lbs (+8.4lbs)

Leg and abs today, went okay I'm still completely lethargic though knocked dose back down to 330/500

Ordered sup3r DHEA to add asap
 
DAY 19

Weight 164.4lbs (+9.4lbs)

Current update
Today the lethargy killed me I couldn't even finish my shoulder workout (did most) felt strong but unfocused due to the lethargy
Joints are super clicky also and a bit achy might lower the ar1micare pro so I can gain a little water weight as I'm dry!
Muscles are hard and strength is good
Dermacrine will be here tomorrow or the next day I assume I will then feel much better
Hair is still shedding, really surprised I have thick hair and so does my whole family (dad is 50 with full head too)
However it will reverse when I stop so not much of a concern
 
Cs1992 said:
DAY 19

Weight 164.4lbs (+9.4lbs)

Current update
Today the lethargy killed me I couldn't even finish my shoulder workout (did most) felt strong but unfocused due to the lethargy
Joints are super clicky also and a bit achy might lower the ar1micare pro so I can gain a little water weight as I'm dry!
Muscles are hard and strength is good
Dermacrine will be here tomorrow or the next day I assume I will then feel much better
Hair is still shedding, really surprised I have thick hair and so does my whole family (dad is 50 with full head too)
However it will reverse when I stop so not much of a concern
Click to expand...

Try to drop epiandro dose and see what happens. See, your full head of hair and good genetics don't mean anything here. I am half-bald and in my 40s and it does not make me shed at all.
 
Cs1992 said:
I'm thinking of dropping the epi andro to 250mg a day to prevent hair shedding is this a good idea ?
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I doubt dropping your Ar1macare dosage will do anything to help your estrogen, it's been and is being supressed by your Epi-Andro. The anti-E complex in Ar1macare is more for E-control not so much E-supression. So yeah, if you're going to drop something, drop your Epi-Andro dose down a bit and try and stick it out until your Dermacrine comes.
 
Interestingly enough, when I used it 1-Andro started causing some mild lethargy in week 5, and I used it solo, with no base - not even a transdermal product. I just dealt with it for another week, but it just shows how these compounds affect people differently. Except that 1-Andro definitely increases mass and strength. That's a given. And it will suppress too, but it's not horrible in this respect.
 
gagandugan said:
Try to drop epiandro dose and see what happens. See, your full head of hair and good genetics don't mean anything here. I am half-bald and in my 40s and it does not make me shed at all.
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I've done extra research the last few days, I am going to drop Epi to 250mg for a couple of days, if I don't see a large improvement on the hair shedding front it will be dropped, I cannot guarantee the damage it's doing will reverse and the gains arnt worth it when there's alternatives!
 
InItForGainz said:
I doubt dropping your Ar1macare dosage will do anything to help your estrogen, it's been and is being supressed by your Epi-Andro. The anti-E complex in Ar1macare is more for E-control not so much E-supression. So yeah, if you're going to drop something, drop your Epi-Andro dose down a bit and try and stick it out until your Dermacrine comes.
Click to expand...
So if I drop the Epi to 0 when the dermacrine comes I could in theory Up the 1 Andro to 440.?
 
Day 20

Weight 169.4lbs (+14.4lbs WTF!) I took 250mg today of Epi and now I'm stopping it I love my hair to much. I'm done with Epi Andro I bought some nizoral shampoo to try and block DHT whilst levels return to Normal.

Rest day today feeling much much better!
 
Cs1992 said:
So if I drop the Epi to 0 when the dermacrine comes I could in theory Up the 1 Andro to 440.?
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I wouldn't drop the Epi completely just yet, you're still going to need a base whilst waiting for your Dermacrine. 250mg should just about have you covered and reduce your shedding issue.
Don't worry about the hair loss too much though, it'll come back after PCT.
330mg of 1-Andro is perfectly fine dose, no need to increase it. Increasing your dose will also increase the risk of sides and severity of sides, which in the case of 1-AD is lethargy and acne.
 
InItForGainz said:
I wouldn't drop the Epi completely just yet, you're still going to need a base whilst waiting for your Dermacrine. 250mg should just about have you covered and reduce your shedding issue.

Don't worry about the hair loss too much though, it'll come back after PCT.
330mg of 1-Andro is perfectly fine dose, no need to increase it. Increasing your dose will also increase the risk of sides and severity of sides, which in the case of 1-AD is lethargy and acne.
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Man I really don't want to lose to much hair lol how do we know it will come back?
 
Cs1992 said:
Man I really don't want to lose to much hair lol how do we know it will come back?
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O.k, O.k. Can't say 100% that it'll all grow back but 95% sure. You're young and side effects from PH's are usually only temporary and last whilst the compound is active in the body. For example, when I used 4-Andro I got really bad acne and bloat in week 3, so I cut my run short to just five weeks. Come week 2/3 of PCT and my acne and water retention were virtually non existant.
 
Day 21

Weight 164.4lbs (+9.4lbs)

Lethargy is gone?! I feel great again
Good arm workout strength increase again my poor elbows let me down a bit though.
Thinning has reduced since epi was dropped to 250mg, dermacrine is here I'm ditching the epi tomorrow i want the shedding to stop
 
Day 22
Weight 165lbs (+10lbs)
Dermacrine is used now
Epi dropped
Clicky joints and feeling wa*k have gone!
Hair shedding virtually zero now so assume that'll stop completely in the next days
Still on 330 1 Andro
Rest day today and chest tomorrow going for 1RM PR!

Still amazed how much a mild compound like Epi did me over!! 1 Andro is treating me well
 
Day 23

Weight 165lbs (+10lbs)

Dermacrine is awesome, beats epi for general feeling any day of the week, I applied it to Chest shoulders and stomach.
Is it true you need to avoid skin contact with others like significant other whilst using this? And will I experiance any gains from dermacrine?
Other than that I worked out without a preworkout today (quite rare) it was possible my best workout ever I finally benched 100kg for a rep! Pictures to follow excuse the tragicness I never tried posing before
 
Cs1992 said:
Day 23

Weight 165lbs (+10lbs)
Is it true you need to avoid skin contact with others like significant other whilst using this? And will I experiance any gains from dermacrine?
Click to expand...

Only whilst it's drying, once it's dry it's fine.
Nothing noticable no, but it is a good overall base.
 
Cs1992 said:
Day 23 Dermacrine is awesome...

Is it true you need to avoid skin contact with others like significant other whilst using this? And will I experiance any gains from dermacrine? ...
Click to expand...

1. Told you that transdermal DHEA is good. It works well and is pretty much side-free.
2. If you apply it in the morning, wash your hands and then you're good once it dries out. And it will dry out relatively quickly.
3. No.
 
gagandugan said:
1. Told you that transdermal DHEA is good. It works well and is pretty much side-free.
2. If you apply it in the morning, wash your hands and then you're good once it dries out. And it will dry out relatively quickly.
3. No.
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Yeah man good call. How's my progress do you think for 20 months training? Started at 142lbs 15% BF
 
Cs1992 said:
Yeah man really need more lean mass! Quite lean I can see 4 abs in the morning, just goes wrong when I start eating lol
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Same here man, I can see vague outlines of all of them looking down, but in the mirror it just looks flat and I can't see lines. As soon as I start eating for the day, I turn to a blob
 
jathan_howe said:
Same here man, I can see vague outlines of all of them looking down, but in the mirror it just looks flat and I can't see lines. As soon as I start eating for the day, I turn to a blob
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Lol yeah it's annoying however doesn't take long to cut up! That's the easy bit isn't it lol
 
Cs1992 said:
Lol yeah it's annoying however doesn't take long to cut up! That's the easy bit isn't it lol
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That's true. I tend to hold a lot of a sub-q fat and water right at my stomach anyway so a couple weeks of cardio and some EvoMuse Eviscerate without much diet change, and I was down 11lbs.
 
Day 24

Weight 165.6lbs (up 10.6lbs)

Rest day today after yesterday's mental chest session tomorrow is heavy back and light bicep, after work though we all messed around with arms wrestles several guys (strong ones) who rinsed me 6 months ago got beaten with both hands and it was almost like it was nothing.
Was well impressed with that
 
My hair is still shedding I believe the 1-test is converting back to DHT. (Unknown pathway)
Just started using nizoral might have to cut this cycle short or get LGD and swap
 
gagandugan said:
Don't swap, just cut it short if you have to. Do one more week and call it quits. Those are great gains.
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Hey man I hate not finishing things! I'll go to 28 days then stop. Really gutted I love the one andro!
Doesn't appear to be any suppression - I know there will be
What do you think for PCT
 
gagandugan said:
PCT? 3 weeks of light Nolva (20/10/10), natural booster for a month, No AI will do.
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Great cheers man I mean I can only assume I have made decent gains on just a month at this point I was 166lbs this morning at around 13% body fat I'd say now so only gained a little fat. Just for future reference what compounds are nicest to the hairline?

Backs and biceps later today!
 
One more thing I've noticed - I already have a deep voice but I have had multiple people comment and say my voice is deeper than usual.

Will this revert back after cycle? I hope not haha
 
Day 25
Weight 166lbs (+11lbs)

Great workout today, strength increases are insane. Only thing is my joints can't keep up they are killing me!
I am using Nizoral shampoo in the hope that it will stop the shedding if it does I'll run longer than 4 weeks.
 
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