Best PEDs to enhance fasting fat burn?

admlite

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M45. Hit a wall at 21-22%BF, measure daily with impendance device. All in lower belly.
Tried many things and straight water fasting is just the easiest way for me to maintain deficit on a weekly basis.
What are best PEDs to enhance fasting fat burn for 36-48 hr weekly fasts? Cost is not an issue.
I'll be running slight surplus on the other days of the week to help with energy and recovery.
Have clen and yohimbine on hand, but can not find clear info whether these can be taken together. Anything else to consider?
Don't want to mess with my thyroid (i.e. taking T3), since according to the recent bloods it is running well.
 
ValiantThor08

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Peptide combo such as Ipamorelin and modGRF. Cardarine.
 
HIT4ME

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Someone in this thread doesn't realize it is summertime out there.
 

admlite

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If you hit a wall at 21%, your diet needs work, not peptides.
I have issues with high SHBG / low fT, which make it extra hard to loose fat. Sure I can fast, but if I am even in a minor surplus - 90% of it goes to fat. I already practice fasting every week (~36 hr or 1.5 day ) with full body workout 3x week. I try to maintain surplus for remaining 5.5 days, but I am still in a deficit on a weekly basis.
There is progress, but it is glacial. I've dropped ~2kg fat in three months that I've been following this regime.
It is much more difficult for me to recover if I follow a daily deficit. Tried it and I would just feel slow, sore, stiff and depressed.
My body was in >20% BF for 30 yrs or so and I really have to force it to find new homeostasis.
 
HIT4ME

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I feel your pain...you sound a lot like me - and a lot of others on this board. I often feel like I am cursed and gain weight way faster than people around me - even when I'm eating less. But the thing is, it's not really true. At least not to the degree that it feels like. When I was on a PSMF and eating 600-800 calories/day - I was on top of it, I had everything locked down - and I lost weight at almost 3.5 pounds per week. And if you do the math - my TDEE is probably around 2300 calories/day (sedentary desk job) - that's 16,100 calories/week. And I was eating probably 4,900 - meaning my weekly deficit was 11,200 calories.. 3.5 X 3500 = 12,250 calories - so I was actually losing faster than probably expected. Sure, some weeks may have been slower...but overall when I was strictly adhering to a diet, I was losing at a rate that would be expected as normal. In other words, even after extreme dieting I still didn't have a slowed metabolism.

A big part of this is a mental shift though - deficits suck. They aren't easy and painless. If you want to lose fat you are going to have to go through some pain. You have to get into a mental state that is ready for that. We all want to lose fat without going through the brain fog, tiredness, soreness, etc.

Another thing is exercise - if you're in a deficit of more than 500 calories/day - drop your exercise levels back!! Let the diet do the work. You should only be lifting to retain lean tissue/strength as much as possible and this actually requires very little work. You shouldn't have a lot to recover from in other words, while dieting. If you do, you need to consider reducing your workload.

As far as the hormonal stuff, I understand and that may have some impact but it isn't impossible to overcome. Supposedly boron and zinc can help reduce SHBG....but I'm not 100% sold on it. It's probably worth a shot though...
 

jrock645

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Youre in a surplus 5.5 days out of 7 and you seriously wonder why youre having trouble losing weight? Jesus bro...

I have issues with high SHBG / low fT, which make it extra hard to loose fat. Sure I can fast, but if I am even in a minor surplus - 90% of it goes to fat. I already practice fasting every week (~36 hr or 1.5 day ) with full body workout 3x week. I try to maintain surplus for remaining 5.5 days, but I am still in a deficit on a weekly basis.
There is progress, but it is glacial. I've dropped ~2kg fat in three months that I've been following this regime.
It is much more difficult for me to recover if I follow a daily deficit. Tried it and I would just feel slow, sore, stiff and depressed.
My body was in >20% BF for 30 yrs or so and I really have to force it to find new homeostasis.
 
LeanEngineer

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A big part of this is a mental shift though - deficits suck. They aren't easy and painless. If you want to lose fat you are going to have to go through some pain. You have to get into a mental state that is ready for that. We all want to lose fat without going through the brain fog, tiredness, soreness, etc.
Agreed! That's the hardest part about a deficit is the mental hunger!
 
Resolve10

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Youre in a surplus 5.5 days out of 7 and you seriously wonder why youre having trouble losing weight? Jesus bro...
This. I don't have any comments on hormonal or more fringe products for fat loss.

Maybe goes against what some people will claim, but I also think lots of extended fasting for fat loss just doesn't sound beneficial. Especially if maintaining lean mass is an issue I am not sold on that being the most optimal approach (eating surplus then just trying to fast to lose sounds also mentally questionable to me from a psychosocial approach as well).

I don't want to get too complicated or delve too deep, but if you are having issues both gaining and losing there are probably tweaks that need to be made (which can be hard to fully iron out just online even with the good help of lots of guys on here).

I'd be willing to bet that if you really have issues gaining (and we go under the assumption that it isn't diet related) that if you can't put muscle on without fat there is an issue with the type of training or how you are training. Again that is something in and of itself that could take a while to dissect and sometimes on forums we just glance past it (I am guilty as well) with being like oh you train three days per week and do these exercises it sounds ok. The intent and the technique may be off to not be providing the proper stimulus, the volume of work could be too low, etc.

Then there may still be some diet stuff still as well. I know I can feel myself going on a long rant/tangent so if you are still with me I apologize for my inability to be brief and know I don't type this to try and pile on, I legitimately want to help. I'd argue even if we feel your macros are correct maybe there are some underlying issues with needing more micros, vegetables, and fruits to help fuel much lower base processes that may be detrimental (partly feeding into what you measure as hormonal issues) and making it hard to eat in a deficit.

I'll end with saying, maybe controversially, it isn't always about looking for the optimal way to cut the calories out (fasting being about the furthest end we can go on that spectrum), but that recently I've been considering the success I see with some in an idea or fashion of trying to prime to body to burn and eat more to still lose. I am not saying we are looking to disregard the thermodynamics of intake/outtake, but that with a system that has been in constant surplus for most of its life the internal machinery just may not be working optimally. If we can get expenditure amounts up (both through structured training and finding an increased and sustainable NEAT boost), we can get the body to eat more as well (while still being in a deficit hopefully, if not know then hopefully down the road to make losing easier), so that we are pushing and pulling more "through the system" therefore making a more efficient system so that weight loss is more readily attainable and maintained.

I probably didn't type that the way I'd prefer and sure maybe I'll get some disagreement, but going off similar ideas of energy flux and ideas similar to this study finding low energy flux was better at predicting weight loss regain: https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/103/6/1389/4637455

Sorry for the long post, I know it sucks, dieting sucks, our world makes it near impossible, but know even if it feels like you are beating your head against the wall that most of us just want to help and we understand (to different extents) the struggle. Good luck!
 

bigdadybry

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What specifically are you eating or what "diet" are you following. Let's start there. Atkins, Keto, 30/30/30, vegan, etc.

Preference would be to confirm diet first, move to exercise plan, fine tune and maximize goals with drugs/supplements. Not saying this is you, but if someone can't follow a diet, just skip to meth for weight loss.
 

jrock645

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What specifically are you eating or what "diet" are you following. Let's start there. Atkins, Keto, 30/30/30, vegan, etc.

Preference would be to confirm diet first, move to exercise plan, fine tune and maximize goals with drugs/supplements. Not saying this is you, but if someone can't follow a diet, just skip to meth for weight loss.
he cant follow a diet. He fasts for 36 hours and then is in a surplus the rest of the time and doesnt understand why that isnt working
 

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