Best option opinions

[RudeBadger]

Guys,

Am looking for advice. I have a new full bottle of DMZ. During my research I found a lot of suggestions that Trest/MENT was a good start for it. Now as far as I know ph's are harsher on the body so my very direct questions are below.
Given MENT is supposedly a reasonably good oral test base. So which of these will be most effective. Not looking to blow up massively just good noticeable keepable gains. Am 6"1 185lbs, 12% body fat and good knowledge of ocs and pct.

1. DMZ + MENT 4 week cycle.
2. Anavar + MENT 10 week cycle
3. Tbol + MENT 8 week cycle
4. Dbol + MENT 4 week cycle

I have the option of swapping out the MENT for 4 androstenediol if that's a better option.

Please put bias toward particular brands aside and let me know if these are good bad or ugly. Please also elaborate on any comments rather than just sayinh " that's s **** idea' am on here to increase my knowledge and adapt accordingly rather than reading a bunch of internet sites that are either poorly playdurisrd or promoting some **** product that is nowt more than a few vitamin

Cheers

Oh and ps, not a newbie, just trying to get the best bang for my buck without screwing my bod too much

 

[Whisky]

Trest is a great compound, however I assume in your research you’ve seen and are ok with the fact it’s very hard to recover from? It’s probably the compound that will hasten your path to trt more than most (if you aren’t already on it).

it’s very wet and a great muscle builder so on that basis I would pair it with something dry and strength focused. Tbol (if legit) or var would be my way to go.

I think dbol and trest would be a nightmare for estro. I’ve not run DMZ so not really commenting on that but given then big hitter will be the trest I think var and tbol having less sides than dmz makes them preferable imo

 

[RudeBadger]

Trest is a great compound, however I assume in your research you’ve seen and are ok with the fact it’s very hard to recover from? It’s probably the compound that will hasten your path to trt more than most (if you aren’t already on it).

it’s very wet and a great muscle builder so on that basis I would pair it with something dry and strength focused. Tbol (if legit) or var would be my way to go.

I think dbol and trest would be a nightmare for estro. I’ve not run DMZ so not really commenting on that but given then big hitter will be the trest I think var and tbol having less sides than dmz makes them preferable imo

Ahhh wasn't aware of that about trest, may give that a swerve. Thanks man.

As a side note I only use Balkan farmer (see what I did there) so happy am gtg on source.

Thanks man

 

[Carnivorecon]

Trest is a great compound, however I assume in your research you’ve seen and are ok with the fact it’s very hard to recover from? It’s probably the compound that will hasten your path to trt more than most (if you aren’t already on it).

it’s very wet and a great muscle builder so on that basis I would pair it with something dry and strength focused. Tbol (if legit) or var would be my way to go.

I think dbol and trest would be a nightmare for estro. I’ve not run DMZ so not really commenting on that but given then big hitter will be the trest I think var and tbol having less sides than dmz makes them preferable imo

Second this ^^^ mike arnold did an episode on beast fitness radio about his own issues with trest destroying his libido, for months! Its not just about having low T after either, its something intrinsic to the compound and it can last a long time. Its definitely not something to take light heartedly. Be aware before going in with this one my friend.

 

[Project223]

TD Trest is worth looking into for your cycle. It offers a more sustained release throughout the day so you don’t have to ride the Trest rollercoaster for two months.

 

[RudeBadger]

Ok, so am bowing to experience and kicking trest to the kerb.

So, taking the below into account Am 6"1 185lbs, 12% body fat and good knowledge of ocs and pct.

1. DMZ + 4AD 4 week cycle.
2. Anavar + 4AD 10 week cycle
3. Tbol + 4 AD 8 week cycle
4. Dbol + 4AD 4 week cycle and
my aim is maintain bf, increases size (a noticeable amount)

Am talking 4 androstenediol rather than 4 4-androstenedione.

Sooooo torn.......

 

[Renew1]

Ok, so am bowing to experience and kicking trest to the kerb.

So, taking the below into account Am 6"1 185lbs, 12% body fat and good knowledge of ocs and pct.

1. DMZ + 4AD 4 week cycle.
2. Anavar + 4AD 10 week cycle
3. Tbol + 4 AD 8 week cycle
4. Dbol + 4AD 4 week cycle and
my aim is maintain bf, increases size (a noticeable amount)

Am talking 4 androstenediol rather than 4 4-androstenedione.

Sooooo torn.......

IMO ... 1. Anavar ( If you can find good Var. It can be difficult.)

2. Tbol.

3. DMZ

4. Dbol.

I'd be happy to elaborate if you have any questions.

 

[RudeBadger]

Thanks man, that's where I was leaning too. Would be Balkan farmer all the way.

Would anavar + tbol (1/2) dose 4ad + 4Ad work. Can't remember if they are class 1 or 2. If I recall correctly a combo of class 1 and 2 should work well??

 

[Renew1]

Thanks man, that's where I was leaning too. Would be Balkan farmer all the way.

Would anavar + tbol (1/2) dose 4ad + 4Ad work. Can't remember if they are class 1 or 2. If I recall correctly a combo of class 1 and 2 should work well??

Personally, I'd pick one.

And since Anavar is probably my favorite Steroid, that's the one I'd pick.

Leaning, hardening, STRENGTH, builds Lean muscle, gives a great look.

 

[Whisky]

IMO ... 1. Anavar ( If you can find good Var. It can be difficult.)

2. Tbol.

3. DMZ

4. Dbol.

I'd be happy to elaborate if you have any questions.

yep, for your goals this is also the way I would go. I think tbol is underrated but for a little bit of quality size as well as strength then this is a good shout.

 

[Hyde]

Tbol is the best balance of new lean size vs sides, and it will increase endurance. Anavar will not produce as much size as Tbol, but whatever you get will be solid lean mass (it also lets you store way more creatine for temporary strength if you use that). Better for a recomp or cut than to lean bulk. DMZ will produce slightly more size than Tbol but higher side effects (gonna feel bad instead of feeling good). Dbol will be the most size but very watery which won’t look as good on and the weight won’t stay on when you stop.

 

[StarScream66]

It really depends on what your goals are. Are you trying to lose weight or gain muscle?

 

[RudeBadger]

Bit odd but gain s bit of timber as well as size shape. Buy the way chaps l, thanks for positive advice. Got hacked off some of the moronic response to other threads I've done, so thanks y'all.

 

[RudeBadger]

Soooo been thinking........ How would say 5 weeks tbol 70mg pd then a week's overlap transfering to 5 weeks anavar 70mg pd for a further 5 weeks?? Cheers all

 

[Mathb33]

Soooo been thinking........ How would say 5 weeks tbol 70mg pd then a week's overlap transfering to 5 weeks anavar 70mg pd for a further 5 weeks?? Cheers all

Stupid idea. Get on some injectables if you wanna run that long cycles.

 

[RudeBadger]

Stupid idea. Get on some injectables if you wanna run that long cycles.

I don't want to inject, any input from you helpfull guys.
10 weeks isn't that long on those particular products. I hear 12 is ok a on Anavar and 10 tbol.

Cheers

 

[RudeBadger]

It really is NOT too long for what you mentioned or for most orals.
I ran orals for 5 months straight and my bloodwork was only off a little bit.
And I was using Msten , Dmz, amd M 1 Alpha together , and for the first 2 months 1 andro ( 1 DHEA ) and androsterone on top of those 3.
Stopped the DMZ for the last month and a half or so and used Halodrol and Epistane. And I took no cycle support back then amd during that. I take it NOW though. But at the moment I ran out like 2 weeks ago.
Only taking Test , Mecha and what is SUPPOSED to be Var. When I switched from one of the major and respected brands to a little known Mexican lab , it doesn't feel the same. Might be tbol.

Thanks bud, and the info. Will be running 4ad as well. Just waiting on bloods sent today to see where I'm at. So tbol then onto var good combo??

 

[Hyde]

Stupid idea. Get on some injectables if you wanna run that long cycles.

I second this, and I’ll tell you why...

I don't want to inject, any input from you helpfull guys.
10 weeks isn't that long on those particular products. I hear 12 is ok a on Anavar and 10 tbol.

Cheers

Is it okay to you to have crashed HDL for 12 weeks, plus the time it takes to rebuild it? And the arterial hardening that will happen during that dyslipidemia?

It really is NOT too long for what you mentioned or for most orals.
I ran orals for 5 months straight and my bloodwork was only off a little bit.
And I was using Msten , Dmz, amd M 1 Alpha together , and for the first 2 months 1 andro ( 1 DHEA ) and androsterone on top of those 3.
Stopped the DMZ for the last month and a half or so and used Halodrol and Epistane. And I took no cycle support back then amd during that. I take it NOW though. But at the moment I ran out like 2 weeks ago.
Only taking Test , Mecha and what is SUPPOSED to be Var. When I switched from one of the major and respected brands to a little known Mexican lab , it doesn't feel the same. Might be tbol.

I have ran cycles kinda like this for a period of up to 13 weeks. Lots of andros, various orals (designers, SARMs, anavar). I got pretty big and strong, BUT the cycle was ultimately very cost ineffective and pretty bad on bloodwork.

When I started injecting some test I have gotten much bigger better results with less money, while feeling better throughout.

Thanks bud, and the info. Will be running 4ad as well. Just waiting on bloods sent today to see where I'm at. So tbol then onto var good combo??

You can definitely do this cycle, just consider longterm you can’t really go anywhere from here. You can’t keep upping the oral doses, or run them longer (I’ve tried but it just doesn’t produce any more results really). You need a more efficient delivery method, and running oral-based cycles isn’t going to be a good option for longterm cardiovascular health.

Consider transdermal AAS/designer preparations if pinning is totally out of the question. Not too expensive for transdermal test, and you can get nandrolone, eq, Trest, dienelone, Tren, mast , all of it.

Sticking to orals is fine for a couple years, but if you wanna keep going down this road you need to find a plan that doesn’t involve a heart attack before age 50.

 

[Mathb33]

I second this, and I’ll tell you why...



Is it okay to you to have crashed HDL for 12 weeks, plus the time it takes to rebuild it? And the arterial hardening that will happen during that dyslipidemia?



I have ran cycles kinda like this for a period of up to 13 weeks. Lots of andros, various orals (designers, SARMs, anavar). I got pretty big and strong, BUT the cycle was ultimately very cost ineffective and pretty bad on bloodwork.

When I started injecting some test I have gotten much bigger better results with less money, while feeling better throughout.



You can definitely do this cycle, just consider longterm you can’t really go anywhere from here. You can’t keep upping the oral doses, or run them longer (I’ve tried but it just doesn’t produce any more results really). You need a more efficient delivery method, and running oral-based cycles isn’t going to be a good option for longterm cardiovascular health.

Consider transdermal AAS/designer preparations if pinning is totally out of the question. Not too expensive for transdermal test, and you can get nandrolone, eq, Trest, dienelone, Tren, mast , all of it.

Sticking to orals is fine for a couple years, but if you wanna keep going down this road you need to find a plan that doesn’t involve a heart attack before age 50.

Love this. Such a smart guy. The end is worth of noting for everybody. Orals are good for a year or so. A little while. Anyone looking to be in that game long term should limit orals to a minimum. My first year on gear I did 3 different orals. I don’t regret any of them. I see the damage they do though. I don’t plan on using orals more than once or year if I ever do again. My bloods on tren test EQ are litterally, LITERALLY 3 times better than my bloods were on a 4 weeks msten and a 6 weeks dmz (both individually not together).

 

[RudeBadger]

Good shout....

 

[RudeBadger]

Can u give me some info on transdermal test?? Product name etc. I've read about but not researched it. Like this a a better option than 4ad as a base. Cheers

 

[jim2509]

Why not look into Sarms at sensible dosing. Both pharma makers of Lgd and Rad appear to be reporting positive results and it looks like they will end up prescription meds at some point albeit no doubt at much lower dosages than people take for performance enhancing benefits. Yeah they aren't going to be on DMZ level but then neither will the side effects.

 

[RudeBadger]

Bloods back today, finished pct Monday. Actually better than pre cycle. ,(Took Oct and pct, diet more seriously this time) lipids, liver all improved and in optimum range. Only flagged was high testosterone and shgb. could nolva be the cause or simply left overs from ped???? Shall reip now in prep for a few weeks.

Any thoughts??

Cheers

 

[Hyde]

Can u give me some info on transdermal test?? Product name etc. I've read about but not researched it. Like this a a better option than 4ad as a base. Cheers

Well, testosterone is a scheduled substance in the US. So you either get prescription or illegally acquire it.

 

[Whisky]

It really is NOT too long for what you mentioned or for most orals.
I ran orals for 5 months straight and my bloodwork was only off a little bit.
And I was using Msten , Dmz, amd M 1 Alpha together , and for the first 2 months 1 andro ( 1 DHEA ) and androsterone on top of those 3.
Stopped the DMZ for the last month and a half or so and used Halodrol and Epistane. And I took no cycle support back then amd during that. I take it NOW though. But at the moment I ran out like 2 weeks ago.
Only taking Test , Mecha and what is SUPPOSED to be Var. When I switched from one of the major and respected brands to a little known Mexican lab , it doesn't feel the same. Might be tbol.

would be very strange for someone to fake var with tbol bro - both expensive. Var is normally faked with winny....

 

[Whisky]

Bloods back today, finished pct Monday. Actually better than pre cycle. ,(Took Oct and pct, diet more seriously this time) lipids, liver all improved and in optimum range. Only flagged was high testosterone and shgb. could nolva be the cause or simply left overs from ped???? Shall reip now in prep for a few weeks.

Any thoughts??

CheersView attachment 197091

bro you gotta wait 1-2 months (I normally say 3) till after pct to get bloods if you want a genuine picture of where your hormones are at (I’ve made this mistake before). It takes that time to rebalance and yes the nolva will absolutely be playing a part in those results.

Hyde’s post was spot on about orals as well. I started that route and quickly moved to pinning.

i like orals whilst pinning (although my last and best blast was all pinned) for the crazy impact something like sdrol can have but I’ll always keep orals for 4-6 weeks with a gap of at least 4 weeks if I run a kicker and starter (I run long blasts and cruise inbetween so that’s not a suggestion for anyone generally unless your on trt or willing to be)

 

[RudeBadger]

bro you gotta wait 1-2 months (I normally say 3) till after pct to get bloods if you want a genuine picture of where your hormones are at (I’ve made this mistake before). It takes that time to rebalance and yes the nolva will absolutely be playing a part in those results.

Hyde’s post was spot on about orals as well. I started that route and quickly moved to pinning.

i like orals whilst pinning (although my last and best blast was all pinned) for the crazy impact something like sdrol can have but I’ll always keep orals for 4-6 weeks with a gap of at least 4 weeks if I run a kicker and starter (I run long blasts and cruise inbetween so that’s not a suggestion for anyone generally unless your on trt or willing to be)

Roger that, still wanna reup as just been paid

 

[RudeBadger]

Can anyone recommend a currant g2g lab. Currently torn between rohm and Balkan farmar

 

[Whisky]

If only Pred's transdermals were not priced so damn high . That tren was pretty damn good , but had me super extra angry at my girl over some **** she pulled. But what she always called roid rage was NOT roid rage at all in my book . Totally justifiable anger and most of how reacted is how any guy in my situation would've done. I'm on injectable tren now for the first time and have not lost my mind once. Now seeing how my body reacts to higher doses( or teen and others ) , I find what all those IFBB bodybuilders CLAIMED their doses were in that famous Tom Platz video is just crazy lowball doses. I don't believe any of those guys.

that dan the bodybuilder from Thailand (what he calls himself) claims on his podcast that most of the bodybuilders lie about their doses and they are taking way more than they claim.

 

[Whisky]

I said tbol because I seen it suggested by a few reputable sources that Var is faked with tbol sometimes. Even my friend that used to be a regional supplier with 3 different safe houses says it's faked with tbol sometimes.

nothing to say I’m right at all bro and if you’ve got people on the inside saying that maybe it’s true, just seems weird to fake one expensive compound with another (normally more expensive) compound?

 

[Hyde]

that dan the bodybuilder from Thailand (what he calls himself) claims on his podcast that most of the bodybuilders lie about their doses and they are taking way more than they claim.

I started listening to his podcast and I couldn’t make it through the first episode. He’s truly a fucking idiot. I appreciate the guy giving his honest advice & experiences out and trying to keep it real with guys who need some guidance - that is awesome to me. But he is not an intelligent man, and some of his opinions are presented purely as absolutes.

He said Taurine is snake oil to fix low back pumps. “So it reduces your pump in your back but not your arms?? Bro, if you believe that, idk what to tell you...” What? Why are you even addressing this, like there’s some giant scam in the industry?? It’s just a fucking amino acid that aids hydration, which gets thrown off some on gear. You drink some in training and hit helps you stay a bit more hydrated with less cramps. It costs nothing and nobody is getting rich off of it lol.

Guy means well but I would take it all with a big grain of salt.

 

[Whisky]

I started listening to his podcast and I couldn’t make it through the first episode. He’s truly a fucking idiot. I appreciate the guy giving his honest advice & experiences out and trying to keep it real with guys who need some guidance - that is awesome to me. But he is not an intelligent man, and some of his opinions are presented purely as absolutes.

He said Taurine is snake oil to fix low back pumps. “So it reduces your pump in your back but not your arms?? Bro, if you believe that, idk what to tell you...” What? Why are you even addressing this, like there’s some giant scam in the industry?? It’s just a fucking amino acid that aids hydration, which gets thrown off some on gear. You drink some in training and hit helps you stay a bit more hydrated with less cramps. It costs nothing and nobody is getting rich off of it lol.

Guy means well but I would take it all with a big grain of salt.

haha yeah I’ve said in other threads that some of what he says doesn’t stack up based on what I’ve heard elsewhere/seen the science behind.

but I think he does talk honestly about what he does and what he sees others do (obviously he can’t state fact about all pro’s as clearly he doesn’t know them all). Most of the stuff seems to be anecdotal and some of it is true based on what I’ve personally experienced (he talked about the pip/inflammation issues with pinning TTM as apparently the solvents they use to make that blend lead to it. I had more issues off that blend than anything else I’ve pinned by miles)

but yeah not a lot of science. I actually use it to fall asleep to as I find him amusing and his voice is quite soothing