Article: Carbohydrates And Fat Loss
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fueledpassion
Well-known member
And get ready for the haters...
I agree with this though. Been doin that 50/30/20 for quite some time with success.
But of course, above 12-15% BF and u need to cut carbs because ur insulin sensitivity probably isnt ideal.
Good article.
I agree with this though. Been doin that 50/30/20 for quite some time with success.
But of course, above 12-15% BF and u need to cut carbs because ur insulin sensitivity probably isnt ideal.
Good article.
dieseljay74
Member
Amen brother ...been doing great on just that same macro breakdown
dieseljay74
Member
Got that right...same here
fueledpassion
Well-known member
Dont count MCT's as LCT's. They metabolize differently and should honestly be their own macro. This is the way I do it anyways.
Dietary fat does not break down in any way like MCT's do.
fueledpassion
Well-known member
True, but I have seen above average natural physiques that carb cycle though. Maybe carb loading every 4 days or so...
dieseljay74
Member
I tried the low carb thing and stayed strong but kind of dead ended in any growth.
Just started an approach as talked about above with carbs as roughly 30% of cal. and do feel better with no noticeable fat gain.
fueledpassion
Well-known member
Yeah, the best macros I have ever done for fat loss are:
Protein 35%
Carbs 25%
Dietary Fat 10%
MCT 30%
Yikes, watchout because that much MCT causes the body to become a furnace.
Combined with T3 and/or mild androgens makes for incredible fat loss with little to no muscle loss.
Example diet for 2500 kcals
Protein = About 215g
Carbs = About 150g
Fats = About 30g
MCT = About 7.5 TBSP
JD261985
Banned
3 tablespoons of MCT's gets my stomach upset. Even coconut oil. But I have acid reflux disease. Oh well maybe I just can't do it
fueledpassion
Well-known member
3 tablespoons of MCT's gets my stomach upset. Even coconut oil. But I have acid reflux disease. Oh well maybe I just can't do it
Prolly not then.
Other solutions are something like baking soda with each MCT dosing.
Gotta spread those dosages out though. I usually do 1 TBSP per meal, and often times only do it 3 times daily. 8 was excessive but yielded good results.
dieseljay74
Member
Well Fueled, that sounds like exactly what I need!
Trying to drop that last lower ab inch and I think if I up my MCT to that amount it may help break my through. That and some Alphamine and F95
fueledpassion
Well-known member
If u do the LG, you'll be fine even with more modest amounts of MCT.
pudgypower
New member
3 tablespoons of MCT's gets my stomach upset. Even coconut oil. But I have acid reflux disease. Oh well maybe I just can't do it
I've had acid reflux disease for 8 years and have tried everything in the books the only thing that I have found that helps is high fiber diet like 40 grams a day. I might get 1 attack every 2 weeks now and it's usually because I don't follow my diet.
dieseljay74
Member
Good to know...love coconut oil in my coffee
snagencyV2.0
Legend
hmmm..you must not get around much
I lived semi-keto lifestyle for ~4yrs, competed, stayed lean and muscular yr-round even when I was not competing, all while natural back then..
aaand there is the part of my own equation as well LOL
carb loads are a must, in that kind of protocol - hell even in true diehard keto, you still have periodic carb days
and this
you can grow to a point, but tough to keep growing the further in you get - assuming you are concurrently trying to stay lean the entire time anyway
anyway, overall the article is solid, on point albeit not very earth-shattering or cutting edge
there is so much more to understanding nutrition and your own metabolism, than simply plugging in random macro splits that everyone else talks about
dieseljay74
Member
hmmm..you must not get around much
I lived semi-keto lifestyle for ~4yrs, competed, stayed lean and muscular yr-round even when I was not competing, all while natural back then..aaand there is the part of my own equation as well LOL
carb loads are a must, in that kind of protocol - hell even in true diehard keto, you still have periodic carb days
and this
you can grow to a point, but tough to keep growing the further in you get - assuming you are concurrently trying to stay lean the entire time anyway
anyway, overall the article is solid, on point albeit not very earth-shattering or cutting edge
there is so much more to understanding nutrition and your own metabolism, than simply plugging in random macro splits that everyone else talks about
I think I have reached the point where it's time to start implementing IF and adding in some carbs see if I can start sparking some growth
snagencyV2.0
Legend
IF in itself does not lend to growth, and in fact I do not even like it for leaning endeavors (I do not like the concept, period)
to each their own tho, just would not be anything I'd ever advise, let alone for lean growth
want to think a funny thought? ask yourself how that guy in your avi would react to IF
fueledpassion
Well-known member
IF in itself does not lend to growth, and in fact I do not even like it for leaning endeavors (I do not like the concept, period)
to each their own tho, just would not be anything I'd ever advise, let alone for lean growth
want to think a funny thought? ask yourself how that guy in your avi would react to IF
Its good for leaning up, but not the best approach for mass gains. You can retain muscle very well on it if u do ur homework and put the right supps/chems together.
I tend to use peps for this type of dieting because GH is anti-catabolic and accelerates fat use. Although I did use LG diet once while 100% natty and I lost tons of weight in the mid-section. The best I ever looked "natty".
If ur into peps, pharma grade fat burners etc and get some IM L-Carnitine along with Leucine, u can cut up really well on that type of diet. The gains, if any, will trult be lean only for sure though. Not much water and probably no fat involved in the growth.
dieseljay74
Member
IF in itself does not lend to growth, and in fact I do not even like it for leaning endeavors (I do not like the concept, period)
to each their own tho, just would not be anything I'd ever advise, let alone for lean growth
want to think a funny thought? ask yourself how that guy in your avi would react to IF
What would you advise for lean growth...I.E. zero to little BF accumulation?
Definitely open to suggestions.
Right now at 6' and around 200 lbs. Maybe 16% BF my Cal's are 2700 - 2900 daily
All while under 50g carbs...the resr split between fats and protein
snagencyV2.0
Legend
certainly no need for carbs to be that low...cals seem a little low as well
nice results can be produced with a simple carb rotation schedule
ie day 1, 150 carbs..
day 2, 200 carbs
day 3, 250 carbs
day 4, back to 150 carbs
etc etc
there are a lot of ways to skin a cat, but this one is very easy and not that restrictive either..
the key, however, in addition to making sure your fats & proteins are properly in line, is making sure the quality of the macros (ie, the micros) are clean, in order to shape the body composition (ie no fat, lean muscle), and #2 - sufficient enough to be able to cause & sustain growth (ie, your current cals look to be too low)
there are some rough guidelines
nice results can be produced with a simple carb rotation schedule
ie day 1, 150 carbs..
day 2, 200 carbs
day 3, 250 carbs
day 4, back to 150 carbs
etc etc
there are a lot of ways to skin a cat, but this one is very easy and not that restrictive either..
the key, however, in addition to making sure your fats & proteins are properly in line, is making sure the quality of the macros (ie, the micros) are clean, in order to shape the body composition (ie no fat, lean muscle), and #2 - sufficient enough to be able to cause & sustain growth (ie, your current cals look to be too low)
there are some rough guidelines
fueledpassion
Well-known member
Good post Snag.
My experience has been that I can have far more flexibility with carbs if my fats are low.
I dont usually recommend this approach to anyone that isnt:
1) performing intermittent fasting OR
2) already in a fairly lean state (12% or less)
When I say low fat, I mean 10% or less. Only take in EFA's, no saturated fats if possible.
I supplement with MCT and eat a 1:1 ratio of complex carbs vs. protein. This has been an excellent way for me to recomp or to have a slow bulk. Complex carbs is key...
Outright cutting may require a more balanced approach, more HIIT and perhaps less carbs to get sub 10% BF.
My experience has been that I can have far more flexibility with carbs if my fats are low.
I dont usually recommend this approach to anyone that isnt:
1) performing intermittent fasting OR
2) already in a fairly lean state (12% or less)
When I say low fat, I mean 10% or less. Only take in EFA's, no saturated fats if possible.
I supplement with MCT and eat a 1:1 ratio of complex carbs vs. protein. This has been an excellent way for me to recomp or to have a slow bulk. Complex carbs is key...
Outright cutting may require a more balanced approach, more HIIT and perhaps less carbs to get sub 10% BF.
dieseljay74
Member
I agree with Fueled on the great post.
Not sure if it matters that I'm natty at all? I know it's little different when geared or so I've read here.
I was thinking I may be a little low on calories so I will bump to 3000 on w/o days and 2700 on non w\o days and see how I fair.
Are your above recommendations applicable to IF or just standard eating throughout the day?
Just looking for a solid starting point really. I'm starting to get the paralysis by analysis bug after reading so many completely conflicting and might I add " research based and cited " protocols.
You'd think science would be more cut and dry in regards to this. I mean we can diagnose, treat and cure thousands of ailments but can't get a solid damn answer on this.
I know we are all different but really, we're all the same physiologically?
My brain hurts
fueledpassion
Well-known member
Just try something based off past experiences and adjust.
PDCA - Plan Do Check Adjust
Get a tape measure and a scale for daily use. Try it. Record measurements. Adjust diet/training until desired results are apparent.
PDCA - Plan Do Check Adjust
Get a tape measure and a scale for daily use. Try it. Record measurements. Adjust diet/training until desired results are apparent.
dieseljay74
Member
Gonna have to apparently.
Just frustrating when there are so many conflicting beliefs.
I read 5 articles today and they were all drastically contradictory.
You'd think this process would be far less vague
snagencyV2.0
Legend
thank you
to an extent yes, but nothing different about nutritional approach for you - if anything, it will just make it more important for you to eat even cleaner to make growth/no fat gain work
okay, but I think 3250/2750 sounds more in line...then, you can make adjustments from there
but start wherever you feel comfortable
I have absolutely no recommendation for IF anything
but you certainly could still apply all the principles, regardless of how you time your eating
there is a lot of info out there, obviously..some of it good some of it worthless and wrong
i advise you take in what you see, apply it personally, and make your own decisions on how worthwhile something is...then, you will eventually no longer search for these unreachable exact macros/cal totals blueprint you seem to think exist
, and know yourself how to construct your own diettrial and error my man, and error and trial
physiological similarity has absolutely nothing to do with metabolic and habit differentiation between ppl, and how their body responds because of these life shaping adaptations, let alone genetic differences, etc etc
humans are not machines that can be studied in a cookie-cutter fashion, with respect to this stuff ... the body is not a textbook
dieseljay74
Member
thank you
to an extent yes, but nothing different about nutritional approach for you - if anything, it will just make it more important for you to eat even cleaner to make growth/no fat gain work
okay, but I think 3250/2750 sounds more in line...then, you can make adjustments from there
but start wherever you feel comfortable
I have absolutely no recommendation for IF anything
but you certainly could still apply all the principles, regardless of how you time your eating
there is a lot of info out there, obviously..some of it good some of it worthless and wrong
i advise you take in what you see, apply it personally, and make your own decisions on how worthwhile something is...then, you will eventually no longer search for these unreachable exact macros/cal totals blueprint you seem to think exist
trial and error my man, and error and trial
physiological similarity has absolutely nothing to do with metabolic and habit differentiation between ppl, and how their body responds because of these life shaping adaptations, let alone genetic differences, etc etc
humans are not machines that can be studied in a cookie-cutter fashion, with respect to this stuff ... the body is not a textbook
Well said man. I think you hit the nail on the head.
I am to get around those calories in each day and adjust as necessary based on goals by manipulating fats and carbs around as needed.
Thanks for all the help and insights. Definitely helped alot
MEGATRONIC
New member
Gotta get ur macros on point so u can Mack hoes!
darmar
New member
What's your opinion on skipping carbs during the first part of the day?
Here's my plan:
- 6am, wake up, protein shake (zero carbs, some MCT & Omega-3)
- 8-9am, zero carbs breakfast (eggs, meat, hard cheese, olives)
- 11:30-12am, lunch (50 or more grams of clean carbs, rice/oats, meat, vegetables, some fat)
- 3pm, snack (cottage cheese with nuts)
- 5-6pm, dinner (carbs, meat, vegetables, some fat)
- sometimes PB&J sandwich with protein shake as pre-workout, if I feel like I need one
- hard workout at 9pm till 10:30pm; gainer post-workout (60g concetrate-casein protein, 85g fast carbs)
I'm 238 lbs, 6'3", about 15%bf. Doing workouts 4-5 days a week for the past 2.5 years when I started with 352 lbs body weight.
I tried "everything", but the above plan is the one I'm currently following as it shows to be the most successfull one, makes me feel good and keeps me in both fat-loss and mucle building mode
Here's my plan:
- 6am, wake up, protein shake (zero carbs, some MCT & Omega-3)
- 8-9am, zero carbs breakfast (eggs, meat, hard cheese, olives)
- 11:30-12am, lunch (50 or more grams of clean carbs, rice/oats, meat, vegetables, some fat)
- 3pm, snack (cottage cheese with nuts)
- 5-6pm, dinner (carbs, meat, vegetables, some fat)
- sometimes PB&J sandwich with protein shake as pre-workout, if I feel like I need one
- hard workout at 9pm till 10:30pm; gainer post-workout (60g concetrate-casein protein, 85g fast carbs)
I'm 238 lbs, 6'3", about 15%bf. Doing workouts 4-5 days a week for the past 2.5 years when I started with 352 lbs body weight.
I tried "everything", but the above plan is the one I'm currently following as it shows to be the most successfull one, makes me feel good and keeps me in both fat-loss and mucle building mode
fueledpassion
Well-known member
What's your opinion on skipping carbs during the first part of the day?
Here's my plan:
- 6am, wake up, protein shake (zero carbs, some MCT & Omega-3)
- 8-9am, zero carbs breakfast (eggs, meat, hard cheese, olives)
- 11:30-12am, lunch (50 or more grams of clean carbs, rice/oats, meat, vegetables, some fat)
- 3pm, snack (cottage cheese with nuts)
- 5-6pm, dinner (carbs, meat, vegetables, some fat)
- sometimes PB&J sandwich with protein shake as pre-workout, if I feel like I need one
- hard workout at 9pm till 10:30pm; gainer post-workout (60g concetrate-casein protein, 85g fast carbs)
I'm 238 lbs, 6'3", about 15%bf. Doing workouts 4-5 days a week for the past 2.5 years when I started with 352 lbs body weight.
I tried "everything", but the above plan is the one I'm currently following as it shows to be the most successfull one, makes me feel good and keeps me in both fat-loss and mucle building mode
That's almost a carbless PWO diet. Basically, start eating carbs around mid day and stop at ur workout and move back to protein and fats afterwards.
There is a but of nifty science that suggests that insulin sensitivity remains extremely high after working out for up to 36hrs. However, that sensitivity returns to baseline after ingesting carbs. This is almost proprietary information to Datbtrue, so my ability to create links to references is limited. I'd suggest joining his site for more details. But here is a nutshell in layman's terms:
The idea behind this very successful diet is to allow the body to remain in a highly anabolic, highly insulin sensitive mode for extended periods. In ur case, u could remain this way for up to 18-20hrs per day. Zero fat accumulation during that period while having a soaring of anabolic activity during the carb - up phase would minimize protein catabolism during training and also increases ur workout performance while giving u about 80% of the day to liberate and burn fatty acids for energy. Taking insulin - suppressing supps would make sense during this window as well to further the results.