Are cortisol comtrol substances necessary in PCT?

[JoePaul39]

For a bulk is a good cortisol control compound a necessary compound tonhave during PCT? What if you are on trt, does that change anything? Also, if it is a mild cycle of just a stack of 3 Sarms and 1 andro would it still be highly recommended? Finally, should it be used during PCT for a cut as well to avoid fat gain? Thinking of buying a bottle of SNS Reduce XT for my upcoming S23, Rad 140, LGD, 1 andro, 175 mg trt cruise dose 8 week bulking cycle, would it be money well spent?

 

[Whisky]

My view is yes but Chados is way more knowledgable than me on it.....

 

[Chados]

My view is yes but Chados is way more knowledgable than me on it.....

Haha i don't know about that but thank you for believing in me

Well yes and no. You have cortisol which is just terrible to deal with during pct. Cortisol is catabolic for the muscle and anabolic with the fat, exact opposite of testosterone which is anabolic for the muscle and catabolic with the fat.

Basically what you're going through being shutdown is the complete opposite of what is happening during a cycle.

If you manage to control the diet to a tee its very possible you don't need it. It's helpful and it's really up to yourself how well you manage it. I think carbs are also a big threat to the physique during pct. If you're at 500gr of carbs and you don't add fat during a cycle you'd probably decrease that to at least half


Being on trt definitely helps, I think a minimum dose to keep (everything) granted you will lose some, that's just the game. The minimum dosage to keep everything you've gained is probably around 250-300mg of test which isn't trt.

 

[stopstalking]

With Reduce XT being so cheap I don’t see any reason not to add it. With the money spent on cycles, I would wanna maximizes what I kept after

 

[Old Witch]

I’ve always used cortisol control after a blast. I always thought it gave me an edge I wouldn’t have had otherwise. It’s not NEEDED but it is good to do.

 

[Old Witch]

Oh, it especially helps with orals. They are highly inhibiting of cortisol, so letting it rebound is obviously not good. Probably why most people don’t keep nearly any oral-only gains. A strong cortisol control after an oral, and you might actually keep the muscles swollen long enough to keep the weight on.

 

[jrock645]

I have always felt like anti cortisol was a good addition to pct. I dont have any hatd numbers, but ive done better at maintaining body composition post cycle with them.

 

[JoePaul39]

Being on trt definitely helps, I think a minimum dose to keep (everything) granted you will lose some, that's just the game. The minimum dosage to keep everything you've gained is probably around 250-300mg of test which isn't trt.

Ya I am only on 175 mg test a week for trt. Don’t want to go any higher because it causes my estrogen to go out of range and I have no interest in using an AI that screws up lipids and puts you at risk for obstreperous . What is your final verdict, yay or no on cortisol after cycles if on trt? I obviously don’t want to waste money if it really isn’t needed. I do follow my diet and macros to a tee, but if it helps maiintain muscle and rid off fat I am willing to invest in buying it. Also, do you yourself use it on cycle as well? I would imagine if you can’t afford to run it on cycle and for pct (like myself) just running for pct would be better than on cycle and none in pct?

 

[JoePaul39]

I’ve always used cortisol control after a blast. I always thought it gave me an edge I wouldn’t have had otherwise. It’s not NEEDED but it is good to do.

Ya I think I am going to get sns reduce xt. It is cheap. You use it on cycle to oldwitch ?

 

[JoePaul39]

Oh, it especially helps with orals. They are highly inhibiting of cortisol, so letting it rebound is obviously not good. Probably why most people don’t keep nearly any oral-only gains. A strong cortisol control after an oral, and you might actually keep the muscles swollen long enough to keep the weight on.

Thanks. I am going to take your advice since I will be on four orals at once. You are a guru veteran with a wealth of anabolic knowledge! Hope you stick around for a long time on the board. Enjoy and learn from your posts.

 

[Old Witch]

On cycle no, never thought extra cortisol control was necessary. Afterwards, though... like I said before.

 

[Chados]

Ya I am only on 175 mg test a week for trt. Don’t want to go any higher because it causes my estrogen to go out of range and I have no interest in using an AI that screws up lipids and puts you at risk for obstreperous . What is your final verdict, yay or no on cortisol after cycles if on trt? I obviously don’t want to waste money if it really isn’t needed. I do follow my diet and macros to a tee, but if it helps maiintain muscle and rid off fat I am willing to invest in buying it. Also, do you yourself use it on cycle as well? I would imagine if you can’t afford to run it on cycle and for pct (like myself) just running for pct would be better than on cycle and none in pct?

I'd you haven't figured out diet to a tee I'd say yes, but you'd might still wanna drop calories and carbs after the cycle cause your metabolism will decrease and your anabolic/catabolic state will change.

 

[jtmartin18]

Old Witch What do you recommend for cortisol control in PCT?

 

[stopstalking]

Old Witch What do you recommend for cortisol control in PCT?

I know You specifically asked old witch but I’ve ran so many cycles I’ve lost count. Reduce XT has been around a long time. Simply because it works. I’ve used it for at least 10 years. Usually during pct.

 

[Old Witch]

Old Witch What do you recommend for cortisol control in PCT?

Vitamin C
5AT
7OH
7KETO
11OXO (possibly suppressive)
Ksm 66
Dopaminergic drugs such as nicotine (indirect)
GW501516 (indirect)

 

[Chados]

Oh, it especially helps with orals. They are highly inhibiting of cortisol, so letting it rebound is obviously not good. Probably why most people don’t keep nearly any oral-only gains. A strong cortisol control after an oral, and you might actually keep the muscles swollen long enough to keep the weight on.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by orals and cortisol, they do have a greater effect on (cholesterol) though if methylated which pretty much is every oral that's worth mentioning. Since you often use orals shorter than injectibles you should experience at best the same but most likely less effect on cortisol, I also noticed you mentioned cardarine and you said (indirectly) which I can sort of understand since it can help with fatloss but cardarine have nothing to do with cortisol, it just prevents cholesterol from steroid usage.

 

[Old Witch]

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by orals and cortisol, they do have a greater effect on (cholesterol) though if methylated which pretty much is every oral that's worth mentioning. Since you often use orals shorter than injectibles you should experience at best the same but most likely less effect on cortisol, I also noticed you mentioned cardarine and you said (indirectly) which I can sort of understand since it can help with fatloss but cardarine have nothing to do with cortisol, it just prevents cholesterol from steroid usage.

The lowered heart exertion during training prevents cortisol release for a more prolonged period of time.

Orals, most of them, have a profound effect on blocking cortisol (glucocorticoid) and highly raising aldosterone (mineralocorticoid) by inhibiting 11bhsd which would normally begin the process to convert mineralocorticoid into glucocorticoid.

If you’re coming directly off an oral, especially a strong one, cortisol inhibition would be ideal to attempt to maintain those watery gains.

 

[John Smeton]

You could try them. I did in one oct.

 

[Chados]

The lowered heart exertion during training prevents cortisol release for a more prolonged period of time.

Orals, most of them, have a profound effect on blocking cortisol (glucocorticoid) and highly raising aldosterone (mineralocorticoid) by inhibiting 11bhsd which would normally begin the process to convert mineralocorticoid into glucocorticoid.

If you’re coming directly off an oral, especially a strong one, cortisol inhibition would be ideal to attempt to maintain those watery gains.

Well the recovery for a shorter cycle is always better and the reason you'd expect to keep muscles from a long cycle is because the muscle comes on slowly (nothing new). In theory it should be the same just a (shorter) side effect from orals, or in general I should say. Recovery might be far harder with oral trestolone for 8 weeks then testosterone for 13.

 

[The Express 42]

I ALWAYS use SNS reduce XT. Ver popular cortisol supplement that works. Ashwaghanda also has a positive effect on cortisol. CEL Mtest has a full dose of KSM66 Ashwaghanda. Also include these two supps in my PCT

 

[stopstalking]

I ALWAYS use SNS reduce XT. Ver popular cortisol supplement that works. Ashwaghanda also has a positive effect on cortisol. CEL Mtest has a full dose of KSM66 Ashwaghanda. Also include these two supps in my PCT

Nailed it

 

[JoePaul39]

I ALWAYS use SNS reduce XT. Ver popular cortisol supplement that works. Ashwaghanda also has a positive effect on cortisol. CEL Mtest has a full dose of KSM66 Ashwaghanda. Also include these two supps in my PCT

Ya pretty much everyone on here seems to say Reduce XT so I have my bottle purchased and ready to go 7 weeks ahead of time!

 

[Chados]

Ya pretty much everyone on here seems to say Reduce XT so I have my bottle purchased and ready to go 7 weeks ahead of time!

I think there's something to be said about lean extreme too. I think it's an improved version if I remember correctly and it has ingredients reduce doesn't. I also don't know the price difference but look it up!

 

[JoePaul39]

I think there's something to be said about lean extreme too. I think it's an improved version if I remember correctly and it has ingredients reduce doesn't. I also don't know the price difference but look it up!

I am on trt by the way, will I still derive benefits from cortisol control compounds even though my total t levels will always be around 900 and up?

 

[jrock645]

Ive been using invictus and 7kt here lately in my pct

 

[Chados]

I am on trt by the way, will I still derive benefits from cortisol control compounds even though my total t levels will always be around 900 and up?

What trt dosage are you on? I mean you might still be affected by cortisol for other reasons but nah I'd say you'll be fine without. Not being shutdown is a completely different story, I'd just focus on changing the diet slightly if needed after cycle.

 

[Ricky10]

Ive been using invictus and 7kt here lately in my pct

Nice...are you full dosing each product??

 

[JoePaul39]

175 mg.

 

[Chados]

175 mg.

Well if that's the doctors advice I guess that's fine. It would be more effective in terms of keepable gains to go 300 but don't mess with the dosage and listen to the doctor, 300mg is rarely if ever trt

 

[jrock645]

Nice...are you full dosing each product??

Yes. Though I’m cutting back on the Invictus, maybe just half dose. At least for a few days. I’m wondering if my cortisol levels are crushed and if it’s causing some constipation. We’ll see if it makes a difference.

 

[Ricky10]

Yes. Though I’m cutting back on the Invictus, maybe just half dose. At least for a few days. I’m wondering if my cortisol levels are crushed and if it’s causing some constipation. We’ll see if it makes a difference.

Hmm...didn’t know that was a possibility from cortisol getting too manipulated until I just looked it up.

That must be why thebigt recommend that I not consider fully dosing the two products in the future!

I prefer working a little harder to drop my stool anyway as opposed to the alternative. The extra effort and increased perspiration burns a few extra calories too!

I am currently just on Invictus, sometimes I can’t dose it twice a day though due to my long work days. It keeps me up at night if dosed too close to bedtime..

 

[jrock645]

Hmm...didn’t know that was a possibility from cortisol getting too manipulated until I just looked it up.

That must be why thebigt recommend that I not consider fully dosing the two products in the future!

I prefer working a little harder to get it out anyway as opposed to the alternative. The extra effort and increased perspiration burns a few extra calories too!

Yeah but working to only manage spitting a couple of marbles is no good. Trust me on that. I haven’t had a proper, satisfying dump in over a week. And it’s not like just some extra work, as you put it, will do anything. It’s all stuck deep in the proverbial pipes. It’s not right there to push out.

 

[Ricky10]

Yeah but working to only manage spitting a couple of marbles is no good. Trust me on that. I haven’t had a proper, satisfying dump in over a week. And it’s not like just some extra work, as you put it, will do anything. It’s all stuck deep in the proverbial pipes. It’s not right there to push out.

Yeah, been there too. When I get too excited with Kratom, it dries everything out. Turns my colon into a cactus!

Supps with Atractylodes, Gentian, and/or Berberine tend to even things out for me down there for the most part..

 

[Old Witch]

Well the recovery for a shorter cycle is always better and the reason you'd expect to keep muscles from a long cycle is because the muscle comes on slowly (nothing new). In theory it should be the same just a (shorter) side effect from orals, or in general I should say. Recovery might be far harder with oral trestolone for 8 weeks then testosterone for 13.

Different steroids definitely inhibit 11bhsd at different rates. 17a methyl will do it the most by default, the more quickly it has an ability to raise water related BP, likely the more effectively it inhibits 11bhsd.

 

[thebigt]

Yes. Though I’m cutting back on the Invictus, maybe just half dose. At least for a few days. I’m wondering if my cortisol levels are crushed and if it’s causing some constipation. We’ll see if it makes a difference.

get back to me on that...feel free to pm me anytime!!!

 

[thebigt]

Well if that's the doctors advice I guess that's fine. It would be more effective in terms of keepable gains to go 300 but don't mess with the dosage and listen to the doctor, 300mg is rarely if ever trt

I've been on trt for over 10 years now, started out prescribed at 400mg every 2 weeks[of course I split it into 200mg weekly]. blood got thicker as time went by and gradually my dose got cut back...officially I am supposed to be getting 1ml vial of 200mg per month, but the pharmacy apparently can't read directions and I still get sent 2 vials monthly.

damn, not even sure if 50mg per week would even make much difference?

 

[Chados]

I've been on trt for over 10 years now, started out prescribed at 400mg every 2 weeks[of course I split it into 200mg weekly]. blood got thicker as time went by and gradually my dose got cut back...officially I am supposed to be getting 1ml vial of 200mg per month, but the pharmacy apparently can't read directions and I still get sent 2 vials monthly.

damn, not even sure if 50mg per week would even make much difference?

It's really not so much about 50mg here and there but if you're above natural levels you'd have a much easier time keeping your gains. I'd say it's rare people have higher than 200mg per week naturally.

An estimation would be that most people cruising at 200 would have a much greater chance keeping their gains

 

[jtmartin18]

Vitamin C
5AT
7OH
7KETO
11OXO (possibly suppressive)
Ksm 66
Dopaminergic drugs such as nicotine (indirect)
GW501516 (indirect)

Thank you!

 

[jtmartin18]

Vitamin C
5AT
7OH
7KETO
11OXO (possibly suppressive)
Ksm 66
Dopaminergic drugs such as nicotine (indirect)
GW501516 (indirect)

Do you know of a good brand that still makes 11 oxo or 11 keto?

 

[Old Witch]

Do you know of a good brand that still makes 11 oxo or 11 keto?

Medfit RX, Iron Legion, Platinum Nutraceuticals, among others.

 

[no reason]

Just take 1000mg of vitamin C