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Arachidonic Acid with Sesamin?

Beneath_the_Sea

Board Supporter
I've been doing some reading, and have come across posted studies on how Sesamin increases AA as opposed to reducing it. Would X-Factor and Sesamin be a good stack then? Would there be any positive synergy there?
 
I directed him to Phosphate Bond, Molecular Nutrition's new rep. He'd be the one to ask IMO.
 
Mixed thoughts. I think the benefits of Sesamin outweigh the benefits of AA. I would rather just eat whole eggs to get some AA then supplement with a gram of it a day.
 
Derek_aka_Beast said:
I directed him to Phosphate Bond, Molecular Nutrition's new rep. He'd be the one to ask IMO.
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Man, that kinda hurt my feelings. It's true though, Phosphate is an MD, I'm not.

Right now we say no Sesamin with AA... things might be changing after the Arnold though. That's when we're going to be talking about all sorts of AA applications.

Even though Sesamin increases AA levels, it might be similar to the way that overall increased Omega 6 (regardless of AA intake) consumption will increase AA. But this is the "bad" pathway and what leads to AA getting into tissues we don't want it in. There is a proper balance to be had which, as I mentioned before, will be better elucidated after the Arnold.

And saying you'd rather get AA from eggs is somewhat like saying I'd rather get sesamin from sesame seeds. It is POSSIBLE, but not easy to do. At least, not to the extent that is going to harness the powers that are harnessed through supplementation with sesamin and AA.
 
Apowerz6 said:
So what do you think Beast? I know sesamin is solid, but to stack? Thoughts?
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To give you a clear answer, I say alternate between cycles of the two.

BTW, Xtend is kick ass while using AA. I highly recommend this combo.
 
Personally, I'm not going to be increasing inflammation more then my body does itself. The health benifits of sesamin FAR outway the extra muscle your might make from x-factor, imo.
 
Aeternitatis said:
And saying you'd rather get AA from eggs is somewhat like saying I'd rather get sesamin from sesame seeds. It is POSSIBLE, but not easy to do. At least, not to the extent that is going to harness the powers that are harnessed through supplementation with sesamin and AA.
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I do not think that is a fitting analogy.
 
Derek_aka_Beast said:
Me either, but I couldn't find a concrete number of how much AA an egg has, so I'm not gonna argue it.
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Egg yolk contains 967 mg of AA per 1/2 pound. Combine that with a loss of approximately 20-30% when cooked and you see that it isn't the best source. The richest sources by far are organ meats.
 
I believe it is 160 mg/egg yolk.

That is about 5.5 egg yolks to get the daily dosage of AA in X-Factor.

Sesamin, on the other hand, is about 1 mg/gram of sesame seeds.

To get a daily dose of sesamin, one would need 1,500,000 grams of sesame seeds, which is more than 3,000 lbs.

As I said, not a fitting analogy.
 
doggzj said:
Personally, I'm not going to be increasing inflammation more then my body does itself. The health benifits of sesamin FAR outway the extra muscle your might make from x-factor, imo.
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When talking about proper use of X-Factor one must differentiate between muscle specific inflammation and full body inflammation.

And no one is claiming that X-Factor is more healthy than sesamin (though I have reason to believe we're gonna find sesamin to not be so great after all), that is why it is used in cycles. But it isn't like stopping your use of sesamin in order to effectively use AA is going to lead to some horrible loss in health.

Another example of your argument is that the health benefits of eating a low calorie diet FAR outweigh the extra muscle you might get from ingesting a large amount of calories. While this is true, who wants to be small and weak for the whole life just to get a few extra years out of it?
 
Aeternitatis said:
And no one is claiming that X-Factor is more healthy than sesamin (though I have reason to believe we're gonna find sesamin to not be so great after all), that is why it is used in cycles.
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What reason is that? I'd honestly like to know.

By the way, my post above was in response to Derek, and you replied before I posted, so the first line of my post comes off as real smart-ass like. Sorry bout' that.
 
Reggin said:
I believe it is 160 mg/egg yolk.

That is about 5.5 egg yolks to get the daily dosage of AA in X-Factor.

Sesamin, on the other hand, is about 1 mg/gram of sesame seeds.

To get a daily dose of sesamin, one would need 1,500,000 grams of sesame seeds, which is more than 3,000 lbs.

As I said, not a fitting analogy.
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In that case, it seem to me as though we were never meant to consume such large amounts of sesamin. It would be impossible to do naturally.

Now before everyone gets pissed at that statement, I want to say that I do think sesamin is a good product (although personally I saw nothing from it, the research is positive). I'm just trying to put a little perspective into the scene. To me though, sesamin reminds me of the flax oil craze. It was touted by everyone as the one thing you can't live without... then whoops. It negatively impacts testosterone? It is implicated in prostate cancer?

Again, sesamin has it's uses (flax does as well), but these alliances people have made to it are crazy.
 
Reggin said:
What reason is that? I'd honestly like to know.

By the way, my post above was in response to Derek, and you replied before I posted, so the first line of my post comes off as real smart-ass like. Sorry bout' that.
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Sesamin usage is still rather new. It is impossible to consume in such large amounts in any natural setting. Anecdotal evidence and personal experience show it to not be so saintly. I think it will eventually go the way of flax oil. But hey, it's just a hunch.

Similarly though, and to be fair, I would never want anyone to use X-Factor on a regular basis... at least not at a full dosage and not without proper supplemental DHA.

Your info on the eggs is very useful actually. Eggs are great because they also contain DHA which, in the right amounts, works well with AA. This is one of the reasons I've always recommended eating the entire egg. The egg whites only trend is not only wasteful, but stupid. If you can get a high quality egg that is safe to eat raw, I say go for 5-6 per day and you should see good effects from it. If you cook the egg, the amount may need to be increased close to 10 eggs per day. And finally, if cholesterol is a preexisting issue for you, this may not be the road to take.
 
Aeternitatis said:
In that case, it seem to me as though we were never meant to consume such large amounts of sesamin. It would be impossible to do naturally.

Now before everyone gets pissed at that statement, I want to say that I do think sesamin is a good product (although personally I saw nothing from it, the research is positive). I'm just trying to put a little perspective into the scene. To me though, sesamin reminds me of the flax oil craze. It was touted by everyone as the one thing you can't live without... then whoops. It negatively impacts testosterone? It is implicated in prostate cancer?

Again, sesamin has it's uses (flax does as well), but these alliances people have made to it are crazy.
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I understand your argument, but that argument can be purported with many supplements.

I.e. antioxidant compounds, Green Tea Extract, syephrine, yohimbine, and plant sterols are all present in extremely small quantities in their natural states, but have their relative benefits when extracted and concentrated to a significant enough level.
 
Reggin said:
I understand your argument, but that argument can be purported with many supplements.

I.e. antioxidant compounds, Green Tea Extract, syephrine, yohimbine, and plant sterols are all present in extremely small quantities in their natural states, but have their relative benefits when extracted and concentrated to a significant enough level.
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Perhaps.

But most of them do not come close to... well, you said a daily dose of sesamin is equal to 3,000 pounds of sesame seeds? I don't know of any other 3000:1 concentrate/extract nor do I know of any that even approach this number.

But the "dangers" of concentrates still holds true. I know that, for example, the negative effects of too much green tea concentrate have been studied. It likely holds true for anything.

Though when it comes to antioxidants, it isn't all that hard to get huge amounts from eating fresh fruits and veggies. Most people just either don't have the time, money, or will to eat them and pils become a convenience.
 
Aeternitatis said:
When talking about proper use of X-Factor one must differentiate between muscle specific inflammation and full body inflammation.

And no one is claiming that X-Factor is more healthy than sesamin (though I have reason to believe we're gonna find sesamin to not be so great after all), that is why it is used in cycles. But it isn't like stopping your use of sesamin in order to effectively use AA is going to lead to some horrible loss in health.

Another example of your argument is that the health benefits of eating a low calorie diet FAR outweigh the extra muscle you might get from ingesting a large amount of calories. While this is true, who wants to be small and weak for the whole life just to get a few extra years out of it?
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Maybe so, maybe not. But I think it's funny how your wrote this post. You are pretty much saying that we need AA or we will 'live our whole life small and weak'. That's a pretty absurd statement.

I live my life taking anti-inflammatory ibuprofen and sesamin every day, and I'm able to make very solid gains in both size and strength. I have no idea why we can't live long and athletically.
 
I also thinks its rude to come on a sponsors board and basically say your product is better than ours and it is just a "creaze". Quoting you:
"(though I have reason to believe we're gonna find sesamin to not be so great after all),"

Not very professional at all...
 
Now if you want to discuss the science behind AA and Sesamin, I would more happy to devulge in why I don't think increasing inflammation is very smart. Short duration in muscle, sure. But AA isn't skeletal muscle specific.
 
I don't believe he is bashing Sesamin, but just expressing his skepticism, which there is nothing wrong with.

I, on the other hand, do completely disagree with him. I take a completely opposite approach in the sense that I believe Sesamin is even more benefecial for health than we make it out to be. I think that it should be marketed more as a "general health" supplement than a fat loss agent, because it exerts very many positive effects in the body.
 
Reggin said:
I don't believe he is bashing Sesamin, but just expressing his skepticism, which there is nothing wrong with.

I, on the other hand, do completely disagree with him. I take a completely opposite approach in the sense that I believe Sesamin is even more benefecial for health than we make it out to be. I think that it should be marketed more as a "general health" supplement than a fat loss agent, because it exerts very many positive effects in the body.
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Thank you for understanding that I'm not bashing sesamin at all. I do think it is a good product. The research and feedback support it very well.

That's an interesting perception, sesamin being even more healthful than thought. Could be true. Of course, just because something is not easily obtainable "naturally" does not mean that it will become deleterious when "unnaturally" obtained (referring to the process required to get high levels of sesamin). It is quite possibly a good example of Atlantis technology for those of you familiar with that story.

To Beast:
I never meant to discuss an outside product on your forum. It's just that AA was already mentioned and I thought it would be okay in that case. I think Primaforce/Scivation is good stuff and though my personal feelings on a few products are not fully supportive, the company has my overall support. I would like to maintain intercompany friendship as it is not only better for us as interacting representatives but also for the customers and industry in general. Nonetheless, I think I'll step out of this discussion since it is inappropriate for me to be here given my affiliations.

Keep up the good work you guys! Your service and dedication to your customers is incredible.
 
Aeternitatis,

We love debate, and have fought long and hard for glutamine and ecdysterone as well as Fenotest.

We appreciate your support and understand your intentions were good.
 
Hahahah, I can't get over how many times I'll see a bunch of meatheads who are passionate about a training style, diet, or supplement and get "snippy" with eachother then become all "I'm sorry, I love you man!". Gotta love it. Very interesting thread btw guys.

BTW, it's funny how most people would look at alot of us and think we'd be unapproachable or to intimidating to argue with. When the reality is, we're generally calm wellspoken/though individuals.
 
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