any powerlifters have some insight on 1/4 andro

[clk]

well, my real cycle of Test-E fell through the floor. never even got to start it. Now im thinking about orals. still a little confused as to what is still available, however, im thinking about running an 8 week cycle of 1 andro and 4 andro to help with the second half of my smolov squatting program and while doing smolov for bench.

im a powerlifter and do the occasional strongman. im only after strength. does anyone have any insight in the strength gains and ability of maintaining it post PCT with these compounds? most of the logs i see are basic body building layouts with no real help in gaining an idea on strength gains.

BTW... not my first cycle. i know i need a pct. right now im just checking out the initial compounds to start with.

 

[moleculargnz]

I haven't ran other compounds so I have nothing to compare it to but my strength went up quite a bit from a 7 week 4-andro/epiandro cycle with no issues maintaining strength post cycle. deadlift went from 495x1 to 495x3 also 525x1 at an RPE of 8~. Squats went from 405 for 2-3 reps to multiple sets at 405, also hit my 1rm of 455 for 2. Bench went from 275 for 4-6 reps to 10 reps and 315 for multiple sets of paused triples. starting weight was 188-190 and ended at 200+ with no bf gain

 

[moleculargnz]

And I don't consider myself a full on powerlifter (my workouts are a mix of bb'ing/powerlifting style) but I usually squat, bench, and deadlift 2-3x per week

 

[Jebrook]

1 andro at high dose will yield decent strength and mass gains. It is best when paired with 4 andro for a better and overal more enjoyable cycle. Of other compounds that are still legal, Msten, DMZ, Alpha 1, and Trest are all much more potent for strength and mass gains.

 

[clk]

I've taken sdmz and had decent gains with it. I guess theoretically that would be the same as stacking DMZ with msten. How toxic is 1/4 and to?

 

[bananagains]

Not very toxic. They're non methylated compounds. Transdermal versions will have better absorption rates as well. My 2 cents

 

[clk]

Ok thanks. Does anyone have any experience with the SD clone called SD rebuild?

 

[bananagains]

That's original SD my friend
The clones are methastadrol and what not

 

[Jebrook]

That's original SD my friend
The clones are methastadrol and what not

Wrong. SD Rebuild is a clone same as any of the others.

 

[bananagains]

Wrong. SD Rebuild is a clone same as any of the others.

my bad.

 

[Jebrook]

Ok thanks. Does anyone have any experience with the SD clone called SD rebuild?

Rebuild is JW's house brand. I've heard several people say they were legit. Hopefully someone with firsthand experience can confirm.

 

[clk]

Any of you run it at low dose before? I'm a med student. So I can't be fighting the lethargy.

 

[clk]

Also, after I get the cycle, would any of you be interested in a log? I don't do bb. So it would be a log gauging deads, squat, bp, ohp and a variety of strongman movements like stones, logs and carries.

 

[bananagains]

10Mg should provide decent gains with minimal sides depending on how you respond. If lethargy us an issue run some dermacrine or 4 andro or dermatrest or trest or some would even say epiandro. They will be a nice test base to keep lethargy at bay.

 

[clk]

10mg of SD Ed + test base?

 

[bananagains]

That should be good yeah don't run the sd longer than 4 weeks though since you have a test base I'd bump it up to twenty the last week or so unless you feel good on ten also might want to get enough test base to run 8 weeks and another 4 week supply of some other ph unless your gonna be using trest as the test base then thats plenty strong enough

 

[C Dub805]

1 andro at high dose will yield decent strength and mass gains. It is best when paired with 4 andro for a better and overal more enjoyable cycle. Of other compounds that are still legal, Msten, DMZ, Alpha 1, and Trest are all much more potent for strength and mass gains.

I believe DMZ made the 2014 banned list

 

[Jebrook]

I believe DMZ made the 2014 banned list

Nope, it's still legal. Matter of time though.

 

[clk]

DMZ 2.0 was banned. But dmz is still out. From what I see, just add msten and bam. Sdmz 2.0. I ran dmz 2.0 while running smolov for bench. I went from a 325 Bp to 405 in 5 weeks ? insane.

 

[clk]

That should be good yeah don't run the sd longer than 4 weeks though since you have a test base I'd bump it up to twenty the last week or so unless you feel good on ten also might want to get enough test base to run 8 weeks and another 4 week supply of some other ph unless your gonna be using trest as the test base then thats plenty strong enough

If I run SD I'd run trest as a base. So what you're saying is
SD+trest week 1-4
Trest week 5-8
Pct

 

[bananagains]

What!?!?!!?! Is that pause bench? I ran something similar and went from 305-350 in 5.5 weeks (1 of which I was off cycle)

 

[bananagains]

Yeah, that will provide a lot of gains right there lol

 

[Jebrook]

DMZ 2.0 was banned. But dmz is still out. From what I see, just add msten and bam. Sdmz 2.0. I ran dmz 2.0 while running smolov for bench. I went from a 325 Bp to 405 in 5 weeks �� insane.

SDMZ 2.0 is still legal, but most manufacturers have discontinued production for fear of it being added to the banned list.

 

[clk]

What!?!?!!?! Is that pause bench? I ran something similar and went from 305-350 in 5.5 weeks (1 of which I was off cycle)

Not paused. Smolov is ****ing crazy. Im recently back from a deployment. My gains suffered. So I've been running smolov to recoup my squat. Went from 370# with wraps to 465 half way through the program.

 

[clk]

SDMZ 2.0 is still legal, but most manufacturers have discontinued production for fear of it being added to the banned list.

You say most... Is there any that don't fall into that "most" category?

 

[Jebrook]

You say most... Is there any that don't fall into that "most" category?

Island Supplements has Fight Pharm brand. Most of the big name companies discontinued it all. That's the only one I know of but I'm sure there are a couple other options out there.

 

[jsav906]

Not a powerlifter but I ran a 1 and 4 andro cycle 6 months ago and every lift including accessories went up quite a bit. I wasn't even hitting my reps in the 1-5 range I was always doing 8-15. Can't imagine what it would be like if I trained for strength during that cycle

 

[clk]

Okay. Well, I'm just going with a cycle of 1&4 andro. Don't feel like dealing with too much toxicity or the complexities of a more powerful cycle.

I'm 260#'s any suggestion of dose for each at my weight?

 

[clk]

Not a powerlifter but I ran a 1 and 4 andro cycle 6 months ago and every lift including accessories went up quite a bit. I wasn't even hitting my reps in the 1-5 range I was always doing 8-15. Can't imagine what it would be like if I trained for strength during that cycle

How much did your big 3 lifts go up? What was your training like?

 

[Jebrook]

Okay. Well, I'm just going with a cycle of 1&4 andro. Don't feel like dealing with too much toxicity or the complexities of a more powerful cycle.

I'm 260#'s any suggestion of dose for each at my weight?

No less than 330 mg per day per week of both for 6-8 weeks. I probably would do about twice that or more. Depends on your prior development and goals. The andros are not cheap by any means but are effective at the right dosages and mild.

 

[moleculargnz]

^ I agree. I was up to 400mg td 4-Andro and 800mg epiandro, which seemed to be the sweet spot for me and I weigh about 200lbs

 

[moleculargnz]

And as for logging I think it would def be useful for a lot of people considering we're practically in the post-sarms era and there are not many good logs out there that are strictly DHEAs

 

[clk]

Thanks! How long does it take yo kick it? I ask simply so I will know when it will be in effect so I can adjust dosage at that point if needed.

 

[clk]

And as for logging I think it would def be useful for a lot of people considering we're practically in the post-sarms era and there are not many good logs out there that are strictly DHEAs

Cool. Then I will go ahead and make a log when I get it all in. Its basically just going to be a log only gauging strength. I don't do much bb'ing. At least people will get an idea of the strength gains that it can/will give.

 

[jsav906]

How much did your big 3 lifts go up? What was your training like?

I was doing high volume and I never one rep maxed but I was doing around 20lbs than my normal bench for reps

 

[jsav906]

Also my squat went from around 245-275 in 4 weeks because on squat I do max out as well as high volume

 

[moleculargnz]

Thanks! How long does it take yo kick it? I ask simply so I will know when it will be in effect so I can adjust dosage at that point if needed.

I noticed strength increases and drastic appetite increases within the first 1-2 weeks but everything really kicked in around the 3rd week

 

[clk]

Right on guys. Thanks. I just ordered the 1/4 andro. I'm looking at pct. When I get it all in, I will start a new thread for my log. I'll be finishing up the back end of smolov and will be on cycle for an entire smolov bench program. Should be interesting.
If it increases my appetite I will be living In a gutter soon. I'm already eating 5200 calories a day. Any more than that I'll be broke lol

 

[l1fterp1nk]

I would be very interested in this log, I'm also considering doing the smolov squat and bench programs together.

 

[clk]

I would be very interested in this log, I'm also considering doing the smolov squat and bench programs together.

You will be very hard pressed to start them at The same time. You squat every other day during the beginning of the week and twice in a row at the end. You will probably want to do what I did and start the bench cycle after you make it to the second half of the squat cycle.
I don't know how much you know about it. Don't mean to insult your intellect... But when you run smolov, don't DL. Basically all other lifts go to the back burner and are only "maintained" during smolov. Its easy to overtrain on the program.

 

[bananagains]

This. While it's a great program, it's not my cup of tea as I like to work everything at once. So, I easily became overtrained during the smolov squat. Smolov Jr for bench was amazing though. Tempted to try it again. Layne Norton's PH3 is my favorite program as of now. Put over 200lbs on my total in 8 weeks.

 

[clk]

Nice. I'll have to check it out. I ran smolov because I lost a lot of strength in my squat on deployment. But I'm back up around the 500# range Now. After The second half is done, it will be a new PR for sure. Now my chest needs some attention lol.always been my weak lift.

 

[l1fterp1nk]

You will be very hard pressed to start them at The same time. You squat every other day during the beginning of the week and twice in a row at the end. You will probably want to do what I did and start the bench cycle after you make it to the second half of the squat cycle.
I don't know how much you know about it. Don't mean to insult your intellect... But when you run smolov, don't DL. Basically all other lifts go to the back burner and are only "maintained" during smolov. Its easy to overtrain on the program.

On no you're fine, I hadn't looked into the program yet. I have simply heard great things about it! Thanks for the advice, that may be the route I go. I'd like to get my squat up around 6, and well my bench is just forever at the poverty level. So if I could hit 350 I'd be happy. What kind of numbers do people usually gain with the program?

 

[l1fterp1nk]

This. While it's a great program, it's not my cup of tea as I like to work everything at once. So, I easily became overtrained during the smolov squat. Smolov Jr for bench was amazing though. Tempted to try it again. Layne Norton's PH3 is my favorite program as of now. Put over 200lbs on my total in 8 weeks.

Now 200lbs on my total is enticing, where can I find this program. Also did you complete it without any additional hormones?

 

[bananagains]

The first four weeks of it was my first four week cycle very mild ph I've made mire strength gains the last four weeks however and you can find it on bodybuilding.com be sure to follow the RIR and percentages don't overestimate your maxes also I didn't do the blood flow restriction training I thinks it's silly anyways look up Layne Norton ph3

 

[clk]

On no you're fine, I hadn't looked into the program yet. I have simply heard great things about it! Thanks for the advice, that may be the route I go. I'd like to get my squat up around 6, and well my bench is just forever at the poverty level. So if I could hit 350 I'd be happy. What kind of numbers do people usually gain with the program?

Really depends on where they are at with their training. A guy new to squatting that much with have insane gains. If you are trying to get to 600, you obviously have been in the squat game a while. your gains won't be as crazy.

After my deployment, (no working out for 7 months) my squat max was a pathetic 315. I did a lot of volume work to build up a foundation and started smolov with a low bar 365 max . Half way through the program I had to test my max again. This time I squatted 485 with wraps and low bar. So without wraps, call it 465. That's a 100# gain. I'm 10# off of my PR that was set shortly before my deployment.
I probably had a 100# gain simply because I've been to that weight before. I don't know. However, many guys on the interweby claim 60#s is very doable.

 

[clk]

http://stronglifts.com/how-to-add-100-pounds-to-your-squat-smolov/

You can download the excel sheet here. Just enter in the date you start and your current 1rm. You will see the weights and reps for each day.

 

[clk]

Any of you tried 6oxo for pct?
Thinking of running it along with clomid. I'm horrible at coming up with pct. So help would be appreciated

 

[l1fterp1nk]

Awesome! Thank you, I'm going to look into it.