Anabolic intake and hair loss

ludeboye

New member
I know if you are prone too a bald head you are going too get it period. But I had a question, my dad has a bald head and I think I am prone too mpb. I know I will just accelerate the process if I take anabolic suppliments but I wanted too know how much will 1 cycle affect it? I am bulking and was thinking of superdrol any opnions on that also thanks!

Stats are

Male - 22
Hair on the head is still full i am thinking there is very mild thinning but thats about it so far.
 
Your response to anabolics will differ from one person to the next, so nobody can tell you how much hair you will lose. With that said SD is probably one of the easiest anabolics on the hair line, you shouldn’t lose much if any with it. I start to notice my scalp getting itchy before i shed, however, i seem to re-grow everything I lose. Take the necessary precautions, read the hairloss prevention sticky.
 
Dude it depends what your taking. You shouldn't lose too much on SD if any. If you go with PP you don't have to worry. Although MPB is passed down from your father I have heard Doctors say that you have to look at your mothers father and brothers. I also know lots of people whose fathers are blad but they're not. If your worrying about hairloss or don't want to speed the process stay away from AAS period. Get a prescription for propecia, or try revivogen. There's a lot you can do but if hairloss is your concern(and it's obvious it is) than stay away from anything that increases test production.
 
Just to add your at a great age to start taking propecia to maintain hair. Although if you plan to have kids you need to get off it and since it's a 5-reductase inhibitor there's a chance of birth defects.
 
Women can be bald too although it's very rare the most common case is extreme thinning. Think it's bad for a guy? Guys can make it look natural, for women it's hideous.
 
AlexParty said:
Women can be bald too although it's very rare the most common case is extreme thinning. Think it's bad for a guy? Guys can make it look natural, for women it's hideous.

True that my brother. Just wear a hat.
 
Hairloss doesn't come from your mothers side; thats a myth. My maternal grandfater had a full head of hair into is 80's, but I have lost a few strands to MPB. My hair looks just like my fathers. And if you want to see if your going to lose your hair look around your family and see who has hair like yours and see if their bald or not.
Second is that Proscar has been out since before your balls dropped and NO ONE has every reported ANY birth defects, of any kind, from someone on Proscar. They have to put that on the packaging in case it ever did happen and their covered.
 
LCSULLA said:
Hairloss doesn't come from your mothers side; thats a myth. My maternal grandfater had a full head of hair into is 80's, but I have lost a few strands to MPB. My hair looks just like my fathers. And if you want to see if your going to lose your hair look around your family and see who has hair like yours and see if their bald or not.
Second is that Proscar has been out since before your balls dropped and NO ONE has every reported ANY birth defects, of any kind, from someone on Proscar. They have to put that on the packaging in case it ever did happen and their covered.

Your partially right. Yes look around in your family and etc..... to find out how your hairs going to be, I researched a lot on this subject. What I meant about looking to your mothers side I didn't mean that only, I meant look at both sides of the family to determine. I am not prone to MPB but I am still skeptical. Anything that messes with your hormones will cause bith defects, they wont state it on the package, it's just common sence. DHT is very important for male fetal development (at least - I'm not certain about female fetal requirements). Employing a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor prevents the conversion from THT (3 hydro) to DHT (2 hydro). Here's an article explaining it better Invalid Link Removed

People wont report birth defects while on propecia and I'm not saying their child's going to be a mutant but you get my point. A friend was on propecia and he couldn't have a kid with his wife, he went off it and 3 months later she was pregnant, coincidence? Maybe...

Anyways I'm not bad mouthing propecia, it does work, I have a twin brother who's taking it, he's not bald or ever going to be but he's paranoid of the thought so he rather be safe than sorry. I would take propecia(finasteride) but I went to 2 doctors already and they said I don't need it. I could order it over the net but it's hard to find reliable sources and sorry IBE ain't that reliable, I ordered from them before, had a question and emailed them, no response since.... that's a pain in the ass.
 
Your partially right. Yes look around in your family and etc..... to find out how your hairs going to be, I researched a lot on this subject. What I meant about looking to your mothers side I didn't mean that only, I meant look at both sides of the family to determine. I am not prone to MPB but I am still skeptical. Anything that messes with your hormones will cause bith defects, they wont state it on the package, it's just common sence. DHT is very important for male fetal development (at least - I'm not certain about female fetal requirements). Employing a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor prevents the conversion from THT (3 hydro) to DHT (2 hydro). Here's an article explaining it better Invalid Link Removed

A. It is on the package. But in the 12 years that it's been around there has not been ONE CASE of child being born with birth defects. I have seen numerous posts on hairloss forums buy guys on Proscar for years that have kids whithout going off.
And please don't be condescending when you writing to me; saying it's "common sense". Yeah well "common sense" tells me that a 35 ton piece of metal can't fly, but it does.
 
Lol funny example. LCSULLA, didn't mean to come across as condescending, or to insult you in anyway. The more knowledge we contribute the better for us, I take everything you say and everyone else says into consideration and thought. I would hate to be right all the time. I'm actually glad to hear you give such good ratings for propecia, makes me want to take it even more without any fears of sides. So sorry if you felt offended.
 
AlexParty said:
Lol funny example. LCSULLA, didn't mean to come across as condescending, or to insult you in anyway. The more knowledge we contribute the better for us, I take everything you say and everyone else says into consideration and thought. I would hate to be right all the time. I'm actually glad to hear you give such good ratings for propecia, makes me want to take it even more without any fears of sides. So sorry if you felt offended.

Its cool, bro. I get a little heated when I hear some of things that proscar may do to someone. Guys coming on here and asking if their johnson is going to fall off if they take a propecia pill. Or claiming that their sexlife is in the crapper because they are on propecia, but you find out that their in the beginning of PCT for a 20 week deca only cycle.

So if I came on a bit too strong I am sorry.
 
It's all good. I'm a little heated too sometimes. I'm also on a cycle so that doesn't help. But hey, my twin bro is taking propecia and he said there is no sexual sides, he has no problem getting it up. Have you heard of revivogen? Askmen.com rates it #1. Check it out @ Invalid Link Removed , it's topical.
 
AlexParty said:
It's all good. I'm a little heated too sometimes. I'm also on a cycle so that doesn't help. But hey, my twin bro is taking propecia and he said there is no sexual sides, he has no problem getting it up. Have you heard of revivogen? Askmen.com rates it #1. Check it out @ Invalid Link Removed , it's topical.

Yeah, I have heard of it. I think it's some sort of fatty acid compound that supposed to block DHT. I used to read the hairloss boards all the time (since the internet really got going in the mid-90's). And I saw a lot of guys jump on this compound when it first came out. But most guys dropped it after a while. The only three things I have used that either regrew hair or slowed the hairloss are 5alpha inhibitors, Xandrox (but only used with the first one), and flutamide. Thats it. I have used 12.5 minox, some NO inhibitor, 2% spiro, 5% spiro, and a few other things. None of them worked as well as I hoped. Constent disappointment.

So for me, unless it's invented by big Pharm with a large amount of data saying it grows hair, then I am not buying it.
 
oh man, i guess it sucks that i ordered a bunch of **** tonight that you are saying doesn't work. :( When you say they didn't work as much as you had hoped, they still worked a little, right?
 
opks, everybody reacts differently so maybe it didn't work fo LC but it might actually do something for you. Try it once, it wont kill you and you should see something from the first bottle, if not try something else.

LC I'll take those products into consideration. Peace
 
AlexParty, thanks for the confidence boost. I actually ordered a small variety pack, so hoping SOMETHING works out. Damnit, i love my hair!
 
AlexParty said:
opks, everybody reacts differently so maybe it didn't work fo LC but it might actually do something for you. Try it once, it wont kill you and you should see something from the first bottle, if not try something else.

LC I'll take those products into consideration. Peace

Alex is right. Not everyone responds in the same way. Try it out and report back on how its working for you. Maybe I'll give it another shot if it works well for you.
 
LCSULLA said:
Hairloss doesn't come from your mothers side; thats a myth. My maternal grandfater had a full head of hair into is 80's, but I have lost a few strands to MPB. My hair looks just like my fathers. And if you want to see if your going to lose your hair look around your family and see who has hair like yours and see if their bald or not.
Second is that Proscar has been out since before your balls dropped and NO ONE has every reported ANY birth defects, of any kind, from someone on Proscar. They have to put that on the packaging in case it ever did happen and their covered.

Sorry but your wrong.
Geneticists have already identified the MPB gene and it does in fact come from your mother. While not all forms of baldness come from your mothers side male-pattern baldness (Androgenetic alopecia) does. I think it's safe to say you dont have MPB.

If you have a Reuters Health acct you can read the whole thing online Invalid Link Removed. //edit: found the journal article, posting it.

American Journal of Human Genetics said:
Researchers in Germany have found that variations in a gene related to male sex hormones may be at the root of male-pattern baldness, the most common form of hair loss. The culprit is the androgen receptor gene, and it dwells on the X chromosome, which all men inherit from their mothers.
 
[SIZE=-1]Here is the full study, I have the PDF if any of you want it and don't know where to get it.
[/SIZE]
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Am. J. Hum. Genet., 77:140-148, 2005
0002-9297/2005/7701-0015$15.00
© 2005 by The American Society of Human Genetics. All rights reserved.

[/SIZE] [FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=+1]Report [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=+2]Genetic Variation in the Human Androgen Receptor Gene Is the Major Determinant of Common Early-Onset Androgenetic Alopecia [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=+1]Axel M. Hillmer,1,2 Sandra Hanneken,4 Sibylle Ritzmann,4 Tim Becker,3 Jan Freudenberg,2 Felix F. Brockschmidt,2 Antonia Flaquer,3 Yun Freudenberg-Hua,2 Rami Abou Jamra,2 Christine Metzen,4 Uwe Heyn,2 Nadine Schweiger,4 Regina C. Betz,2,5 Bettina Blaumeiser,5 Jochen Hampe,6 Stefan Schreiber,6 Thomas G. Schulze,7 Hans Christian Hennies,8 Johannes Schumacher,2 Peter Propping,2 Thomas Ruzicka,4 Sven Cichon,1,5 Thomas F. Wienker,3 Roland Kruse,4 and Markus M. Nöthen1,5

[FONT=helvetica, arial]1Department of Genomics, Life & Brain Center, and 2Institute of Human Genetics, and 3Institute for Medical Biometry, Informatics and Epidemiology, University of Bonn, Bonn; 4Department of Dermatology, University of Düsseldorf, Düsseldorf; 5Department of Medical Genetics, University of Antwerp, Antwerp; 6Institute for Clinical Molecular Biology, Christian-Albrechts-Universität zu Kiel, Kiel, Germany; 7Division of Genetic Epidemiology in Psychiatry, Central Institute of Mental Health, Mannheim; and 8Department of Molecular Genetics and Gene Mapping Center, Max Delbrück Center for Molecular Medicine, Berlin[/FONT] [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Received March 21, 2005; accepted for publication April 27, 2005; electronically published May 18, 2005.[/SIZE][/FONT]
Androgenetic alopecia (AGA), or male-pattern baldness, is the most common form of hair loss. Its pathogenesis is androgen dependent, and genetic predisposition is the major requirement for the phenotype. We demonstrate that genetic variability in the androgen receptor gene (AR) is the cardinal prerequisite for the development of early-onset AGA, with an etiological fraction of 0.46. The investigation of a large number of genetic variants covering the AR locus suggests that a polyglycine-encoding GGN repeat in exon 1 is a plausible candidate for conferring the functional effect. The X-chromosomal location of AR stresses the importance of the maternal line in the inheritance of AGA.
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Address for correspondence and reprints: Dr. Markus M. Nöthen, Department of Genomics, Life & Brain Center, University of Bonn, Sigmund-Freud-Straße 25, 53127 Bonn, Germany. E-mail: [email protected][/SIZE][/FONT] Androgenetic alopecia (AGA [MIM Invalid Link Removed]), or male-pattern baldness, is characterized by a defined pattern of hair loss from the scalp (Hamilton 1951). In whites, the proportion of affected males increases steadily with age, so that a male in his 50s has a 50% chance of having some degree of AGA (Hamilton Invalid Link Removed). Association of AGA with a variety of clinical phenotypes has been suggested, including coronary heart disease (Lotufo et al. 2000), benign prostatic hyperplasia (Hawk et al. 2000), prostate cancer (Oh et al. 1998), and disorders associated with insulin resistance (Matilainen et al. 2000). Androgen dependence is an important characteristic of AGA, and genetic disposition, which is assumed to be polygenic, plays the most substantial role in the development of AGA (Küster and Happle 1984; Ellis et al. 1998; Nyholt et al. 2003). Although the only factor known to influence onset age in patients with AGA is genetic predisposition, no systematic approach has hitherto been undertaken, to our knowledge, to identify the contributing genes.
As part of a genomewide linkage study of AGA, we investigated linkage to markers covering the X chromosome. The sample consisted of 95 families in which at least two brothers had early-onset AGA (391 genotyped individuals, including 201 affected men). We obtained evidence of linkage in chromosomal region Xq12-22 (nonparametric linkage [NPL] score of 2.70 [Invalid Link Removed]) (for X-chromosomal marker information, see Invalid Link Removed). This region contains the AR gene (MIM Invalid Link Removed), which is an obvious candidate for explaining the development of AGA, and an association with this region has been suggested elsewhere (Ellis et al. 2001), on the basis of results from the investigation of three polymorphic sites. In the present study, we have systematically explored the contribution of the AR gene to the development of early-onset AGA.
Invalid Link Removed
[SIZE=-1](50 kB)[/SIZE][FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Figure 1 [SIZE=-1]Multipoint NPL analysis of chromosome X, calculated by the Allegro v1.2 software (Gudbjartsson et al. 2000). The X-axis is the chromosome location (top, cM; bottom, STR marker), and the Y-axis is the LOD score.[/SIZE][/SIZE][/FONT]
Invalid Link Removed[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Table 1[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=arial,helvetica][SIZE=-1]STR Markers Used for Linkage Analysis of Chromosome X[/SIZE][/FONT] We tested 39 SNPs, two STRs (a polyglutamine-encoding CAG repeat and a polyglycine-encoding GGN repeat in exon 1 of AR), and one biallelic insertion polymorphism (XARx8insA), in a range of 4.4 Mb at the AR locus, for association with AGA (Invalid Link Removed). Our analysis included the three previously studied variants (Ellis et al. Invalid Link Removed): the CAG and GGN repeats and StuI RFLP (rs6152). TaqMan assays for genotyping of SNPs, listed in Invalid Link Removed, were designed by Applied Biosystems. PCRs were performed using 2.5 ng genomic DNA, AmpliTaq Gold DNA polymerase (Applied Biosystems), and an annealing temperature of 60°C for 45 cycles on Biometra T1 (Biometra) or Perkin Elmer GeneAmp 9700 (Applied Biosystems) thermocyclers. Fluorescence was measured with an ABI Prism 7900HT sequence detection system (Applied Biosystems). The fragment lengths of the CAG repeat, the GGN repeat, and XARx8insA were determined using the following fluorescence-labeled primers for PCR: CAG-F 5Invalid Link Removed-TCCAGAATCTGTTCCAGAGCGTGC-3Invalid Link Removed and CAG-R 5Invalid Link Removed-GCTGTGAAGGTTGCTGTTCCTCAT-3Invalid Link Removed (La Spada et al. 1991), GGN-F 5Invalid Link Removed-CCTGGCACACTCTCTTCACA-3Invalid Link Removed and GGN-R 5Invalid Link Removed-GGATAGGGCACTCTGCTCAC-3Invalid Link Removed, and XARx8insA-F 5Invalid Link Removed-CACGGGAAGTTTAGAGAGCT-3Invalid Link Removed and XARx8insA-R 5Invalid Link Removed-TCACCTTCTCGTCACTATTG-3Invalid Link Removed. Forty nanograms of genomic DNA was used in PCRs with AmpliTaq DNA polymerase (Applied Biosystems) in 38 cycles on a PTC-200 (MJ Research). The annealing temperatures were 62°CInvalid Link Removed60°C (touchdown PCR) for the CAG repeat, 58°C for the GGN repeat, and 63°CInvalid Link Removed55°C (touchdown PCR) for XARx8insA. MasterAmp PCR PreMix G (Epicentre) was used to amplify GGN fragments. Fragment lengths of the amplified products were analyzed on an ABI Prism 377 DNA sequencer (Applied Biosystems). Double-strand sequencing of genomic regions was performed with the ABI Prism BigDye Terminator Cycle Sequencing kit, version 2.0 (Applied Biosystems), and the ABI Prism 3730 DNA analyzer (Applied Biosystems).
Invalid Link Removed
[SIZE=-1](73 kB)[/SIZE][FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Figure 2 [SIZE=-1]Gene and LD structure of the AR locus. A, Distribution of known genes (left) and typed SNPs and STRs (right) at the AR locus. The shown genomic region spans 4.4 Mb. Gene content information is based on Ensembl. B, LD in 198 individuals with AGA (upper right diagonal) and in 157 individuals without AGA (lower left diagonal) was measured with Invalid Link Removed2 and was visualized using the GOLD program (Abecasis and Cookson 2000).[/SIZE][/SIZE][/FONT]
Invalid Link Removed[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Table 2[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=arial,helvetica][SIZE=-1]Oligonucleotides for TaqMan Assays[/SIZE][/FONT] For case-control analysis, we compared allele frequencies in 198 males with early-onset AGA (including 95 unrelated and randomly chosen affected individuals from the linkage-analysis families), 188 control individuals, and 157 unaffected individuals. For family-based association analysis, we studied 179 families containing at least one affected male in the youngest generation. The family-based association sample included the 95 families from the linkage analysis and overlapped with the case sample, for 179 individuals. All affected males were aged <40 years (mean [± SD] 32.0 ± 5.2) and had AGA that was representative of the most severely affected 10% of the distribution for the respective age class, on the basis of the classification of Hamilton (Invalid Link Removed) (modified by Norwood [1975]). AGA classification, age, and ethnicity were the exclusive criteria used to select individuals for inclusion in the case sample. Unaffected males were aged >60 years (mean 67.9 ± 6.2) and without AGA, representing the least-affected 20% of the distribution for this age class. Families and unrelated individuals both with and without AGA were recruited through various sources, including press reports and advertisements in magazines, newspapers, and placards. Control individuals were male blood donors from the blood transfusion center of the University Hospital Bonn, from whom information was available only on sex, age in years (mean 29.4 ± 8.6), and ethnicity. EDTA anticoagulated venous blood samples were collected from all individuals, and lymphocyte DNA was isolated by salting out with saturated NaCl solution (Miller et al. 1988). All participants were of German descent. The study was approved by the ethics committee of the University of Bonn, and informed consent was obtained from all participants.
Association analysis was conducted using a modification of the FAMHAP software (Becker and Knapp 2004a, 2004b) for X-chromosomal data. Case-control SNP single-marker analysis was performed using the Invalid Link Removed2 distribution of the 2 × 2 contingency table, and multiallelic markers were evaluated with the permutational version of the Invalid Link Removed2 test. For case-control haplotype analysis, P values were calculated from the Invalid Link Removed2 distribution with n-1 df of the respective likelihood-ratio test (n = number of different haplotypes). The family data were analyzed with the permutation-based association test for nuclear families (Zhao et al. 2000; Knapp and Becker 2003). For each marker (single-locus analysis) and each marker combination (haplotype analysis), we used 1010 permutation replicates.
Pairwise distances between haplotypes were calculated as allele mismatches. By resampling markers randomly with replacement, 100 bootstrapped data sets were generated as input for the program neighbor contained in the PHYLIP package.
A region of 1 Mb showed strong association with the lowest P value of 2.1 × 10-12 for rs10521339 in the case-control analysis of affected and unaffected individuals (Invalid Link Removed). As expected, the association is stronger for comparisons between individuals with AGA and individuals without AGA than between individuals with AGA and an unselected control sample (Invalid Link Removed). We also performed a separate analysis of the 103 cases that were not included in the linkage analysis and found that the association was also present in this sample (data not shown). The association is further supported by family-based analysis, for which SNP rs938059 shows the lowest P value (4.03 × 10-6) (Invalid Link Removed). AR is the only known gene in the strongly associated 1-MbInvalid Link Removedspanning region (Invalid Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed). The X-linked ectodysplasin-A2 receptor (XEDAR), which is located 900 kb 5Invalid Link Removed of AR, is outside this region (Invalid Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed). The significance of the association decreases within the 3Invalid Link Removed part of the 180-kbInvalid Link Removedspanning AR gene, and oligophrenin 1 (OPHN1), which is located 320 kb 3Invalid Link Removed of AR, is not within the block of strongest association (Invalid Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed). rs6152 (P = 6.66 × 10-10 [Invalid Link Removed]) in exon 1 of AR corresponds to the StuI RFLP, for which an association has been described by Ellis et al. (Invalid Link Removed).
Invalid Link Removed[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Table 3[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=arial,helvetica][SIZE=-1]Association of AGA with Markers at the AR Locus[/SIZE][/FONT] The long range of the associated SNPs implies the presence of a large haplotype block, visible in Invalid Link Removed. In principle, this is not unexpected in a location close to the centromere, where recombination events occur at a relatively low frequency (Nagaraja et al. 1997). To test whether the size of the haplotype block stands out even in comparison with X-chromosomal loci with similar low recombination frequencies, we analyzed average pairwise linkage disequilibrium (LD) (measured by |DInvalid Link Removed|) between SNPs retrieved from the HapMap Project database in 1-cMInvalid Link Removedsized windows. Average pairwise LD was found to be inversely correlated with recombination rate (Spearman's Invalid Link Removed = -0.598; P < .001). An average LD higher than that at the AR locus was displayed by only the six windows covering the centromere; these windows showed distinctively smaller recombination rates (Invalid Link Removed). This result might suggest that the predominant AR haplotypes are evolutionarily more recent, perhaps indicating positive selective pressure acting at this locus (Bamshad and Wooding 2003). Since androgens mediate a wide range of developmental and physiological responses through the androgen receptor (AR) and are especially important in the male reproductive system (Lee and Chang 2003), it is conceivable that variability in AR can have an impact on selection. In accordance with this hypothesis, the haplotype with the highest frequency (0.45 [Invalid Link Removed]) (which also confers risk of AGA) in the German population seems to be evolutionarily recent, as indicated by the low sequence identity with the ancestral haplotype (Invalid Link Removed).
Invalid Link Removed
[SIZE=-1](34 kB)[/SIZE][FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=-1]Figure 3 [SIZE=-1]The AR locus: LD relative to the X-chromosome and haplotype structure. A, Average pairwise LD (measured by |DInvalid Link Removed|) between SNPs retrieved from the Invalid Link Removed Project database, plotted over X-chromosomal recombination rates in 1-cMInvalid Link Removedsized windows. An average LD higher than that at the AR locus was displayed by only the six windows covering the centromere and showed distinctively smaller recombination rates. B, Neighbor-joining tree of frequent haplotype sequences (>5% in the samples from the individuals with AGA, controls, and individuals without AGA) within the most strongly associated haplotype block (genetic markers rs1385695Invalid Link RemovedXARx8insA). The CAG repeat, XARx7_01, and XARx8insA were omitted from tree construction, because the corresponding Pan troglodytes allele could not be retrieved from the chimpanzee genomic sequence. The AGA haplotype is shown in red, and the chimpanzee haplotype is shown in orange. The AGA haplotype shows low sequence identity to the ancestral (chimpanzee) haplotype. Haplotype frequencies of the respective samples are indicated in parentheses (affected/control/unaffected [in %]). GGN-23 is indicated as "23"; GGN-24 is indicated as "24."[/SIZE][/SIZE][/FONT]
Sequencing of the transcribed region and of 3.4 kb of conserved sequences in the 5Invalid Link Removed region and intron 1 of AR in 12 individuals revealed only two additional variants of the associated haplotype (XARx7_01 and XARx8insA [Invalid Link Removed]). The additional variants were noncoding and did not show a stronger association than other tested markers. Of the two repeat polymorphisms in the coding region, the CAG repeat was not associated with AGA (affected/unaffected global P value of .1), whereas the GGN repeat was highly associated (affected/unaffected global P value of .0001). The study by Ellis et al. (Invalid Link Removed) also showed a larger effect for the GGN repeat than the CAG repeat. However, the pooling of alleles in their study renders an exact comparison of results difficult. The GGN allele of 23 repeats showed a difference of affected versus unaffected allele frequencies of 0.23, which was in the range of the strongest-associated SNPs (rs1385695Invalid Link RemovedXARx8insA [Invalid Link Removed]) but with a lower frequency in controls. This suggests that GGN-23 either is closer to the AGA mutation or is itself the AGA-susceptibility allele. Previously obtained functional data, in which shorter repeat alleles of the GGN repeat were associated with higher protein levels and thereby higher AR activity (Ding et al. 2005), support the possibility of a causal role for the repeat, and this would be compatible with current understanding of the involvement of androgens in AGA. Several studies have also suggested an effect of CAG repeat lengths on AR transactivating activity (Mhatre et al. 1993; Chamberlain et al. 1994; Kazemi-Esfarjani et al. 1995; Choong et al. 1996; Nakajima et al. 1996; Beilin et al. 2000; Ding et al. 2004). Since both repeats modulate AR activity and since we observe an association only between the GGN repeat and AGA, it may be that cells of the hair follicle lack cofactors that interact with the CAG-encoded domain.
Interestingly, shorter alleles for the GGN repeat have also been associated with prostate cancer (Hsing et al. 2000; Chang et al. 2002), whereas longer alleles have been associated with endometrial cancer (Sasaki et al. 2005), which would be in accordance with the differing effects of androgens on the endometrium and the prostate (androgens exert an inhibitory effect on endometrial cell proliferation, whereas they have a mitogenic effect in the prostate). However, the association findings with prostate cancer remain controversial, and no effect was shown in a large meta-analysis (Zeegers et al. 2004). The association with endometrial cancer has yet to be confirmed.
It remains possible that an as-yet-undetected variant in either a regulatory region affecting the expression level or an intronic variant affecting the splicing pattern of AR might be responsible for AGA susceptibility. The latter seems unlikely since we did not detect alternatively spliced transcripts of AR in human hair follicles of seven individuals representing different haplotypes. Previous studies have identified AR regulatory elements up to position -737 of the AR transcription start site (Faber et al. 1991, 1993; Supakar et al. 1993), as well as exonic enhancers in exon 1 (Faber et al. Invalid Link Removed) and exons 4 and 5 (Grad et al. 2001). Our sequencing analysis of 12 individuals with the associated haplotype revealed no variability in these regulatory elements of AR. However, there may be additional regions with regulatory effect that have not yet been fully characterized (Lower et al. 2004). Haplotypes carrying the GGN-24 allele show clearly higher frequencies in individuals without AGA than in those with AGA (Invalid Link Removed). Since this effect is strikingly weaker in the ACAAAAAGCATTTAAG-24-ATA haplotype than in the other GGN-24Invalid Link Removedcarrying haplotypes (Invalid Link Removed), it is likely that further functionally relevant variability exists that modifies the protective effect of GGN-24Invalid Link Removedbearing haplotypes.
It is interesting to note that genetic variation in AR, which is located on the X chromosome, cannot explain the resemblance of fathers and sons with respect to the development of AGA (Küster and Happle Invalid Link Removed; Ellis et al. Invalid Link Removed), since sons always inherit the X chromosome from their mothers. The fact that family studies of AGA have typically stressed the resemblance of fathers and sons is understandable, given the differences in patterns of hair loss between males and females. Our genetic data, however, stress the relative importance of the maternal line in the inheritance of AGA, since we estimate an etiological fraction of 0.46 that can be attributed to having Invalid Link Removed23 GGN repeats within AR. This suggests that the average phenotypic resemblance should be greater between affected males and their maternal grandfathers than between affected males and their fathers. It is likely that the remaining etiological fraction is due to genetic variation at autosomal loci, which could explain the similarity of the AGA pattern of fathers and sons. Some autosomal candidate genes have been investigated in the past, including the insulin gene (Ellis et al. 1999), the 5Invalid Link Removed-reductase genes (Ellis et al. Invalid Link Removed), and the hairless gene (Hillmer et al. 2001, 2002), but none of these has been associated with AGA. A systematic linkage-based approach should enable the identification of additional loci.
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=+1]Acknowledgments[/SIZE][/FONT]
We thank all participants for consenting to the study and for providing blood samples. This study was supported by grants from the Deutsche Forschungsgemeinschaft (DFG) (Forschergruppen "KeratinozytenInvalid Link RemovedProliferation und differenzierte Leistung in der Epidermis" and "Genetische Epidemiologie und Medizinische Genetik komplexer Erkrankungen"), the Bundesministerium für Bildung und Forschung (German Human Genome Project, "Pharmacogenomics"), and the Alfried Krupp von Bohlen und Halbach-Stiftung. R.C.B. is a recipient of a DFG Emmy Noether fellowship. We thank Faten Dahdouh and Carola Müller, for assistance in STR genotyping, and Dr. Christine Schmäl, for help in preparing the manuscript.
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=+1]Web Resources[/SIZE][/FONT]
The URLs for data presented herein are as follows:
  • Ensembl, Invalid Link Removed (for AR locus information) Invalid Link Removed
  • HapMap, Invalid Link Removed (for pairwise LD on the X chromosome [genotypes queried in November 2004]) Invalid Link Removed
  • Online Mendelian Inheritance in Man (OMIM), Invalid Link Removed (for AGA and AR)
  • University of CaliforniaInvalid Link RemovedSanta Cruz (UCSC) Genome Bioinformatics, Invalid Link Removed (for X-chromosomal recombination rates and definition of the reference strand for SNP allele calling) Invalid Link Removed
[FONT=helvetica, arial][SIZE=+1]References[/SIZE][/FONT]
  • Abecasis GR, Cookson WO (2000) GOLDInvalid Link Removedgraphical overview of linkage disequilibrium. Bioinformatics 16:182Invalid Link Removed183 Invalid Link Removed | Invalid Link Removed
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Jag,

What LC meant was it doesn't "JUST" come from your mothers side but more both sides of your parents. If your dad was bald that increases your risk of MPB as well. Look at both sides of the family and not just one. Either way if your noticing something with your hair you need to take action NOW, don't go to a doctor because they'll just say that your worrying too much about it and you don't need anything or it's natural. I say bull**** to this. You yourself are the best doctor so if you think something is wrong with your body you know better than anyone else.
 
I agree with Alex given the fact that on my mother's side, baldness is no problem whatsoever. My grandfather has a FULL head of hair, yet I am experincing thinning on the front right side of my forehead. My brother is also experiencing loss of hair, but no thinning in a specific area. Then you turn to look at my father's side, and baldness is an issue. So i would have to say in my particular case, this validates the fact that both sides of the family should be taken into consideration.

LC, will do, and I will post how the products do. I ordered a myriad of different things, so let's hope something works... :)
 
AlexParty said:
Jag,

What LC meant was it doesn't "JUST" come from your mothers side but more both sides of your parents. If your dad was bald that increases your risk of MPB as well. Look at both sides of the family and not just one. Either way if your noticing something with your hair you need to take action NOW, don't go to a doctor because they'll just say that your worrying too much about it and you don't need anything or it's natural. I say bull**** to this. You yourself are the best doctor so if you think something is wrong with your body you know better than anyone else.
You're wrong too.
It doesn't matter if your dad was bald from MPB, you didnt get it from him.

You can only get it from your Mom, it's located on the X chromosome.

What you mean is that if your father is bald for another reason it is possible for you to inherit that reason as well, but it isnt The male pattern baldness. You can't argue with this science, I agree that it's not 100% fool proof, the error here is in your definition of Male Pattern Baldness, just because you or someone you know is losing hair doesnt mean that they are losing hair because they have the gene for male pattern baldness, but if they did, then they got it from their mother.

Its simple really MPB is a subset of Baldness in general. Baldness in general is not completely understood in its inheritance, but MPB is, and MPB (a subset of baldness) comes from the X chromosome which you can only recieve from your mother ( uhh.. if you're a dude anyway.)
 
^^ I don't understand, Opks proves my theory correct, Doctors have told me this, I have read this and your saying I am wrong? I think more people agree with me than disagree. Lol I mean Opks just said it in blood, his living life has just typed an actual experience and I'm wrong? Unless Opks is a generated bot programmed to always agree with me than your wrong. If I took into consideration that my moms side was the only contributing factor in MPB than I'd be bald already since her brothers lost their hair at a young age(21) and I am almost 24 and have a full set of hair and just like opks I am thnning a little bit on my left side. So I think examples override script.
 
It is interesting to note that genetic variation in AR, which is located on the X chromosome, cannot explain the resemblance of fathers and sons with respect to the development of AGA

Hmmm. And one study does not mean its gospel. Ask anyone who has done any sorta of reading in scientific studies about how many time studies will contradict each other.
 
and that doesn't apply just to science or the study of the human body but in statistics and economics. It would be a disaster if economists didn't have several studies done on the same subject.
 
Alright Guys,

I understand one study doesn't prove anything beyond doubt (note: there are plenty of studies on this topic) as I have done more than my share of reading technical publications.

Can any of you prove that male pattern baldness doesn't come from your mother? No, you cannot, all you can do is show that baldness may also be inherited from your father.

I dont understand the difficulty here
baldness != male pattern baldness
male pattern baldness baldness

I've said my piece, you guys have a great week.
 
What? No one was trying to prove anything, we just think you are trying to hit people over the head with that study. You were ht eonly one going on and on and on. You were going off of one study, whereas the other people in the thread were trying to use several examples.
 
Excellent post jagleaso! However, I am not completely convinced that this is the be-all, end-all of the genetic source of androgen-related baldness in males. I didnt have time to read the whole study in detail, but this paragraph at the end caught my attention:

It is interesting to note that genetic variation in AR, which is located on the X chromosome, cannot explain the resemblance of fathers and sons with respect to the development of AGA (Küster and Happle 1984; Ellis et al. 1998), since sons always inherit the X chromosome from their mothers. The fact that family studies of AGA have typically stressed the resemblance of fathers and sons is understandable, given the differences in patterns of hair loss between males and females. Our genetic data, however, stress the relative importance of the maternal line in the inheritance of AGA, since we estimate an etiological fraction of 0.46 that can be attributed to having 23 GGN repeats within AR. This suggests that the average phenotypic resemblance should be greater between affected males and their maternal grandfathers than between affected males and their fathers. It is likely that the remaining etiological fraction is due to genetic variation at autosomal loci, which could explain the similarity of the AGA pattern of fathers and sons.

Autosomal loci - or genes that are on non-sex related chromosomes - could account for numerous factors that could influence MPB. The above study is excellent, and definitely shows strong evidence that MPB is influenced from the maternal X chromosome - but that just means that this could be ONE of the causes of MPB for some men, not THE cause for every man.

In my example, there is not one case of MPB on my Mom's side as far back as I know. My maternal grandfather died at 86 with a full, thick head of hair and my Mother's brother still has his hair as well. In contrast, nearly EVERY male on my fathers side of the family started losing their hair before age 30. My brother and myself, all my male 1st cousins that are in their mid 20's are starting to show signs of MPB. And, looking at pictures of my father and uncles from when they were my age - the hair loss is following a nearly identical pattern. Receeding at the corners of the hairline and general diffuse thinning emphasied at the front and the vertex of the scalp.

I seem to be responding well to anti-DHT treatments like Azelaic Acid, Finesteride, etc which would seem to point to a androgen related cause of my hair loss issues. I would think that numerous genetic, and possibly developmental factors could influence the amount of 5AR in a man's system which could lead to increased levels of DHT, which generally equates to baldness issues at some point in life.

BV
 
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